ATTN: Calling all evangelicals....

[Dob Bole]

I need help with my latest idea!

I'm an evangelical Christian living in the South. There are many other evangelicals in my area, but most white evangelicals (who aren't farmers) are Republicans. I'm looking for ways to change that.

My first stop in this revolution is my public library. I want to put together a list of DVDs and reading materials that are targeted toward contemplative evangelicals, but are left-leaning. (no TV preachers allowed!)

I haven't thought of any films yet, but liberal evangelical authors that come to mind are:

Jim Wallis
Jimmy Carter
Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
Clarence Jordan
Millard Fuller
Philip Yancey

Also, a couple of magazine subscriptions that I've thought about donating to my library are:

Sojourners magazine
Southern Christian Leadership Conference mag

There is no guarantee that they would display these, though. Still, the library does subscribe to Christianity Today magazine, and it's a little rightist at times.

Any other authors, videos, or magazines that you can think of?

Thanks,

DB

[Coyote_Bandit]

1. Good luck

but I doubt if many of the folks who need enlightenment will benefit from your generosity.

I live in (J)Oklahoma. I know a lot of fundies. Most don't read much if any. Those who do read mostly do so for pleasure rather than for information. Most have been taught not to question what is taught from the pulpit of their church. And, frankly, most of the material that is in print has been largely ineffective in changing the political views of evangelical fundies.

[hashibabba]

2. I used to live in Oklahoma...

and I have to say that some of them do just listen to the preacher and don't use their brains a lot. And a lot of the time, they only read the publications of the conservatives. But there are those who listen and they're worth reaching with the truth about politics. I think every little bit you do helps, so keep doing your good works! I just don't have any ideas at the moment.

[Coyote_Bandit]

4. Thing is

another book about abortion or gay marriage is not going to change views. It would be nice but the arguments I have seen in print primarily address only the symptomatic political issues and not the larger issues.

[AspenRose]

3. If you really want to start a firestorm, get some stuff by

Bill Moyers; he's an ordained Baptist minister I believe....

I'd also add Tony Campolo to that list too!

[gratuitous]

8. Second the Campolo mention

And while Desmond Tutu may not turn everyone's crank, his books "The Rainbow People of God" and "No Future Without Forgiveness" speak with a personal experience and a moral authority that cannot be casually dismissed.

[Tigermoose]

5. A few names and books for you...

"deep stuff"
Keith Ward
John Polkinghorne
N. T. Wright

George Lakoff's chapter on Christian morality in his Moral Politics.
....also by Lakoff...The Embodied Mind theory challenges the duality of body and soul conceived out of Greek Platonic philosophy (OT and NT Christians and Jews did not have this dualism).


"on the lighter side.."
Brennan Manning
Brian McLaren

IMHO:
Basically, a paradigmn shift is emerging from Cognitive Science that has profound effects on Theology, Philosophy, Literature, Science, Politics, pretty much everything. The best Christian minds have begun to see that Scriptural Christianity is fully compatible and complimented by Evolution and the concept of the Embodied mind. God as Trinity (and man being in His image) fully complements Cognitive Science's disctinction of three levels within the Embodied Mind. Complex metaphoric evolution is revealed remarkably in the Bible....as few books can show better. How many other texts span thousands of years of record and interpretation?

[Leopolds Ghost]

19. Epiphenomenalism

And other theories such as:

Crystalline Space-time,

Consciousness as a dimension,

and Chance/Probability as a dimension (i.e. Multiverse theory)

These theories provide a window into understanding why Materialism
(the dominant religion of secular neoliberals and neocons who are
trying to control both major parties) is insufficient to explain existence.

They offer alternatives to Cartesian Dualism, the supposedly "christian belief" which has largely been dismissed by secular "liberal" college students and academics... who have tried to establish Postmodern Materialism as the dominant "liberal" school of thought in educated settings.

The shift from Modernist Existentialism to Postmodern Materialism explains a lot about the resurgence of capitalism as an alternative to religion amongst "enlightened" folks who understand little about consciousness, like it was in the "God is Dead" Gilded Age. See: Postmodernism and the Cultural Logic of Late Capitalism. A recent issue of American Scientist had not one but three articles by futurists trying to prove that god cannot exist...! Many of these people believe robots will replace us or make us immortal: They are Social Darwinists in the purest sense.

These Materialists dismiss any notion of mind-body or space-time theory which does not fit in with their stark dichotomy between Cartesian Dualism and 20th Century Materialism.

[noonwitch]

6. Phillip Yancey is a liberal?

I did not know that. I always thought he was a conservative. But I've only read one of his books ("Knowing God"), and that was a very long time ago.

I do know that as much as conservative christians love to quote CS Lewis, he was not a conservative. Not a liberal, mind you, except perhaps for his personal life, but definitely not a fundamentalist. He said that if it doesn't hurt you to give, then you're not giving enough. I don't know how seriously that is taken by the religious right.

I would consider the late Deitrich Bonhoeffer to be a liberal by his day's standards. Since he left no written opinions regarding abortion or homosexuality, I have no idea where he stood on those issues-they weren't exactly the issues of the day in the 30s and 40s. He was very clear about nationalism and the Nazis, however. I just finished reading "The Cost Of Discipleship" ("Nachfolge" in german)-it's certainly a challenging read.

[Dob Bole]

7. If I recall from reading "Mere Christianity...

C.S. Lewis said that in the ideal world, government should be leftist and society should be rightist. Not sure exactly what he meant by the last part, because I'm not that knowledgeable about the British political situation during that time.

And Philip Yancey has an audio interview on the front page of the Sojourners website:

http://www.sojo.net/

[Raffi Ella]

9. I can't help you with that

But I wanted to wish you all the luck in the world with your project.It's about time Evangelicals took back their good name from the NeoCONS.

[Sammy Pepys]

10. Interesting dilemma...

...that of conversion. I think the best you can do is to put those resources out there and let people come to them. It's amazing how much work the numerous copies of "The Nation" that have graced my coffee table, catching the eys of friends and visitors have done with absolutely no effort on my part.

"Conversion" is possible, but a lot of times it has to start from within someone. Force-feeding it usually has the opposite affect.

[madguy]

11. He's already been mentioned, but C.S. Lewis is among the best.

He's thoughtful, pragmatic, evangelical...truly knows God and loves the Lord. He wrote a series of books commonly referred to as the "Space Trilogy," the last of which, "That Hideous Strength," is a cautionary tale for a society much like the one the Bush-bots are trying to turn us into.

[newyawker99]

13. Hi madguy!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Leopolds Ghost]

20. Tolkien considered himself an anarcho-Catholic.

He was best be described as a paleocon in today's American terms.
Liberal on social/economic issues, very conservative on cultural
issues. Like Buchanan without the racism.

But he didn't write about his political beliefs like CS Lewis did,
so he's mostly been co-opted by right-wing baby-boomers: ex-hippies
and others who wish to return to "a simpler world of black and white morality."

As reflected in the recent Tolkien films, which were re-edited to "tie into" the impending war with Iraq, much to the chagrin of the actors. (The Narnia films, based on CS Lewis' childrens books, are being produced by an actively right-wing Christian media institution, Walden Media.)

[Sammy Pepys]

24. C.S. Lewis is very much revered by conservatives...

..but I would agree with your summation of him.

[LoZoccolo]

12. I like this quote by Tony Campolo, a Baptist minister.

I have three things I'd like to say today. First, while you were sleeping last night, 30,000 kids died of starvation or diseases related to malnutrition. Second, most of you don't give a shit. What's worse is that you're more upset with the fact that I said "shit" than the fact that 30,000 kids died last night.

[Coyote_Bandit]

14. I like it

Can you cite a source for that? Please....

[LoZoccolo]

16. Here you go.

http://www.progressive.org/?q=mag_camp0805

[Coyote_Bandit]

17. Thanks! n/t

[Perky]

15. Does my heart good to see names like

Clarence Jordan - Founder of Koinonia Partners and the precursor of Habitat and author of CottonPatch Gospels

Along with Millard Fuller who actualy started Habitat.

What most people do not lnow is how strong the copnnection is between Milliard, Clarence and Jimmy.. All products of Plains/Americus Georgia. which is about as Bible Belt SOuth as you can find.

[Leopolds Ghost]

18. I'm a radical Christian

I don't know if I'd consider myself evangelical, I wasn't raised in that milieu. Considering its location in the Bible Belt, I hope to encounter like-minded folks when and if I go down to the Gulf to try and help gutting homes and electrical systems.

One source which may be too far left for you, but interesting to read, is http://Jesusradicals.com

They are more on the Mennonite / Anabaptist / Catholic Workers /Unaffiliated House Church end of the spectrum. Left-Libertarian Christians.

[Perky]

21. Since we seem to have found eachother, I have an abortion question

for evangelicals.

What is the appropriate progressive evangelical response to abortion? I ask because it tends to be a shibboleth for our conservative brethren. It is how they view one's faith. Pharasaical though it may be. a rigidily liberal view of either "its not a life" or a woman's right does not wash very well and that undermines our legitimacy as Christians. It should not but it does.

At one level it should not matter but at may other levels it obviously should.

[Leopolds Ghost]

22. Abortion is no different from any other form of taking of life

that civil law has always tolerated. The bible does not condone it, just as the bible does not condone killing in self-defense or other
things that are legal (such as adultery or lying).

I would not personally participate in any taking of a life, including abortion or self-defense. But I can't tell someone else they should be arrested for accidentally running over somebody in their car, even though that's taking a form of life too..

Nowhere in Anglo-Saxon jurisprudence do they attempt to legislate morality -- or ethics, depending on how one personally feels about abortion. So my feeling is if they want to make abortion illegal they'll have to make other forms of killing that the bible tolerates, but does not condone, illegal. Such as killing an intruder in your house. Can't have it both ways. The reality is that our society values humasn life much more than the ancients did, when you could kill someone for looking at you funny and babies were exposed on mountainsides (including babies of vanquished enemies which fundies claim was fair because God supposedly told them to do it -- that's the danger of believing the Bible is inerrant.)

[Ferret Annica]

23. I like this song

Do not go to this video URL if graphic language used to express political thought bothers you.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=exDo2SMdB-0

[blondeatlast]

25. Another author: Randall Balmer: "Thy Kingdom Come: How the Religious Right

Distorts the Faith and Threatens America."

More pointed in his criticism of the Radical Religious Right than Jim Wallis, but a true evangelical.
A must read for anyone concerned with the prostitution of faith.

ISBN: 0465005195

http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?isbn=0465005195

[Toots]

26. Try the New Testiment...it is as left leaning as they come

Name one thing Jesus ever did or said that can be construed as right leaning..I dare you and I dare any of your fundie friends to do the same. Jesus was the Liberal's liberal and no amount of wishful thinking on the right will change that FACT.

[Dob Bole]

27. Thanks, everyone. Good advice so far. nt