Christian Newswire: "Lesbian activist actress recklessly irresponsible"

[Bluebear]

WASHINGTON, Sept. 14 /Christian Newswire/ -- Rev. Rob Schenck, founder of Faith and Action, a Washington, DC based Christian ministry on Capitol Hill spoke out today about comments made by co-host Rosie O’Donnell on ABC’s daytime talk show “The View”. During a discussion about the war on terror the lesbian activist actress said, "Radical Christianity is just as threatening as radical Islam in a country like America."

Schenck said, "Miss O'Donnell's comment was recklessly irresponsible and even dangerous. To equate 'radical Christianity' to mass murder is outrageous. A 'radical Christian' is one who takes his or her faith seriously--a faith that has as one of its primary tenets, 'Blessed are the peacemakers.'"

Referencing a new Baylor University study on religious identities, Schenck pointed out, “O’Donnell’s comments are dripping with contempt and hostility for the vast majority of Americans who consider themselves religious.”

He continued, “Miss O'Donnell's remarks foster suspicion, animosity and prejudice. She owes every American--especially Christian Americans--an immediate apology and a retraction. If she refuses, she will have contributed significantly to the suffering of Christians around the world."

Schenck chastised O’Donnell and the entertainment industry for promoting religious intolerance. He pointed out that because the entertainment industry has a power like no other medium to affect public opinion and cultural attitudes it has an obligation to act responsibly. Schenck noted the catastrophic consequences of that occurred in Nazi Germany when the entertainment industry became a propaganda tool that bred hatred of Jews and other forms of religious intolerance.

http://www.earnedmedia.org/FAA0914.htm

[NC_Nurse]

1. SO true!

Rock on Rosie!

[Annces]

2. Ha, Ha, taste of their own medicine

The rabid dogs.

[mark414]

3. so now 84% of the country is like the european jews of the 30's and 40's?

oh you poor poor christian man...it must be SO hard with your christian president and christian congress and christian supreme court to get by in this world...

[Jo March]

6. When all else fails, call your detractors "Nazis", right?

:eyes:

Rev. Rob Schenck needs to worry more about the illegal war in Iraq, the thousands of displaced Katrina victims and so on and so on before he worries about Rosie.

[Jo March]

4. Um, no. "Radical Christianity" is when a believer thinks

that ALL people should convert or pretty much die. Radical Christians bomb abortion clinics and blow up federal buildings. They picket the funerals of dead soldiers. They send out messages saying "Shut up or die" to those who do not believe as they do.

Christianity is a peaceful religion until you get the radicals involved.

Memo to Rev. Rob Schenck, Bush is a radical Christian - he thinks that God told him to bomb the heck out of Iraq. :eyes: Not very peacemaking of him.

A Christian believes in "blessed are the peacemakers."

A radical Christian believes "kill them and let God sort them out."

Edited to fix HTML tag.

[etherealtruth]

15. That pretty much sums it up ...

The only Change I would make, is to replace "Radical Christian" with (to quote a dearly departed poster) "religiously insane."

[Jo March]

32. Well, I think that saying "religiously insane" absolves them of guilt

If you are insane, then you aren't really responsible for your actions.

To take a peaceful faith and twist it to pursue your own bloodlust and greed - well, I believe that is a choice. It's an evil choice but still a choice. There should be consequences to the actions of these folks.

Bomb an abortion clinic? You are not religiously insane. You are a criminal, period. Oh, and maybe a radical Christian. Either way, don't blame it on insanity!

:D

[etherealtruth]

39. Point taken ... n/t

[lonestarnot]

25. True dat!

:hi:

[Jo March]

27. Hey, darlin'!

:*

[lonestarnot]

35. Huggs to arnheim!

:grouphug:

[EFerrari]

38. Hey, she's mine!

:hug:

:grouphug:

lol

[Jo March]

46. You guys are nuts!

But I love you both! :loveya: :grouphug:

Lonestarnot, the next march that we have, I would still want to follow you: "George W. Bush is a serial killer!" :D

[lonestarnot]

49. LOL That he is!

[Leopolds Ghost]

45. I'd agree with you except that's not how radicals on the left see it.

http://jesusradicals.com

And I read their account and agreed with their definition of "radical" long before Rosie or this pastor came along.

Before you may reply, "well, anyone who would cal themselves a radical
or a radical leftist is beyond the pale" you may wish to consider what
an average man on the street would have to say about many of the things
that are common knowledge to us here on DU.

They would say, "you are a radical leftist and your opinion counts for sh*t, and furthermore I don't care if you got beat up at the protest, you deserve it because of your radical, pacifist garbage."

Because I've had people say stuff like that to me and my friends.

So, yes, I take issue with anyone who

(a) think religion, or even misguided fundamentalism, is the source of the world's problems -- as if people like Dobson and Bin Laden were motivated by an excess of the sentiments expressed by people like Jesus and Gandhi.

(b) associate "radical" (which most of us should prefer to being called a "leftist" unless you believe in a state-run economy) with "extreme, immoderate, EVIL".

[funflower]

5. The comparison to Nazi Germany is ironic....

Schenck noted the catastrophic consequences of that occurred in Nazi Germany when the entertainment industry became a propaganda tool that bred hatred of Jews and other forms of religious intolerance.


Nazi Germany. I think that was when the "radical" Christian majority cooked the Jews, Gypsies and, er, homosexuals, right? I don't recall anyone being sent to the ovens for being a Christian.

[mnhtnbb]

10. Actually, if you opposed Hitler, regardless of religion, you were toast.

[Bluebear]

34. I notice the right can conjur up "Nazi Germany" when they feel like it.

If we do, we are "beyond the pale".

[Cha]

66. I've just taken it away from the

"pale" for us on the left to compare bush to hitler with his heil bush fucking salutes.

Goebbles anyone? With their catapulting the propoganda in the corporate media? If they want to get in a nazi comparison, I say "bring it.".

[MrModerate]

7. To the degree that "radical Christians" bear some responsibility . . .

For enabling Bush's Iraq war, equating its believers with mass murderers is factually correct. Somewhere between 40 thousand and 100 thousand Iraqis have died for that particular sin. That meets MY definition of mass murder.

If the sandal fits . . .

[xchrom]

8. as a believer -- i can honestly say that

radical christians are a cancer on the faith.

[Jo March]

9. Amen to that.

:hi:

[xchrom]

12. hi arnheim!

:hi:

[Jo March]

16. Non-radical Christian, right here

Unless it's opposite world in which case I'm the radical for believing all of that peace, love and tolerance crap that Jesus taught!

:rofl:

[EFerrari]

31. How can all these Christians just completely ignore CHRIST?

It's just SO weird!

I'm not crazy about all that crucification stuff that various churches have turned into a creepy worship but the guy had it going on with all that peace, love and tolerance he kept talking about.

lol

:)

[Jo March]

33. I've always wondered that too

I have Christian friends who totally support the war with Iraq. When asked about the dead and dying, they just seem to gloss that over.

Who would Christ bomb, indeed?

I love Christ. I love His teachings. His teachings are why I am a Democrat. Not much peace, love and tolerance from the other side, is there?

[EFerrari]

36. They are full of hatred. How in the world does anyone mistake them

for spiritual people? It's crazy.

There is no "Christian Right". The appropriate term is "fascists".

:shrug:

[dkofos]

29. As a non-believer, I say the same thing.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

11. Boy they just get so rabid when someone dares to speak the

truth about their cult.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=214&topic_id=87957&mesg_id=87957

[Disturbed]

14. Fundies love this.

They lap up this stuff. It gives them what they need to whine and dominate with their demented agenda.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

20. I know what you mean, it is just pathetic to watch

Like someone else pointed out, they should go to some of these other countries where they really do persecute people for their religious beliefs.

[Jo March]

24. I worked with a guy who truly believes that Christians are persecuted

in this country. I could not believe it. His proof? No prayer in school. When I pointed out that there is, indeed, prayer in school but not organized prayer, he just responded, "You can't even mention Jesus's name in a public school."

I wandered off and wondered what drug he was on. :crazy:

[Freedom_from_Chains]

37. Yeah there is no talking to these people.

I use to think, years ago, that rational argument and presentation of proofs would persuade them. But over time I learned it has nothing to do with proofs and facts. They have a belief and to them that belief is true no matter what the evidence shows. So these days I have just given up.

[Jo March]

60. The masochist in me keeps trying

It's just funny because his eyes just glazed over and it was as if he turned into a robot. Scary.

Sigh.

[Jo March]

19. Just remember not to lump us all with those guys!

That's all I ask, lol!!

[SoCalDemGrrl]

13. O'Leilly made a huge deal of this last night too.Christianity under attack

Hey they think it'll be good for the GOP in November is they can portray

us Democrats as Godless heathens who are a threat to Christianity.. PULEEEEZE!!!:puke:

[Jo March]

22. Well, the war on Christmas is gearing up, you know

And don't you DARE mock the War on Christmas!!

[SoCalDemGrrl]

52. Yeah - and I can't Wait for the War on Easter!!

[Jo March]

55. Well, the War on Easter is really a minor war

Besides, weren't we keeping it on the down-low?? If so, you just let the cat out of the bag! :spank:

:evilgrin:

[SoCalDemGrrl]

68. Oops. My Bad!!

[conflictgirl]

17. That moran clearly lacks reading comprehension skills

It's radical Christians that are the problem, not Christians period. It's the ones who want the Bible taught in schools, who support bombing abortion clinics, who think there should be no line between church and state, etc. The people who hold those beliefs may be Christian, but they don't define the faith. Similarly, the Muslims who advocate suicide bombings are not representative of Islam.

Fundamentalism of ANY variety is dangerous.

[Nikki Stone 1]

18. "Recklessly irresponsible"--that about sums up Iraq

:evilgrin:

[originalpckelly]

21. I guess those weren't Christian terrorists who blew up the abortion...

clinics. They were wrath-of-The-Lord-ists.

[Leopolds Ghost]

47. I guess those weren't Muslim terrorists either.

Don't tell me Pol Pot wasn't a Buddhist.

Don't tell me Stalin wasn't an atheist.

Don't tell me Hitler wasn't Catholic

(because he sure as shit wasn't a fundamentalist, although quite a lot of his modern-day fascist followers happen to be fundamentalists.)

Etc.

This cuts both ways. If you want, you can say "I'm equal-opportunity
opposed to religion, and I think it originates, or leads to murder
regardless" but then you're just saying you find religion intolerable.

[Zhade]

53. Stalin's crimes were not driven by, nor done in the name of, atheism.

And, of course, atheism is not a religion.

[Jo March]

61. Right. Wasn't Stalin just pure evil?

And that's what drove him? :shrug:

Just sayin'.

[Zhade]

69. He was pretty twisted, no doubt!

NT!

[dkofos]

23. Why do they hate the truth??

[Jo March]

26. They hate the truth for its freedoms.

Silly!:silly:

[Marnieworld]

28. Well he just proved her point

Restricting speech, mentioning her sexuality repeatedly to discredit her, and overall deciding that she is a second-class citizen with limited rights and legal benefits because of it, is the Radical Christianity that she was talking about. This goes right along with another radical christian propoganda piece I read today from the Family Research COuncil I believe that is diseminating the talking point that Christians are under attack. Apparently, according to them, just defending gay rights is an attack on their religion. Waaaa! I want to hate someone and hide behind the bible and they won't let me! Waaaa!

They declared war on her before she uttered a word. I'm not worried though. People can say what they want about her but no one can say she can't speak up for herself.

[Raksha]

30. Screw this hypocritical asshole.

Re >>Schenck said, "Miss O'Donnell's comment was recklessly irresponsible and even dangerous. To equate 'radical Christianity' to mass murder is outrageous. A 'radical Christian' is one who takes his or her faith seriously--a faith that has as one of its primary tenets, 'Blessed are the peacemakers.'"<<

So what has this Capitol Hill-based "Christian" spokesman been doing in the way of "peacemaking" lately? I'm surprised he even remembered the quotation!

[Red Right and BLUE]

40. They just HAD to throw the "lesbian' part in there

as if it's relevant. Crybabies.

[Leopolds Ghost]

44. Yes, AND if they hadn't, I would have thought it was a left perspective.

Given the defense of the term "radical" which I myself cited in a previous thread because it is A CHRISTIAN LEFT ARGUMENT.

This guy is passing himself off as a "radical" social justice activist, people like me who have been upset for years about comments like Rosie made that marginalize committed Christians who care deeply about social justice and other "radical" cause.

The "lesbian" reference is a wink and a nod to this man's real audience, who DETEST "radicals" and refuse to call themselves "radicals".

"Radical" implies not just "at the heart of the issue" or "absolute" but also "social outcast". Radicals elevate the outcast and the downtrodden.

The objective of fascism is to play on people's sense of alienation and desire for REVENGE against the hated majority who are, in their opinion, easily duped by the despised Other, and thus a nation fit only to follow. They are not radicals, they want THEIR beliefs to be the ONLY ACCEPTABLE BELIEFS and despise all others. They want people to conform. "Radicalism" does not apply in a fascist worldview, even as propaganda.

By defending the term "radical" as leftists have long done, this pastor is either confused (most likely) or deliberately pretending to be a Christian leftist.

(probable, as Christian left publications have long commented on this propaganda method used by fascists, who frequently also pretend to be moderate Democrats, protectionist Republicans, you name it. In each case, they adopt the arguments of their doppelganger, with the objective of advocating authoritarianism, which is their most sincerely held belief.)

[Sparkly]

48. Yes, that reminded me of an old "Onion" piece

Titled something like, "Homosexual Man Rescues Family of Six from House Fire."... "Smith, who is gay, crawled through the smoke and carried two of the children to safety. 'When I heard more cries, I knew I'd have to return,' said Smith, who prefers having sex with men rather than women.... " etc...

[Leopolds Ghost]

41. Unfortunately there is a grain of truth (despite the gay-hatred)

Were it not for the hatred of gays and entertainers and general insults expressed by this "pastor", or the (presumably fascist) "Christian Newswire" he represents,

I would not have been able to tell if this were a press release from a left-wing Christian or a right-wing Christian.

Both groups (right and left) have been denounced as "radical".

Both groups, especially radicals on the left, such as radical Christians in the traditional sense of the word "radical", have defended the use of the term "radical". See, for example:

http://www.jesusradicals.com

Never mind the fact that right-wing extremist beliefs (which are all quite similar without any religious justification) are quite "mainstream" in modern day America.

Social justice groups have always been out of the mainstream and denounced as "radical".

It is easy to do when anything immoderate is denounced as "radical".

It is even easier when religious leftists are cut out of the picture by declaring that an immoderate attachment to religion explains fascism, when in fact the people involved were fascists BEFORE they became born-again, and were educated to become fascists BEFORE they grew old enough to understand the (alleged) religious connection to their fascist beliefs.

Unfortunately, I really had to read this press release twice looking for some indication that it had been posted by a Christian-left advocacy group.

I wish it had, because I pointed out the same thing from a left
perspective in a recent post (Rosie really gave the impression that
all immoderately religious people are responsible for our fucked-up world). In other words, the same as Bluebear's post. Only mine was alerted. One of the few replies I got was something along the lines of "when someone takes their religion as seriously as you, it's always an indication" (An indication of what? That they are a Republican? That they are one of the people Rosie is indicting? That they are responsible for the Iraq war?)

Bluebear, you used to be a mod, right? I don't want to be an asshole so I will not comment on the issue of inconsistency here. But I will point out that your thread is on the exact same topic as mine (in fact, you replied to my thread.)

Apparently only fascist Republicans are allowed to cite their religion on DU. by means of "Newswire" press releases no less. Although us Christian leftists are constantly being chided for "allowing right-wing Christians to speak for them".

Most of the "devout Christian Democrats" I've met besides myself are unaware that radical Christian activist groups (in the sense of "radical" similar to that used by many people on the left) even exist,

and in general, the impression tends to be that if you're a liberal Christian, that means you don't take religion too seriously BY DEFINITION.

(My own mother is a liberal Christian who holds resolutely to this common definition of the phrase. She will not support anything that is "radical", "absolute truth", or otherwise immoderate, including, say, belief in stolen elections, or the Iraq war being out and out immoral, or any other absolutist belief.)

More often, as noted on this thread, the very word "radical" has been insulted and condemned as a synonym for "extremist". It is not.

http://www.jesusradicals.com

Saying that "all radicals, religious or otherwise, are to be condemned" is a statement that one is a devout centrist, and believes the Democratic party should govern from the center. That's fine.

However, most American centrists, be they center-left or center-right, detest radicals and do not mind when they are mis-treated by police. That's why we have a Constitution.

Saying that "radical Christianity is wrong" or even that "extreme Christianity is wrong" is simply stereotyping and has nothing to do with condemnation of radicallism. It is simply an assertion that people should be criticised for taking their religion too seriously.

I would ask Rosie (or whoever the host was, I don't pay much attention to daytime TV talk show hosts) to be more clear about which group of "radical Christians" she's referring to, just as I would ask her to be more clear about which group of "radical Muslims" she's referring to EVEN IF she hadn't mentioned Christians.

If she means fundies, she should say so. If she meant Evangelicals, etc. If she was just referring to "all jingoistic consrervatives who use religion as a tool to incite their populace to violence" well, that doesn't support her argument that religion is the heart of the matter.

[Jo March]

63. Great point. I had never heard of Jesus Radicals until this thread

I clicked on the link expecting to be disgusted but was very pleasantly surprised. They simply believe that Christ would never stand for what is going on today - capitalism, wars, flag-worship, etc.

I was pleasantly surprised. :thumbsup:

I don't think that she meant "all jingoistic consrervatives who use religion as a tool to incite their populace to violence." I think that she meant the followers who twist, distort and cherrypick from a religion to justify their own violence, hatred and greed.

And yes, if that's what she meant, she should have said so.

I can see why she didn't in this age of bumpersticker-level comprehension that most folks have. In trying to condense it down, she left room for incorrect interpretation.

[BlackVelvet04]

42. A 'radical Christian' is one

who takes his or her faith seriously--a faith that has as one of its primary tenets, 'Blessed are the peacemakers.'"

If that's true how come so many "radical Christians" support the war in Iraq?

[Leopolds Ghost]

43. No "radical Christian" supports the war in Iraq.

One of the primary goals of "Christian" fascist organizations is to infiltrate faith-based groups, be they liberal, conservative or moderate. If they cannot infiltrate a group that is avouwedly anti-fascist, (say, www.jesusradicals.com) they will co-opt their positions in order to muddy the waters.

These sort of propaganda techniques were pioneered by fascists and adopted by John Birch and other neo-fascist organizations in the US that use "Christian" as a cover label (think "Council of Concerned Citizens" here.) That is the source of Karl Rove's accumulated knowledge of propaganda techniques. (If I'm not mistaken, one of Rove's relatives WAS a fascist, was he not?)

Point is, radicals on the left adopted the defense of the term "radical" over a decade ago -- well before mealy-mouthed fascist organizations decided to copycat left activist groups by pretending that they consider THEMSELVES to be radical.

If you really believe that "radical" refers to right wing extremism ONLY, that is your prerogative, but self-identified "radicals" on the left do not see it that way, and "radical Christians" were among the first left-wing groups to advocate the original use of the term "radical".

The pastor in this "Newswire" is merely copycating a common argument on the Christian left, that "radical" IS NOT analogous to extremist, murderous, mysogynistic or authoritarian.

The word you are lookign for is "fascist" and it is an antonym of "radical" as commonly defined by activists on the left (both Christian and atheist).

Thanks! :-)

[Jo March]

59. I clicked on the link for Jesus Radicals

This is what they have on their home page:

Jesus Radicals aspires to be a resource for those who believe that the Christian Gospel is primarily a message of love and peace, and that militarism, capitalism and the state are idols that stand in stark contrast to the rejection of power by Jesus in favor of a personalist way. If you are questioning the church’s involvement in these idols and wonder if there is a better way to follow Jesus: You are not alone.

I guess in this day and age of militarism, capitalism and the state, these folks are radicals - the good kind!!

I mean, check out these essays:

The Gift of the Other by Joshua Casteel http://www.jesusradicals.com/essays/events/iraqother.html
This essay comes from a military soldier in Iraq Using Derrida he reflects on how we construct notions of "others" in order to justify our own selves and use them as scapegoats.

Catholic Bishop Botean's Pastoral Letter on Iraq http://www.jesusradicals.com/essays/events/Lent_Pastoral_(Iraq)_2003.pdf
This letter calls on all Christians to refuse to participate in this war and calls it a grave moral evil to participate in the attack on Iraq. This is a shining moment in Catholic thought.

Flagolatry: The Golden Calf Returns by Nekeisha Alexis-Manners
http://www.jesusradicals.com/essays/events/flagolatry.html
Commentary on the relationship between the prevalence of the American flag as a response to the September 11 tragedy and the Golden Calf of the Old Testament. Explores the impact of this idolatry on the church.

[bobbieinok]

50. local RW talk host outraged by Rosie's comments

Caller took him to task that he just read the comments; caller claimed 'you didn't get the force of the hatred of christians that she showed when she snarled(?) that comment.'

[The Wielding Truth]

51. Hello, Reverend. Let's write and let him hear that Jesus's way is not

violent hatred, but tolerance,love,and faithfulness.It exists when two or more are gathered in his name and sees all, as children of God. He turned no one away and would abhor the misuse of His teachings to force the secular state rules of greed as represented by the Bush corporate manipulation.
contact Rev. Rob Schenck at :

Faith and Action's ministry plan on Capitol Hill,
[e-mail] <[e-mail]>
or call 703-257-5593

I have my letter almost ready.

[Raffi Ella]

58. Ha! THANK you!

Oh yeah.We need to flood this guy with OUR thoughts on his "request".I'll definitely go let him know just what I think :) Thanks.

:kick:

[ContraBass Black]

54. BINGO!

Lesbian, actress, activist, Nazi, and intolerance! I've got Conservative Victimist Bingo!


I thought O'Donnell was just a talk show host.

[Divine Discontent]

57. DANGIT you beat me to the BINGO!

A 'radical Christian' is one who takes his or her faith seriously


hold on while I crack UPPPPPPP!

oh, Rev. Rob, so a Christian DOESN'T take his or her faith seriously then? We have to have the "radical" part in there to be "real" Christians? What a fruitcake.

As a devout born again Christian, it gives me a more factual argument to point out false prophets like Rev. Rob as point perfect that all men are sinners, even ones that call themselves Christians can be delusional or so obsessed with wanting to be associated with power (God) that they themselves start to put themselves above others, who by the way are certainly more talented and lovely than this hack of a pastor. I loved Rosie in Another Stakeout!

She spoke truth to power, and as always, they fear that. Or, in this case, they love it because they can present her comments to their harpies and say, "look at what that mad lesbian is spewing forth!"

www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<<--- check it out! antibush prodem stickers/shirts

[Raffi Ella]

56. um,yeah Okay.Not only is she dead on right BUT

Him even bringing up the fact that Mrs O'Donnel is a lesbian offends me because we know this is a sin in his book and is meant to slander and discredit her...So,my reply?.

“Rev. Rob Schencks -, founder of Faith and Action, a Washington, DC based Christian ministry on Capitol Hill - remarks foster suspicion, animosity and prejudice. He owes every American an immediate apology and a retraction."

If he doesn't issue one I will take this as a prejudicial and therefor inflammatory remark against gays that could result in even more hate for and hate crimes against Gays and Lesbians.

He has a responsibility as a community leader to act in a responsible way and not encite these kinds of feelings for other Americans regardless of their orientation.

[Deja Q]

62. Oooh, cherrypicking Christian quotes again!

That fella who said "blessed be the peacemakers" probably forgot what it says about the poor, the wealthy, not being selfish, et cetera...

Read my sig line for more.

[Cha]

64. Miss O'Donnell's remarks foster

Truth, but you can't handle the truth, mr.schenck.

[dback]

65. Three words, people: Army...Of...God

Were they not the militia nutcases who shot talk show host Alan Berg and threatened (if not killed) various abortion doctors?

[Maat]

67. Yes, and Tim McVeigh, through his selling of weapons at various

places knew members of the Army of God, Christian Identity, etc. (he was in contact with them, and influenced by the Radical Religious Right).