Is the Democratic Party Bankrupt?

[ihaveaquestion]

Article - http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0502-20.htm">Are Democrats a Bankrupt Political Party?

I, for one, am extremely disillusioned by the Democratic Party. I'd really like to see the rise of a national Progressive Party. Vermont already has a progressive party that works, http://www.progressiveparty.org/">Vermont Progressive Party, so why not?

[davidinalameda]

1. the Greens should take the initiative here

and start a outreach to the disillusioned Democrats

they just can't sit there and wait for people to come to them

[ihaveaquestion]

2. I like the Greens, but...

I don't think they're likely to be winners in the US for many, many years, if ever. Unfortunately, they're a turn-off to many Americans and I think it's the party name - "Green." Pretty shallow, I know, but a significant portion of Americans are VERY shallow. It's what we're known for in the world, after all.

[davidinalameda]

8. they're the only group out there that has a nationwide network

and isn't beholden to the Democratic Party

[thegreatwildebeest]

25. They're the....

They're the only ELECTORAL group out there. More and more people of a leftist persuasion are getting militant and forgetting the whole rubbish of voting for lesser evils and simply organizing and getting things done amongst people, the only place it really matters anyways. Fight locally, trade stories globally, and hope for the best. Make your elected represenatives ACCOUNTABLE by God.

I hope that sometime in the next decade or so some semblance of electoral reform busts through the creaky hall of power and loosen things up a bit. But even if it doesn't happen, I don't really mind. It doesn't affect my political organizing and grassroots work.

[electropop]

10. It's not easy being Green

Actually, I think it's the favorite color of both parties: it's the color of healthy environments, and also the color of money. :P

[leanin_green]

22. I like a lot of what they believe, however. . .

some of it just isn't realistic in today's day and age. I guess that's why I'm just "leanin_green."

[The Blue Flower]

3. check out

Progressive Democrats of America (www.pdamerica.org)

[ihaveaquestion]

5. This looks interesting, but it's not a political party.

I'm begining to think that only a new political party will do the trick for progressives. A clean break and a fresh start is what I think I want. Maybe this will evolve into a separate party in time.

[cprise]

4. They have become the Outer Party

Every fascist regime needs a little democratic window-dressing, some excuse to say "we're not totalitarian".

But on economics the United States has become quite close to totalitarianism. NO alternative to capitalism is allowed, not even a mixed capitalist/socialist environment as found in eastern Europe. All human actions must be monetized, and the winners of the cold war must be allowed to buy and sell the transportation, water, and power services of poor countries on a long-distance, misinformed whim.

The US has developed an actual money religion, where people are expected to subdue their grievances and guilt at the altar of the "magic hand of the market".

Clinton makes a good example: He pushed NAFTA and wellfare rollback through in a very serious effort, yet gave Universal Healthcare to his WIFE to handle... instantly crippling its prospects. But Republicans hate him so he's "great" by us... not. Democratic Party politicians do a song and dance to become popular, and it turns out they can even keep losing elections and still have a prosperous career consulting for marketing and PR firms, and making rounds on the lecture circuit.

Dems we are told, keep the Republicans from going bonkers. No kidding... which is a big part of their problem. Its all a popularity contest between the two brands of a single vendor: When one brand pushes the wrong buttons, the other one is elected and tries to administer the same basic policy with a different set of side-shows to make people feel represented. This isn't all a huge sinister conspiracy... it is a matter of complicity, determined lack of self-examination and of how they operate at an instinctual level.

What really tops it all off is that the party acts like it is the leader of the left/progressive cause around the world. Nothing could be further from the truth. To the rest of the globe Democrats have become a blueprint for failure through superficial friendliness and greed.

[ihaveaquestion]

6. You echo my cynical thoughts pretty well.

I still maintain a hopeful optimism that somehow progressives will find a way to make their cause successful. I used to think it would happen in my lifetime, but I'm less confident about that now. I really think I've given up on the Democratic party as the means to our ends. Not sure where to turn now, though. Guess I'll be an independent from now on.

[cprise]

7. Not realy cynicism

...just the result of taking a cold, hard look.

I'd be a cynic if I said "that's just the way things are", and had a "they're all the same" attitude.

They're not all the same and there is far better out there on the left than the DC Democrats. They have made a choice to be career corporate cheerleaders and worked very hard on the language that hides this fact from themselves. Everything that has happened since 2000 is simply a reflexive attempt to formalize the Inner/Outer Party relationship. The old way was so unassuring to corporations... now that they own almost all the wealth along with their major shareholders, they have everything in the world to lose and the dominant need is to have the assurance control. For that control to be real, they need the simplicity of a government that acts, debates and votes in effective unity.

Bipartisanship should be a swearword in a 2 party democracy. But it springs eternal in the aftermath of every national election.

[kevsand]

9. I think there's a much better chance of taking over

the Democratic Party than of ever getting any real traction with a third party. Both are hard, but with a third party one would have to retrain large chunks of the general public. Taking over the Dem Party would require a LOT less retraining, and the built in base in already astronomically larger than any third party seedling.

[electropop]

11. Yeah, make sense. So where do we start?

Support primary challengers to Dems who have fallen away from our values? (e.g. Lieberman, Biden)

[kevsand]

12. I've got no problem with that.

It does have to be evaluated on a case by case basis, so that we're sure that: 1) we have a worthwhile alternative, and 2) we're not screwing ourselves out of a shot at majority control by putting forward someone who might lose the district to the Repubs.

Assuming both, I'm all for sending the message that the party is going to start standing for something recognizable again. I've always thought that primary contests were a sign of a healthy, dynamic party.

Like any other organizing, it's got to come from the bottom up. Dean is making good faith efforts to rebuild party structures in places where we've been weak recently. We all need to help him with that, as well as start insinuating ourselves into our own existing local party structures.

[Itsthetruth]

16. How Will You Do That?

""I think there's a much better chance of taking over the Democratic Party"

Many talented people and very big progressive organizations have been trying to do that for years. And every year they get farther and farther away from the goal.

The Democratic Party was taken over years ago. Those that took control have consolidated their control over the Democratic Party and most leading Democratic Party politicians. I'm talking about the big corporate interests and the wealthy.

How do you propose to expell those special corporate interests from the Democratic Party in a new way that hasn't been tried by well-intentioned progressives before? Many are growing tired of spinning their wheels so you'll have to come up with a clear, realistic and sensible proposal to boot the economic royalists out of the Democratic Party.

[Ken Burch]

20. There's a case for taking over the Dems, and as a left-Dem

I'm naturally receptive to it.

But the question then becomes, how do we avoid repeating the cycle of progressive takeover followed by moderate-to-conservative desertion of presidential ticket followed by progressive capitulation to moderate-to-conservatives.

We went this way in the 70's and then again in the transition from the 80's to the 90's. Is there a way to prevent a third recurrence?

[PATRICK]

13. Can you afford to follow

the traditional paths of disillusionment? I know, it is an old excuse, but iunfortunately the stakes have been truly raised to the ultimate. Any benefit in crushing the Democrats has long been overtested and exhausted. It has been no more of benefit than the rise of third parties.

The Democratic party has open flaws and open possibilities(none a cakewalk or guaranteed)to progress for the better. It has a viable position to oppose the increasing tyranny of the RW in the deadly crisis of these times.

Now the cynic would say out of the frying pan into the slow cooker if the party positions were reversed, and that might be be very true in the long run. The later fight for the Democratic Party has the possibility of allowing dissatisfaction to create sane third parties with populist bases. Its thrust seems to guarantee that future openness as a main character of keeping its own power. A natural check, one hopes, but there are never any guarantees.

So would you rather be sanely arguing over growing the reforms and rational possibilities or would you rather die under the certain tyranny of a perverted, functionally mad GOP? That is very much the implied, distasteful compromise of the DLC and its like, but current realities have brutally shown that pragmatism has been utterly incapable of surviving except as a yes man to power. The more that the leadership MUST rely on and, in truth, support populist democracy, the more the integrity problem can resolve itself. If they carry this internecine tension into victory, then the balancing splits can occur in a restored context without killing us all. Unhappy, unsatisfied, and natural. But alive and free.

A "victorious" Democratic party that softpedals reforms, sacrifices mandate margins for cautious support of discredited corporate values, takes its populist base for granted for the "big picture", uses fear alone and profit to carrot and stick the electorate, well deserves the strongest defections. The grass roots are aware of the future. the party leadership has shown time and again among its most revered and seasoned veterans that it his not. We who die and go broke have the nerve and the values. When we come to question whether the seated leaders of the moment are up to that standard of sight and courage and effectiveness, it is the top of the party that should be in question, not the entire organization and rank and file. That goes for any party, for even the wackiest and most resolute once in the seats undergo a transformation into the same old thing. These are not the times to await a natural tempering of over-stimulated crazies and will likewise pull our own leaders from the dull conformities they would very much be personally satisfied with.

[iconoclastNYC]

14. The ;people are taking control of the Democratic party

The democratic party is going to be reformed. Big things are coming from Howard Dean.

[Itsthetruth]

17. Sure

""The people are taking control of the Democratic party. The democratic party is going to be reformed."

I've heard that old refrain before. Year after year after year after year. And we'll hear it again in 2006, 2008, 2010, 2020, 2040 and beyond as big business tightens its grip on the Democratic Party and funds most candidates of that party.

[dajoki]

19. grassroots

maybe dean could make a trip to the backwoods of the 10th cong. dist. in pa and help try to rid us of sherwood. refer to my post below.

[dajoki]

15. don't know

i don't know about the entire party , but they must be bankrupt in the 10th cong. dist. in pa. i've been trying to contact party officials about challenging sherwood for about a year or more. first of all my local hq's phones are disconnected(what a joke). then i got ONE response from the state party, it said "i spoke with one person and he will not run". pitiful!!

[Califooyah Operative]

23. have you contacted the dnc, just to let the know? nt

[dajoki]

24. yes

told me to contact state party.

[bemildred]

18. The Democratic leadership is bankrupt. The party will be fine. nt

[Deja Q]

21. Something new; the Greens failed in their attempt. Witness:

2000 governor campaign, MN. I forgot (and don't care about) his name but his few TV ads were a total mockery. Maybe his intent was to make a mockery of the "2 party" system, but he only looked like he was mocking himself. What a dork.

Then there was Ed McGaa, 2002. I disliked Wellstone because of DOMA and going back on a campaign promise, but McGaa (for a Green!) supported some anti-environment initiatives, namely the Yucca mountain bit. (he also breaks the stereotype that all Native Americans are pro-environment. Seems everybody ha$ their pri¢e.

Dunno how others in other states are, but in MN I will not vote for a Green. They made an attempt and looked dumb.

We can also thank JESSE VENTURA for being given a chance and then blowing it on self-interest, only reminding the spoonfed public that 3rd parties are rubbish. FSCK EWE, VENTURA. x(

[nnn]

26. no

way

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

27. It feels tired and old. Democrats need to reinvent themselves as the party of the future N/T