Regarding the Duke Lacrosse case.....

[MonkeyFunk]

I'm just going to count the views on this vs. the number of views on real issues.

[MonkeyFunk]

1. in less than two minutes

it got 12 hits.

For those of you who believe the media are force-feeding us crap about missing blonde girls and shark attacks... it's what we WANT. That's the real problem to address. I expect to have at least 8 more hits before I finish composing this.

The problem is not the "media".

The problem is us. If we cared about politics, the news would cover politics. But people here disparage most Americans, and the media, by claiming that the sensational stories are forced on us.

They are not forced on us. We choose to follow those stories.

Look at the view-count on this thread.

[MonkeyFunk]

2. 43 views

in 12 minutes.

[MonkeyFunk]

3. 58 views

in 16 minutes.

[MonkeyFunk]

4. 127 views in 20 minutes

People seem to care about stuff like this.

[MonkeyFunk]

5. 183 views in 23 minutes

[Richardo]

6. I've pointed it out before: they don't tell us the news...

...they sell us the news.

[MonkeyFunk]

7. and we buy it

255 hits in 26 minutes.

[MonkeyFunk]

8. 295 hits

in 32 minutes.

[MonkeyFunk]

9. 410 views

in 40 minutes.

If I'd posted a thread entitled "Regarding Working-Class people" how many views would it get?

[MonkeyFunk]

10. 543 people

have expressed interest in this. And the day is young.

[Dorian Gray]

36. Everytime you look into this topic

you create more hits.

[dsc]

11. Out of control prosecutors are an issue that matters

Prosecutors have entirely too much power in this society and this case provided a pretty good example. Here is one example of his out of control behavior.

http://www.courttv.com/news/2006/0830/cab_driver_ap.html

DURHAM, N.C. (AP) — A cab driver who has supported an alibi offered by one of the three Duke lacrosse players charged with rape was acquitted Tuesday of a three-year-old shoplifting charge.

Moezeldin Elmostafa was arrested in May after he surfaced as a potential witness for Reade Seligmann, one of the players charged with raping a woman at an off-campus party in March.

Prosecutors said the warrant for Elmostafa's arrest was discovered in a routine background check of witnesses in the lacrosse case. Defense lawyers in the lacrosse case have said Elmostafa was charged because he is a favorable witness for Seligmann.

The 2003 warrant accused Elmostafa of stealing five purses worth about $250 from a Durham department store. He denied the charge, and has said he helped store security locate a woman after he picked her up from the store and drove her home. The woman later pleaded guilty to larceny.

A store security officer testified Tuesday in District Court that he saw the woman steal handbags before leaving in Elmostafa's cab, The News & Observer of Raleigh reported on its Web site.

end of quote

This was the cab driver who provided Seligmann with his alabi. Just coincidentally this bogus charge gets taken to trial. If this abuse of power isn't a public issue, then I am not sure what is. This is exactly how Ken Starr behaved and how prosecutors often behave.

[MonkeyFunk]

13. Thank you

for not reading the original post and making me laugh.

[dsc]

14. You claimed this isn't a real issue

it is a real issue. Yes, in this case we have salacious details and issues of race and class but take all of that away and you still have the very real issue of prosecutoral power which has systematicly been increased over the years. Mandatory sentencing has given federal prosecutors unrivaled power to decide who goes to jail and for how long. Again, if having one person or a small set of persons given the power to send people to jail for years isn't a real issue, I fail to see what a real issue is.

What Nifong did to that cab driver was an abuse of the court system. That man faced years of jail time on a bogus charge and likely without the high priced mouthpiece that the Duke players had. All because he was truefully relating what happened and Nifong wanted to hear a different story.

[MonkeyFunk]

19. Is it a real issue?

yeah, if you extrapolate it.

Is the experience of one woman at Duke a national issue? No, it's not.

If you want to take the time to search around, you'll find I have expressed my opinion on this issue, and I suspect my opnion won't offend you.

But my point is this:

People are interested in these kinds of stories.

The view count of this thread proves it. From the fact that even DUers find this fascinating, I determine that it's ridiculous to blame the so-called "mainstream media" for feeding us bullshit. We fucking LOVE the bullshit!! We can't get enough of it!

The problem is not the media. The problem is the market. And the market is us.

[BushOut06]

23. Who decides what is an what isn't a valid issue on DU?

I don't suppose we're complex enough to be able to focus on the "important" issues, and also talk about regional issues like this?

[MonkeyFunk]

29. I'm not pretending to

determine what's a "real" issue.

I'm simply demonstrating, with great success, that people are more interested in the claims of a North Carolina stripper than they are in the claims of the President of the US.

Titillation is hard to fight with.

[BushOut06]

30. That is complete nonsense

How many threads are on DU regarding * and his nonsense? Now tell me how many threads there are about the Duke rape case?

I'm fairly confident you'll find there are overwhelmingly more posts on DU about *. Your OP seems to be flamebait. It doesn't really have anything to back it up.

[MonkeyFunk]

32. There are definitely more

threads about Bush.

But more people click on a thread like this.

[MonkeyFunk]

12. 762 views

in 50 minutes.

[katsy]

15. Whoah!

I just came to kick some duke lacrosse reading butt!

Really.

How do you see the # of views? I don't get to see that.

[dsc]

17. are you seeing the whole screen?

It is in the far right hand column after the name of the thread. First column is reply count, second is recommend count, third is view count.

[katsy]

18. Thanks MonkeyFunk... but alas,

I can't see it. Maybe my browser is outdated or it may be my MAC.

The # of views you're getting is wild!

I'll check back at the end of the day.

My guess would be 1,600 views if you keep it kicked.

:freak:

[MonkeyFunk]

16. 1200 views

in one hour.

Don't tell me people care only about what the "MSM" tell them to care about. This was an entirely non-biased thread title.

[ms liberty]

24. OK, I won't...

some of us are from the area, and are interested in the case because of that. If your MIL grew up in the house around the corner, and had been in the house where the alleged incident occured numerous times as a child, you'd probably keep up with the case, too. Furthermore - this case is taking place in MY state, and has serious implications concerning issues of justice and equality in MY STATE. You're doggone right I'm interested in this case, and I'm not going to act like I'm ashamed of being interested.

[MonkeyFunk]

33. You have nothing to be ashamed about

I'm also interested in stories like this.

I'm not trying to shame people for being interested in the "wrong" things.

I'm pointing out that people naturally ARE interested in stories like this, and we should stop blamning the media for fulfilling our desires.

edit: fixed typo.

[MonkeyFunk]

20. Just shy of 1500 views at 140 minutes

[BOSSHOG]

21. A renegade DA is not a real issue?

Have you or a loved one be falsely accused, have the DA withhold evidence exonerating the accused, have the case drag for 10 months. You may then choose to lump the Duke Case along with the rest of the real issues. An injustice in whatever venue is a real issue.

[BushOut06]

22. Women who lie about rape isn't an issue?

How many women who are truly raped won't come forward because of shit like this? My wife has already stated that if she is ever raped, she'd rather stay quiet over it than deal with all the bullshit. Stunts like this do NOT help one single bit.

[MonkeyFunk]

25. Dunno

don't care for the purposes of this thread.

I'm trying to point out that people care about these kind of personal-interest stories far more than they care about national issues that really matter.

[BushOut06]

28. What the hell are you talking about?

With all due respect, I think you're flat out wrong on this. All you have to do is look at the forums. They're full of the "important" issues. There are PLENTY of topics about the Iraq war, Bush's illegal domestic spying program, Iran, etc. It's not as if these topics are being ignored. Are you saying that we shouldn't be talking about prosecutors who abuse their power, or women who lie about being raped? Are you seriously suggesting that DUers can't handle talking about your important issues and these other issues simultaneously?

Maybe we should all sell our earthly possessions, and go live in a DU commune, where we can devote 100% of our time and energy to these "important" issues. God forbid we bring up anything that you deem "non-important".

[MonkeyFunk]

31. look at the view counts

My point, which I've articulated here in this very thread before, is that people, even DUers, care more about personal-interest stories far more than they care about politics.


I have never once judged that.

My argument (again, which I have already expressed), is that the mainstream media feed us what we buy.

WE are at fault for the state of the media. If we didn't care about nonsene stories like the Duke Lacrosse case, they'd stop selling us such bullshit.


Don't blame them. Blame us.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

49. if you think this doesn't encompass politics then perhaps

you should go back over some of it. White priv boys vs. african american gal. Outrageous prosecution. Vote getting schemes. Lawsuits to protect against malicious prosecution. Prejudgement by just about EVERYONE. There is more political stuff in this one topic than you can shake a stick at!

sP

[MonkeyFunk]

51. Of course there are

many political issues raised by this case.

But this thread has been clicked on over 3,000 times when the title is utterly generic, and refers only to a Nancy Grace-type event.

I'm happy to discuss this case in other threads, and I have done so.

My intent was to demonstrate WHY the mainstream media spend so much time on stories like this one - people WANT to know about them.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

53. no...it is not a nancy grace thread

it is a thread that says "regarding the duke rape case..." God knows what you could be talking about in this thread. If you are interested in ay of the things I mentioned in the previous post you are not interested in the purely titillating aspects of it. So your premise that people are interested in that is false.

sP

[MonkeyFunk]

57. I agree

that this particular case raises bigger issues that intelligent people (like most DUers) are interested in.

But EVERY criminal case raises such issues. There's something particularly titillating about this case that warrants widespread attention.

And I'm not faulting people for being interested in this case. Not at all... read all my posts on this thread, as well as other threads regarding this case. I think it's perfectly natural to be interested in such things.

I'm simply pointing out that such interest is exactly why the media offer us these stories. We buy 'em.

[countingbluecars]

26. How many of the views are your own? eom

[MonkeyFunk]

27. I don't know

but it's definitely a very small percentage of the 2,000 views this thread has already gotten in the middle of the night.

On edit: no more than 30.

[MonkeyFunk]

34. 2500

hits in two hours.

[rooshab]

35. Hello

Aren't you artificially inflating the view count by constantly bumping this thread to the top? You would probably have a similar view count if you did the same thing with any controversial current event. Then again who knows.

[Dorian Gray]

37. Exactly

Everytime she/he looks into the topic, it gets bumped for a whole new slew of online readers who may have let it fall to page two or three an hour ago, rendering it less viewable.

I think that a true test of this would be to start the topic then not respond to your own topic for two to three hours and see what happens.

[MonkeyFunk]

38. Yes

you can subtract 100 hits from me.

[MonkeyFunk]

39. close to 3000

hits.

Minus my hits, so take out... and let's be generous... 200. That's VERY generous.

So 2800 hits on a totally insubstantial issue.


Are people fed cheap news? Or do people eat cheap news?

[MonkeyFunk]

40. early in the day...

Scratch a numeral off.

[MonkeyFunk]

41. 3,000 views

like the OTH$ER Duke thread.

[Totallybushed]

42. You don't think

racism and false prosecutions for non-existent crimes are a real issue?

OK :-(

[aikoaiko]

43. this thread is so gratuitous.

almost flame bait material.

[Buzz Clik]

44. Just for you, I hit it ten times in a row. I'll do that every hour.

It's a real issue. If you don't think so:

a) don't click the threads
b) don't start new threads

[npincus]

45. abuse of power by the state is a real issue.

We're not talking about missing honeymooners or a disppearance in Aruba.

We're talking about a DA ignoring exculpatory evidence against 3 young people whose lives he seems to have ruined. It could be someone you know or are related to next time.

[MonkeyFunk]

48. it is a real issue

to be sure. But the topic says nothing about that. Simply a reference to a titillating public event.

If you read the thread, and other threads on this topic I've posted on, you'll see I take it very seriously.

But this thread was to show simply that people ARE interested in things like this, and that's why the media focus on them.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

50. do you perceive a problem with the media focusing on this? n/t

[MonkeyFunk]

52. No

not at all.

I perceive a problem with people who claim that such a focus is a coordinated effort by all the media to "distract" us from other important issues.

Newspapers, Cable TV, Radio, etc., are selling a product. If people wanted 24-hour coverage of the Iraq war, they'd provide it.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

54. this you and I can agree on n/t

[BluePatriot]

46. Aw, I shouldn't count, I was coming to post "who cares?"

Oh well. Sneaky!

[Buzz Clik]

47. kick

[fishnfla]

55. So we are not allowed to talk, read, or even think about it

wow. just wow

Did you ever notice that lil' "x" next to ta thread title?

[fishwax]

56. I don't get what makes this not a real issue

I also don't get how the large number of views proves that the interest in stories like this comes not from the media but from ourselves--were it not for the all the discussion of the case in the media, this thread would draw few views, I assume.

[MonkeyFunk]

58. Do you disagree

with my position that the audience drives media? Do you believe our news is forced upon us?

[fishwax]

59. I think both forces effect our news

I don't think it's as simple as one or the other.

[MonkeyFunk]

60. Imagine this scenario:

There are only two TV stations.

One has a fascinating and insightful discussion of the long-term ramifications of the Earned-Income Tax Credit as it relates to the federal deficit.

The other station is covering a breaking news story about a man who was arrested for engaging in sex with penguins at the local zoo.

Which station do you think most Americans would turn to?

[fishwax]

61. I'm sure the penguins would get higher ratings.

But, as I said, I don't think either of the forces acts on the quality of our news alone, so I'm still not sure what that proves.

Is there some reason you specify Americans in that scenario?

[MonkeyFunk]

62. yes

I've traveled pretty extensively, and I find that Americans tend to be the most insular people.

The rest of the world seems to be much more informed about international issues.

[fishwax]

66. I wonder if that has anything to do with their different media environments

Not that it would be the only factor, of course, as there are others that are easily identified ... but it remains, in my mind, an egg/chicken type question.

[frogcycle]

63. ha! Nice trick

I just was going to respond to WHATEVER you had posted that it was a sad event handled terribly but we had more important issues to dwell on

but you trumped me!

[ShaneGR]

64. Runaway prosecutors, lies, young lives ruined....

I'm sorry, but that's the type of issue that affects all of us. It could be your child that's the next victim of a predator DA. Heck, cases like that actually HURT rape victims.

[MonkeyFunk]

67. Yes

of course it raises big issues.

Neither you nor I know whether or not the charges are true or entirely made up. But cases like this occur daily across the country. Why is THIS one so much more important?

[Lex]

65. Aw, come on now, CNN's Glenn Beck thinks it's an important case!

See? http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x3129436


_________

[Evoman]

68. Ha...you make a good point.

Although I don't find this Duke thing that interesting...I actually clicked on it by mistake (intending to look at a thread about Pelosi and Bush and MLK).

Still, I probably would have looked in everntually anyway. When a post gets lots of views/responses, I like to take a look and see what the latest flame wars about. I'm more of a lemming than anything, lol.

[Egnever]

69. Interesting premise

And I certainly get your point. Not sure that this proves it though. There can be any number of different explanations for this particular result.

I myself looked at this thread simply because I have been reading real life horror stories for the last three hours here and figured I would get a break from reality for a minute with this spectacle.
Not that I am trying to say there aren't important issues involved in this case there certainly are ...now. When it was originally touted to the world I was less than impressed but now that it appears to be a prosecutor run amok I find it much more interesting.

Anyway my point is there are a number of reasons why this post could be a popular stopping point in tonights crawl not least of which could be your continued bumping of it to the top every time it almost fell off the page.

Cool experiment though I like the way your thinking.

[MonkeyFunk]

70. Thanks

I certainly don't take this as a definitive result.

I was curious.