A question for this group.

[potone]

I am not a Jew, or I probably would not have to ask this question. I have started reading the Old Testament, as part of a project to read the Bible from cover to cover, and I am having a hard time figuring out the dates of the early history--the period of the patriarchs. It then occurred to me that I have no idea how far back in history one can trace the Jewish people. What is earliest one can date the Jews, and what evidence do we have to support that date? I guess I am also asking for the earliest archaeological evidence for the Jews as well as the literary evidence.
Any help will be appreciated!

[blueraven95]

1. well, the quick answer is

that on the Hebrew calendar it is year 5768.

I'm sure other people here can give you a much better answer, but that is at least a partial answer.

:hi:

[potone]

3. Answer to my question.

Thank you. Now could you or someone else tell me what event marks the beginning of that calendar?

[Lurking Dem]

2. I vaguely recall

an archaeologic dig that found evidence of a Jewish city from the 10th century BCE. They also found a stone tablet that old in a wall with Hebrew writing on it.

I don't know if they have found anything older.

[potone]

4. Thanks to you, too.

I think there is some reference in an Egyptian inscription that is earlier than that, but I don't have precise information.

[Lurking Dem]

5. The calendar was set

sometime in the 4th century by Hillel II (Sanhedrin president.) Prior to that, the calendar wasn't "fixed" so the lunar months would drift and they would sometimes add a leap to catch up.

The year number on the Jewish calendar represents the number of years since creation, calculated by adding up the ages of people in the Bible back to the time of creation.

Since most Jews (even Orthodox) don't consider a "day" to have been 24 hours during creation, that doesn't really mean much.

[potone]

7. That is helpful.

As you can tell, I am asking these questions out of a lamentable ignorance. I appreciate the information.

[Phx_Dem]

6. Is this a personal project?

It should be noted that the Christian "Old Testament" is not the same thing as the Jewish Tanach.

[potone]

8. Yes, it is.

I am aware that there are differences. I am a classicist who is considering teaching a course on the Greek New Testament, because there are students who wish to take such a course. I am trying to acquire a better background on the world that produced the New Testament, and for that I need to learn more about Judaism. As a Hellenist, I also have an interest in the ancient Near East, and the cultural interactions between the Greeks, particularly in the period after the destruction of the Mycenaean civilization, and other cultures.

[Phx_Dem]

9. Thanks for the reply

Good luck with your project, it sounds interesting.

[Meshuga]

10. There is nothing much of evidence of how or when

the Jewish people came to be. You can check out books by Richard Elliot Friedman (about how the Torah and part of the tanach came to be) which is biblical scholarship that will not answer your questions directly but give you some clues. You can also order "The Unity Principle" by Ellis Rivkin (from Amazon.com) which also gives a nice take of how things came to be.

The arquiological evidence gives us some information about the two kingdoms (Israel and Judah), and theories like the documentary hypothesis give us some clues about these people with their politics, interests and how (and why) they put biblical stories together.

[Trajan]

11. Merneptah Stele: Circa 1209 BCE

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merneptah_Stele

Merneptah Stele

The Merneptah Stele (also known as the Israel Stele or Victory Stele of Merneptah) is the reverse of a large granite stele originally erected by the Ancient Egyptian king Amenhotep III, but later inscribed by Merneptah who ruled Egypt from 1213 to 1203 BC. The black granite stela primarily commemorates a victory in a campaign against the Libu and Meshwesh Libyans and their Sea People allies, but its final two lines refer to a prior military campaign in Canaan in which Merneptah states that he defeated Ashkelon, Gezer, Yanoam and Israel among others.<1> The stele was discovered in the first court of Merneptah's mortuary temple at Thebes by Flinders Petrie in 1896.<2> Petrie remarked "This stele will be better known in the world than anything else I have found" <3> and is now in the collection of the Egyptian Museum at Cairo; a fragmentary copy of the stele was also found at Karnak.<4> It stands some ten feet tall, and its text is mainly a prose report with a poetic finish, mirroring other Egyptian New Kingdom stelae of the time. The stela is dated to Year 5, 3rd month of Shemu (summer), day 3 (c.1209/1208 BC), and begins with a laudatory recital of Merneptah's achievements in battle.

The stele has gained much notoriety and fame for being the only Egyptian document generally accepted as mentioning "Isrir" or "Israel". It is also, by far, the earliest known attestation of Israel. For this reason, many scholars refer to it as the "Israel stele". This title is somewhat misleading because the stele is clearly not concerned about Israel—it mentions Israel only in passing. There is only one line about Israel: "Israel is wasted, bare of seed" or "Israel lies waste, its seed no longer exists" and very little about the region of Canaan. Israel is simply grouped together with three other defeated states in Canaan (Gezer, Yanoam and Ashkelon) in the stele. Merneptah inserts just a single stanza to the Canaanite campaigns but multiple stanzas to his defeat of the Libyans. The line referring to Merneptah's Canaanite campaign reads: Canaan is captive with all woe. Ashkelon is conquered, Gezer seized, Yanoam made nonexistent; Israel is wasted, bare of seed.<1>

-snip-

This is only a reference to an 'Israel' ..... Which may have existed only as a single tribe at that time.

I would refer to more biblical archaeology here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_archaeology