I saw a video today of bill and hillary clinton laughing and joking with cheney

[still_one]

I think it was during the swearing in ceromony.

We will see what happens in the next two years, but I sense we are all being played for suckers. This is all a game to them.

In the last six years I sensed something wasn't right. Hell, quite a few of the Democrats in Congress rubber-stamped whatever this administration threw at them.

No real resistance on the Supreme Court justices presented by this administration, too many of them voted for the IWR, even though it violated the war powers act, and when bush violated the terms of the IWR, no one called him on it.

In the next two years the Democrats either do their job, or I will not belong to the party they call Democrat, because I will have no idea what they stand for.

The last six years they sure haven't stood for much

[Eric J in MN]

1. On top of that, the "Ethics Bill" which House Democrats...

...are acting proud of is a piece of trash, full of loopholes which let Congressional trips funded by outside groups continue:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3039651

[still_one]

2. It is so important that elections are publically financed, and all lobyists

kicked out of washington

I am cynical, but have not given up hope. At the minimum they better stand strong on getting us out of Iraq, and if that means investigation of this administration, followed by impeachment, then so be it

[Disturbed]

3. I have lost all respect for Bill and Sen Clinton.

I believe that they are both con Artists.

[still_one]

13. Some days I agree with you, other times I look at the Bill Clinton foundation

and what he is trying to do in Africa and remain conflicted

On the whole though, I think they are more concerned with a legacy than an actual contribution, of course if the results are positive, then I guess it is a good thing

[Solomon]

4. What you say could be true, but it has nothing to do with seeing them

smiling and joking together. What do you expect them to do, scowl at each other every time they see one another? Life doesn't work that way. Sometimes you have to share a laugh with your enemy during breaks in the contest.

[shance]

7. Considering what Dick Cheney has inflicted on American kids, you are damned right.

If this is true, then to me its like hanging out with any other mass murderer.

Look at the loss of Iraqi lives and our American troops lives.

For WHAT?

So these wealthy, out of touch, (in Cheneys case, five deferments) white men can make more money off the backs of those they have exploited before?

Money and jewels and elegant hallways doesn't clean the hands of the blood that soaks them.

It sickens my stomach to see them delude and rationalize the pain and loss that is being carelessly dumped on so many people just trying to get by.

It is despicable to observe these people who have been allowed to sit in seats of power be so ammoral and indifferent. That is what it is.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

5. I disagree.

We will see what happens in the next two years, but I sense we are all being played for suckers. This is all a game to them.

It isn't a game, it's a job. And more so than any job, in politics you are regularly forced to work with people you dislike personally, or whose ideas you find distasteful. That is the reality of politics. That is why you shake hands with the guy who fucked you in the last election. These guys all have to work together, and they can't do that in a climate of personal vitriol. Perhaps you'd prefer a legislature where fistfights are a regular occurance, but that doesn't really appeal to me.


In the last six years I sensed something wasn't right. Hell, quite a few of the Democrats in Congress rubber-stamped whatever this administration threw at them.

You seem to be confusing a lack of political spine with conspiracy to defraud. The last four years have also been a nightmare scenario for the Democrats. There isn't anything comparable in the last fifty years. It was not, shall we say, a particularly good climate in which to be the minority party. And yet they still did stop some of Bush's crazier plans. Remember Social Security? Whenever they felt like the public was on their side, they challenged him. I know we all despise Bush and think he's a useless bastard, but he has been one of the most powerful presidents in American history both in terms of his actual statuatory power and his political position. Dubya as a weak President is a relatively recent development.

In the next two years the Democrats either do their job, or I will not belong to the party they call Democrat, because I will have no idea what they stand for.

If you don't like the party, change it. Leaving accomplishes nothing, and the only other viable alternative is the Republicans. I'm sure they'd be happy to have your vote, and I'm sure they'd listen to your concerns.

[HamdenRice]

10. An immoral argument

So would it be appropriate for Social Democrats in the 1930s to joke around with Hitler? Would it be appropriate for Chilean Socialist politicians to joke around with Pinochet? You yourself mention that there is no precedent for what has happened in the last 50 years.

Bush and especially Cheney are architects of a policy that have killed 650,000 Iraqi civilians. At some point, decent politicos recognize that Bush and Cheney are not just political rivals and political co-workers, but war criminals, and you don't "joke around" with these mass murderers.

Only spouters of republican talking points would defend "joking around" with the likes of Dick Cheney.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

11. Personal attacks are completely unnecessary. n/t

[aquart]

6. This government ONLY works by compromise.

It was set up that way deliberately. That means you work with people you disagree with down to the bone.

It is grade school juvenile to expect the different parties to hug the wall on different sides of the room and glower at each other. Grownups don't do that.

Bill Clinton ESPECIALLY has a genius for finding common ground among deadly adversaries. Ask the Irish.

To accuse him of betrayal for behaving like a gentleman in a public setting is to misunderstand all the principles upon which our form of government was founded.

[luckyleftyme2]

8. another way to look at it

He probably was internally thinking =it's your turn in the barrell(chenny) and I'll turn the heat on every chance I get!
He has the ability to to get even without your realizing it until it happens: ask KNEWT!
Clinton didn't leave washinton in a hurry;knewt sure did. I have a feeling "chenny " knows better than to go one on one with either "clinton". HIS INFAMOUS STATEMENT "FU" MIGHT get apply permanently to him!

[JohnnyLib2]

9. People complain every day about opposing lawyers doing this.

Being sociable, especially with the cameras on, is a tiny slice of the pie.
I'm eager to watch the Clintons roll if H declares.

[Geek_Girl]

12. This could just be a game of Cat and Mouse

The Senate needs the corporation of the White House to not veto legislation. And The VP may be sucking up to Heavy Weights in the senate because he's scared of what the investigation might bring out.

I wouldn't read to much into this. IMHO Cheney is in control of the Presidency and he's trying to play nice with the big kids on the block.