Help - I've got a crazy freeper cousin too.

[tenshi816]

We haven't spoken since the summer before the 2004 election, nor have I responded to her various "Jesus loves you" e-mails since a rather heated exchange we had the day before the election when she sent me a message telling me to be sure to vote for GWB because "he's a good Christian man".

She was my favorite cousin too although we didn't see each other much, what with me being in England and her in Georgia.

Anyway, today out of the blue I received the following e-mail from her:

By the NewsMax.com Staff
For the story behind the story...
Tuesday, Aug. 9, 2005 12:06 p.m. EDT

Clinton Admin. Knew of 9/11 Hijackers

More than a year before the 9/11 attacks, Clinton administration intelligence officials had identified four of the 19 9/11 hijackers as a terrorist threat - including al-Qaida team leader Mohamed Atta and his partner Marwan al-Shehhi, whose planes destroyed the World Trade Center and killed over 2,700 people.

But the critical information was not acted on, at least in part, because of prohibitions against intelligence sharing implemented by former Deputy Attorney General Jamie Gorelick, who was reportedly installed in her post at the insistence of then-first lady Hillary Clinton.

I wrote back immediately saying that NewsMax wouldn't know the truth if it bit them on the ass, and that their use of "reportedly" and the lack of a specific reporter's byline meant that they had nothing to back up their allegations. I also said that even if the Clinton team had known the identities of some of the 9/11 hijackers, they knew that they couldn't arrest someone who hadn't committed a crime yet (unlike the current administration). I went on to say that the Clinton administration had tried to warn Bush, but their warnings went unheeded until it was too late, and I then asked my cousin who among the people behind 9/11 had Bush captured (answer: none, and they never will capture them because they're too useful). I also pointed out that Clinton could hardly be called soft on terrorism because he caught the 1993 WTC bombers and Timothy McVeigh, and sent the link to the 1996 CNN article where Clinton called for beefing up anti-terrorism measures, only to be rebuffed by the Republicans.

My question is, what else should I add when my cousin gets back to me? I really would like to enlighten her, but she's so indoctrinated by her church that she's hard to get through to sometimes. On the other hand, she respects my inquiring mind (we went to high school together so she knows what I'm like) and I'm hoping she'll at least look at some of the stuff I send her. As far as video goes, I've sent her 9/11: Press for Truth and the segment of Bush Family Fortunes that deals with the Bush/bin Laden connection.

Finally, is there any truth at all in the NewsMax allegation of "prohibitions against intelligence sharing implemented by former Deputy Attorney General Jamie Gorelick"?

[meegbear]

1. Media Matters has a good writeup on it ...

http://mediamatters.org/items/200508180007?offset=20&show=1

[liberaldemocrat7]

7. I do not consider George W Bush a christian.

as most Republicans as well. They tend not to follow his teachings of caring for the least of these.

Oh yes they will say but Jeeeebusssss never meant for the government to take care of the poor.

Baloney. Jesus lived in a period of slavery and a senate that only represented the upper class.

[tenshi816]

11. Thanks for that link.

It certainly clears up the NewsMax crap my cousin sent to me, although I doubt she'll read the Media Matters link when I send it to her. She's a freeper; they're not so much on the lengthy reading and critical thinking. In fact, I can picture her in my head now ("but, but, but NewsMax said...").

[rfranklin]

2. You probably cannot change her mind because...

the fundamentalist have aligned themselves with the rightwing Republican Party. Believing in Bush has become integral to belief, i.e, Bush is a "good Christian man." Now, we know that this is a crock but them it is a matter of faith and no facts will change that.

[annabanana]

3. It really sounds like you've got it covered.....

Good Work!

[William769]

4. Sorry to say she's a lost cause.

No matter what you say or facts you provide, I don't think will do any good.

She may be your cousin, but there have been some in my family that are just as hopeless. I suggest reading a good book you'll it enjoy it better.

[tanyev]

5. Send her this.

President wants Senate to hurry with new anti-terrorism laws
July 30, 1996
Web posted at: 8:40 p.m. EDT
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- President Clinton urged Congress Tuesday to act swiftly in developing anti-terrorism legislation before its August recess. (1.6 MB AIFF or WAV sound)

"We need to keep this country together right now. We need to focus on this terrorism issue," Clinton said during a White House news conference.

But while the president pushed for quick legislation, Republican lawmakers hardened their stance against some of the proposed anti-terrorism measures.

One key GOP senator was more critical, calling a proposed study of chemical markers in explosives "a phony issue."

http://www.cnn.com/US/9607/30/clinton.terrorism/



Oh, and while you're at it, ask her if she's seen this site: www.bushisantichrist.com

[tenshi816]

9. I did already.

She replied back that she watched The Path to 9/11... :banghead:

[zbdent]

6. Ask this:

"If Clinton was clearly and undeniably at fault for dropping the ball on the war on terror, then why was Bush and his administration so adamant against testifying (not just having a casual conversation) under oath to the 9/11 commission that they fought against actually having? If Clinton was at fault, don't you think that this administration would have wanted Clinton exposed?"

[zeemike]

8. I think you have done the best you can with politics

But the source of her delusion is caused by the subversion of religious belief not the actual facts of history.
I would issue a challenge to her like this;
Using only the words of Jesus in the bible justify any of the things that Bush and his administration has done. That is a problem for the religious because Jesus spoke often and forcefully against almost every thing he has done. And then ask her if a "man of God" would do the opposite of what Jesus taught.
The question then is does bush do the work of God or the devil.

[YOY]

10. She is getting her news from NewsMax

That alone is a sign that she is well beyond hope...

[FSogol]

12. Tell her that "Bearing False Witness" is a sin and that you will pray for

her.

[Habibi]

13. Tell her that Ashcroft downgraded terrorism as a priority

and the Justice Department "curtailed a highly classified program called "Catcher's Mitt" to monitor Al Qaeda suspects in the United States":

http://web.archive.org/web/20040401142034/http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040321/nysu007a_1.html

[tenshi816]

16. Thank you for that information.

The latest e-mail from my misguided relative, referring to The Path to 9/11 (after I told her it was largely fictionalized), said: "If the movie wasn't telling the truth, I don't think they would have put it out there." (This is what I worry about in the mid-terms, that too many voters will think the same thing and fall back on the "Republicans = safety" meme.)

Then my cousin went back on to "Bill Clinton didn't do anything to stop 9/11". Maybe your link will help. On the other hand, I really don't know. It's shocking the amount of cognitive dissonance that goes on in freeper minds. Every time I get my cousin backed into a corner, she just says "we'll have to agree to disagree" (it's what wingers always do when they're losing an argument) - I truly despair of her ever critically examining anything I send her, but it won't stop me from trying now.

Actually, my cousin is a textbook born-again freeper. In her youth, she was really wild, drinking, drugging, petty larceny, hanging out with biker gangs - even doing a brief prison sentence. Now, in middle age, she has embraced Jesus, Republican politics and rabid anti-abortionism. Like many people with addictive personalities, she's just exchanged one set of addictive behaviors for another. She's afraid to let truth intrude on her world because she's comfortable where she is, with her pastor and church friends telling her what to think. She needs their acceptance to feel validated.

[Habibi]

17. Heh. Well, maybe it's time

to get her high again!

:smoke:

[Sydnie]

14. Tell her to google 'Able Danger' and get a true education

about what blivet** knew, when he knew it, and what he did with it.

A little reminder about what Plame was working on before they outted her wouldn't hurt either.

[immoderate]

15. About intelligence sharing.

That didn't start with Jamie Gorelick. That was a remnant of Nixon era abusive spying on domestic dissenters. She was enforcing laws that have been on the books since the seventies.

--IMM