Have You Read The Bill?

[Jcrowley]

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c109:1:./temp/~c109MVBFIq::

SEC. 7. TREATY OBLIGATIONS NOT ESTABLISHING GROUNDS FOR CERTAIN CLAIMS.

(a) In General- No person may invoke the Geneva Conventions, or any protocols thereto, in any habeas or civil action or proceeding to which the United States, or a current or former officer, employee, member of the Armed Forces, or other agent of the United States, is a party, as a source of rights in any court of the United States or its States or territories.

(b) Geneva Conventions Defined- In this section, the term `Geneva Conventions' means--

(1) the Convention for the Amelioration of the Condition of the Wounded and Sick in Armed Forces in the Field, done at Geneva August 12, 1949 (6 UST 3217);

(2) the Convention for the Amelioration of the Condition of the Wounded, Sick, and Shipwrecked Members of the Armed Forces at Sea, done at Geneva August 12, 1949 (6 UST 3217);

(3) the Convention Relative to the Treatment of Prisoners of War, done at Geneva August 12, 1949 (6 UST 3316); and

(4) the Convention Relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War, done at Geneva August 12, 1949 (6 UST 3516).

SEC. 8. IMPLEMENTATION OF TREATY OBLIGATIONS.

(a) Implementation of Treaty Obligations-

(1) IN GENERAL- The acts enumerated in subsection (d) of section 2441 of title 18, United States Code, as added by subsection (b) of this section, and in subsection (c) of this section, constitute violations of common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions prohibited by United States law.

(2) PROHIBITION ON GRAVE BREACHES- The provisions of section 2441 of title 18, United States Code, as amended by this section, fully satisfy the obligation under Article 129 of the Third Geneva Convention for the United States to provide effective penal sanctions for grave breaches which are encompassed in common Article 3 in the context of an armed conflict not of an international character. No foreign or international source of law shall supply a basis for a rule of decision in the courts of the United States in interpreting the prohibitions enumerated in subsection (d) of such section 2441.

(3) INTERPRETATION BY THE PRESIDENT- (A) As provided by the Constitution and by this section, the President has the authority for the United States to interpret the meaning and application of the Geneva Conventions and to promulgate higher standards and administrative regulations for violations of treaty obligations which are not grave breaches of the Geneva Conventions.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c109:1:./temp/~c109MVBFIq:e104603:

[silverojo]

1. Wow....

How is it possible to use so many words to express one simple thought:

Fuck the Geneva Convention--Bush is our dictator.

[MiniMe]

18. Because people might actually figure out whats happening if its...

written in plain english like that

[uppityperson]

2. yes

[Rex]

3. Yup, kinda freaks me out still.

So the law is now whatever they say the law is. Right.

[mb7588a]

4. Love this part:

" the President has the authority for the United States to interpret the meaning and application of the Geneva Conventions"

Apparently the senators don't know who the president is, and how intellectually fucking stupid he is...

[Rex]

7. They get the Supreme Court and the Executive Branch mixed up.

Have we ever had such incompetent and useless people in charge? Ever?

[hootinholler]

5. One of possibly many unconstitutional sentences...

No foreign or international source of law shall supply a basis for a rule of decision in the courts of the United States in interpreting the prohibitions enumerated in subsection (d) of such section 2441.

I bet the courts have something to say about what the constitution says about treaty obligations.

-Hoot

[Marie26]

6. Yes

Scarier than any horror novel.

[Miss Chybil]

8. I wonder how many people they'll execute in kangaroo courts before

the Supreme Court gets around to this one. Not that I have a soft spot for terrorists, but I really worry about the innocent guy who gets picked up because his name sounds like someone else's, or his skin is too brown.

[silverojo]

9. Don't think you're safe if you're white

I'm sure the Bushistas consider Democrats "potential terrorists", too....

[Miss Chybil]

11. I'm sure you're right, but being white does have some privileges

in this country. I'm probably not rich enough to matter, though, or pretty enough, but I'm sure I would still get a better shake than a lot of brown folks. At least, somebody might feel sorry for me before they hung me. I don't know.

I'm sad today. I can't believe any of this. I realize the whole vote thing was a show for the election and will never stand up to the Supreme Court, but it still makes me sad - again. When will this nightmare end?

[bigbrother05]

17. it will be the middle class

[WinkyDink]

21. "[P]otential"??

[valerief]

10. Or he's a war protester. n/t

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

12. So we can't breach Geneva (at least not GRAVELY), but the prez determines

what constitutes a breach. Nice.

[clmbohdem]

13. If the Supremes do not void this, then I will really worry.

We are in some deep constituental law issues. Article 2 says the President has the power to "make treaties" not interpret past treaties. The Supremes voted 5-3 in Hamdi v. Rumsfeld. and said BushCo was breaking the Geneva Convention. If the Supremes thought "make treaties" meant interpret past treaties, then why bother overturning Hamdi v. Rumsfeld.

[StellaBlue]

14. I have the same reaction as to the PATRIOT Act

Did any members of Congress (except Kucinich and Feingold and a few others) actually READ this???

[SlavesandBulldozers]

15. i love how they wrote clever little jokes in.

"the President has the authority. . . to promulgate higher standards."

"the President has the authority . . . to interpret the meaning and application of the Geneva Conventions."

these had me rolling in the aisles for about a half-hour, before i realized that it wasn't a joke. which makes it even more funny for a second until the dread sinks in and I realized that I am in fact living in the twilight zone.

[moondust]

16. But apparently it's okay to invoke them against a "foreigner".

And justice for all! :eyes:


Our insistence that US nationals are not bound by laws that others are required to accept repudiates what we stood for at Nuremberg. It brings us into disrepute as a hypocritical bully. Fair trial requires that everyone be bound equally by the same laws.

BENJAMIN B. FERENCZ
Nuremberg war crimes prosecutor

http://www.benferencz.org/arts/88.html

[Jack Rabbit]

19. !!

:bounce:

[politicat]

20. Please post the bill number

The link provided goes to a temp file that does not survive.

[Catrina]

22. I think it's HR6616 ~ I tried to verify it and this is what I got

The text of HR6616 has not yet been received from GPO

Bills are generally sent to the Library of Congress from the Government Printing Office a day or two after they are introduced on the floor of the House or Senate. Delays can occur when there are a large number of bills to prepare or when a very large bill has to be printed.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas


If that is the number, they should have left out the '1' ~ HR666 seems appropriate.

[Jcrowley]

23. Try Here

You can google HR 6616 Detainee and get links.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c109:H.R.6166:

(24) TERRORISM- Any person subject to this chapter who intentionally kills or inflicts great bodily harm on one or more protected persons, or intentionally engages in an act that evinces a wanton disregard for human life, in a manner calculated to influence or affect the conduct of government or civilian population by intimidation or coercion, or to retaliate against government conduct, shall be punished, if death results to one or more of the victims, by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct, and, if death does not result to any of the victims, by such punishment, other than death, as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(25) PROVIDING MATERIAL SUPPORT FOR TERRORISM-

`(A) OFFENSE- Any person subject to this chapter who provides material support or resources, knowing or intending that they are to be used in preparation for, or in carrying out, an act of terrorism (as set forth in paragraph (24)), or who intentionally provides material support or resources to an international terrorist organization engaged in hostilities against the United States, knowing that such organization has engaged or engages in terrorism (as so set forth), shall be punished as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(B) MATERIAL SUPPORT OR RESOURCES DEFINED- In this paragraph, the term `material support or resources' has the meaning given that term in section 2339A(b) of title 18.

`(26) WRONGFULLY AIDING THE ENEMY- Any person subject to this chapter who, in breach of an allegiance or duty to the United States, knowingly and intentionally aids an enemy of the United States, or one of the co-belligerents of the enemy, shall be punished as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(27) SPYING- Any person subject to this chapter who with intent or reason to believe that it is to be used to the injury of the United States or to the advantage of a foreign power, collects or attempts to collect information by clandestine means or while acting under false pretenses, for the purpose of conveying such information to an enemy of the United States, or one of the co-belligerents of the enemy, shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

`(28) CONSPIRACY- Any person subject to this chapter who conspires to commit one or more substantive offenses triable by military commission under this chapter, and who knowingly does any overt act to effect the object of the conspiracy, shall be punished, if death results to one or more of the victims, by death or such other punishment as a military commission under this chapter may direct, and, if death does not result to any of the victims, by such punishment, other than death, as a military commission under this chapter may direct.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c109:2:./temp/~c109UMIY82:e81730: