Would you compromise on the abortion issue to oust Rick Santorum?

[Cyrano]

Democrat candidate Bob Casey, the son of a former Pennsylvania governor, is leading Senator Rick Santorum in the polls by 11%. Casey is also against abortion.

Is there a compromise on this issue? Casey is all for contraception, including the so called "morning after pill." I, for one, would vote for Casey just to get rid of the maniac Santorum who compared gay marriage to screwing a turtle, (among the other pieces of insanity that have come out of his mouth).

The real question is, how much do we compromise in order to win? If we back Dem anti-abortion candidates today, do we start backing Dem tax cutters tomorrow, and war hawks the day after?

I'm torn on this issue. Getting rid of Santorum would be a step toward wiping out a disease. There's no doubt that we must do everything possible to rid ourselves of the Republican sewerage that controls congress. But if we so with no concern regarding HOW we do it, do we end up winning and becoming THEM? I don't know.

[tatertop]

1. Yes, in a heart beat

[valerief]

2. No compromise. Abortion should remain safe and legal. n/t

[tatertop]

7. So... you would not vote for him?

[patrice]

3. Pro-Life and Pro-Choice need new leadership.

I'm "Pro-Choice" BUT Parental notification is a reasonable requirement. There are all sorts of things you can't just do whenever you take a notion to, why should abortion be an exception. We should focus on reasonable controls for abortion. Don't leave it open. Don't make it impossible. Movement of somekind on this issue could clear the way for an alliance between Pro-Peace and (real) Pro-Life supporters. An alliance between these factions could address the causes of Abortion by addressing social and economic justice.

Mutually exclusive alternatives presented by both sides are false dichotomies.

[0007]

4. I don't see a problem.

Ya have to vote for someone to get that asshole Santorum out of office. What is you're other option? Not voting?

[noahmijo]

5. Abortion rights aren't going anywhere and this guy won't make a difference

But he can make a difference concerning matters such as the bullshit war, the economy ect (pending he's on the right side of those)


If I were in Pennsylvania I'd hold my nose and vote for him.

[Coastie for Truth]

6. The issue is NOT "choice"

The issue is control of the Senate - the chairs of the Senate Committees and the sub-committees, the appointment of the Senate staffers, setting the Senate Rules and Agenda, confirming judges.

We lost on choice (and worker's rights) with Alito and Roberts - because we didn't control the Senate. That is Poli Sci 101 (or 10th Grade High School Civics)

[Cyrano]

10. Casey endorsed Roberts and Alito for the Supreme Court.

[cyclezealot]

19. Choice bad enough/ Alioto tho.

ROberts maybe. Supporting Alioto is supporting Scalia. This really puts me over a barrel. Inclined to, but the guy really needs some pressure put upon him or he will become another Liebermann. How is Casey on the war, taxes, labor, etc? I certainly would make him work for my vote.

[Coastie for Truth]

22. Better then Rickie

Look folks - I live in California now - Barbara Boxer is a my Senator and Zoe Lofgren is my Congressperson-

NEITHER OF THEM COULD CARRY PENNSYLVANIA BEYOND PITTSBURGH'S EAST END/SQUIRREL HILL/SHADY SIDE, PHILADLPHIA'S CENTER CITY, AND MONTGOMERY COUNTY -that's why I moved to California.

Besides, the alternative is Rickie, not Barbara Boxer or John Edwards or Dennis Kucinich.

[cyclezealot]

26. Casey allows Scalia to whittle away our freedoms'

which he will. Then what use is Casey. Scalia will bring us BUsh's theocracy;not Bush himself. You should read of the Plans Scalia intends to implement as given to us by the Federalist Society. Go to People for the AMerican Way for details.
When informed of Scalia's plans, I can't believe Pennsylvanians are that different from Californians.

[Coastie for Truth]

35. So

You support Rickie - who will vote with MISTER Frist to organize the Senate - and give us GOP Committee Chairs, GOP Sub-committee chairs, and GOP Senate staffers,

Listen - I was criminally prosecuted (Court Martialed) in 1968 for supporting Hubert Humphrey (Article 88-Uniform Code of Military Justice; 5 USC 7323) - and I was doing the "K Street" thing for Kyoto. I've been there, done that, have the scars and wounds.

[cyclezealot]

42. I did not automatically say i'd vote RIckie.

I said anyone who supports the designs of Scalia needs be educated by an angry. Don't think you realize what this court will do. Does not necessarily matter who is in the Senate or presidency if the Supreme Court is run by radicalsl. I expect more from a Democrat to be called a Democrat.
I said we need pressure him before he becomes a run away Liebermann. If he comes around a little bit, then he will later deserve our vote. If he does not hear our disagreement now , he will later certainly take us for granted. Just like a primary challenge to Liebermann might be a good thing for LIebermann, should he be re-elected. Or might Liebermann very well switch to the other side.
Scalia is just too big an issue. Far extends beyond the cause of just choice.

[Coastie for Truth]

44. That was the logic of the Naderites in 2000

and we got Bush.

[Coastie for Truth]

21. I was born and came of age in Pennsylvania

-- I held Party office, my Dad held Public and Party office, my grand dad held Union and Party office.

-- I know the Demographics of steel and coal country.

-- I know what it takes to get elected outside of Center City Philadelhia, Montgomery County, and Pittsburgh's East End/Squirrel Hill/Shadyside.

[Cyrano]

25. The issue is not "what it takes," but what basic beliefs and values

would we have to turn our backs on to win?

And having turned our backs on what we're supposed to be about, then what have we become?

Nonetheless, I think that lowlife like Santorum need to be removed from positions of authority no matter the price. And once we're rid of him and his ilk, how do we get back to what we proclaim to stand for? (I'm not speaking only about abortion. I'm referring to the core issues and the soul of the Democratic Party.)

[BlooInBloo]

8. Craptacular thread title. Abortion is SAFER with Casey than without...

Because with Casey we have a greater chance at Senate control, and with Senate control, there will be no confirmation of anti-choice judges.

[Cyrano]

11. See posting #10.

That Casey endorsed Roberts and Alito was mentioned in today's NY Times. I can't link to it because you have to subscribe to the Times to access their site.

[napi21]

9. You wouldn't have to compromise. As I understand it, Casey said

HE is personally against abortion, but he would obey the laws, and not try to overturn them!

How is that a compromise?

[saltpoint]

12. Yes.

Santorum must go.

[Sugarcoated]

13. I'm planning on voting for Pennacchio in the primary

And yes, I'll hold my nose and vote for Bob Casey in the general. After we take back the Congress, if he proves to be too much of a DINO, we address it in future races. That's the only way I can justify it, though Casey is light years better than Santorum. Gotta take back Congress first.

[valerief]

14. I guess it would depend. Is he anti-choice to just to get the

anti-choice vote or is there evidence he would really try to overturn Roe v. Wade?

Also, when the e-votes are rigged, would Santorum get more votes by my voting or by my not voting? I mean, my vote for Casey might mean 20 extra votes for Santorum, whereas if I didn't vote at all… Oh, I just don't know how the election fraud works!

[demosincebirth]

15. You bet!

I'm pro-choice, but the abortion issue is not on the top of my list.

[Savannah Progressive]

16. We have and continue to abandon the issue of Choice

Democrats helped to pass the North Dakota ban on Abortion, Democrats in other states are continuing to work to abolish Abortion. The DNC has said exactly nothing on the issue, for fear of losing the far right wing lunatic vote.

We decried this here, and were told that it probably won't stand up in court, by many of the same voices who claimed that the Repugniks wouldn't do it in the first place.

It's a good example of where our current party is, and where it is heading. The Democratic Party is abandoning it's principals, in favor of the radical right wing agenda to try and attract the Conservative Voters. They assume that we will all turn out and vote for Democrats, instead of a Third Party, or not voting, but they are wrong.

Many people will stay home in November, Abortion being one issue, there are hundreds more. The Democratic party is literally shooting itself in the foot trying to run to the right, and be more Right Wing than the repugniks. I have been forecasting a Democratic Defeat in November, not because I don't love my party, but because I see it throwing the people overboard, those who are called the base. What do they do for us? Did they protect us from Bankruptcy Reform? Did they protect us from the PATRIOT ACT? Are they defending a womans right to choose? Are they protecting us from machine guns in the hands of the Right Wing Wackos? No, they let all those go overboard, in an effort to appear Right Wing in the voting record.

A womans right to choose, the right to be in control of her own body, is a quickly dissolving right. In ten years, it will be banned nationwide. Democrats will lead this charge too, in an effort to get the John Birch folks, the radical fundies, and the rest of the Conservo Fascists to vote Democratic in the elections. To get the Fundies vote, our political leaders will do anything.

[msgadget]

17. ...

:applause:

[cali]

36. I think you're wrong.

From all indicators, it's the repukes who'll stay home in significant numbers, not the dems. In addition, the dem party, is not now, nor has it ever been, a monolith. Yes, support for abortion rights is in the party platform but you'll never get all dems to agree on everything in that platform. You're certainly right that the party is not doing a good enough job supporting issues important to rank and file dems, but suggesting that in order to get the fundie vote, dem leaders will do anything, is simply not accurate. Most dem leaders are fully cognizant of the fact that fundies will never vote dem and they're equally aware that the same holds true for the birchers.

[skipos]

18. Yes, Santorum must go and I am not a single issue voter.

Casey will be great on many fronts, I just disagree with him on choice.
Are we not a big tent party?

[mandyky]

20. Where does Casey stand on other issues?

I am not in PA, so this is a mute question for me personally, but

Where is he on environmental issues like drilling in ANWR?
Where is he on tax cuts for the rich?
Does he address poverty and issues of the Middle Class?
What is his plan for Health Care?
What is his stance on Iraq, the "war on terror", and other National Security issues?
What does he think of GWB and this administration?
What does he have to say about government reform to end "the culture of corruption"?
What is his stance on "gay rights"?

Choice is important, but so are these other issues! Even if he is Pro-Life, he has to be a step up from "Sanatorium"!

[mvd]

23. Yeah

I'd hold my nose and vote for Casey in the GE. Even campaign for him if the election gets very iffy. Casey's a conservative Democrat, but not a complete DINO.

Right now we need to get the neo-cons out. I'd rather the party backed more progressives, but after we get the neocons out, then we can begin the next step of party soul-searching.

[Bill McBlueState]

24. it's not a compromise

A vote for Casey is not a "compromise" on the abortion issue. If the question is "With which candidate will the right to an abortion be safer?" the answer is Bob Casey.

[bcoylepa]

27. Here's a PA pro choice candidate that needs your vote

Valerie MacDonald Roberts for Lieutenant Governor
heard her speak last week - she is dynamite!!
Vote for her her and put her next to Rendell - don't let Bob Casey near the governorship
the current LG(Knoll) is also pro-life - here is an opportunity to vote for a real pro-choice candidate in PA

[insane_cratic_gal]

28. I'll vote for Pennacchio before I compromise on Casey

Given all of the upheaval over SD and other states, woman's rights are quickly becoming extinct.

I'll vote for Casey when he promises me he won't vote against A woman's right to control her body.

[liberalnurse]

41. Bravo....that is a strong vote!!!!! For a real Democrat.

Bravo to you!!!!!:kick: :woohoo: :applause:

[Bridget Burke]

29. What is Casey's political stance on choice?

You say he's "against" abortion. Lots of people are. Has he sponsored legislation making it more difficult for woment to get abortions? What, specifically, does he plan to do about choice if elected?

What are his positions on other issues?

[jukes]

30. no

he's a democrat or he isn't. this is a key democrat issue; hence, he's a DINO. i wdnt vote for either candidate.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

31. No. A woman's right to choose is non-negotiable.

Fortunately, for Casey, I don't live in Pennsylvania.

[Peter Frank]

32. Where's the "we" if you disagree???

This is a no-brainer. If you don't stand on principle, you don't have a leg to stand on.

[DanCa]

33. Is Casey for Stem Cell Research?

I hate to link the two because they absolutely have nothing in common with each other. If anyone doubts me on this i can take you to a stem cell lab an Il that does the work. However most of the anti choice crowd can't seperate the two thanks to the Bush Rhetoric and their reluctance to do research on this issue for themselves.

[W_HAMILTON]

34. Yes.

I've been willing to put aside my short-term, personal wants from a politician in favor of getting more DEM's into office for the elections coming up, so I would hope others would do the same as well. My reasoning is that once we get Democrats back into power, maybe they won't have to hedge on the gay marriage argument, or when it comes to abortion, etc.

Now, if they do regain some semblance of power, and they don't push through some of the Democratic staple issues, and instead play Republican-lite, then screw them. Let them get voted out of office again, and let them rot in each election afterwards until they get power hungry again and realize that they will have to cater to their Democratic backers if they want to get that power back.

In some cases, I would agree, we shouldn't compromise our beliefs. But I definitely don't want to see this administration get off the hook without any oversight on what has been going on, and that's what is going to happen if we don't take back at least one part of the Congress. So I'm willing to give these questionable Democratic-types a pass at least for this election, because I want to hold this administration accountable, and maybe I'm gullible to believe that if they do retake power, they will try to push their agenda thru rather than trying to be Republican-lites.

[liberalnurse]

37. No.....Casey is Santorum lite.....

Lets stop looking for (D) and get with the real candidate....

Chuck Pennachio for Senate.

[hyphenate]

38. I don't think a single issue

ought to be the determinant in any election. But we know from past experience that Adolph Hitler could have won the repukes' vote simply if he said he was against abortion and for every other nasty thing he did believe in.

However, we also note that many ignoramuses in the US support the right winged agenda for single issues only, and as a result, we get shit like the idiot in chief elected (or stolen, however you want to phrase it).

Nowadays, simply to eradicate the repuke virus in our country, I think most Dems are willing to vote a straight Dem ticket. It doesn't mean they're forgetting single issues, but are indeed more willing to get rid of the cancer spreading in our country from narrow-minded assholes.

[warrens]

39. It's his choice to make

You can be anti-abortion and pro-choice. Who here thinks abortion is WONDERFUL? We'd all like to see it become totally unnecessary; the Repukes would like to make it impossible. There's a huge difference.

As for tax-cutters, Clinton was the greatest tax-cutter in history. The best tax cut for the middle class is eliminating the deficit. Bogus tax cuts like Smirky's just transfer wealth from the middle to the wealthy. We end up paying for it in higher state and local taxes, reduced services and trillions in long-term debt that will eat up government spending for decades.

[Odin2005]

40. The obsession with social issues is why we lose.

The republicans have been so successfull because they got socially conservative, economically left-wing people (what are sometimes called "communitarians" to care more about social issues then economic issues. Purism on social issues puts us right where the Republicans want us. The people screaming for litmus tests for social issues seem to want to rather lose and have the fundies stay in power rather then comprimise and have a democratic majority.

[BurgherHoldtheLies]

43. I'd vote for a ham sandwich against (P)ricky!!!!

Santorum MUST go!!!! Casey is a tough compromise for me but...I would rather get rid of the 3rd most powerful Republican and have Casey as my freshman Senator (rather than Governor Casey).

I will hold my nose and cast my vote for Casey.