'Why would I want to pay life insurance and have [my wife] enjoy my benefits with another man?'

[Book Lover]

http://www.sfweekly.com/2009-01-21/news/exporting-the-dead/2

The article is really about how people in San Francisco are shipped home after they die, but this line just ... jumped out at me. Here it is in some context:

"If people don't take responsibility of their own expenses, all the rest, including you and I and the president, pay for the funeral services for that person," company spokesman Jose Luis Ontañon says. The service "costs as much as a six-pack. There's no excuse to not have the money to pay for this."

But insurance agents in the Mission say it's not easy to sell Latinos on the need to plan for death. "Latinos think it's bad luck," says Ruben Noboa, who sells preneed insurance for Driscoll's. "They think that that's calling death and then death is going to knock on your door." Undocumented workers can't get life insurance policies, since they must have Social Security numbers, says Allstate agent Lupe Guevara, and those who do have documents don't want insurance: "I would say 80 percent of clients would say, 'Why would I want to pay life insurance and have enjoy my benefits with another man?' That's a very typical saying. That just happened on Monday, as a matter of fact."


Men. Hate. Us.

[Gormy Cuss]

1. That's a pretty sick sentiment.

I'll just assume that Mr. Noboa is exaggerating the percentage of Latino men who use that excuse. What a backward, misogynistic thing to say.

[Book Lover]

2. Well, I'm sure the actual number he pulled out of thin air, but it's telling

that he chose such a large number.

[ismnotwasm]

3. That's very sick

My personal experience with Latinos is that there are very family oriented, and would want their families taken care of. I do know there can be cultural differences in attitudes toward death in general. I just googled real quick and found this jesuit website (which doesn't address women's issues)but has decent information on the challenges affecting the Latino community dealing with death and our healthcare system

http://www.scu.edu/ethics/publications/iie/v14n1/elipse.html


Googling one using gender and life insurance found another article echoing what the one you posted said;

"What surprised me even more is that less than 5% of them have any disability insurance or even any type of life insurance. You may be wondering why this is so. I too, was curious and most of the men told me that why should they leave their wife with so much money since they feel it will make it easier for their wives to go out and spend it with another man. This ignorant mentality of the Latino men, even though spoken with a laugh does not take into account how much it would help a woman and the children left behind due to death of her husband to continue on a comfortable life without having to get any outside assistance or maybe even having to get a man just for financial support."

http://www.hispanicvista.com/HVC/Columnist/dcasanas/051605casanas.htm

I suspect although it's part of the machismo culture to say and feel such horrid thing, I found this small study to be informative. It's PDF so has that awful up and down way of having to read it
http://www.philippebourgois.net/Social%20Science%20&%20Medicin%20%20Undocumented%20Laborers%20Masculinity%202004.pdf


It's still about the patriarchy though. And patriarchy, unfortunately is everywhere. Thank God for brave Latina feminists. It's one area of feminism I haven't read much on, but I think I check around and see what I can find.

[Book Lover]

4. Each culture has its own flavor of challenge, but you're right.

It's everywhere.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

5. I call bullshit on it

I'm in life insurance and many applications come across my desk from Latino men.

[Book Lover]

6. Well, the stories linked to in this thread

have this coming out as something men say, not write down. And you know, you're not seeing applications from all the men who aren't applying, if you take my meaning. I wonder if this, if it is a real phenom, is something that happens more on this coast than yours.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

7. Well, it just seems that the amount of applications I get from Latino men is pretty

relative to the population of Latinos. Probably close to a third of them come from people with Latino sounding last names.

My office works with brokers on both coasts, so I don't think it's a regional thing.

It's pretty extreme to say "Men hate us" because of some article quoting a couple agents, who apparently can't sell.

[Book Lover]

8. Well, I do take your point seriously

I'm not giving up on the men hate us theme quite yet, but you're the one with the experience, so I defer to you on this point. Thanks.

[noamnety]

9. I can't speak to ethnic differences

but I can tell you this.

My husband has decided that we can't afford to retire until we have XX amount of money in the bank.

He announced recently that he was thinking of canceling his life insurance entirely, he's decided I don't need it. I asked him what the hell?

He figured we have enough now that I could pay off the house with the savings, and with my income (which is part time public school teacher - you can all do the math there) I can scrape by okay, so why should he waste his money on insurance?

There is no concern over whether I get laid off completely and can't find a job, no concern over whether I have a medical issue and can't work, no wheels turning figuring that in my entire life, I cannot earn anything near what he feels he needs to retire on, no worries that maybe if I'm making a quarter of what his salary is currently, maybe I might want the same size safety net as what he's comfortable with.

I wouldn't exactly say Men. Hate. US. My experience is more like men are apathetic to what happens to us if it doesn't affect them directly. It's like saran wrap on sandwiches. I don't hate it, it serves a purpose in my lunch bag, I value it. But I'm content to discard it once my lunch is eaten.

[ismnotwasm]

10. Many men hate women

Not all. And many of the ones that do, most don't recognize it AS hate. Point it out and what do you get? Buncha apologist bullshit or "lighten up" bullshit. And you're right about the apathy as well, I think.

My experience is this; My husband is disabled with MS. He relies on my income and my insurance. In return, he runs the household, drives where I need to go(I hate to drive)and as a side benefit, loves me to distraction. Kind of intoxicating.

I always picture him as being cleansed by fire. His experiences with a disease that steals small pieces of you at a time and never gives them back gives him a perspective I don't find in many men. He understands physical weakness from being weak, he understands humiliation of daily fear. He understands getting up and facing daily life in spite of fear or relative weakness, or feeling inferior for no good reason. In fact I've learned a lot from him.

There's about much about gender he doesn't understand,-- perhaps he can't, he is male. He doesn't have to think about it any more than I have to think about being white. But he appreciates and supports the strength and dignity of women, and women tend to feel safe around him, which is in many ways a wonderful quality.

As I lose him, so so very slowly, and I am, I'm losing him, I'm losing him dammit, and it will kill me inside when I do, I take time to appreciate the-- call it spiritual-- maleness of him. At least the idea of being male without being an gender entitled asshole. It can be done. I just wish it wasn't being done like this.