Rangle--Why the hell is he admonishing Chavez for remarks?

[Carni]

OK, whether or not I agree with Chavez about having our own devil here is pretty immaterial (I happen to agree with him but anyway...)

What is up with C Rangle saying (I think this was just on CNNa few moments ago) that no foreigner should come here and bash our pResident????

Seems to me that our leaders have always felt free to go around admonishing other leaders that they don't like (not to mention our invasion of Iraq based on BS)

Pat Buchanan was just earlier stating on msnbc that Chavez is a big problem for the Democrats and that they should distance themselves and come out against him for his remarks--I thought geez, if Pat says that they should defend the resident...then I think they should do the opposite and say the man can say whatever he likes while he's here as we have a free and open society that welcomes debate (even if that isn't true)

I am verfy disgusted that Rangle seems to be following Buchanan's advice--I had hoped the reps from New York would not cave and rally around this unelected leader of ours and back his sorry ass up (again)

They don't have to support Chavez and his devil remarks... but they certainly don't have to feign outrage over them to win political points with people who won't vote for them anyway.

Grrrrrr! Is it me????

[Armstead]

1. He generally says what he thinks...

I think in this case he's genuinely offended, and not trying to be strategic.

[maddezmom]

9. I agree with you

:)

[MrCoffee]

2. Because he's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't

so why not try to win a fucking election?

[Richardo]

4. .

:thumbsup:

[BurtWorm]

6. Sad fact: You don't win elections in the US calling Bush a devil.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

8. ...

Chavez isn't running for re-election in the United States.

[MrCoffee]

10. Charlie Rangel is, and he's not a fool.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

12. I disagree.

But more to the point, Charlie Rangel didn't call Bush a devil.

[MrCoffee]

16. True, but by not denouncing Chavez, it'll get spun that he did.

We can excoriate him all we want in DU, but it's the politically smart move on his part.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

19. Baloney.

He could have just said "no comment."

[MrCoffee]

21. "Rep. Rangel (D-NY) agrees with Chavez...no comment on *=Devil"

That right there is the tag line for Fox/CNN/MSNBC/ABC/CBS/NBC et al.

[Buzz Clik]

30. Agreed. Even as ignorant as the voting public tends to be...

... they resond poorly to rank insanity.

[KingFlorez]

33. Newsflash, Chavez isn't running for anything here

[MrCoffee]

35. Rangel is.

[KingFlorez]

39. Whatever

[MrCoffee]

44. You're right. He should actively try to lose his seat.

That's one hell of a campaign strategy you've devised, and all in one word.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

52. Funny you should mention that...

I'm not a resident of the 15th district of New York, but if I were, the Rangel's next opponent in the Democratic primary would suddenly look more appealing.

[BurtWorm]

58. I am a resident of the 15th District.

Rangel voted against IWR. He votes against tax cuts. He stood with the CBC in challenging the legitimacy of the Bush administration in both 2000 and 2004. He speaks out again and again against the abuses of power of the Bush adminstration and the Republicans in Congress. He holds town meetings against the war. He votes in almost every way as I myself would vote.

He's not perfect, but he's an excellent representative.

[The Magistrate]

37. Democratic Politicians Distancing Themselves From His Remarks, Sir, Are

"Can't nobody here play this game?"

[Carni]

11. I guess I just think this shouldn't be a problem for the Dems

With the way we have all been gouged by the oil companies for the last four years my own thought was that the Dems could use this to their advantage...it's outrageous that some foreign leader is trying to aid the low income people with reduced priced heating oil.

Guess I just thought Chavez's remarks were more of an embarrassment to the bush reich and had zero to do with the Democrats in NY.

Maybe I'm not thinking about it right because I thought Chavez had a point about our unscrupulous Pres...

[MrCoffee]

14. It's a huge problem for the Dems...

of course they think Chavez was right. Of course they'd love to buy him a beer and pat him on the back. But they can't. Because it would be political suicide to do so. Why do we want Dems to act like children?

[Carni]

27. I guess I preferred Clinton's comments about the issue

I would have preferred to hear that type of a statement from Rangle as opposed to what he stated.

[MrCoffee]

40. Bill ain't running for office.

Charlie did the right thing. You come out hard, and it's not an issue. There won't be any bizarrely worded questions later insinuating that Rangel called el diablo a devil. There's no story to fabricate anymore.

It's the right thing to do.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

3. My guess is...

he's selling out.

[Annces]

5. We can't take our own medicine.

Everyone else is evil, not us.

[maddezmom]

7. Charlie is his own man and has been fighting bushco forever

I don't think Pat B's comments has anything to do with his press conference. :shrug:

[Carni]

17. My only point was when Buchanan suggests strategy

I usually think he's trying to shape the debate in favor of the GOP even though Pat at least pretends to go against Bushit.

Let's just say any time a con suggests that Dem's should do a certain thing my bullshit detectors go off.

[maddezmom]

23. I get what you're saying about Pat

but honestly, Charlie is on our side and even agreed with what Chavez said...just that he shouldn't have said it in his neighborhood, perhaps a bit like my cat....wants to control the property(or debate). Charlie is and has been there to bash * every chance he gets and does a fine job at it.

[Carni]

29. Honestly I was just surprised

Rangle has indeed been so verbal against the chimp that my knee jerk reaction to his comments was one of irritation...I must admit I am probably not a very good focus group at this point as to what the Joe Blow public thinks!

[maddezmom]

34. the great thing about DU is we don't have to care about what joe blow

public thinks...we can have thoughtful discussions on what our guys do. We don't alway agree, but in the end more times than not we agree to disagree. :hug:

[AzDar]

13. Chimpolini sure doesn't mind labeling those he finds disagreeable

as "The Axis of Evil". What's the diff?

[Kahuna]

56. He does it routinely. Remember the repukes and MSM puffing their chests..

out over how tough chimp was at the UN on Tuesday? But it's different when somebody else does it.

[WI_DEM]

15. I think most Americans (not DUers, of course) agree with Rangel

that it was inappropriate for Chavez to say what he did and despite political parties.

[MrCoffee]

18. That's exactly right. Exactly.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

20. Which Americans are these?

The ones who own stock in oil companies, or the ones worried about how they're going to pay for heating oil this winter?

[maddezmom]

24. The ones that are elected politicians

:)

[MrCoffee]

25. The ones who watch 24 hour news

[The Magistrate]

28. The Hundred Millions Or So Who Routinely Vote, Sir

In national elections.

The things we have to win to break the ultra-reactionary strangle-hold on the national government....

"We don't know what we want, but we're ready to bite somebody to get it."

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

36. Really?

I didn't know that the hundred million people who voted in national elections think that Chavez comments were inappropriate.

I haven't seen that study.

I have seen studies that would suggest some 60% of Americans would probably agree with him.

But hey.

[The Magistrate]

45. No, Sir: He Is Out Of The Family

Nobody smacks my kid brother but me: there is no older rule in the book.

It is a very great mistake to imagine that the nearly three fifths of the adult populace here who poll as not approving of the current occupant of the Oval Office consider him a devil incarnate leaving a reek of brimstone where he is present. That is a mere splinter view. Col. Chavez, while in my view an excellent if eccentric fellow, is not particularly popular in our country, and his criticisms, couched in extreme terms, of even unpopular figures and policies, accordingly will be received with angry rejection. It is far and away the best and most beneficial course for a professional politician to take to distance him or her self from such rematks by the Venezuelan leader.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

48. Well, if attacking Chavez will help us win...

Then by all means, let's go get that Chavez bastard.

:eyes:

[The Magistrate]

49. Happy To Have You On Board, Sir....

"We must hang together, or we will surely hang seperately."

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

54. How odd.

"'We must hang together, or we will surely hang seperately.'"

I mean, given the context and all.

[Freddie Stubbs]

31. Heating oil wouldn't be so expensive if Chavez and other OPEC leaders

would increase production. But Chavez would rather keep prices high so that he can be seen as a hero when he offers it at a discount.

[Taoschick]

50. Absolutely

Chavez is on record requesting OPEC to cut production to keep oil prices artificially high.

[Virginia Dare]

22. No American politician can even imply...

that they condone a personal attack on the President, even if he agrees with it.

[Kahuna]

32. I think the UN is usually the venue for leaders to voice their opinions

about other world leaders and their policies. Chimp does it all the time. Chimp even goes to the UN and LIES about other leaders.

[Sensitivity]

38. Agreed. Implication of Rangel Statement is Unique IMUNITY to U.S. Pres

because the U.N. headquarters is in the U.S.

[obnoxiousdrunk]

26. Well Nancy Pelosi

went a step further calling Chavez a modern day thug.

[Cha]

43. But no one can say bush is a

"modern day thug"..actually he's worse. bush is a modern day devil.

[Cha]

41. bush is metaphorically the

devil, I don't what Charlie Rangle says..now off to fighting bush's cry for torture!

[EFerrari]

42. The Republicans are trying to suspend habeus corpus, supress the

vote, invade Iran, and Charlie Rangel is talking about CHAVEZ with whom he probably secretly agrees? Isn't that in some way taking the bait? Isn't that stepping back into a reactive mode?

Most Democrats I know don't think that Chavez speaks for them. :shrug:

[The Magistrate]

47. And Many On The Other Side, Ma'am, And In The Middle

Think or at least suspect what he says is what the left, and hence the Democrats, really do think. So some early distancing is adviseable.

[EFerrari]

57. This is one of the most interesting developments I've witnessed

in a long time. I hope it works for them.

[Singular73]

46. Its you.

Chavez' comments were innappropriate.

[windbreeze]

51. I have read two threads on this now....

and have added my own thoughts to the mix....now I am sitting here LMAO...because it is so funny to watch the reactions...and I have come to the conclusion that being a politician is NOT in my future, immediate or otherwise....LOL..first because I don't like mind games...and second because I see point a and point b, being reached by a direct line...for Rangel to have said what he did...and for it to be explained as politically expedient...well, ok...but the fact is...the UN is an international organization and the property it's on, is not US property..soo technically, Chavez can say whateverthehell he wants to say, within that venue..and no one, including Rangel, (who has * bashed quite a bit himself, oh, it's different when we do it?) needed to say a thing...whether or not it was considered politcally expedient...too funny..damned if you do, and damned if you don't....poor Charlie...(it's called a Pandora's box)
wb

[EarthNeedsHope]

53. He actually came to INTERNATIONAL TERRITORY to bash

"our President"

[quiet.american]

55. Firstly, Bush may be in WH, but he is not my president.

He sleeps peacefully every night even though his criminally negligent policies allowed thousands of our fellow citizens to die horrible deaths (9/11 & Katrina); even though his outright criminal policies cause hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians to be brutalized and slaughtered (Iraq); even though his "don't-give-a-damn" approach does nothing to stem the flow of blood in Darfur; even though his paranoia has him spying on every American through the big telephone and internet companies; and even though his sadistic approach to the environment has brought the world to the tipping point of annihilation -- "devil" is not a strong enough word for this monster.

Say your piece, Hugo.