Need a little help here re Torture Bill...

[MsKandice01]

Can someone please explain how this particular bill applies, if at all, to American citizens? I've read some conflicting information and I'm getting a little confused.

[magellan]

1. It gives the president the authority to decide who's an unlawful combatant

That's the whole ball of wax as I understand it.

[MsKandice01]

2. Yeah, but according to the bill, does that apply to US citizens?

I don't think it does.

[MrCoffee]

3. It doesn't matter, because the courthouse door is locked.

An american citizen held outside the US cannot seek habeas relief under the act. Guantanamo is a short boat ride away.

[magellan]

5. Or even a citizen within the US

Secret charges can be brought, you can be disappeared. It's your word against theirs. Who's going to stop them? And how do you free yourself when you can't make a call and no one knows where you are?

For those not paying attention, the fascists in charge don't care about laws that tell them what they can't do. THIS law is simply lipstick on what's already happened and will continue to happen. Combine it with the Patriot Act and you'll see no one is safe. If Bush** decides you're a threat (and he gets to define what 'threat' means too) then it's adios amigo.

[rock]

9. Of course it does

a US citizen can be a terror suspect.

[LynnTheDem]

4. Yes it applies to Americans.

President Given Undue Power to Silence Critics

On September 26, 2006, attorneys for the Center for Constitutional Rights (CCR) determined that what appears to be the final version of the Military Commissions Act of 2006 could allow the government to detain the attorneys themselves as 'enemy combatants.' CCR Legal Director Bill Goodman said: "This ominously broad definition of enemy combatants would mean that almost anyone who actively opposes the President or the government could be locked up indefinitely. This bill makes a mockery of the rule of law."

The current version of the Military Commissions redefines an "unlawful enemy combatant" (UEC) so broadly that it could include anyone who organizes a march against the war in Iraq. The bill defines a UEC as "a person who has engaged in hostilities or who has purposefully and materially supported hostilities against the United States" or anyone who "has been determined to be an unlawful enemy combatant by a Combatant Status Review Tribunal or another competent tribunal established under the authority of the President or the Secretary of Defense of the United States." The definition makes no reference to citizenship...
http://www.ccr-ny.org/v2/reports/report.asp?ObjID=zQrItml3Gv&Content=845

As Ms. Ivins said, don't pretend shock when the world starts comparing us to the Nazis.

[MrCoffee]

6. don't pretend shock when they round us up like Jews, either.

[FedUpWithIt All]

7. Jose Padilla was a US Citizen....

bush declared him an enemy combatant. A US court held this up.

Today's Bill does not necessarily distinguish between citizen and non citizen. It simply regards enemy combatants. And we know that US citizens are not exempt from this labeling.

This is the catch 22. This may be where they screwed up. By not defining the Bill as pertaining to non US citizens only they have stepped over Section 9 of the Constitution which says...

The privilege of the writ of habeas corpus shall not be suspended, unless when in cases of rebellion or invasion the public safety may require it.

This Bill cannot supersede the Constitution.

Edited to add...

the Bill also attempts to override two main points of the US Supreme court cases regarding the Geneva Convention rights of detainees. Article 5 of the Geneva Convention says that detainees are due the protections of a default POW status until a competent tribunal determines them an "unlawful combatant". bush tried to SKIP this step and en mass declared all of the detainees unlawful. This is in direct violation of International law, in itself, but it also opens a whole new can of worms...by not allowing the detainees a status review, we are also in violation of following the law granting the detainees default POW rights (such as a fair and speedy trial).

Not only are bushco. War Criminals but Congress is now an accessory. The language in the Bill attempts to justify the act of denying the detainees the right to a status review and determination while condemning the detainees for breaking the laws of the Treaty.

[MrCoffee]

8. The one problem with your argument is that no one can challenge in court

Who has standing to sue? NO ONE has standing to challenge this bill in court.