NYC reservists are being asked to return their Iraq pay!!!!!!

[readmoreoften]

This is sick. The gist of the story is, the government agrees to compensate reservists for the loss of their salaries, health, and pension benefits while they're deployed in Iraq, but they have to pay their lost wages and benefits back (in a lump sum) when they return.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09/23/nyregion/nyregionspecial3/23pay.html?ei=5088&en=8a98e78cab78455d&ex=1316664000&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&pagewanted=print

New York City’s Reservists Are Asked to Return Iraq Pay
By ANDY NEWMAN
When they were called up for military service in the wake of 9/11, hundreds of uniformed city workers in the Reserves faced the suspension of their city health and pension benefits. The city offered them an option: it would keep paying their salaries and continue their benefits, but when they returned they would have to repay the city their city salary or their military pay, whichever was less.

On its face, the offer made sense. And many reservists had only a few days to get their affairs together before shipping out — hardly enough time to consult accountants. Nearly all took the deal. As the war dragged on, more than 1,600 city employees, mostly police officers, signed up for the benefits program.

Now the bills from the city are coming due, for far more than many veterans imagined they would have to pay — as much as $200,000 — and often for more money than they ever received.

[MadMaddie]

1. What the hell is this about?

Is New York insane....to ask these soldiars to put their lives on the line....and then when they get back to kick them in their face :wtf:

[readmoreoften]

2. Kick for manipulated NYers.

I'm sure a lot of these folks signed up after 9-11 with the realistic idea that they'd have to defend the city against another attack. Now they're being murdered and used by the regime.

You mean we can't even make sure our soldiers' family's have health insurance. Fucking disgusting.

[michreject]

13. Is not and never has been an option

I'm sure a lot of these folks signed up after 9-11 with the realistic idea that they'd have to defend the city against another attack.

You sign on the line and go where they tell you to go. PERIOD. You can make requests for a duty assignment. What active military unit is deployed in NY City?

[Rageneau]

3. HOO-AH! Ain't the all-volunteer army wonderful?

[zbdent]

9. Wait a minute ... how many times have we heard RWers say about something

where a person "volunteers" for something, and then gets paid? They scream that "volunteer" means unpaid (at least, when it's a LW type situation) ...

Whenever a RWer says that they troops are "volunteers", point out that their definition of "volunteer", the soldiers wouldn't get paid at all ...

[MethuenProgressive]

4. Um, OK ... but wait, a minute..

They are being required to do what they agreed to do?
It's significantly a much better deal than most reservists get, that's for sure.
Sorry, no sympathy from me on this one.

[HeeBGBz]

5. What they agreed to do was get paid

And not lose their jobs. That was the deal. They put their lives on the line and they deserve to get reinbursed for that.

[MethuenProgressive]

7. They got to keep the higher pay! What a deal!

Most reservists *only* get the promise of having their job held for them, and all they paid is the service pay. These guys got a very good deal, one that I wish all reservists had the option to take.

[Sydnie]

6. They agreed to do something yes, but I would bet dollars to donuts

that they were told that their deployment would be short (has anybody's been short so far?) and that would keep the amount down to a smaller manageable amount. After years of deployment, there is a bill the size that they could only imagine waiting for them.

There is a reason to give NY more homeland security funds, so they can cover this. With Rummy saying that he didn't think it would take 6 months, they agreed to something that would have been more manageable than this monster it has turned into.

Glad things are so black and white for you. They aren't so black and white for many of us though. Yes, they made an agreement, but what they agreed to has morphed into something entirely different than the bill of goods they were sold at the time.

[MethuenProgressive]

8. I'll take a blueberry jelly filled, please.

The deal was they'd get to keep the higher pay. Not keep both paychecks, just keep the higher one. Do you understand what a great promise that was compared to what the average reservist signed up for? The average reservist gets only his military pay - which isn't that much. I'd be nice if ALL reservists got the option to keep getting their civilian pay AND their military pay, but that's never ben an option - this deal where they were offered to be paid at whatever was the higher one was an extraoridinary and generous circumstance.
It *is* a black and white issue. The gray is the fog of emotion.

[readmoreoften]

10. And you live in Kentucky or some other place where rent is $400 a month.

If you don't live in NYC, then you can stop talking about what NYers need. You can't afford to survive in NYC take care of your family on military pay. How about..."reservists" aren't supposed to act as full-time, fully deployed military personel. I see the word "progressive" in your name. Historically, progressives are those who fight for labor rights. Yes, there are reservists who are MORE screwed over than NYers. And people who work at Walmart are paid so poorly that they're eligible for welfare benefits. I suppose that means that I shouldn't support any other retail labor strike because they don't have it "as bad" as Walmart workers.

This issue is black and white, alright. And the only gray are the cold, clinical people who like to argue and muddle that which is perfectly clear: people who are risking their lives to fulfill a duty to their country shouldn't have to worry about losing their home because there is such a serious gap between military pay and their regular pay and they shouldn't have to return to a $200,000 bill to the government...including taxes on the loan.

Yeah, yeah, I know you're going to say that you don't live in Kentucky at all... that you live in suburban Massachussets. Whatever.

[MethuenProgressive]

11. OK, you need to "read more" closely

Reservists lose their regular pay, and have to live on miltary pay while they serve. All they get is a promise of getting their job back when they get back.

The news story says that these NYC employees were offered their regular pay, or their military pay - whichever was the higher dollar figure. This was a very generous offer! I wish all reservists were offered such a sweet deal!

Where you've hit a logic speedbump is that they were not offered BOTH paychecks, just the higher one, and you've somehow decided I'm advocating they only should get the lower paycheck. Please, read what I wrote more closely, and you'll see that you're very wrong about what you think I said.

Post#4: They are being required to do what they agreed to do?
It's significantly a much better deal than most reservists get, that's for sure.
Sorry, no sympathy from me on this one.

Post #7: Most reservists *only* get the promise of having their job held for them, and all they paid is the service pay. These guys got a very good deal, one that I wish all reservists had the option to take.

Post #8: The deal was they'd get to keep the higher pay. Not keep both paychecks, just keep the higher one. Do you understand what a great promise that was compared to what the average reservist signed up for? The average reservist gets only his military pay - which isn't that much. I'd be nice if ALL reservists got the option to keep getting their civilian pay AND their military pay, but that's never been an option - this deal where they were offered to be paid at whatever was the higher one was an extraordinary and generous circumstance.

Nowhere in there did I say they should get the lower paycheck, ReadMore...

[michreject]

12. To some

reading comprehension is an alien subject.

It is a very good deal for the reservist.

[nedbal]

14. I as a NYC union steward have worked with some that were called up.....

.


While not in the reserves myself, I have answered many a question about pay and benefits for those called up. ANY that are now claiming they are shocked by having to pay back their military pay to NYC while getting their full base pay and benefits must have a IQ of 62. They get 22 days a year for normal military reserve leave training (above normal vacation and sick). If called up Rudy Giuliani for the first gulf war also gave them full pay. more recently Bloomberg also did this policy. Yes they may have to do more on their IRS forms at the end of the year. Understand many/most stay in the reserves due to the extra reserve pay and reserve retirement they get, not thinking forward that they may actually get called up for a action such as Iraq.

The part about not having to pay "housing allowances" that are included in military income is currently being worked on

I'd like to hear of a better deal anywhere for those in the guard or reserves.