It's not really about the kind of man Saddam was...it is really about what our country did.

[madfloridian]

It is about the fact that we have become a nation that invades countries who were not a threat. It is about the fact that before that invasion so many lies were told to the country.

It is about the fact that politicians who were in doubt about it often took the easy way out...going along rather than confronting.

It is about the fact that a hurry-up execution was held, and our media gloated and carried on like we had done something wonderful. It is about how we treated another country's leader by showing a soldier examining his mouth on public television.

It is about how we killed his sons and put their bodies on public display on our television...with gloating.

We attacked a country that was no threat, we executed its leader. It is not about that leader and how "bad" he was. It is about how our country has lowered its moral and ethical standards, about how our media is the outlet for the government. It is about the fact that we lost our credibility in the world.

It is about us and what we did. We invaded a country based on lies, we executed its leader, and we showed it on our television mockingly.

[Uncle Joe]

1. Thanks for the post madfloridian

Kicked and recommended

[mdmc]

2. We invaded a country based on lies, we execuated its leader, and we showed it on our television mock

:kick:R

[Solly Mack]

3. Exactly

[cali]

4. That's all absolutely true, but

when people on this forum start calling Saddam a pillar of virtue compared to bushco, or saying that he's a sympathetic figure, or posting mawkish "Daddy" tributes, it sure as hell becomes about him, and about keeping the historical record straight. Despite America's supporting Saddam through his bad acts, despite the whole April Glaspie mixed message thing, Saddam was not merely an American puppet or an American creation, he committed vile acts all on his own. We can do better than whitewashing SAddam as a counterpoint to bushco's bad acts.

[madfloridian]

12. This is not about Saddam....it is about what we have become.

I remember an America that was different. An America that would never have shown the bloated bodies of Saddam's sons on on TV so blatantly. An America that would never have shown a soldier peering into Saddam's mouth for hours.

I remember a country that was never this outrageous.

It does not matter what Saddam was like unless he was an immediate threat to our country. And that he most certainly was not.

I remember an America that would never have shown the execution of a leader whose country we invaded because of lies.

[Cass]

19. My father and I were just discussing this earlier tonight. You said it so much better

than we did.

Excellent post.

[cali]

21. You remember an America that never was n/t

[madfloridian]

22. You are wrong.

There was another America. Not perfect, things were done covertly that most of us wouldn't like.

But never have we done such things so blatantly, so openly, with such disdain for other countries.

Never.

[sanskritwarrior]

26. Bravo sir

agree completely......So we killed his raping murdering sons, boo hoo.

[madfloridian]

28. Who is our country going to murder next? Which country do we attack next?

Which country's leader that angers us? Are we going to kill his sons as well and display their bodies on TV.

We never did that here in America, we were always better than that.

We crossed a line.

Too many have been hardened by the hatred spewed by the extreme right wing.

[sanskritwarrior]

29. What does left or right

have to do with two murdering rapists getting their due??

We created the monster hussein, we helped bring him down. sounds very American to me.

[madfloridian]

30. Which leader's sons do we display next?

Who decides their guilt or innocence.

That "we killed a monster" stuff is only a way to excuse the horrible things we have done.

It is a lame pathetic excuse. It is an excuse for people who won't admit we were lied to and snookered into believing a man who can't even speak without tripping over his own tongue....or wee cowboy boots.

[sanskritwarrior]

31. Hopefully none ever again

just don't expect me to feel sorry for Saddam or his sons.......

[Cha]

32. She already said it

wasn't about sadam and no one expects you to feel sorry for him or his idiot sons.

You completely misread what madfloridian was writing about.

[sanskritwarrior]

33. No I can read

What we did is nothing different than our past history.

we supported bad guys, sometimes we removed the bad guys we supported other times we kept supporting them........America has been like this most of the 20th century if not longer.....

[Cha]

34. It's just getting more and more

blatant with the bushits running the media.

They don't mind showing the horror until it comes time to film the coffins coming back from Iraq.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

5. And what is worse is what our country did not do

in places like Chile, where we allowed (and some say helped) a democratically-elected president to be killed and supported the brutal repression of the Chilean people.

[NanceGreggs]

6. EXCELLENT post, madfloridian!

A concise, to-the-point summary of what this really is all about.

:kick: and Recommended!!!

[madfloridian]

11. I guess the full realization of the propaganda our TVs spew

just hit me worse than ever this week. I haven't watched much TV, but everytime I turn on MSNBC, CNN, or FOX...they were spreading White House memos. All of them, not just Fox anymore.

I think it will get worse without regulation of ownership, or some kind of restrictions. It is almost like cable news has become the voice the right needed to complete their mission.

A good friend and DFA local member died last night. She was an avid letter to the editor writer, and she was so angry about this war, this invasion. Maybe I feel her anger within me today as well as mine.

Thanks for the kind words.

[malaise]

7. Bingo n/t

[mirandapriestly]

8. This country has covertly been killing 3rd world civilians

for years and always the ones who can not retaliate. Now it has just become more blatant. They also have overthrown stable, democratic governments so the bit about "freedom" is , as we all know, a lie.

[Karenina]

14. Haiti? What's THAT???

Didja ever hear of such a place??? Maybe it's just the name of a strip joint in N.O. or sumpin'...

[indepat]

9. Pretty much sums up what we, as a country and a citizenry, are all about

for supporting, in number too large to comprehend, the man, his policies, his wars, his ideas of what America should be all about that are foreign to everything this country should stand for. :shrug:

[az chela]

10. Thank you for writing what I have been feeling!!!

You even mentioned the horrible display of mutilating Saddams sons and then patching them up to look like hideous bloated corpses but what a lot of people didnt know is that at the same time Saddam's sons were killed so was his grandson.Our government was afraid to brag about that.
We created Saddam and then we used him for years and were alllies with him and then when he went against Kuwait,our rich oil buddies we had to take him out,destroy his country and almost a million people who lived there.
How unchristian of you bushco.You are the spawn of the devil and everyone who supports you is equally guilty.
This isnt about 9/11,its about greed,ego and oil

[spanone]

13. You are absolutely correct, IMO. Bush* has destroyed America's Ideals. What made us great.

Saddam & Iraq are personal vengeance that was imposed on our nation.

[90-percent]

15. We still have some goodness

If we were really rotten evil bastards then we would have drawn and quartered Saddam on the Fifty Yard Line during Super bowl halftime.

I think the USA showed tasteful restraint and no gloating at all over the dignified way Saddam met his end.

If we were really bastards, there would have been much better video of the whole thing, too.

I think the hanging shows the world how benevolent and good the USA will be for quite some time. Get over it world, and if you fuck with us, your leader is gonna be in a few spaghetti western scenes in the near future.

-85% Jimmy

:sarcasm:

(post # 999, by the way. One post away from FINALLY having some well deserved DU creds around here)

[madfloridian]

16. I am stunned at your comment.

"I think the hanging shows the world how benevolent and good the USA will be for quite some time. Get over it world, and if you fuck with us, your leader is gonna be in a few spaghetti western scenes in the near future."

I want to think you are joking, but I don't believe you are.

Little Boots has instilled the cowboy mentality in much of our nation.

[sweetheart]

17. Its about the kind of man Saddam was, he was our country

Saddam was a mass murderer, we built him, armed him and celibrated his killings.

Saddam was a liar, we lied for him, we apologized and overlooked his predictable tat.

Saddam is cheney, he is rumsfeld, he is a newly dead Ford,
Parked on the curb of eternity, by all the others,
in the traffic jam on the way to petroverpopulation hell.

Singing the songs of abuse, to all who find them repeatable,
songs of divisions, songs of repent,
wrongful incisions, deadfully silent.

Leader against the lecherous american enemy Saddam died true,
now that he's dead, what'll they say about you.

Its about us and what we did, we joined the british in a 100 year bombing and extermination
of the tigris people for racist kicks... ain't being the lackeys for racist elite's 3000-slick.

Mockingly cockingly, we went to war,
and now that its all gone, who wants some more?
Dead at an angle, deadly right quick,
saddam's joined his sons,
cheney'nrumsfeld's yet undone,

[Pastiche423]

18. Perfectly stated!

K&R

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

20. K & R. You've said it better than I ever could. n/t

:kick: MKJ

[tnlefty]

23. Thank you.

Shock and Awe after all of the deceptions/lies and the misery that has resulted from it and now we're even further into the gutter with this.

After reading Riverbend, I'm very concerned about what will happen next.

Sorry to learn about the loss of your friend.

[madfloridian]

24. Riverbend's posts have concerned me as well.

Appreciate the thoughts. We were not prepared for the loss of our friend. It hit us very hard last evening, like a kick in the gut. It was too unexpected, too sudden.

[madfloridian]

25. This is so sad. A little boy dies after watching Saddam's hanging on TV

http://www.ketv.com/news/10678329/detail.html

"WEBSTER, Texas -- Investigators said a 10-year-old Texas boy apparently was mimicking Saddam Hussein's execution when he hanged himself from a bunk bed. Webster police said Sergio Pelico was found dead in his apartment bedroom after watching a news report on the former Iraqi leader's death.

Police said Sergio tied a slipknot around his neck while on a bunk bed. Investigators think the boy was "experimenting." An autopsy is pending.

The boy's uncle said Sergio asked him about the execution, and that he responded by saying Saddam died because he was "real bad."

"The uncle wonders why television networks showed Saddam with the noose around his neck.?

I am like the uncle, I wonder as well. This event is second only to (or perhaps even succeeds) that horrible shock and awe bombing day on March 20, 2003.

We are no longer the same nation we were.

[PsN2Wind]

27. Saddam was likely the "kind of man" he was

because, as we're finding out, Iraq had to have that "kind of man" to hold it together. We'll leave there with that "kind of man", only with a different name, in charge. The only difference will be that Iraq will be worse off that under Saddam.

[shance]

35. We attacked a country that was no threat, we executed its leader.

Its leader which we manufactured and created, like many other countries.

Good post Floridian.