Things you may not know about Hillary Clinton

[Herman Munster]

http://www.canada.com/victoriatimescolonist/story.html?id=cdbe06f0-f7b0-45e6-9ab3-362348604c67

INTERESTING NOTE: After graduating from Wellesley College in 1969, Clinton spent the summer gutting salmon at a fishery in Valdez, Alaska. "Of all the jobs I've had, sliming fish was pretty good preparation for life in Washington," she wrote in her autobiography, "Living History."

DETAIL YOU MIGHT NOT KNOW: Clinton's 87-year-old mother, Dorothy Rodham, lives with the Clintons at their home in Washington.

CAREER NOTE: During Bill Clinton's years as Arkansas governor — a job that paid him about $35,000 annually — Hillary Clinton was the family's primary breadwinner. She was a partner at Little Rock's prestigious Rose Law Firm and served on several corporate boards, including Wal-Mart's.

[rockymountaindem]

1. Did she seriously serve on the board of Wal-Mart?

:puke:

[napi21]

8. Yes she did, but she resigned because she didn't approve of their

tactics of operation.

I realizehow many people fault her for being a voard member of Walmart, but remember, this was an Arkansas Company, and she was a prominent attorney in Arkansas at the time!

Why would you hold that against her, especially since she resigned after disagreeing with theirmethods of operation>

[rockymountaindem]

17. Well, if she resigned, that's fine

I'd just never learned about any of this before.

[Hippo_Tron]

53. Wal-Mart didn't always treat their employees like shit

They used to give their employees stock in the company and other benefits I believe. I think Clinton served on the board back in those days.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

2. Here's what I do know about Hillary Clinton

Measure Title: A joint resolution to authorize the use of United States Armed Forces against Iraq

Clinton (D-NY), Yea

[journalist3072]

3. And did you also know

That she said it was a mistake to trust this President, and this vote would not have occured if they knew then what they know now.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

5. Which indicates that she's too stupid to hold any public office.

Seeing as how I don't consider her stupid, or less informed than the majority of the people in the world who saw through Bush's cooked intelligence reports, it calls into question her integrity. A question that I think she answered with that vote.

[Matariki]

6. well you're not supporting Edwards then I take it?

and Obama - are you sure you know how he would have voted when the majority of the senate voted 'yea' for the IWR months after 9/11?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

7. No. And, I don't know.

I'm supporting Kucinich.

[Matariki]

10. i'm leaning in that direction too - Kucinich that is.

[MonkeyFunk]

12. And you're comfortable

with his previous anti-choice position, and the change that occurred only when he decided to run for President?

No politician is pure.

[Matariki]

13. I'm ignorant on that one

got some links?

[MonkeyFunk]

21. here are some

"As a Congressman, he amassed one of the most anti-abortion voting records in Congress, one especially unusual for a Democrat. Fair enough, Kucinich was raised Catholic. He voted to criminalize partial birth abortions, to deny American servicewoman the right even to pay for their own abortions overseas, to prevent Washington, D.C. from funding abortions for poor women with nonfederal dollars, against research on RU-486, even against health coverage of basic contraception for federal employees. In 1996 he told Planned Parenthood that he did not support the substance of Roe v. Wade. He received a a 95 percent position rating from the National Right to Life Committee, versus 10 percent from Planned Parenthood and 0 percent from NARAL. "

from: http://www.realchange.org/kucinich.htm


" In his first few years in Congress Kucinich was ranked among the Democrats most hostile to abortion rights, but more recently, after a public scolding by his friend Studs Terkel, Kucinich has consistently voted against restricting abortion rights."

from: http://www.nndb.com/people/763/000024691/


And here's his history of votes on reproductive rights from both before and after his "conversion" on the issue in 2003:

http://www.ontheissues.org/2008/Dennis_Kucinich_Abortion.htm

[Matariki]

26. Thank you. That's good information.

do you think he's changed? not his personal opinion on abortion, but his decision to interfere with a woman's right to choose? do you think he'd 'flip-flop'? appoint anti-choice judges?

i guess there's no way to really tell. but what do you think and why?

[MonkeyFunk]

28. OH

I believe he's definitely changed.

I also believe he won't appoint anti-choice judges, because he'll never come within 40 million votes of becoming President.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

14. Yes, I am. And, I certainly agree that no politician is pure.

As politicians go, a breed generally worthy of contempt, Dennis is less contemptible than most.

[MonkeyFunk]

19. Just as long as you're

comfortable in your hypocrisy.

[koopie57]

15. I don't care for Hillary either

and I think the only reason we discuss her running is the republicans can't shut up about it cuz they are scared of her, but I am curious what you have accomplished in your life for you to feel you can judge her so harshly?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

18. I never voted for a war.

And, when offered the choice to participate in one while I was in the service - refused.

What have you done in your life to question my right to question the integrity of politicians which, under a democracy, should be every citizens responsibility?

[koopie57]

23. oh dear ...

slam dunk on me ... I thought you said she was too stupid to hold office. Mea culpa, mea culpa.

I didn't realize I questioned your right to question the integrity of politicians which, under a democracy, should be every citizens responsibility. So, if I had questioned your right to question the intergrity of politicians who hold office, I certainly have done nothing which would allow me to question you about that.

I'm curious, what I said to make you think that though? I never realized I was such an aggressive person.

Since when is a soldier given the choice to join a war? I'm not trying to be a jerk, just curious is all. I have an 18-year-old son. Maybe scared would be a better word than curious.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

25. Here you go.

"...but I am curious what you have accomplished in your life for you to feel you can judge her so harshly?"

I do not believe that Hillary is stupid. I believe that she is an all too typical politician who bases her ethics on the polls.

[koopie57]

27. well, okay then

:toast: I would have a hard time disagreeing with you on that statement.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

29. In further answer to your question about choice.

I was in the Marines in 1965. My enlistment was up in June. I was asked to re-enlist. I refused. I was then asked to extend my enlistment to go to Vietnam. In my youthful idealism, I told the NCO asking me that I wasn't about to kill people for LBJ in language not advisable when addressing a "superior".

My reward for expressing my thoughts was 30 days mess duty. A small price to pay for not becoming a murderer.

I hope your son finds something better to do with his life than be a soldier.

[koopie57]

30. Well, I'm glad you didn't have to go

to Vietnam. My brother didn't have the luxury of choice though. I remember the day he left, he gave me a snicker bar and I knew if I took care of that stupid candy bar he would come back. He did come back with all his parts intact, but he wasn't soft and caring anymore. I always feel like he was killed over there and this other person came back to me.

I really wasn't trying to pick a fight or anything, but I'm always curious how someone can make such grandiose assessments based on one bad decision. I would not like to have to justify my life based on the bad decisions I have made. Bad comes with the good. A strong person can deal with both and be okay, IMHO.

Edit .. my son is a third degree black belt, teaching since he was 14, a grandma had told him she was proud that her grandson picked him as his hero. He is in the upper 97 percent of the country in math assessments and in the lower 90s and upper 80s in every other area. You need not patronize the young man with your well wishes. He understands that he is strong and that means he builds others up. Only weak people need to tear others down or call them derogatory names or belittle their thoughts and opinions.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

31. Neither did many of my comrades.

Soon after I got out "voluntary" extensions became "involuntary". A couple of them have their names decorating a wall for dying in war they didn't want to fight and didn't believe in.

"Grandiose assessments"? I've made some pretty dreadful decisions in my life. However, we're talking about assessing the quality of those who wish to "lead" us. The fact is that Hillary and some of her colleagues gave the OK to kill thousands of people. Many thousands. She may now say that she was "misled", but I would have to turn my brain off to believe such rubbish.

IMO having people killed to advance one's political ambitions is a rather telling indictment of one's integrity and moral values. And, I do not think it a "grandiose assessment" to say so.

[koopie57]

32. okay

it is okay for you to believe as you wish, I was simply curious and thought you had the balls to explain. You did, :pals: My respect goes out to you.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

33. And, cheers back at 'ya.

One of my lousier decisions was to have a too intimate and too long love love affair with the booze. So, I'll pass on the beer. But, thanks for the conversation.

[MyNameGoesHere]

34. when asked to re-enlist

you refused. Were you a draftee?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

35. At that time, all marines were volunteers.

Undoubtedly the dumbest thing I ever did. But, the experience took me from being a rather apolitical adolescent to a budding Marxist and dedicated anti-militarist. I've moved left from there.

[MGKrebs]

49. So could we say that your decision to join the Marines was either

ill-informed or a mistake? In other words, if you knew then what you know now about the Marine Corps, you would have chosen differently?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

50. Absolutely! And, I get your rather lame analogy.

It was most certainly a mistake that I regretted for 4 very long years.

The difference being that it really was a mistake.

Unless you believe that Hillary is a naive, inexperienced, easily bamboozled, adolescent, as I was, then your analogy doesn't hold up.

Hers was a carefully calculated political decision that went sour along with the war she voted for. Just as hers, and the others, now find it politically advantageous to be against the war and "regret" their vote...which cost thousands of lives. As they knew it would when they voted.

[helderheid]

40. She did??? Thank goodness. I know Edwards and Kerry both said it was a mistake - I hadn't heard it

from her. I hate that they ever made that vote. I am pleased they are capable of admitting they feel the same way now.

[cool user name]

43. How can someone like me know and a Senator doesn't?

Fuck that and fuck her.

[journalist3072]

44. I've heard several Senators say that

if the American people were seeing the same intelligence that they (the Senate) had seen, we would have been scared out of our boots. They saw the intelligence (which now of course we all know was wrong).

That's how. You had people from the Administration going up to Capitol Hill and showing members of Congress very bad intelligence. Scary intelligence.

[napi21]

11. Check back on that resolution and what was going on at the time.

It was shortly afterthetrade denter attack, and I remember very well, the Prez asked for authorization to use military forces a bargaining chip, and ONLY after he used EVERY other option available.

I realize NOW Shrub was lying through his a**, but at the time, even I understood the idea ofa negotiator having all options available!

Too bad so many people seem to forget the circumstances at the time.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

16. I haven't forgotten that 23 senators voted against the war.

I would imagine these senators understood things like "bargaining chips" and "every other option" but saw through the B.S. so obviously apparent.

NAYs ---23
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Boxer (D-CA)
Byrd (D-WV)
Chafee (R-RI)
Conrad (D-ND)
Corzine (D-NJ)
Dayton (D-MN)
Durbin (D-IL)
Feingold (D-WI)
Graham (D-FL)
Inouye (D-HI)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Kennedy (D-MA)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Mikulski (D-MD)
Murray (D-WA)
Reed (D-RI)
Sarbanes (D-MD)
Stabenow (D-MI)
Wellstone (D-MN)
Wyden (D-OR)

[napi21]

20. maybe you're right, but I can understand someone believing

an American President just MIGHT be telling them the truth! Imagine that!

I dont hold it against any of the Reps or Sens for voting to give the Prez authority to useforce as a bargaining chip. I hold the Prez responsible for not using all the other optionsas his promised to do. HE'S the one that lied, and was wrong here, not the people who trusted him!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

22. You are more generous in your forgiveness than I am.

There are certainly stupid politicians, but I find it hard to believe that people who managed to get elected to the senate are so politically inept as to be unable to see a political action for what it is.

Even if they really were that unaware of what Bush was doing at the time, that would certainly call into question their qualifications to hold any public office, let alone the presidency.

[nosmokes]

36. I stand w/ you on this TyL. you don't hand theprez a blank check for using

the military w/o asking some hard questions and getting some damn good answers, neither of which was done in this case. hell, not even a charade of it was done. those shrubco asssholes stood up in front of everyone and proclaimed they *knew* where the WMD were but no one made them prove it before they were given the keys to the armory. and on the other hand we had the UN inspectors saying they hadn't been able to find any evidence of WMD. so what i don't understand is why, still to this day, do we allow the media to continue saying but the whole world thought saddam had WMD? excuse me?!? the *whole world ddid *NOT* think so. old europe, bless their hearts, apparently didn't think so, because they din't find it necessary to go charging into iraq. saudi arabia apparently din't think so. ditto jordan. so why did almost the entire congress practically wet themselves in the rush to give up their constitutional duty and responsibility to declare war? buncha fucking cowards that worry about getting elected more than any other damn thing, especially the life of an American GI. if they took their job seriously they woulda done the footwork and found out this was all BS and we wouldn't be in the mess we're in and 100 of thousands of iraqis that never did nothing but get born in the wrong place woyld be alive as would 3400 US troops.
but our fucking congress couldn't be bothered to get off it's arse to do it's job.

[cool user name]

45. Bravo, Tierra_y_Libertad ...

Thanks for standing up! It seems that too many are willing to give a pass to people that have helped facilitate one of our worst National nightmares.

Thanks for not forgetting. If you ask me, it's unforgettable and unforgivable.

[MoseyWalker]

4. i heard that she eats boogers.

yep

:thumbsup:

[Ron Green]

9. The most fucked-up thing about Hillary

is that although she's really a moderate and will abandon progressive issues when politically expedient, the mouth-breathers think she's a LIBERAL, in the worst, shrill-female sense of the word. Which means she'll be easily tarred by the RW spin machine and is probably unelectable.

[Pyrzqxgl]

51. Why is "Shrill Female" the worst sense of the word "Liberal"?

[Ron Green]

52. Because that's the way many, if not most, of the Bush-voting masses see her.

Her negatives among right-wing voters are very high, just as they were when she was First Lady. They don't like a woman who's outspoken, and consider her "shrill" or "cold."

[Marr]

24. I fail to see the up-shot of Hillary Clinton.

She's one of the few figures that could actually get the right wing energized. On top of that, she's DLC.

Why risk everything for a shot at gaining nothing?

[WinkyDink]

37. She is a cold fish, I don't care what her close friends say, as that is the point:

she lacks the common touch. Reaching out to crowds ain't her thing.

Nor will be making history.

[Missy M]

38. She is not a cold fish and she reached out to the crowds...

in New York, against all odds and won. She worked hard, traveled every corner of the state and did it with the common touch. She has already made history by being the only First Lady to become a US Senator.

[WinkyDink]

41. It's an impression, and impressions count in politics. In any event, it looks like we'll find out,

on a much larger stage.

[journalist3072]

42. Exactly! And she won parts of New York that no one ever thought a Democrat would win

She did it by listening to the issues that were on people's mind. And she's really cultivated a reputation as a workhorse in the Senate. I think the majority of New Yorkers have a sense that she is going to the Senate every day working on their behalf; putting their interests first.

[Annces]

39. Also Hillary has a similar astrology chart to Condi

I think they have the same suck it up and be tough type of personality. Also they do not show their cards, they keep their strategy close to the vest. They are both fighters.

[Buzz Clik]

46. shhhhhh! Don't talk favorably about Hillary at DU!

The Hillary haters here are more vocal than those at the New Republic.

[tabasco]

47. Yeah, let's all fall in line and praise her.

What's your point? :shrug:

[Buzz Clik]

48. My point is simple:

There are roughly a dozen Hillary bashing threads per day on DU.

Starting a thread that shows some positive points about her will attract maggots.

[Swamp Rat]

54. maggot checking in

:D

[Change has come]

56. . . .

:rofl:

[Imagevision]

55. Bill Clinton was dumb to be photo-oped with 41 , Babs states that she has

another President in the Bush family -- not good. what are we getting a female George W. Bush??!!

[AtomicKitten]

57. Hillary puts live babies on spikes.

Or so I've heard ... at DU. Really.