Social Security to be Phased Out in 2007

[springhill]

Social Security to be Phased Out in 2007
By Josh Marshall | bio

Still don't believe Social Security is on the ballot this November?

In an interview published today in The Wall Street Journal (sub.req.), President Bush told editorial page editor Paul Gigot that next year he plans on partially phasing out Social Security and replacing it with private accounts, and that he thinks he can do it as long as the Republicans retain control of Congress, which he thinks they will.

http://www.tpmcafe.com/blog/coffeehouse/2006/sep/09/social_security_to_be_phased_out_in_2007

[DemInDistress]

1. didn't raegan try that in the 80's? he was met by an angry crowd

of mom and pops.
It's kind of strange first bush rewards the oil merchants/producers. then he rewards the drug industry now for the longest time he's trying to reward Wall St. with our retirement funds.

george w bush.. a born loser

[Blackhatjack]

39. Yep, I recall angry senior citizens w/canes& walkers confronting Reagan

...Bush could only be so lucky to get the same treatment.

Fixed income folks are mighty irritated at Bush right now. Let him start messing with social security, and they will take to the streets to protest(after all they remember what marches and protests and sitins were all about).

[Tigress DEM]

49. TWO WORDS.... Signing Statements

750 pieces of legislation that bush don't feel apply to him. What is one more?

[w4rma]

54. I'm glad he used those signing statements. Once he is gone every one of

those signing statements will be gone too. They won't be enforced as they are blatantly unconstitutional.

[badgerpup]

69. Is that true? Legally I mean?

Has kind of a 'spell that will break only if the evil sorceror is defeated' ring to it.

This Path to 9/11 and the nasty ad hominem campaign that's coming up have me pretty discouraged.
I know they're fighting dirty because there's no other way left for them to remain in power, but cornered rats can inflict some serious hurt on ya...
and these particular cornered rats you're NOT supposed to kill.

[Cobalt-60]

55. the button doesnt work!

I hit delete- but the chimp is still there.
Call Tech Support!

[TahitiNut]

75. Tell me about it. I've worn out my mouse on it and they're still there.

:grr:

[CatWoman]

2. unbelievable

simply unbelievable.

Bush doesn't give a FUCK about the wants and concerns of Americans.

simply unbelievable.

[TitanicWreck]

5. The Republican scorn for FDR and his legacy

The Republicans are keen on undoing the legacy of FDR. Morbidly obese Rush Limbah is open is his contempt for FDR's policies, the assine movement being pushed by the right to replace FDR's face with Reagan's wrinkled mug on the dime is an example of the scorn they hold for FDR.

[CatWoman]

11. Welcome to DU, Titanic Wreck

:hi:

Thank you for that food for thought.

You are correct, they do hate FDR and his great accomplishments to this society.

I suppose his success/legacy reminds them too much of their failed and terrible policies.

[NMDemDist2]

12. welcome to DU TitanicWreck!!

:hi:

[Patchuli]

20. Who cares what drug-addled 'Rush'

thinks? His fat arse should be sitting in jail for buying drugs illegally.

Welcome to DU! :hi:

[Imagevision]

28. Key words: "as long as the Republicans retain control of Congress

[leftchick]

60. and they will

I have lost all hope. :cry:

[CrispyQ]

61. Ohhhh!

:hug:

[ChiciB1]

65. HOPE Is A Four-Letter Word!

I don't ever use it anymore. Really sad, huh???

[Imagevision]

67. lost all hope? - c'mon! Bush will at the minimum lose the house - that's

a given... then it's quack-quack lame duck time...!

[civildisoBDence]

73. Hope springs eternal, in the fall

I'm hoping for a stampede of anger and revulsion in November, after which DUHbya will be a lame duck backed by a lame Dick on an animal farm populated by pigs, chickenhawks, and sheep.

Otherwise, I'm afraid we'll hear doves cry.

Newsprism

[susanna]

35. That's what gets me...the undoing FDR legacy part...

Good grief, it was 70-80 years ago! WTF?

Especially since the USA (under FDR) essentially won WWII singlehandedly, according to these same yahoos. "The British/French/Everyone Else we Hate In Europe were straight-up incompetent! We had to save them...blah, blah, blah." :sarcasm:

[gully]

38. Were it not for FDR we'd still be living in "The Great Depression."

They're idiots.

[susanna]

40. Thank you. n/t

[vssmith]

57. They're trying to get us back there!

[Occulus]

42. They don't like the idea of getting something for being a taxpayer

By 'something', I mean things like food, water, or shelter. Republicans believe one must, always, earn those things- even to the point of making feeding the homeless illegal.

It's funny, though. They just love giving money away to businesses. Hand over fist, every time they're in power.

[earth mom]

74. Yup, the taxpayers SUBSIDIZE businesses in this country.

:wtf:

How's that for crazy?!

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand that something is really wrong with this country if we the taxpayers are paying money for businesses to stay in business! :grr:

[Poppyseedman]

3. SS needs to be addressed

I'm not sure we want it addressed under the bush administration, but if bush takes from the third rail of politics to at least being discussed in the future, it's a good thing.

[Crabby Appleton]

7. I don't know what the best way to fix it

but it is about 10 years away from causing a real problem, soon as they start having a negative cash flow, it's a Ponzi scheme that would be illegal if a private company had the same business model.

[druidity33]

8. pffftt!!!!....

:eyes:

[rasputin1952]

18. Actually, the one way to fix SS is for congresscritters to quit using

the funds for excess garbage.

The "excess" funding of SS has been exploited for years to cover up the budget crisis. If that money were left in SS, there would be about a trillion, (that is not a typo), dollars set aside to be used for SS. Over many decades, the money has been siphoned off, and it has gotten much worse since bush has gotten into power.

Recently, several billion dollars was found that was not used for educational grants, that was used to cover budget maladies...Pell Grants went way down this year, as did state grants.

bush can't kill SS, but he's sure gonna try. It fascinates me that with an approval rate in the 30's he thinks he can do anything, he has lost the trust of the American people, and he isn't gonna get it back.

[focusfan]

58. He never ever whatsoever had any kind of trust from me anytime.

[rasputin1952]

59. He never had any trust from me either, but a lot of people, for at

least some time, trusted him. His #'s were decent for a good portion of his terms, but he has squandered so much, that his viability as a leader has evaporated among the majority of those that thought he could do a good job. What support he has left, is merely that of those who would never contemplate anything but GOP dominance for whatever reason.

This is, quite simply the most inept and worst administration ever.

[JHB]

24. And your source for this is?

Be careful about what you think you know about Social Security's "problems". The current push against it is the culmination of at least 15 years of scare-em stories, distorted statistics, and general propaganda to undermine peoples' confidence in it (including the "Ponzi scheme" myth you repeated).


Here's one quick overview debunking the idea that there's a looming crisis for SS. It's hardly the only one, either.

But how serious a problem is this (referring to the Baby Boomers and changing demographics--JHB)? Nowhere near as serious on the second glance as the first. As with many of the projections, the Trustees' are considerably gloomier than those produced by other entities. The Census Bureau, for example, projects the 65-and-over share of the population to be less than 22% in 2080. That may not sound like much, but if the Census Bureau is right and the Trustees are wrong, that adjustment alone could reduce the system's projected deficit 75 years from now from 2.1% of GDP to 1.6%.

And looking only at the elderly share of the population is a very selective analysis. A broader analysis would ask how many nonworkers is each member of the paid workforce projected to support. In 2080, the Trustees project that there will be 1.01 nonworkers for every paid worker, up from 0.90 today (see nearby chart). But the 2080 figure is still way below 1955's 1.68, when there were many more kids running around, and many fewer women in paid employment than today. Even if you don't buy the nonsense about the New Economy's productivity revolution, it's hard to imagine why the U.S. economy of 2080 would have a rough time coping with the same nonworker/worker ratio that it did in the mid-1980s.

Speaking of that productivity revolution, it's nowhere in the projections. Over the very long term, output per worker in the U.S. has grown around 2% a year. Some reputable economists project that the infotech has kicked us up to a higher rate of 2.5% a year, though that seems like a stretch. (Some boosterish business pundits are even pushing an implausible 4% rate.) Lost in their gloomy world, the Social Security Trustees are projecting a 1.6% rate of annual productivity growth through 2080—20% below the long term average. Those differences might not sound like much, but they really compound over time. At 1.6% a year, productivity in 2080 would be almost 230% of today's levels; at 2.0%, over 340%; at 2.5%, almost 540%. Obviously, the bigger the number, the better the economy will be able to afford its retirees—but the Trustees chose a very small one.

Economic growth isn't only a matter of growth in productivity per worker; it's also determined by the growth in the labor force. And the Trustees project that the growth in the labor force over the next 75 years will be about one-sixth as fast as it was between 1960 and 2004. Some slowdown is likely, since women's entry into paid labor is a trend that may have run much of its course (though just 57% of adult women are working, compared with 72% of men, so that gender gap in employment hasn't closed any more than the pay gap has).

But the Trustees' projection represents a stunning drop from historical experience, and one that can only be partly explained by the 60% slowdown in population growth they foresee. (And one reason for the slowdown in population growth is that they also foresee a sharp dropoff in immigration—important, since immigrants tend to be young, making them net contributors to Social Security.) Oddly, they're projecting that the labor force will grow more slowly than the population, even though it's grown nearly twice as fast as population since 1960. Maybe the Trustees are implicitly projecting a breakdown in the American economy's prodigious powers at putting people to work—but if that's the case, it's a big deal, and we should really be talking more explicitly about it.
Full article at:
http://www.leftbusinessobserver.com/SocialSecurityRevisited.html

[Leopolds Ghost]

50. This "left" business observer seems to like productivity growth more than

seems warranted. Remember, the higher the productivity of the workforce, the less unit value your labor has. With manufacturing leaving the country, there's no correlation between productivity and "more stuff" to buy, unless you count stuff that can be sold to Americans in bulk, like junk food and poor-quality ("high productivity") Chinese products. and Americans are working MORE hours to pay the rent, than they were in less inflationary times like the 40s and 50s.

[JHB]

72. The point was the skewing of the Trustees projections toward gloomy...

..., depression-grade estimates of the future economic performance when it served to scare-up acquiesence to "Soecial Security reform".

There's no need for scare quotes about LBO being left: it's usually too much so for my tastes. But (if you go to the source article and read not only it, but follow the links it gives to previous visitations to this subject back to 1994), it was punching holes in this BS long before many other people were.

[devilgrrl]

51. I heard SS has weapons of mass destruction...

if * says it's bad, it must be so!!!!!! :sarcasm:

[sam sarrha]

84. lots of old people farting poison gas..

[FUGW]

13. Gee, your not sure we want Bush's solution?

[Poppyseedman]

16. It's a figure of speech

Not, that I agree with bush's solution, but frankly the Dem's haven't come up with anything really viable either.

[FUGW]

30. The Dems came up with S.S. didn't they, thats not viable?

[Patchuli]

21. Why exactly does "SS need to be addressed"

other than to raise the cap which solve any such problems and not cost the taxpayers to "fix" it. If you make more, you should pay more. Period.

[Divernan]

62. To provide billions in annual income for privatized fund "managers"

Why do you think Bush was reassuring Wall Street about this? Because of the vast ripoff potential for Wall Street re the "administration" of these private funds. And these fees will be charged to the individual account holders, i.e., anyone who is stupid enough to agree to this switch.

[Patchuli]

71. I was being facetious!

SS isn't broken and I certainly don't want any Wall Street mooches attaching their suckers to my earnings!

All their madeup reasons are pretty flimsy. SS has worked for more than half a century and it sure doesn't need the Mayberry Machiavellis monkeying with it!

[Divernan]

85. Me, too.

Actually, if someone gave Bush a shot of truth serum and asked him why he thought changes were necessary, my explanation is the one he would give. Every policy he has implemented as president is always crafted to provide obscene profits to him and his "base"

[mmonk]

29. It just needs to be paid for. It's an anti-poverty type

of program for seniors. Don't buy into the "needs to fixed" bull. You either have such a program or you don't. Life was a lot worse in America before it had it.

[Iowa]

45. Yep, it doesn't need to be fixed...

And I'd add that it already has been paid for (see my post below). For many years the trust fund has been taking in more than is necessary to cover current benefits. That money has been invested in treasury securities, and those securities will be liquidated to meet the increasing number of retirees coming soon. As you said - no fix is needed.

[Iowa]

44. This is not correct...

SS does NOT need to be addressed. The trust fund is sound. The program has been managed competently. It is one of the most successful government programs in our history. Asking politicians to "address" it (beyond infrequent actuarial tweaks) will only f**k it up.

Obviously the trust fund will need to liquidate treasury securities to meet its obligations to retirees. That is well known, has been expected for many years, and has been planned for.

The REAL issue is that repukes have run the country into the ditch financially, and the government must honor its debts - not just to the SS trust fund - but to ALL treasury investors. Last time I checked (a few months ago) the national debt was roughly 8.4 trillion and the SS Trust fund held approximately 1.8 trillion of that - roughly a fifth. The trust fund is only one of many treasury security holders that must be paid - with interest - on time. This is an obligation that cannot be evaded without dire consequences. The repukes know that - so they're trying to renege on the obligation to repay the debt to the trust fund (and note that they aren't trying to renege on ALL government securities - just the money owed to elderly working people). They won't get by with it unless we let them.

Bottom line: WE DO NOT HAVE A SS PROBLEM! SS does NOT need to be "addressed". The problem is simple - we have an incompetent bunch of rich kids who managed to get their hands upon the levers of government, they went on a big spending spree, and now they're looking for someone else to pay for their damage (as rich, weak, spoiled children often do). But the country won't allow it unless these repuke punks can convince the country that we have a SS problem - or that SS needs to be addressed. We don't - and it doesn't.

Please help spread the word. There is no SS problem. Thanks for listening.

[earth mom]

76. Social Security is NOT broken!

That is a rethuglican meme that is simply not true. This topic was discussed here on DU in depth the last time chimpy took Social Security on.

The truth of the matter is that chimpy and his thugs want to channel all that money into the stock market so they all can benefit while they screw all of us over and steal our money. :grr:

Don't buy into their lies!

[TahitiNut]

77. Raising the minimum wage and re-creating a middle class would do it.

By far, the most serious problem with OASDI is the continuing obliteration of the economic health of the middle class - actually, the bottom 90% of wage earners in this country. Payroll tax revenues cannot increase when payrolls below $90K are decreasing. The Bushoilinis have wiped out 10 million jobs! The federal minimum wage is at its lowest in 50 years! The distribution of income is more inequitable today than it has been since the Great Depression! Today, the gap between the "rich getting richer" and the "poor getting poorer" is wider than it's been in 75 years! We have become a banana republic, controlled by neocolonialists who want a plantation economy.

By far, the WORST thing that could be done is to shovel the trust fund into the stock market. It'd be an economic disaster for the working class - but the "investor class" (top 1%) would love it. (Until a bloody revolution, that is.)

[Ignacio Upton]

4. Josh Marshall is like Paul Revere

"The privatizers are coming, the privatizers are coming!"

The problem, however, is that our Democratic leaders aren't doing anything to expose the GOP's plan for privatization yet again. Did you know that EVERY GOP Senate candidate in a competitive race SUPPORTS privatization (except for Lincoln Chafee.)

[Raksha]

6. No, I didn't know that. Are their opponents confronting them with it?

Re >>Did you know that EVERY GOP Senate candidate in a competitive race SUPPORTS privatization (except for Lincoln Chafee.)<<

If that's true, ALL the Dems should be pounding on it 24/7.

[Ignacio Upton]

26. The following GOP Senate candidates support phaseout or flip flopped:

(and this is just for competitive races:)

Steele, McGavick, Kean Jr., DeWine, Burns, Santorum, Kennedy, and Allen. That's all from my memory. I can't remember where Kyl in Arizona stands, or where Corker in Tennessee stands. I got the info from Campaign for American's Future:

http://socialsecurity.ourfuture.org/research-center/

[hedgehog]

32. They all need to be shouting this from the rooftops

Iraq is over there. Social Security is over here. Every Democratic candidate should be campaigning with someone who lost everything with Enron!

[ProgressiveEconomist]

9. Here's a free LINK--Is this the item you saw?

http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110008919 ?

Usually anything you see on the WSJ Editorial Page is posted to their free editorial site, opinionjournal.com

[lovuian]

10. Let this be the Issue for 2006 the polls will crash

for Republicans

[athena]

48. YES! We need to make a big deal out of this!

If Bush had any brains at all, he would have waited until after the elections to even mention social security. There is no support whatsoever among the public for privatizing social security. Long before Katrina, long before Terry Schiavo, Bush had begun to make himself very unpopular because he was pushing for social security "reform".

Please, everyone: forward the news to as many people as possible. Talk about it with others whenever you can. Don't let anyone forget that Bush said he will privitize social security if the republicans win in November. Bush wants to make the election about terrorism; we should make it about securing social security.

[MoonRiver]

14. Bring it on!

Double dare ya Pukes. They will lose so bad they may never see the political light of day again.

[CarlVK]

15. He has LITTLE support for this

which hasnt changed since he started with this hairbrained idea. He's fantasizing as usual. Dno't be distracted with this. Keep the heat on the Iraq War and the Economy.

[CatWoman]

17. he had to invent support for the Iraq War

what a loser POS

[CarlVK]

86. Correct. But you know he really blew his wad and now its gone

which is why I'm not that surprised at his support FINALLY sinking. for the life of me I can't figure out what took people so long?

[gordianot]

19. It might be possible only if martial law is declared.

Suspension replacement of Social Security will only occur with the complete suspension of the Republic.

[mitchum]

22. Well, there ya go

[mentalsolstice]

23. Hillary

I don't have a link or an exact quote...However, I remember Hillary, after her first year in the Senate saying something to the effect...when she first got there she was upset that GWB was dismantling Bill's achievements, and she took it personally and was depressed about it. But then she realized GWB was trying to dismantle every social program created from FDR on up...

Bush is trying to undo the advances of the 20th century entirely...he wants to take us back to the time of sweatshops, and to the time when there was only two classes, the very rich and the very poor. If you're in the latter class, according to him, you should work until you drop dead.

[hedgehog]

33. Bush hasn't learned a thing since he heard his old man and his

grandparents rant against Roosevelt when he was a kid.

[katinmn]

25. In america, social security trumps imperialism any day of the week

Why aren't Dems holding this as a unifying torch?

Jeebus. We're the Baby Boomer nation, in debt to our eyeballs, and and I bet 60-70 percent are counting on that SS check come 67.

This issue alone would assure a Dem majority in both houses if only the Dems would say: "Repubs want to to take away your social security."

It's like telling the fundies: "Dems will ban your Bible" only stronger and scarier.

[Imagevision]

27. And just how does a lame duck president pull this one off??

[Imagevision]

31. Bush presidential power to be Phased Out after 2006 election

[scarface2004]

34. fine...then give me back all the socsecurity

i've had withheld since my first job as a busboy you asshole!!

[Corgigal]

36. What a gift for the platform

Someone, get grandma and grandpa out there making some commercial. Have some alpo can's on the counter and place over due bills next to it. What a symbol for republican values. Starving old people....

Hop, hop.

[gully]

37. Republicans want to undo "The New Deal"

http://www.bergen.org/AAST/Projects/depression/successes.html

That means no FDIC, no child labor laws, no regulation of shady stock deals, no social security and more.

[file83]

66. They want to take this nation back 100 years...

to the "good ol' days" -- shit, they don't call it the "Grand Old Party" for nothin'.

[lonestarnot]

41. He thinks? first of all, and second of all he may know about the cheat is

in. bbwwwwwwwwwwwwwwaaaa he thinks :rofl: now that is an oxymoron.

[EVDebs]

43. Well, he just touched the Third Rail of politics and let's hope

he has his arms around all those R candidates !

[tyedyeto]

46. If they try to take away the years of taxes I have paid

to Social Security (I started paying into this in 1966 while in high school), I will do all I can to insure that those receiving it NOW, will never see another red cent of it.

I know many old folks who are getting only Soc Sec as income but you talk to them and they are so Repug it's pitiful. The mindset they have... 'I've got mine but you are totally fucked and I don't give a shit' is very common among the 70+ crowd down here in retirement city.

You would think they would be more receptive to the average worker but they think the Repugs are looking out for their ass. These same folks believe that their 'heirs' will have to pay estate taxes on their modest $100K-200K home when they die. They drank the Kool-Aid!!!!!!!

How can we turn them around?

[shanti]

47. of course he's still going for it

it's a PNAC item. they have to complete ALL the items on their agenda.

[ima_sinnic]

52. in 2008 I will be eligible to receive SS, & it better be there!

Under a sane administration that wasn't threatening my funds, I'd wait until I was 70 to start collecting, so I could get the max. But since it looks like the shitty little greed-head punk liar has now targeted SS, which I've been paying into since the Olden Dayes, I am now making a defnite plan to start collecting on The Day I turn 62. As a graduate of the 1960s School of Protest and Civil Disobedience, I WILL be "a force to be reckoned with" if the repukes mess with my SS!

[GreenTea]

53. Man, you are correct...Bush announced they will hold...His only legacy

can be, his dreams can only be to destroy the "New Deal" -"Social Security"- Bush will be the king among the rich if he can do the impossible...that's truly his goal...They thought it could never ever, ever be done...So tuff-guy, --- And...Daddy's boy, will do it, in our face...Fuck Iraq, (except for the profits) it's all about destroying Social Security... destroy..privatize...they'll steal the majority again, and they'll do it!!

Privatization!

[bananas]

56. Medicare too.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2094546

[Peggy Day]

63. Look's like the fix is in nt

[cassiepriam]

82. Yes I thought the same thing. He already knows......

looks like Baker and Rove have it all in the bag already.

[wiggs]

64. This was said for two reasons....

1) fundraising from wall street corps for november elections

2) to give a bump to wall street indexes heading into elections

[athena]

79. It wasn't said for any reason at all.

Do you honestly believe that Bush always thinks before he speaks? Karl Rove must be kicking him right now. Bush let this one slip out by accident. He's angry that the Democrats appear to be winning, and we all know he acts irrationally when he's angry. (Remember the first debate in 2004?)

Democrats have to keep quoting him on this until the elections.

[BlueStorm]

68. I am on Social Security...

I certainly hope this won't happen as I am soley surviving off of it. I also need Medicare and Medicaid. If this dumbfuck in office suceeds I certainly hope that I can go to school and learn a trade so that I could move to Canada.

BLue

[The Count]

70. All Dem candidates need to drum this statement!

It's the kind of stuff that gets people to the polls.

[earth mom]

78. SOCIAL SECURITY IS NOT BROKEN!!!

Yup, posted 3 times in this thread because this issue is that important! Let's not let them get away with this shit people! Yes, shit because this LIE stinks to high heaven! :puke:

[Spiffarino]

80. I wish I'd known this an hour ago

A little old lady was standing in front of the Charles Taylor (R-Asshole) booth at the NC Mountain State Fair. As I looked on I heard her asking Taylor's representative about Medicare and Medicaid bills Taylor had supported. He was giving her all kinds of fluff about how great it was and she didn't seem to be buying any of it. How I wish I'd known about Bush's statement...I'd have given them both something to think about.

[cassiepriam]

81. Private accts all managed by Halliburton and other cronies?

There is no end to the corruption and greed is there?

[Wiley50]

83. R U UAW/Saturn by any chance?

If so, we have things in common