"It Appears Fitz Is On The Verge Of Indicting Cheney & Hadley": L. Johnson

[kpete]

Wrecking Patrick Fitzgerald?
by
Larry C Johnson

.......................

It is tough to tar a prosecutor who is frugal, focused, and apolitical. Nonetheless, the Bush/Cheney defenders and their media buddies are ramping up a campaign to smear Fitzgerald. The Johnston NY Times piece is prima facie evidence. Johnston notes that in the wake of a report that Richard Armitage was one of Novak sources that:

the question of whether Mr. Fitzgerald properly exercised his prosecutorial discretion in continuing to pursue possible wrongdoing in the case has become the subject of rich debate on editorial pages and in legal and political circles.

So, attention to detail, a refusal to try the case in the news media, and insistence on bringing charges based on evidence suggest improper "prosecutorial discretion"? Nope. I don't buy that. The facts show that Fitzgerald is keeping his cards close to his vest, which certainly has Dick Cheney and Stephen Hadley crapping their pants. Their role, particularly Cheney's, in directing the campaign to discredit Ambassador Wilson, has become clearer in the last year thanks to court filings in the case against Scooter Libby. For example, we now have Cheney's notes that became the basis for RNC talking points in attacking Ambassador Wilson.

I am not privy to Fitgerald's plans or thinking; but, given the nature of the offensive now directed against the Wilsons and Fitzgerald, it appears that Mr. Fitzgerald may be on the verge of asking the Grand Jury to indict Dick Cheney and Stephen Hadley. Karl Rove is no dummy and would be derelict and incompetent to not prepare for this contingency. He know that if Fitz drops a new legal bomb before the November elections on someone in the Administration that the Republican ship of state will sunder. When it comes to hanging on to power in Washington all is fair, regardless of job performance and competence. And, when it comes to poltical survival for the discredited Bush Administration, trashing a courageous, honest prosecutor is okay.

http://noquarter.typepad.com/my_weblog/2006/09/wrecking_patric.html#more

[Greeby]

1. Hope your instincts are right, Larry

I can't see much room for hope :(

[liberaldemocrat7]

112. Armitage, the fall guy?

Did Armitage volunteer this story about revealing the name of Plame as to take the heat off Karl Rove and Dick Cheney?

Who can tell if Fitzgerald will indict Cheney. People said Rove would get indicted and look what happened.

[ktlyon]

129. I will wait until Fitzgerld says he is done to draw a conclusion.

I still beleive we will get satisfaction on this issue, it may take awhile.

[high density]

2. Jason Leopold is writing under the name "Larry C Johnson" now? (NM)

[Cha]

5. Give it a rest.

Please.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

14. I call Bullshit.

15 yard loss, loss of down, and no snark rights for the rest of the day.

[KittyWampus]

31. Tandalayo_Scheisskopf, can I buy you a drink of your choice?

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

32. Sure.

But nothing alcoholic. I don't do that no mo'.

Perhaps a pitcher of Walmart Limeade, perhaps the only good reason they should continue to stay in existance.

[gkhouston]

34. would you like a cookie to go with that?

simply because you have a delightful username?

[CatWoman]

40. Let me chip in on that drink

I'm so sick of that stupid dumb shit.

[bahrbearian]

95. Will this hold you over till I get to Walmart,,, which is months away.

[Larry_Johnson]

35. Stop Trashing Jason

Larry Johnson, author of the blog that this thread is
following, reporting in.  Yes, give it a frigging rest on
Jason.  I'd encourage everyone to get a copy of his book, News
Junkie.  The most brutally honest, painful book I've ever
read.  Jason pulls no punches about his life, his
shortcomings, his mistakes, his lies, etc.  I suspect that
those who spend so much energy taking shots at him don't have
the stones to look at their own lives with the same degree of
candor.

You should also be aware that there has been a group effort
from folks who appear to have ties with Diebold to send out
malicious emails disguised to appear that they were sent by
Jason.  Jason may not be perfect but his heart is in the right
place.

I presume most people on this thread share my outrage and
disgust at the lies the Bush Administration has told, which
have resulted in wars and deaths of tens of thousands of
people.  That's where our anger ought to be focused.

I apologize for lecturing like your third grade school
teacher.
Best
Larry

[TacticalPeek]

42. Come, let us lecture together.

Or preach, maybe, if need be - whatever it takes to get the focus on > The Ball.

:patriot:

[Raksha]

44. Welcome to DU, Larry!

:toast:
I want you to know I consider your blog a valuable source of information on the Plame case. I hope you're right that the current smear campaign against Patrick Fitzgerald and the Wilsons means new indictments are imminent. Anyone who's been even half awake during the past six years knows how BushCo loves to use the "pre-emptive smear" technique.

[bleever]

45. Thank you for weighing in on Jason.

His detractors here are very vocal, but definitely representative of the opinions of most people at DU.

Thank you also for your blog, and your fight to see justice done for the Wilsons.

[The Count]

88. "Most people on DU?" My, my - are we presumptive!

Some who lead the lynching disappeared once their mission was accomplished. Some unwitting followers remain. They are hardly "most people on DU".
Most people on DU do not have a personal stake in this.

[bleever]

99. I apologize.

I regrettably failed to properly proofread my post.

I meant to say that they are not representative.


That was the opposite of the contribution I wanted to make at this moment. I'll edit if I can.



(Kicking myself, especially after taking the time to track down the verification of Mr. Johnson's contribution to DU.)

[H2O Man]

125. I think most

of us are familiar enough with your consistently "on target" messages to have known what you were saying.

[Coexist]

209. Agreed.

[MissWaverly]

157. we, believe in you bleever

But surely you realize, most of the damage here is from the minders that have attached themselves to DU. They are not the people who dug in their sofas for money to send to Andy.

Miss Waverly
:-)

If you want to see these folks up close and personal, post over in the 9-11 forum.

[autorank]

219. I read you ... got my "clear channel" going.

You are a scholar and a gentleman...

[bleever]

100. Confession: like the Bush administration, I omitted a crucial "not"

in my post.

Hopefully the tone of my post suggested an editing error.

Mea culpa.


ed: D'OH!! (Smacking forehead.)

[juajen]

138. Not this DUer

Thank you, Mr. Johnson, and a "Welcome" to DU.

[papau]

46. Well said - - Jason deserves little of the crap tossed at him on DU

As an aside, I should note that in the few areas where I have a reasonable amount of information, Jason has been spot on - despite posts on DU telling me he was making everything up.

Defeating Bush and friends should indeed be job one for Dems - including DU posters.

But as MAdem said - this is a "guesswork... exercise. Fun, but worthless". Until Frist calls a press conference, I will not celebrate.

[Dems Will Win]

47. Larry, have you heard any scuttlebutt on the Damage Assessment?

I heard some people helping through the Brewster Jennings front ended up dead and one agent (unnamed) was killed soon after the Plame leak.

Did you hear something similar or nothing real yet?

[Catherine Vincent]

48. Are you an imposter?

We have a Patrick Fitzgerald and a Jason Leopold sign up here also, but they are imposters. What are you?

[bleever]

52. Larry posted a few months ago at DU, and it was confirmed

to really be him.

[Catherine Vincent]

57. I remember that.

And I don't think it was actually confirmed.

[bleever]

66. Here you go:

Jeralyn Merritt at TalkLeft confirmed it:


http://talkleft.com/new_archives/014842.html

One last note on former CIA Analyst Larry Johnson's comment on Democratic Underground that Joseph Wilson received the same information as Jason: Some have questioned whether Larry really wrote the comment, or whether it was an imposter. I e-mailed Larry, and he responded, indeed it was him. He added,

Joe heard the same things but not from Jason. If these multiple sources are lying then I certainly hope Jason outs their a*s.

ed:sp

[OzarkDem]

59. Welcome, Larry!

:patriot:

[CatWoman]

61. Larry!!! My Hero!!!

welcome to DU!!!

:loveya:

[high density]

62. I just like facts more than BS... But that's just me.

I know many here at DU love to gulp down BS that sounds good because they must love the feeling of disappointment when reality catches up with the BS.

Yes, I'm outraged/angered/pissed off at Bush and I'm also annoyed by Jason Leopold. To be honest, I didn't expect my little sarcastic comment to invoke a "lecture." I just think too many at DU are falling into a nasty hypocritical cycle of being annoyed by the manufactured garbage on Fox News while drinking up every sound good, feel good piece of BS on the liberal blogs without thought.

[Kingshakabobo]

79. Then why don't you say as much without acting like a snarky jerk-off? nt

[Generic Brad]

93. I like B.S.

But only if it favors the Democrat cause.

[ktlyon]

128. Have you read "On Bullshit" by Harry G. Frankfurt

It is very interesting, puts bullshit in perspective.
"I like B.S."
You might change your tone after reading.

[Seabiscuit]

137. It's not just you. I think we all agree.

Unfortunately, the Leopold B.S. about Rove was promoted here by Will Pitt who took partial credit at the time for the story, and who viciously attacked the doubters among us. There were the idol worshippers who attacked anyone who critized Pitt (and Leopold by the same token). The critics fought back, calling the Pitt followers "groupies". That's when things began to fall apart here over the Leopold Rove story.

Beyond the bickering, there is a fundamental point that seems to have been lost: we all prefer facts to B.S. And as a corollary, we "progressives" on the 'net must be exceedingly vigilant not to tolerate B.S. among ourselves, and have a moral obligation to call out B.S. when we see it done in our names. The journalists among us must be held to a very high and rigid standard lest we all slip into the patterns of the B.S. spouted by the MSM. That, in essence, was what the Leopold uproar was all about - the Rove stories represented the sloppiest of journalism, to the point that not only were there inherent self-contradictions and absurdities contained in the original story, the story kept changing and shifting, yet Leopold et. al. (even to this day)kept incredibly insisting that he got the story right.

We as a people on this blog can't allow ourselves to tolerate that kind of B.S. within our ranks. Too much is at stake in our fight to take our country back from the Bush fascists.

I don't think anyone here who has criticized Leopold for his Rove story takes it personally. I don't imagine anyone's ever even met the dude. He may be well intentioned, but apparently never learned the lesson he was trying to teach himself about contrition in the book he wrote, referenced above, because he still lacks the cajones to admit that his story was, if not an outright fabrication, at least completely without merit.

[Catherine Vincent]

144. Idol worshippers?

Talk about bullshit. :eyes:

[Seabiscuit]

152. Poor choice of words.

There has been a group of people on DU that have not only been admirers of Will Pitt for quite some time, but who are so loyal to him that they placed that loyalty above their better sense when he screwed up during the Leopold/Rove fiasco, to the point of rabid hostility towards anyone questioning the story.

That's what I meant, but I agree I shouldn't have put it that way.

I will say that to Mr. Pitt's credit, he's avoided entering into any discussion of Leopold's Rove indictment stories since May. He moved on to writing about other topics, and it's easy to see from such writings why he is so popular with some people on DU.

Unfortunately, Mr. Leopold, as of just last month (over 3 months after the early May stories - I call them stories because there were several different versions of them) was still writing on Truthout about his original story being true - just amending it to now focus on Cheney instead of Rove (yet another twist to excite and confuse his audience).

The point I was trying to make was more general, although inspired somewhat by the Rove stories fiasco: that we on the "left" of the political spectrum cannot afford to make the kinds of mistakes made by Bushco and the MSM. We need to be vigilant to speak nothing but truth to power. We don't have the luxury of mis-steps like the Rove stories.

That means that any journalist holding him or herself out as representing our interests, or speaking on our behalf, must be held to a strict standard: report the facts, and editorialize, if at all, only on well established facts. There is no room for sloppiness about the facts, and no room for speculation driven by wish-fulfillment or some unprofessional craving to outscoop someone else, or childish pandering to an admiring audience for strokes.

[Name removed]

190. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

206. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JuniperLea]

183. If it wasn't taken personally, then why the continued hard-on?

You should call a doctor when it lasts so long, and you should stop the vile public stroking too.

:eyes:

[Seabiscuit]

187. This is a good example of the kind of irrelevant, nonsensical and

insulting personal attack I referenced from those whose loyalty to personalities interfered with their better judgment, and which drew comments from the Rove stories' critics referencing those making them as "groupies", all of which led to a morass of silly bickering. All the while, the real issues, which I've tried to identify, got lost in the discussion.

[JuniperLea]

189. Oh, I see. You did it to set your own example of nonsense

Gotcha.


:eyes:


You are allowed insulting personal attacks on TO, et al, and anyone who takes offense to your snarky self-stroking is a groupie.


:freak:



:nopity:

[Seabiscuit]

192. Thank you so much for proving my points with such fine examples.

[JuniperLea]

193. Thanks for agreeing with me eom

[Seabiscuit]

195. I think you just ran out of steam if you can say something that vapid.

[Straight Shooter]

75. Thank you, Larry!

Jason is still all right with me :D

[Swamp Rat]

78. Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[AspenRose]

80. Lecture here whenever you want.

You've earned my respect and the respect of countless others here, I'm sure.

Thank you for what you do.

[femrap]

86. Great Post, Larry....

and Welcome to DU.

I do so hope you're assessment is correct and our evil VP will soon be indicted, impeached, and imprisoned.

This guy makes Nixon look sweet.

[Independent_Liberal]

90. Welcome to DU Larry!

You're a true patriot!

:patriot:

[bahrbearian]

98. Lecture all you want,,, I wish I had and Apple for the Teacher..

But all I have is a Big Thank you

[Sydnie]

101. Welcome back Larry

Great to see you here again. :hi:


Don't be such a stranger. We need voices like yours here ... and often!

[autorank]

108. Welcome to DU Larry!!! You're one of my mainstays for real news and

analysis. I don't know where I'd be without your input.

Thanks for your sacrifice and for all you're doing!!!

[Swamp Rat]

115. You're one of my mainstays for real news and analysis, autorank...

along with TruthIsAll, Octafish, et al. :)

[autorank]

173. Man, that is some rendition...

I'm frightened just looking at it....

Put it out front for Halloween...keey the merry makers away;)

:hi:

[Larry_Johnson]

117. All is Forgiven

I grew up in Kansas City, so you know how we feel about the Raiders. However, thanks for the love.
LJ

[autorank]

172. You guys really beat us up, on a number of occasions... ('60's, 70's)

I grew up near Oakland. We're just trying to live up to our name, "America's Team"

Great to have you on board!!!

On a more serious note, your writing was skillfully presented and formed a key part of the narrative in DUer Understandinglife's excellent book, "We the People ... have no clothes" http://tinyurl.com/zlh7s

Thank you for your hard work and personal sacrifice in what you do. I can't even begin to imagine...

[fooj]

111. Wise words. Thank you.

This gives me hope.

Note- with hope in your heart- that those earlier Americans always found their way to the light and we can, too.- K. Olbermann

Input appreciated!:smoke:

[Kahuna]

122. Larry Johnson, you are a true hero and patriot. May God

continue to bless you and give you courage to confront the powerful and demand accountability.

:applause: :loveya: :yourock:

[leveymg]

123. Larry, Are there other indicators telling you that indictments are coming?

Many of us here have concluded the same thing as you. Why do you thing Armitage finally went public, and which side is he on?

Thanks -

[H2O Man]

127. Thank you, Mr. Johnson.

We appreciate your efforts.

[understandinglife]

132. Welcome to DU, Larry and ...

... thank you, Bob.


Peace.

[Joanne98]

133. Hi Larry!

[johnfunk]

141. Hear, hear, Larry!

I'll see you and raise you this: it is Jason's most obnoxious, cheap-shot, schadenfreudebationist detractors at DU who need most to read News Junkie.

[stepnw1f]

154. Thank You Larry! (nt)

[robertpaulsen]

160. I agree! Thanks for your words of wisdom, Larry.

People tend to forget that after Fitz indicted Libby, he got an 18 month extension with a new grand jury. It ain't over til Fitz says it is.

[stop the bleeding]

161. Well, I'll be dipped in shit

What a close/large community DU has become.


Thank you

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_oet&address=358x3589

[JuniperLea]

179. Third grade mindsets deserve a lecture in kind

Thanks.

[Snivi Yllom]

194. remember this prediction Larry?

If it's really you. Certainly it wont be the last time a Larry Johnson prediction was 100% wrong.

http://www.slate.com/id/1008336

[DoYouEverWonder]

203. Please do

Many of them are disrupters and they need to be called on their bs whenever they pull it.


BTW: Welcome to DU :hi:

Hope you come and 'lecture' us some more.

[Coexist]

207. Thanks, Larry - I love your blog -

Both you and SusanUnPc are terrific writers with great passion and insight.

[JuniperLea]

178. Still stroking your hard-on in public

How crass. Do you never tire of being so vile?

[DoYouEverWonder]

204. That's why we have an alert button

The poster in not only calling out LJ, the poster is insulting a new DUer and that's clearly against the rules.

[radwriter0555]

3. No indictments on rove mean that rove can't plead the 5th amendment...

which is pretty wise of fitzgerald. Rove is more valuable as the man to spill the beans on the big fellas.. rove can always be indicted later. He's not going anywhere.

I believe the intent is to fry the larger fish, which cheney certainly is.

I have faith... lots of faith. I trust truthout's instincts on all this.

It will work out just the way it's supposed to.

[Crabby Appleton]

7. You can plead the 5th

unless you've be granted immunity.

[kestrel91316]

73. Hey! You stole my childhood nickname!

[leveymg]

149. Also, no 5th Amendment privilege to those who've been pardoned.

Keep that in mind if this is still going on post-01/20/09. Which, at the rate this prosecution is proceeding, seems a near-certainty.

[symbolman]

11. You were making a lot of sense until you said

truthout had the right instincts, how can you say NO Rove Indictment, when TO has said it at least once and Leopold has said it already happened TWICE?

I agree with the non Indictment of Rove angle being good for now, but am puzzled at the TO remark.

And while Larry Johnson has gone out on a limb before, he is stating OPINION, which anyone can, Leopold and TO stated the Indictment{s} as FACTS, and still do..

Larry I trust, but I have no idea other than if wishes were fishes why he or anyone thinks these criminals will be put away.. even if they go to trial it will be a kangaroo court.. the whole legal system is FIXED, there is NO LAW in this country anymore, other than who has the most guns and money..

[JuniperLea]

180. Yawn.

Your self-gratification and public axe grinding is beyond vile... yet so boring. How do you manage?

[applegrove]

4. Jumpin' Jellibeans superman... at least put on your caped uniform

before flying.

It is just as likely the smear is to procure the environment in which Libby can get a pardon.

Do we really, really need to be torn apart again over some unverified hopes?

[KittyWampus]

33. Well, don't you wonder why they're pimping the Armitage angle so hard

right now... and have moved to phase 2- trash Fitzgerald.

Really, after the "Rove wasn't indicted" crap... you'd think they'd want to keep things quiet about this subject.

[gkhouston]

39. I *do* wonder why they're pushing the smear campaigns so hard

it's got to be related to the midterms. Is anyone aware of polling numbers indicating that the CIA leak case is really hurting the R's compared to say, the Iraq war, the economy in general, or the price of gas in particular? I'm thinking not, which means this is pre-emptive damage control. Libby's case won't come to trial until months after the midterms and most of the back-and-forthing in the motions isn't going to mean much to Joe Average Voter, so the possible threat is probably from another indictment.

[applegrove]

55. You don't have enough information. Don't jump. Be honest. Speculation.

The wild kind. That is all it is.

[gkhouston]

56. amazingly enough, I was aware that I was speculating

but thanks for the heads up. :eyes:

[applegrove]

58. I worry. Cause last time.. the excitment part fooled alot of people. And

we spent weeks in a circular firing squad. I responded to you like you were the OP. Sorry.

[gkhouston]

60. I didn't get that revved up last time -- sounded promising, but I

figured the celebrating could wait for the actual announcement from Fitzgerald. And it's kind of a sad thing to celebrate. Yes, wrongdoing is being brought to account and that's a good thing to pay tribute to, but when you think of all the harm that's been done, it's pretty depressing, too.

'Sides, don't we have to have a biweekly firing squad for no apparent reason?

[bleever]

67. My special bottle of champagne is still in the fridge.

I didn't drink it, but I also haven't taken it out.

:hi:

[applegrove]

71. All I have in the fridge is a tiny bottle of wine..to remind me..every

time I see it... Applegrove (my parents gave me a strange name eh).. Applegrove you cannot drink. Keeps my resolve high. At least when I am near the fridge.

But I'll dance a jig - even an Irish one - or maybe a Highland Fling..if Fitz punches through to the truths. I'll need a bottle of water to replenish.. cause I will be cryiing so hard.

[librechik]

92. I used the Bush subpoena the other day as an excuse

and finally opened mine.

[bleever]

102. We know

that champagne will be enjoyed for the right reasons.

Yours was a good one.

:toast:

[applegrove]

70. Harder to avoid when there is no reason. At least the brakes are on

and people have had a grain of salt tonight. Hard when up is down, in is out, big is small, etc. to know what is what. But at least we can learn from our mistakes. One hopes.

[glitch]

139. Speculation gets a bad rap. But we have to deal with good people being

actively smeared and very little information to combat it, we don't have a lot to go with, other than patience. And patience watching good people get trashed doesn't sit well with a lot of us.

Speculation has its uses too.

[applegrove]

197. Yes - Fitz is being smeared. But better to defend him on the facts.

That way..a week down the line.. your defence still stands.

[glitch]

198. When you have them, absolutely. If you don't you cannot let the smears

stand while you gather them.

That gives them a open playing field for however long it takes to gather your facts.

Plus at some point you can look at previously proven liars and say this is most likely another lie. Their new lie may not be proven a lie yet, but you've got experience on your side. To ignore that experience and wait for proof also gives them an advantage, and they well know it.

The time between a lie and the proof that it is a lie is where the power of the Big Lie lays. IMO.

“A lie can travel around the world before the truth has got its boots on.” attributed to Mark Twain

[applegrove]

199. You talk about the basics. Fitz fought the blind sheik, the early binLaden

bombings in Africa, and has done a whole host of other things.

Did Armitage tell the whole truth at the first go? Cause Rove had to go back again and again.

[glitch]

200. Basics are good too, but I don't think you should leave out speculation

based on experience. Wild speculation sure, leave that out. But disciplined speculation based on experience and analysis has value as well.

I doubt if any of them tell the truth at the first go, it's not in their nature.
I speculate. ;)

[applegrove]

201. Speculation based on experience.. and fear that someone will get

hurt... absolutely you have to open your mouth. I do it. So does everyone on the DU. In an attempt to hash it all out and get to the truth..cause it sure isn't going to come from the character challenged * WH.

[FredStembottom]

87. I agree. If some kind of actual indictment happens, nudge me.

As of this reply, putting this whole subject on "ignore".

[seemslikeadream]

6. What a coincidence I was just re reading this about 1 hour ago

can't link source though, sorry.

Interest again because of this thread
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2031398

The special prosecutor has been focusing on Bush, Cheney, presidential counselor Karl Rove, Cheney's chief of staff Lewis I. ("Scooter") Libby, Cheney assistants David Wurmser and John Hannah, and National Security Council officials Elliott Abrams and Stephen Hadley.

Recently, CIA Director George Tenet and Plame's ultimate boss, Deputy Director of Operations James Pavitt, suddenly resigned within hours of one another. Intelligence sources have said the two have been cooperating with Fitzgerald's investigation of the Plame/Brewster-Jennings leak and the damage to U.S. clandestine operations which globally track the flow of WMDs.

Sensitive CIA operations that were compromised by the leak included companies, government officials, and individuals associated with the nuclear smuggling network of Pakistan's chief nuclear scientist Abdul Qadeer Khan. In addition, the identities of U.S. national and foreign agents working within the headquarters of the International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna, North Korea's nuclear laboratory in Yongbyon, Pakistan's Kahuta uranium enrichment plant, banks and export companies in Dubai, Islamabad, Moscow, Cape Town, Tel Aviv, Liechtenstein, Cyprus, and Kiev, and Kuala Lumpur, and government agencies in Libya, Pakistan, Malaysia, and Iran were severely compromised. The CIA has reportedly given Fitzgerald highly classified details on the damage done to the CIA's WMD tracking network.

According to Department of Justice insiders, the length of Fitzgerald's 70 minute interview of Bush was significant. Only one other prosecutor's interview of a sitting president lasted as long, that of Iran-contra prosecutor Lawrence Walsh's questioning of the late Ronald Reagan. However, in that case, Walsh concluded after the interview that Reagan actually did not know what had transpired in his administration with respect to the scandal. Today’s officials may not be so fortunate.



Dick Cheney exposed Valerie Plame to cover up his association with A.Q. Khan's Nuclear Walmart. Read about it here: http://s93118771.onlinehome.us/DU/AMERICANJUDAS.pdf

[KoKo]

12. George Tenent has been the only Bush Official Trashed who hasn't

been VISIBLE for years.. He's been leaking to rescue his credibility? No?

Why is it that we've heard so little from Tenent, although there have been rumors that his book is forthcoming for awhile. :shrug:

I think more than Tenent have been leaking...so let's "cross our fingers" and hope once again...even if our hopes are dashed..I do believe their is more going on behind the scenes in America today than Bush Crime Family vs. Feckless, powerless Dems.

There ARE PEOPLE who are NOT PARTISAN who like us here on DU are horrified at what's going on and THEY are the Shadow Government who believes in the CONSTITUTION and ORDER for the PLANET as well as our own AMERICA!

I've hoped that they were out there...and seen little signs here and there.. Let's hope this isn't a fantasy..

[seemslikeadream]

17. This guy is talking

I wonder there must be many more



http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A5652-2004Sep8.html?referrer=email

[HysteryDiagnosis]

27. Interesting stuff that..... especially this

http://s93118771.onlinehome.us/DU/AMERICANJUDAS.pdf

2. Halliburton fined $1.2 million in 1995 for selling dual-use nuclear equipment to Libya. - Halliburton came
under fire in the early '90s for supplying Libya and Iraq with oil drilling equipment which could be used to
detonate nuclear weapons. Halliburton Logging Services, a former subsidiary, was charged with shipping six
pulse neutron generators through Italy to Libya. In 1995, the company pled guilty to criminal charges that it
violated the U.S. ban on exports to Libya. Halliburton was fined $1.2 million and will pay $2.61 million in civil
penalties.
During his chairmanship of Halliburton, Cheney criticized U.S. sanctions against "rogue" nations such as Iran and
Libya in a 1998 speech. According to a July 26, 2000, Washington Post story, Cheney complained the sanctions
"are nearly always motivated by domestic political pressure, the need for Congress to appeal to some domestic
constituency." (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/onpolitics/article... )

[Catherine Vincent]

8. It does make you wonder if Fitzgerald is about to do something

that the Bush/Cheney cabal don't like. Just check all the anti-Fitzgerald articles coming out.

[kpete]

9. Thats why I like sharing what I find

It just makes me WONDER too!

[MADem]

19. Well, the articles are following along right after Armitage confessing

It's not like they just came out of the blue.

Sorry, I can't buy anything that anyone speculates at this point. And certainly not from an outlet that has gotten it so stunningly wrong in the past.

Fitzgerald hasn't said shit to anyone, his crew doesn't leak, there's no one skulking around his offices taking note of who comes and goes, and until he goes on tee vee and says something, I call bullshit guesswork on the whole exercise. Fun, but worthless.

[dogday]

22. You do have to wonder why Armitage is

coming forward after all this time.. That set off my weird-o-meter.....

[KittyWampus]

36. Armitage isn't coming forward. Others are using his name.

[dogday]

38. Then why did they not use it earlier?

I don't understand... Did they just pick it out of the blue... Why now?

[NOLADEM]

10. So is this why Armitage was trotted out...

To fall on a fake sword to attempt to confuse the public and discredit Fitz?

To me, sadly, unless the indictments come down before the election, what's the point?

No trial would be finished before the end of Bush's term, and he will pardon every last one of them anyway.

I guess it is good to get em indicted even if they are pardoned, but I am skeptical of much really coming of this.

[Pachamama]

109. Absolutely and the media is following the game playbook and telling the US

public "game over".

In fact this morning after waking up and turning on NPR, they were summarizing news events of the weeka and when the topic came up, they started going on about Armitage and the "big news" that he was the "big leak" and that what had all the makings originally of an explosive big story has really come to an end.

I remember looking over at the radio and shouting "yeah, that's what they all want everyone to think"...

Yep, its exactly why they are letting Armitage take one for the team and now trying to discredit Fitz...Lets hope that it doesn't work....

[janx]

13. Has Fitz even been working on this lately?

Does anyone know? It seems like a stretch to say that because Fitz is receiving partisan criticism, he is therefore about to indict Cheney and Hadley.

Am I missing something?

[C_U_L8R]

15. Oh it's getting juicy again

this Armitage mendacity starts to make more sense...

the admin is throwing off flares and decoys so they can escape

[Blue_In_AK]

16. I do hope this is correct...

The attacks on Wilson/Plame and Fitzgerald in the media right now are shameful.

[KoKo]

18. If Fitzgerald still has a "Grand Jury" convened within the time limit then

it would say he left it open for a reason. That's the one thing that's given me hope throughout all this. It's been hard to hang it there for Fitzgerald...but one has to hope there are still A FEW HONEST FOLKS left in US GOVERNMENT!

I just think our Constitution is strong enough and there are enough of us who are fighting to preserve our "Great Experiment" that Bush and our feckless Dems aren't the only folks out there working in every way they can to overcome what the Bush Crime Family has dismantled in 40 years.

We have to hope...because if someone doesn't do something soon...America is going to go through something like the Civil War of Iraq and not the Civil war of the 1860's.
:-(

[seemslikeadream]

20. I still have some faith in Josh Marshall's TECHTONIC PLATES

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=4002813


In June, Josh Marshall Talking Points

A few points before signing off, though. You may have noticed a slight down-tick in the frequency of posts of late. And that’s for a few different reasons. But a principal one is that I and several colleagues have been working on a story that, if and when it comes to fruition — and I’m confident it shall — should shuffle the tectonic plates under that capital city where I normally hang my hat. So that’s something to look forward to in the not too distant future. And that’s taken some of my time away from TPM and prevented me from sharing with you some delectable tidbits which otherwise I would have loved to have done.


I’ve spent so much time over the last several months reporting on a project that has to do with classified materials that I’m embarrassed to say that I don’t know just what the rules are for taking notes of such classified documents in secure reading rooms.

[KoKo]

41. Sadly...Josh's speculation about "Tech Plates" went down with Rather/CBS

Demise. :-(

I think Josh is a better man for it going down in that he increased his website views and hired to good investigative reporters and he's distanced himsef from his former buddies in philosophy (like Peter Beinart) and is getting closer and closer to becoming a "Populist Leaning Dem."

What was done to Josh and Linda Rozen on their reporting showed the power of the MSM/Corporate Media to SMACK DOWN the "Upstarts."

I don't think the scoop Josh had about the Italian/Brit/US Connection over the "Niger Forgeries" has been allowed to go forward and I give Josh and Linda credit for "Moving On" and keeping a fight going...while realizing that it won't be one SINGLE BOMBSHELL that blows the Bushies outta the water...it will be more likely a geurilla attack of many bombs taking their tole until they have to retreat or are crushed. Josh and Linda in their innocence hadn't yet realized that they were up against the Bush Crime Family that had been puppets for decades while the REAL POWER used them to destroy everything we all grew up believing was the strength of America...our Constitution, Courts, Congress,Legal System and most of all the "CHECKS AND BALANCES."

Josh and Linda were innocent believers like many of us who are still here on DU after all these years. We thought change would come soon..it's going to take years....and years..

[OzarkDem]

64. Agree with you

Josh was torpedoed on that story, but there was something to it. I'm sure he's learned from the experience and hopefully we'll hear the whole story some day.

[Poppyseedman]

21. Your sentence makes no sense whatsoever

"I am not privy to Fitgerald's plans or thinking; but, given the nature of the offensive now directed against the Wilsons and Fitzgerald, it appears that Mr. Fitzgerald may be on the verge of asking the Grand Jury to indict Dick Cheney and Stephen Hadley."

You surmise all this from Armitage giving up his role played which was widely known within the DC circles?

[Catherine Vincent]

24. That's from Larry Johnson...not KPete.

[Poppyseedman]

25. You are right, so sorry

but it still makes no sense

[JI7]

23. not going to get my hopes up on this

but of course i'm do want him to be right.

[Taoschick]

49. I've just about

Given up on any meaningful indictments coming out of this. How many times have we had our chains yanked in the last couple of years?

This stopped being *fun* a while back.

[joe_sixpack]

77. I think it's over people

and time to move on.

[Catherine Vincent]

82. It ain't over until Fitz says it's over!

[H2O Man]

186. silly n/t

[DemReadingDU]

26. Something must be cooking with all the spin in the media

but I think it's best to wait until Fitz makes an announcement before getting my hopes up.

[StrictlyRockers]

28. Crossing my fingers. Rawstory has always stood by their previous...

...prediction about this months ago. They never did back down on Rove indictment story. They said they knew something was coming.

:crosses fingers:

[janx]

29. Rawstory smells something now:

http://www.rawstory.com/

[tinfoilinfor2005]

53. Oh. Rove's father is gay.

Well, that was a letdown. Who cares about his father, blah blah blah. I just want to see him in prison.

[lala_rawraw]

37. We never reported Rove was indicted, TruthOut did, fyi

[mp3hound]

51. I read rawstory and I don't think they said that.

I could be wrong, though. Do you have a link?

Thanks in advance.

[autorank]

175. You make a great point...

...there is a lot of stuff coming up that you don't normally see. 911 is rearing it's head, more election fraud including Mexico in our face as real resistance to tyranny, and more. It's strange, like an acceleration with no pattern clear yet.

:hi:

[Me.]

30. Pure Speculation Here

Since the info regarding Armitage as primary leaker, I have wondered if he had access to the info by reading the memo that was sent to Powell on AF1. I was always of the opinion that the plan was to have Powell situated to be the fall guy. And I wouldn't put it past Armitage to have done an end run around the plan by talking to Novak and placing himself in the cross-hairs. That said, it doesn't have spit to do with any case against the felons in the WH. They are still the focus on this. I have looked for and not found any info about the GJ being disbanded which I take as a sign of an ongoing investigation. In addition, I'd be willing to bet that RA knows where all the bodies are buried and will make a fabulous witness either for FitzG. or the Wilsons. He may look buffoonish but he is no fool and as a guy who did three tours in Vietnam, he isn't afraid of much. In addition I keep in mind how angry he was/is about the way Powell was treated. I don't consider this over by a long shot and the fact that they are going after FitzG. now says to me the dance hasn't ended.

*shadow government*

[snappyturtle]

130. Oh, yes! I hope you're right!

.........until the dance ends...........:popcorn: :popcorn: :popcorn:

[truedelphi]

43. I only read it once and it was reported in of all things

A Catholic newsletter on the Miracles of our Lady Of Medjourie(Spelling?)

But the newsletter (circa 1994) said that Richard Armitage and Holbrook were behind the installation of Milosevic in Yugoslave, and without their participation in this theatre of events the conflics of the Serbs against the Corats and vice a versa would not have come about

[SmokingJacket]

50. At this point, I see no purpose in speculating.

Wait and see... it'll happen or it won't.

[INdemo]

54. Dream on

fitz has already sold out.....either his life was threatened or there is some dirt in his past or he was bought off
with hefty stack of large bills in some secret account......
Other wise Karl Rove would have already appeared before the Judge to make his plea....so dream on this is now a page of history in the chapter titled corruption.

[mp3hound]

63. Do you have any evidence to support those accusations?

Patrick Fitzgerald seems, by all accounts, to be an honorable man. It is wrong, in my opinion, to accuse him of such things in the absence of any evidence.

[Catherine Vincent]

74. Welcome to DU, mp3hound!

:hi:

[mp3hound]

91. Thank you, cat_girl25

:hi:

[UWS_DEM]

76. Fitz background

Actually, I dont believe Fitz' background is quite as impressive as everyone makes it out to be. He and Chertoff were the prosecturs in the WTC 93 attack... who let Ali Mohammed go (he's still MIA today for all I know).

I give him credit for taking down Gotti, but all this hype about how he goes after the bad terrorists guys and whatnot.. is pretty overblown.

Long ago he learned the Giuliani method... prosecute small things like crack dealers and play nice with the Feds... and you are justly rewarded.

[JanusAscending]

96. Gee, this sounds so familiar..............???

Oh, I remember now !! Great repuke talking points, put out by Rove in one of our "liberal" media rags!!! Way to go!! Who would have thought that even we DUers on this here Democratic site would swallow it HOOK, LINE AND SINKER !!???? Give me a break !!:spank:

[UWS_DEM]

113. i have no idea what you are trying to say here..

[SeveneightyWhoa]

155. Really?

The post was quite clear to me..

[Binka]

177. Transparent As Glass

Some folks are easily confused I guess. :hi:

[mp3hound]

97. I know his background.

And it is much more than what you set out in your post but that is neither here nor there.

As I said above, I believe that Patrick Fitzgerald is an honorable man and I have seen no evidence to the contrary. If you have some to present, please do.

Further, please provide facts and evidence to support your assertion that his reputation is overblown and, more importantly, please provide facts and evidence to support your assertion that he operates on the "Giuliani method" you described above.

Emphasis on "facts and evidence". Surely, it should require that at the very minimum before trashing the man on a public forum, so I will suppose that you will have no problem providing said facts and evidence.

I'll wait.

[UWS_DEM]

110. No more indictments forthcoming

So his background is neither here nor there, but I am supposed to provide facts and evidence thereto? Confused..

In any case, I want the W scumbags to come down just like everyone else, and it is oh so tempting to place my hope in the white-knight that is Fitz. BUT I also was once a prosecutor and I know how things actually work. I think it's a lot more complex than people want to believe... people want to synthesize it to fitz=good guy, therefore big indictments.

But it rarely works like that, sorry. Fitz may well be an "honorable guy" but that doesnt bring down Cheney on its own merits. He was a few years ahead of me in law school, and it's true, I've heard nothing but respect for him. But if you remove our collective political hope and focus strictly on the legal case and how that would play out in the context of this administration... I think it very unwise to place your hope in anything big yet to come from Fitz. He blew his proverbial load already, my 2 cents.

I wont even start on the background of Giuliani, but feel free to research the dirtbag if you want. He perfected the art of going after just enough to appear to be doing his job, whilst turning the head to ignore the much larger.

[mp3hound]

163. As I am sure you are aware, UWS_DEM,

I asked you to provide facts and evidence to support your assertions that Fitzgerald's reputation is overblown and to provide facts and evidence that he operates on the "Giuliani method" you described above.

It appears that, despite your claim of being a former prosecutor, you have some difficulty following a very short exchange, sticking to the subject, and backing up your claims.

You should also note that I made no comment expressing anything even remotely along the lines of placing any "hope in anything big yet to come from Fitz". You have leapt very quickly to a wholly erroneous conclusion. That is also a poor trait for a lawyer to exhibit.

Since you raised it, however, I will say that I do not expect any further indictments in this matter. You really should ask for someone's opinion before willy nilly assigning one to them.

[Catherine Vincent]

165. I like you already, mp3hound.

Anyone that would take up for Fitzy is A-OK in my book. Thanks! :thumbsup:

[mp3hound]

170. Well, thank you, cat_girl25 but

just to be clear, I don't "take up" for anyone without good reason, so there is no need to thank me. I'd do the same for anyone else who is being falsely and prematurely maligned without evidence to back up the allegations, such as those being tossed around all over the internet about PJF these days.

The way I see it, Patrick Fitzgerald is being unjustly maligned here for no good reason, solely on the basis of nothing more than a couple of anonymous internet posters spouting off unfounded crap, and I think that's just wrong. Those slagging off PJF without any facts or evidence seem to also be members of the tinhat crowd, though, so maybe that explains it. I don't know.

[JuniperLea]

182. Awesome post

Welcome to DU and keep up the good work!


:toast:

[mp3hound]

217. Thank you for the welcome.

:toast:

[INdemo]

185. Well he let Karl Rove off the hook

who was obviously guilty..
Time will tell but he certainly isn't as aggressive as he was in the beginning of this investigation..

[Pithy Cherub]

68. Thank for letting us know

how much deference your opinion is worth.

[lies and propaganda]

196. HA! dirt in his past?!?!?

I find that so incredibly hard to believe.

[Pithy Cherub]

65. Fitz going to ground for the summer

is a very good sign imo. He is quietly amassing the facts for his decision. Fitz also has not said one word about being done. Both Bush & Cheney have already lawyered up, not sure about Hadley. And we know Rove is lawyered up. Cheney is running around sounding desperate and pathetic about Iraq and nobody except Rummy to carry his water. Keith O put some serious holes in that rusty bucket last week. Libby's worst nightmare is an indictment of his former lord liege. Patience is key because making it airtight is most important!

:popcorn:

[Kurovski]

69. K&R.(nt)

[mnhtnbb]

72. I'll believe it when the indictments are fact.

[saltpoint]

81. It's been real hard to find anything positive to say about Hadley, and

that's the only positive thing I can offer. Leslie Stahl took him out at the knees on 60 Minutes, and he must have stumbled out of that interview in a daze.

As for Dick Cheney, I suspect him of sinister conduct that might bear Johnson's hunch out, but whether Cheney is indicted or not, he has disgraced the notion of public service in this country. Dubya's a poor liar but Cheney's a polished, practiced one.

If Johnson is correct on that possibility, loud cheers would ensue from my house.

[blogslut]

83. kpete thread are the best threads!

Welcome to DU Mr. Johnson. :hi:

[Stephanie]

84. this has been my prediction - it's DICK

No doubt, this is why Judy went to jail. It was for Dick.

[Catherine Vincent]

85. LOL!

Who's dick? :evilgrin:

[femrap]

89. Dick's dick! lol nt

[Coexist]

210. Dick... Bush... no wonder the country is so consistently fucked.

:evilgrin:

[ms liberty]

94. Thanks for posting kpete...

I'm squirming like a 2 year-old to have this story to break out, but I'm also willing to wait until Fitz is ready. I'm also willing to wait without losing hope, or thinking he's selling out just because he hasn't held a press conference. He said at the beginning that he'd say something when he had something to say, and I'm okay with that. Sometimes the wheels of justice turn slowly, particularly when there are asswipes doing their best to throw a cog in the wheels and stop them from turning at all! I can handle the wait, I'm a grown up and I know events aren't always instantaneous. I also know better than to think something's over just because a potential target or a potential target's lawyer says it is.

I wonder what H20Man's got to say about this? Looking forward to hearing his take on it.

Hey, major congrats! You've got a post from Larry Johnson himself on this thread! Now how kewl is that?!!!

K&R for ya!

[kpete]

103. way "kewl"!

I know it is all speculation, hoping and wishing - but something IS definitely in the air...

[bleever]

104. At DU, we speculate

with the best.

Thanks for the thread, kpete.

[Laurab]

105. I know it's speculation, but....

it certainly IS their MO. It's quite possible.

[Stardust]

106. Excuse my ignorance, but wasn't there some speculation that Rove

had been indicted but it was sealed? Or was that just an unfounded rumor, too?

[PatrioticLeftie]

107. I was wondering

whatever happened to Fitzgerald. Haven't heard from him in a while.

I sure hope this chalks up to something, especially after two disappointments.

[mikelewis]

114. Are you sure this doesn't involve another equally explosive Fitz story?

While I'm all for a Dick Cheney indictment, I just don't see that happening. Because Rove is still free, it means that the information that Valerie was an agent was declassified prior to its release. Only an impeachment hearing can get to Cheney now as this evident declassification applies to the President's constitutional authority. Seeing as how Cheney was granted the power to classify information as he saw fit, only Congress has the power to challenge this authority. The courts may be able to do it with the civil suit filed by Wilson/Plame but Fitzgerald isn't going to be involved in any of that.

My guess is the smear campaign is coming from another quarter. Here's a snippet...

With the major media already under fire for compromising the war on radical Islamic terrorism, a recent court decision suggests that the media may have something else to hide in connection with their conduct in national security and terrorism-related cases.

The allegation being pursued in the courts is that reporters for the New York Times (Judith Miller and Philip Shenon) tipped off two controversial Muslim groups to the fact that federal authorities were going to raid their offices in an effort to find evidence implicating the organizations in alleged terrorist activity.

Believing those calls "endangered the agents executing the searches and alerted the targets, allowing them to take steps mitigating the effect of the freeze and searches," federal prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald convened a grand jury investigation into the disclosure of its plans regarding the foundations. He wanted to know who in the government had leaked the information.

Essentially, Judge Winter has put forward a very reasonable argument that there should be no shield law, and that there are court precedents, state-court shield laws, and federal guidelines that govern such a situation. In this case, the media argument for maintaining confidential sources runs directly contrary to the clear and convincing need for the government to know who leaked the information to the Times, thus possibly compromising a sensitive law enforcement action.
http://www.postchronicle.com/commentary/article_21236204.shtml

With Fitz attacking Bush's agents in the media, *'s other media assets may be firing back in an effort to discredit Fitz in the eyes of the public. While I hope the OP is right and that this attack portends a Cheney indictment, this other story could prove to be equally as explosive. If Bush's Girl Friday at the New York Times tipped off terrorists after speaking with another senior official there will be an unimaginable shit-storm. After letting Bin Laden escape at Tora Bora and constantly thwarting attempts to track down and surveil Al Qeada operatives before 9/11, now we find out that someone in the administration actually aided a suspected Al Qeada front in our own country. I can see why Rove would call out his attack dogs over either issue. If an indictment is handed down in this before the election, goodness gracious...

[speedoo]

116. Holy shit!!!

Great catch. I only recall this vaguely, but it is certainly significant.

I would assume that by now Fitz knows who leaked to Miller and the other Times hack. Still building his case, or about to indict, I hope!!

[deminks]

118. Ah, yes, the untold Judy Miller story.

This story could be very important. Who tipped Judy off, and why exactly did she call the charity? This was a charity that was under suspicion for funding septembertheeleventh. It would be a very bad deal for Smirky if the govt tipped its undercover, I mean, tipped off a news reporter who in turn warned the charity. I have posted this before, but could not generate much interest. This may be just as big a crime as the Plame matter, and might even be a key to the _hop theories. I think you may be on to something, and I thank you for posting.

BTW, Fitz just won the right to examine phone records through appeal.

http://search.netscape.com/ns/boomframe.jsp?query=fitzgerald+phone+records&page=1&offset=0&result_url=redir%3Fsrc%3Dwebsearch%26requestId%3D5dbc1c97901a6597%26clickedItemRank%3D2%26userQuery%3Dfitzgerald%2Bphone%2Brecords%26clickedItemURN%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.washingtonpost.com%252Fwp-dyn%252Fcontent%252Farticle%252F2006%252F08%252F01%252FAR2006080101207.html%26invocationType%3D-%26fromPage%3DNSBoom%26amp%3BampTest%3D1&remove_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.washingtonpost.com%2Fwp-dyn%2Fcontent%2Farticle%2F2006%2F08%2F01%2FAR2006080101207.html

So the timing of your theory is spot-on. Thanks again.

(snip)

The New York Times may not withhold reporters' phone records from a federal grand jury investigating an alleged leak of a pending government raid on two Islamic charities suspected of supporting terrorism, a federal appeals court ruled yesterday.

A three-judge panel of the New York-based U.S. Court of Appeals for the 2nd Circuit ruled 2 to 1 that the Times has no First Amendment or other legal right to refuse a demand for the records from the grand jury in Chicago, which was empaneled by U.S. Attorney Patrick J. Fitzgerald.

Though the legal issues and the cast of characters are similar, this case is separate from the case of the Plame leak.

It arises from Fitzgerald's post-Sept. 11, 2001, investigation of possible links between al-Qaeda and two U.S.-based Islamic charities, the Holy Land Foundation and the Global Relief Fund.

In December 2001, Times reporters Miller and Philip Shenon learned of a pending government move to freeze the two groups' assets. They called the charities for comment shortly before FBI agents raided their offices.

[speedoo]

119. Ahh... another great catch.

The WP story you linked is dated August 2, 2006. So perhaps by now Fitz has the phone records, or is close enough to getting them that Bushco is really sweating this one now. I think that Rove has disclosed to Fitz who the leaker to Miller was. Rove had to know.

In any case, this seperate investigation is very much alive.

[blogslut]

120. Nifty turn

I'm digging the possibilities in this forgotten Judy Miller story. I have never heard it before. I like it. :)

[KoKo]

131. Ah...Judy Miller ...that would explain why NYT's article was so vicious

about Fitz. It talked about Fitz wasting two years and hadn't we had enough of this with the "investigations of the 80's and 90's." And, it mentioned how a "reporter" went to jail and others were threatened. Yet, the article didn't point out that Fitz is a "Special Prosecutor" and not an "Independent Counsel" and if I recall correctly didn't mention Judy Miller's role that the NYT's had to apologize for in an editorial about their role in excessively pushing Iraq Invasion.

I hope someone has the link to the NYT's article..I didn't save it...but the article really went after Fitz in even a harsher way than the WaPo's it seemed to me.

That must be the news that's coming out... Miller..

[deminks]

134. Here is a thread with both links

to the WaPo and Times articles. If this is all true about Judy, if she interfered with a terrorism investigation following a leak from federal officials about the raid of possible sources of septembertheeleventh, it will be earth shaking.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=2034277&mesg_id=2034277

[KoKo]

135. Thanks...good reads there for folks who want to refresh memories....

So much is going on it's hard to keep it all straight and with the Media making diversions and chaos their game...it's great to have DU'ers who can link and archive.

[Catherine Vincent]

148. Thanks for the links, deminks!

I've got some catching up to do!

[malaise]

121. Come on Fitz

I don't want to wait in vain

[The Backlash Cometh]

124. Would ya'll stop teasing me!

It's not kind to string along an old lady.

[Hubert Flottz]

126. Is Fitz about to capture Bushco's number two man?

Or is he the number one man?

[tlsmith1963]

136. I Hope This is True...

...but I am being cautious after what happened *last* time (Leopold). I won't be fooled so easily this time.

Tammy

[Dinger]

142. Me Neither

I don't get too excited about bu$hCo's ***BREAKING, SOMETHING'S ABOUT TO BLOW*** news any more. Instead, I'll just wait till they finally say bu$hCo sentenced to a very rough life in exile, somewhere on the sun for instance.

[Imagevision]

140. I hope it happens before November primaries...

[saracat]

143. Sure.Right. I don't buy it anymore. Fitzmas never came.

Get over it.

[Tiggeroshii]

147. This would be Fitzmas.

But you are right, it's hard to believe it more now. IT'll have to happen first. I'm not gonna anticipate it anymore like so many others might.

[saracat]

150. I guess I sounded harsh but I find it hard to believe anymore.

People seemed to forget Fitz was a Republican and everyone swore he was a "good one'.Well, I just don't know.He was probably just as subject to pressure as any. You can't prove any of this stuff by me any more. I hope it happens but I am not convinced it will. I will not be diappointed again.

[Tiggeroshii]

158. likewise.

same with the election. It's really hard to be hpeful when we've been let down so many times.

[Missy Vixen]

166. Proof, please

I'd like links to articles proving that Patrick Fitzgerald is or was a Republican.

>People seemed to forget Fitz was a Republican<

When was that? He deliberately registered as "no party" both in New York and Illinois after registering as an independent and getting fundraising calls as a result. Again, let's see some proof.

Julie

[Tiggeroshii]

167. He's a Bush Sr. appointee

He's a registered independent, but a Republicabn appointee.

[Missy Vixen]

169. And this would mean what?

>but a Republicabn appointee<

I asked for proof that Patrick Fitzgerald is a Republican. Proof.

James Comey was a "Republican appointee" as well, and created massive amounts of heartburn for Bush and his minions.

Julie

[Tiggeroshii]

205. I'm not convinced he has loyalties to either party. n/t

[Tiggeroshii]

145. Would be good if it's true. n/t

[Kingofalldems]

146. I gotta disagree--this is all about a pardon for Libby

William Kristol today called for an immediate pardon. They worked up to it this week and I see a pardon coming very soon. Slick, aren't they? Hope I'm wrong, but this last week has been classic Rove/Bush media manipulation.

[BadgerKid]

159. Had the same thought

after seeing today's earlier thread here http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=2808921

Should an indictment come, may it be at the worst time for *co.

[gkhouston]

162. William Kristol's been fishing for that pardon for months

and getting nowhere. All of a sudden, Novacula pops out of his coffin and Armitage steps forward and we're supposed to believe that Armitage's "innocent" actions (how effin' stupid was that man? I'm dubious) magically wash away Libby's perjury? Why pop open this can o' worms two months before the midterms? The civil case the Wilsons are pursuing is likely not on the radar of most voters, so it is really in the best interest of the neocons to drag the CIA leak case back to the front pages one more time just now? Even if Libby gets his pardon, that could backfire with moderate and even some conservative Republicans and the R's are gonna need every vote they can get this fall.

[Chicago1]

151. I pray for this every night...and then I pray Dumb Dumb gets INDICTED

The icing on the cake would be for Stupid to get indicted AS WELL. I think there's ALOT going on behind the scenes and we may be in for ALOT of fireworks this fall. (I keep praying for it!!!!)



START THE REVOLUTION
START THE IMPEACHMENT

[WillyT]

153. Yep... Faux News Sunday Did An Entire Round-Table Segment Attacking...

Fitzgerald, Armitage, Colin Powell, Joe Wilson...

Looks like something is definitely up with this story.

:shrug:

[democrank]

156. It ain`t over `til it`s over.

I`ll wait until Fitzgerald announces his investigation is concluded and then make up my mind. My gut feeling....something`s brewing.

[Tellurian]

164. Concluded? He's just begun..

We have no idea how involved this investigation has become.
What we can be sure of, none of the underlings want to swing for Cheney...
And certainly Baby Bush is not going to throw himself under the bus to
spare ole Dick his just deserts.

This time we wait is like the time necessary for the aging of a fine Rothschild's wine.

Well worth the wait indeed.

[JABBS]

168. johnson has been wrong before

he predicted that rove and hadley would be indicted last year. I remember writing about it for JABBS.

[JackDragna]

171. Sure he will.

And I'm Richard Nixon. No one in this administration is getting indicted. Not anyone in an official office, anyway.

[elperromagico]

174. Call me when they're indicted.

I'll be off somewhere not holding my breath.

[autorank]

176. The Irish People Fought for Independence for Hundreds of Years...

...generations came and went, without a victory, sometimes without hope for victory.

Did they stop fighting? No. Did they give up? No.

I'm sure there were those who were optimistic from time to time, who said this or that would happen. What do you think happened to those people? Were they excluded, ridiculed, called all sorts of names.

I sincerely doubt it. They kept going, kept fighting.

Personally and politically, I don't judge someone based on predictions, I judge them based on their life work.

I think Johnson has a tightly reasoned case. That has nothing to do with who he is or what he's contributed...it's prediction, speculation.

Thank God for people like Larry Johnson.

http://tinyurl.com/zlh7s Read his great words in understandinglife's book on the Constitution and our obligations as citizens.

Keep the faith.

[Catherine Vincent]

188. Amen, Autorank, Amen!

:hi:

[bear425]

208. o/t. What ever happened to understandinglife?

And you're right. Thanks God for people like Larry Johnson (and you).

[Catherine Vincent]

211. He's still around. He has posted in this very thread.

He replied to Larry Johnson.

[bear425]

212. Oh, I see now! Thank you, Catgirl 25

Nice to see both you and UL!

[Catherine Vincent]

214. Nice to see you too, bear!

:hi:

[autorank]

218. understanding life has "Emeritus" status; or maybe , he's "of counsel"

A wise man who comes in from the forest to let the villagers know some new secret or remedy...

He's got some three dimensional mojo going...but it's all good and he's not left, he's just less
frequent. He'll get the jones again :evilgrin:

[berni_mccoy]

181. K&R!

Kicking for Truth, Kicking for Mr. Johnson!

:kick:

[Tellurian]

184. Yep, I don't know LJ..what I do know is Perseverance will prevail

if you believe you are right. The example given of the Irish perseverance against all odds is a stellar example of Faith, Hope, and never giving up the fight. The opposition can only hope to wear you down, break you financially, plunge you psychologically into despair, turn you inside out. Why do they do this? Because you THREATEN their very lives. It's a duel to the death. If you give up and walk away...they win by default.

You might say the Darwinian approach applies for future generations.

*on edit:

autorank, thanks for the link!

[Snivi Yllom]

191. Larry Johnson: the credibility elevator, going down!

I have become less and less impressed with Larry Johnson.

This is from the man whom a month before 9/11 penned that the threat of terrorism is exaggerated.

http://www.slate.com/id/1008336

[DoYouEverWonder]

202. Looks like summer vacation may finally be over

and remember when you use to wish summer would never end?

[bluestateguy]

213. Please don't tell me L. Johnson is going moonbat

I really think Fitzgerald is closing the whole thing down because he knows that whoever he indicts will just be pardoned by Bush anyway.

Let's not get Leopolded again.

[Catherine Vincent]

216. It's pretty sad when your own call you a moonbat.

:(

[boolean]

215. PLEASE let this be true!!!

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!