National Heathcare and the 10th amendment...

[Fountain79]

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.billofrights.html#amendmentx

When discussion of national healthcare is brought up, conservatives often point to the constitution and the 10th amendment and point out that healthcare is not a designated function of the national government. Is there any constitutional foundation for nationalized healthcare?

[eleonora]

1. so, what's a government for then?

Oh yeah, I keep forgetting...a government's only reason to exist is to provide a friends-only club for the rich's interests.

[Fountain79]

6. I think this....

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

[brentspeak]

10. "insure domestic tranquility" justifies a national health care system

Not going to have a very stable United States when great numbers of citizens are forced to leave the middle class because of health expenses.

[Fountain79]

12. Very vauge....

A lot of things could fall into that category.

[brentspeak]

13. If a national health care system would abet "domestic tranquility"

then it would definitely be among those things that fall under that category.

[Telly Savalas]

16. Like Social Security?

[Swamp Rat]

11. kick n/t

:kick:

[johnaries]

15. "promote the general welfare". n/t

[elehhhhna]

2. How 'bout the "Life" part in "Life, liberty etc." Works for me.

[Fountain79]

3. Technically that's the Declaration of Independence...

Important document but not really for this discussion.

[elehhhhna]

7. oopsie and WELCOME TO DU

ya smartypants

lol:hi:

[Fountain79]

8. ummmmmmmmmm......

I've been here for about a year now....

[brentspeak]

4. Well, I'd say that the conservative argument

is pretty much invalidated by something as simple as financing the sending of men to the moon. According to conservative logic, the federal government's commissioning of NASA flights should have been declared unconstitutional because financing rockets and space shuttles wasn't a designated function of the national government.

[Selatius]

5. This is a problem of enumeration vs. non-enumeration of gov't power

There were those who argued that each and every function of the government should be enumerated in order to make it clear where the government's boundaries were. Others argued that doing such a thing was not a good idea because if a new situation arose that required the government to pursue a new course of action, it would have to seek a constitutional amendment, and by design, constitutional amendments are notoriously hard to pass. They argued this would leave the government slow to respond to changes and potential threats and argued that the most basic roles of government should be enumerated only with the rest being left to debate.

[Bluerthanblue]

9. how about the simplest

the 'right to life'

the 14th? Amendment in the BoR says:
No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

If we cannot arrest and prosecute a person without giving them a pro-bono lawyer, how can we allow a person to die without giving the basic medical care that would indeed preserve their 'right to life'?

Not of a 'yet to be born' person, but of an actual living breathing human being??

[Fountain79]

14. The state doesn't deny...

anyone the right to purchase healthcare. If there were laws that specifically stated that people could not purchase healthcare that would be one thing. I don't see where this provides for national healthcare.

[Bluerthanblue]

20. The state doesn't deny

anyone the 'right' to hire an attorney either- and yet, the government goes that issue one further- IF one cannot afford an attorney, one will be provided at the cost of the people- INSURING a person of proper representation before the law-

Now, the state DOES deny folks the right to 'end their lives'- but does nothing to assure a person who requires medical assistance to pay for that assistance without encumbering the families of those who are closely related to the person who feels like they do not want to burden their children with a prolonged disease, and the costs that that disease will have on those they love most.

I'm not speaking 'metaphorically' here- I'm speaking for myself- having no insurance, no medicare, and the only access to medicaid I could have would require me having the state put a lien on my home, the one and only thing my children have to fall back on when I die- and I cannot in 'good conscience' do that to my sons... who have lived with so little for the bulk of their lives.

It has not passed my notice, that if I were to commit a crime, and be placed in prison, I could receive treatment for my illness, and possibly even 'be cured' without having a lien placed on our home, and my oldest son could take care of the family- but that seems absurd to me- and rather twisted.

This country has a very strange mentality- and i have the 'distinction' (or curse) of being able to trace my blood ancestry back to the mayflower- and relatives who were members of the SAR.

[SPKrazy]

17. The Constitution Doesn't Specify A Lot Of Things

But then, was national healthcare even an issue when it was written?

The constitution should be a living document, not a dead one.

Stop with the Federalist Society strawman arguments, National Healthcare is good for America.

It in no way damages the nation, and serves to protect it.

[Fountain79]

19. Some would argue...

just because something is good doesn't necessarily mean that the constitution allows for it.

[Cleita]

18. Not in our Constitution, but other countries' do

have words to the effect that access to health care is a human right in their constitutions and therefore it is the duty of their government to see that everyone in their nation is provided with it.

I think we need an ammendment stating what human rights are and the duty of the government to see that these rights are addressed.

[killbotfactory]

21. Wouldn't this fall under "promote the general welfare"