The FAA is LITERALLY starving air traffic controllers.

[MercutioATC]

One of the FAA's new imposed work rules is that ATCs are not permitted to leave the facility for food.

At some air traffic control towers, the actual tower is the "facility", so controllers cannot even go to the terminal to get food.

Why don't those controllers just bring a lunch? Because they have to go through a TSA security checkpoint to get to the tower, and they're subjected to the same carry-on restrictions as passengers...no food or drink allowed!

Yes, there are facilities at which air traffic controllers must go 8 hours without food.

[ananda]

1. This is too crazeee!

More Bushite.

[redqueen]

2. These rules are flippin insane.

You can't bring shampoo, lotion, etc... but you can bring 'personal lubricant'?

:wtf:

Those air traffic controllers should go on strike until they can get decent working conditions. Oh, wait...

[Hugin]

3. Mmmm... personal lubricant!

Where others see problems I see new recipe ideas. :sarcasm:

[acmavm]

4. Remind me never to eat dinner at your house.

[Hugin]

7. It's just loaded with vitamin C...

Especially the strawberry flavored KY.

[acmavm]

12. Oh. Well in that case...

[redqueen]

18. baaahahaahahaha

:P

:hi:

[Horse with no Name]

5. As a nurse

We are not permitted to leave the facility either except in dire circumstances.
I guess the feeling is that one of use could get killed or something and then the patients would be abandoned.
We don't have a cafeteria, but we have a giftshop that serves lunch provided that you get there in time. Most of the time it is impossible.
At night there is nothing.
People adapt. They bring their lunches or eat out of machines.

[MercutioATC]

8. At least you're able to bring a lunch...

As a nurse, would you agree that not allowing somebody any access to food for 8+ hours could have both short and long-term health effects?

[Hugin]

11. I for one would prefer an ATC who isn't on a 'sugar low'...

I agree with you...

[Horse with no Name]

14. Absolutely.

And if I am not mistaken, ATC's have a union.
Why aren't they addressing this?

[Hugin]

16. *snort*

Ronald Reagan pretty much turned the ATC Union into an organization designed to
hold them while the other guy punches them.

[MercutioATC]

24. Untrue, actually...

NATCA has been fighting this.

The issue is that the FAA declared impasse after 9 months of contract negotiations which allowed them to unilaterally impose a "contract". We're fighting it in Federal court, but until it's resolved, they've decided to implement these new imposed work rules (which include pay cuts).

The ability to deny controllers access to food is one of these new imposed work rules.

[Hugin]

25. Good to hear...

Progress!

[kestrel91316]

21. At the very least it would be considered a violation of basic

workplace rights that even minimum-wage lackeys enjoy - the right to take potty breaks and a meal break during an 8-hr shift.

I was legally entitled to that at the first job I had at a burger stand at age 16, decades ago...........

[MercutioATC]

31. Yes, and we're filing suit, but it'll take a while to be heard...

In the meanwhile the FAA, in the wake of an air disaster, has chosen to take actions that negatively impact controllers by denying them access to food...


Even I didn't think the FAA was this stupid.

[mtnester]

40. It all depends on where you work and how old you are

Here is an interesting site that helps:

http://www.dol.gov/esa/programs/whd/state/meal.htm

Apparently, in some states, you do not have the right to lunch or rest breaks, they simply follow FLSA, which does not show requirement for those type of things for adult workers.

[Sherman A1]

6. Time to file a complaint with OSHA

and the Department of Labor (not that either will do much good), but the complaints should be on file as well as contacting their congressmen.

[karlrschneider]

9. I also heard something about a 'dress code'....?

:wtf: is up with that?, it isn't as if the general public is wandering around windowless radar
rooms or up in the tower cab...

[MercutioATC]

13. Here was my response to the dress code on Day#1 of the Nontract...

Management didn't say a word, so I'm forced to conclude that they consider it appropriate attire...

[Hugin]

17. Poofy shirts?

I'd expect a spandex spiderman outfit.

[woo me with science]

30. LOL poofy shirt

"....but I don't WANNA be a pirate!"

[redqueen]

20. Love it!

:D

[karlrschneider]

27. LOL! Roger that.

:D

[woo me with science]

28. LOL!

I see they didn't let you keep the sword, though.

[MercutioATC]

33. Nah...no weapons, no hats...

...the earring did work well, though...

[OzarkDem]

49. Ha! Ha! Good for you!

What did they say when you reported for duty in your puffy sleeve shirt?

[MercutioATC]

54. They didn't say a damned thing.

My supervisor just chuckled and said "Well, you said you were going to do it..."

I worked the entire shift dressed that way. I have no option but to believe this affirms my contention that a pirate outfit does, indeed, meet the new dress code requirements.

[dorktv]

52. Sssssssssexy!

[MercutioATC]

56. Why, thank you!

The boots wre a little warm (there's a leather strap inside that cinches tight right below the knee) but I had fun wearing it...

[dorktv]

57. ugh, warm boots...I have enough issues with the AZ heat to want to

put up with that. :p

[Sammy Pepys]

10. Source? n/t

...

[MercutioATC]

15. Ummm...my fellow air traffic controllers...

Here's a link to the new Nontract:

http://www.employees.faa.gov/news/natca_negotiations/media/06-06_FAA_NATCA_Contract.pdf


(The FAA insists on calling it a contract, but it's not)

[Sammy Pepys]

22. Thanks...n/t

...

[Sammy Pepys]

26. Article 33, Section 4

First priority for breaks shall be given to providing a reasonable
amount of time away from the position of operation for meals. In the event the employee is required to work during the fourth (4th) hour through the sixth (6th) hour of his/her shift without a minimum thirty (30) minute uninterrupted meal break, he/she shall be compensated at the rate of fifty
percent (50%) of one-half of the applicable hourly rate of basic pay. If the employee requests and receives the meal break during some other period,
they will not be eligible for the missed meal premium pay.

Section 6. Employees shall remain at the facility unless released by the
Agency.

Sounds to me like the boss gets some control over when you take your lunch...what else is new?

[MercutioATC]

37. The point is that the Agency isn't releasing controllers for meals.

That's more than "the boss getting some control over when you take your lunch"....

[Sammy Pepys]

41. Well, it looks like your union...

...helped author the contract. Have you spoken with your rep?

[MercutioATC]

43. That's the rub...they didn't.

The FAA declared impasse after 9 months of contract negotiations and unilaterally implemented new work rules. There was no agreement.

They're now billing it as an "Agreement between the FAA and NATCA", but that's a blatant falsehood.

http://www.fairfaa.com/default1.asp

[karlrschneider]

29. That pdf has been erased...

rats
edit: well, weird...it wouldn't open with Netscape but did with IE.
sorry...

[woo me with science]

19. Hum.

Interesting, that our version of "literally starving" is an air traffic controller who missed lunch, or a child in New York "suffering from hunger and obesity." Two examples in the last two days of this myopic use of language, right here on DU.

What a comment on this comfortable, self-satisfied nation.

[DemoTex]

23. My airline did away with crew meals a few years back ..

With quick-turns, irregular operations, and other company-sponsored B/S, our flight crews sometimes went all day without meals. It was particularly hard on the flight attendants on a quick-turn, because they were required to stay on the aircraft during de-planing and boarding, and at many out-stations they were required to clean the aircraft during that 10 minutes or so between the last passenger off and the first passenger on.

I waved the Bullshit flag on that crap. When I felt it necessary, I invoked "captain's authority" to ensure the "safety of flight." My crews ate and the delay went against me. I always documented my decision with my dispatchers (that was the key). Once documented that a potential safety of flight condition exists, they would be insane to force the issue. I was very serious and very professional about it. Gate agents hated it, but never once did I have a supervisory pilot say a damn thing to me about it.

If the public only knew the bullshit that Air Traffic Controllers and flight crews are subjected to .. if they only knew. Hang in there, MecurioATC. I have a feeling that the LEX crash is going to shake up some management-types: FAA and airline. Remember what we are up against. It took body-count to get TCAS, cargo compartment fire detection and suppression, GPWS, EGPWS, and a host of other life-savers.

[GOPFighter]

32. Starting salary for pilot's: $21,000

Harold Meyerson mentioned in his column last week that pilots for Mesaba Airlines (an affiliate of Northwest) have a starting annual salary of $21,000...and the company is asking their employees to take a 19% paycut! Personally I'd prefer to pay an extra $75 for a flight and know that the pilot and crew are paid a decent salary and are happy with their jobs. I also want the ATCs to be well-rested and not distracted by hunger pangs.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/29/AR2006082901042.html

[MercutioATC]

34. Yes. Pilots get absolutely screwed.

Sure, senior UPS pilots make $200k+, but for every one of them there are scores of commuter pilots making $20k.

That always amazed me. How could you pay somebody with that much responsibility so little??

[Sammy Pepys]

42. Commuter airlines are "stepping stones"

into the majors, and retention is extremely low. Most pilots take commuter gigs to build hours so they can move into a major, as well as get rated appropriately for jet aircraft and the like. That's the motivation for taking those positons, not the money. Commuter airlines don't have to offer much money to get pilots to work for them.

[MercutioATC]

44. Yes, I'm aware of that. However, the job is the same.

Instead of 150-250 people on the plane, a commuter pilot may only have 20-50, but he's doing everything a pilot for the majors does.

To pay somebody with that degree of responsibility $20k/year is scary, IMO.

[Sammy Pepys]

45. And instructors make even less....n/t

....

[karlrschneider]

48. I quit instructing years ago...not so much a money thing as

all the damn bureaucracy, paperwork, bullshit and potential liability.

[karlrschneider]

47. My first paid pilot job brought me a whopping $500 a month

but back then (late 1960s) it was damn near impossible to find a job, there were way too many pilots looking for work and it got even worse when the VietNam 'war' ended. I started as a co-pilot for just 6 months when the chief pilot quit to advance to an airline (which never interested me - I would't consider wearing a uniform)...so I became chief pilot by default and when I put out the word for a co-pilot I got hundreds of calls from guys willing to work for NOTHING. Just to 'build time' and I knew they wouldn't hang around for long so I hired a guy who actually asked to be paid. He was a fair pilot but never did learn to make a take-off in our plane, a Lockheed 18 (tail dragger - he had never flown one)...he could manage a crash-free landing but couldn't keep the damn thing pointy end forward on takeoff. sheesh.

Anyway, the pay improved somewhat when we got the jet but I always thought 'how strange...I'm flying a million dollar plane with customers, clients and the company honchos and their families on board, their lives literally in my hands and they didn't think I was worth much more than they paid the company janitors.'

[alarimer]

35. That's got to be a violation of employment rules

Like OSHA or something. I thought everyone who worked 8 hours was guaranteed an hour for lunch (or a half-hour lunch and 2 15 minute breaks). There are rules posted at every workplace (or are supposed to be at least) detailing the rules. So why is the FAA exempt?

[Nikki Stone 1]

36. Thanks to Ronald Reagan who effectively broke the ATC Union

There is no one minding the store

[MercutioATC]

38. The FAA isn't exempt...

...they're providing the required breaks...just not alowing access to food.

and yes, we're going to be filing on this...

[alarimer]

39. Well I hope you win

good luck.

[MercutioATC]

46. Thanks!

:)

[OzarkDem]

51. Give us an action alert

if you need us to make phone calls or emails to our legislators.

[MercutioATC]

53. Thanks! Will do.

Right now we're just furiously filing grievances, unfair labor practice complaints, EEO complaints and federal lawsuits.

When we go back to Congress again, we'll need all the help we can get.

[McCamy Taylor]

50. A plane crashed in Kentucky because of the FAA's abuse of air traffic

controllers.

[Rex]

55. Trying to cause chaos, maybe it will help their Bosses.

Fucking assholes. Blowback is a bitch.