My preacher said today.......

[theophilus]

That he wished that there was a helmet law here in Arkansas. He said that when some "melon head" falls off his bike and has to go to the emergency room we will probably all be paying more because of it. I know that is not true in all cases but the principle is sound, I think.

In this area folks are wont to say, "Ain't no guvmint tellin' me I gots to wear a seat belt!", etc. This is a tried and true Repug lambasting of "big government". The preacher's point is well taken, though. Many would understand that regulations, when properly done, are in place to save the average person money, time, and health. Dems need to speak out on these things and always focus on the pocket book.

My being free to be an idiot ends when my idiotic behavior costs you something you didn't plan on paying. This is the case supporting sorts of regulations. Of course the big Corps don't want any regs so they can squeeze every penny out of a declining society.

Anyway. I thought this was a good argument.

[begley]

1. Ive often wondered if insurance companies are behind helmet

and seatbelt laws.

[theophilus]

3. How so? What profit do they make from folks being healthy?

They are behind much of the huge increases in health care costs and they sure haven't been emphasizing preventive medicine. What do you mean, exactly?

[begley]

5. Well, if people get severe injuries in car accidents,

it costs the companies more.

[theophilus]

7. That's possible but I think they just raise the rates on everybody

and end up making more. I could be wrong, but I just don't see the Insurance Comps making decisions that benefit you and me very often. Oh, and Welcome to DU! :hi:

[begley]

9. I don't think they do it to benefit people.

I think it's all about the bottom line. However, if people happen to benefit, then they can cite that as the reason.

[Dogmudgeon]

13. Insurance Companies and Safety Campaigns

Insurance companies are behind most of the "safety" campaigns. Not out of a sense of altruism, but out of a sense of economics. It is very expensive to send someone to neuro rehab, and it's difficult to just deny benefits, like they routinely do for things like mammograms, colonoscopies, and post-cancer reconstructions. (And they're just medical-benefit denials, the ones I'm most familiar with.)

And they're behind Joe Lieberman, too.

The insurance industry is extremely devious. There is a lot of money at stake, and when that's the case, the ethic becomes "Public Be Damned!"

--p!

[Warpy]

16. Yes and no. Yes, they do lobby for them

However, I worked in several head injury units and I found the average patient to be a young male without insurance. Most of them didn't live long enough to get to my area, but the ones who did would require some level of care by family members or nursing homes their whole lives. That care, kids, is on our dime through Medicaid and may last a normal lifespan, 50 years or more. Even if one had insurance, that insurance had a cap that was generally reached sometime during the first 6 months post injury, then Medicaid took over for them.

I remember cars that came without seatbelts. I was grateful when cars put them in, I've been a fanatic about using them, and one saved my life once.

Seatbelt and helmet laws are public health laws, IMO, on a level with making sure rats and roaches don't have the run of restaurant kitchens and hospital equipment for invasive procedures is sterile or disposable. If anything, their enforced use makes these little jerks realize they're not immortal after all, that they can be hurt, and they need to be a little more defensive when they're driving some piece of machinery on the roads with the rest of us.

[theophilus]

23. Thanks so much for your personal experience. This is pretty

much what I was thinking about the situation. Even if it is not every time, there is a lot of cost passed on to the rest of us. It just pays to be as safe as possible. Thanks again, and thanks for the work that you do. :hi:

[Massacure]

25. Probably.

My parents tell me that our insurance company won't pay the first $10,000 if I am in an accident and not using a seatbelt. It is a damn good reason to wear it!

[DS1]

2. I'm all for it

I won't even get on my road bicycle without a helmet. People doing 60, 70, 100mph without one just because they "want to feel the wind through their hair" also have wind whistling between their ears.

[holboz]

4. LOL! "wind whistling between their ears". I love it! eom.

[Maddy McCall]

6. There was a police chase in my county last night...

guy doing 125 on a cafe racer. Made it across the MS/LA state line before he could be pulled over, as if they could pull him over.

There's a terrible fate awaiting that guy--and it won't come in the form of a speeding ticket.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

8. Any way you cut it,

keep in mind that the insurance industry is still the largest UNREGULATED industry in our country.

Always has been.

They can do whatever they want, and there's nothing to stop them.

Helmet laws, seat belt laws - they're all probably wise, but don't be fooled by thinking that they in any way affect what health care costs people in the United States. The insurance companies decide that, all by themselves.

[Sgent]

11. HUH?

How is insurance unregulated?

Property & Casualty insurance is one of the most heavily regulated industries around -- just not by the federal government.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

14. Health insurance

You go look up the "regulations" that allegedly apply to them. The exemptions are so brilliantly written and incorporated, the functionality of it all is lost, and it's nothing but a big joke.

When was the last time anyone invoked the law in order to get a health care provider to conform to an existing regulation?

Never.

They're taken on anecdotal case-by-case bases, and, more often than not, the patient loses.

Check to see how much the PACs receive from insurance companies.

It's a joke, and always has been here in DC.

[demosincebirth]

22. I Ca., we have a elected Insurance Commissioner to enforce

insurance regulations. They are regulated.

[Canuckistanian]

10. Just make registered Republicans exempt

Simple solution.

Oh, and they don't have to wear seatbelts, construction helmets or gas masks while handling dangerous chemicals.

Freedom!

[kineneb]

12. In the days before mandatory helmets in CA

the doctors used to call motorcyclists "organ donors". I don't think I need to explain why. I actually heard it from my doc when I was a kid.

[knitter4democracy]

18. They still do.

Now they've added in "Donorcycles" for the crotch rockets.

[Haole Girl]

15. Was this your Sunday sermon?

(just curious)

[theophilus]

24. Yes, today. It was a small part of a larger lesson. I liked that part

especially.

[JackintheGreen]

17. Sure it's stupid

but the American Mototcyclist Association frequently cites studies that prove that MOST motorcyclists have the health insurance required to prevent "the taxpayer" any expense from an accident, just as NHSTA cites their own that state the contrary.

I am the first to agree that riding without the proper safey gear is the dumb-assiest thing a person can do: not only are they putting themselves at risk, but they are also gambling with their family's future. But I have yet tosee conclusive proof that non-helmeted motorcyclists cost the rest of you any more money than car drivers with cell-phones shoved up their asses...I mean glued to their ears.

All states require insurance, and increasingly more are requiring "extra"insurance for those who wish to ride without helmets. So just consider those jerks - who make the rest of us look bad, by the way - advanced applied Darwinism: Survival of the Least Dumb.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

19. Survival of the fittest

Just hope they don't get a chance to breed.

[demosincebirth]

20. Helmet and seat belt laws are just common sense.

[Mythsaje]

21. Well, of course we should all get on board

the government telling us what to do. Especially if it's "for our own good." And citing economic necessity makes it even more palatable.

People who drive without seatbelts and ride without helmets are idiots. But I don't like ANYONE forcing me to comply at the point of a gun. And, when you get right down to it, that's what they're doing. "Do what we tell you to or a gun-toting officer of the law will MAKE you do what we tell you to."

Some people just don't get that. The underlying lie is that we're a free people in any sense of the word. If it can't be justified by appealing to security concerns, it can be justified by appealing to the pocketbook. "Of course we have to control you and your fellow citizens. If we don't, it's going to cost you big."

Government micromanagement sucks...be it from the "right" or from the "left."

And I'm not buying the argument that it's the same as regulating corporations. It's not. It's about regulating individual citizens and getting us all accustomed to dancing to whatever tunes they choose to play.

[seabeyond]

28. right there with you dude n/t

[400Years]

26. I've researched this and school sports injuries cost way more than

head injuries resulting from motorcycle accidents.

So until you ban highschool football don't whine to me about motorcycle helmets.

[seabeyond]

27. i couldnt disagree more. no fast dangerous cars, suv more likely

to roll over. no sky diving, scuba diving, shit just no motorcycle. nothing that will be likely to raise risk of injury because.... the non insured may cost us something.

i can just go all over the place with this, the unhealthy foods, riding a bike, no walking across the street, no alcohol (cause abuse ergo a hospital bill)

and no, no using bathrooms since the majority of accidents happen in the home, in the bathroom