A little tin foil

[Fire Walk With Me]

I've been hearing that Bush has cut funding for the National Guard and for the Coast Guard as well, and that the National Guard is losing equipment to the arid conditions in Iraq...

Um, just less to protect us should a military power grab occur within the US. We're losing another check and balance.

Hey, make me wrong so that my active imagination can rest!

[helderheid]

1. have a drink and check back tomorrow.

I can't handle one more thing right now.

[Canuckistanian]

2. That's some tinfoil you're wearing...

But I see where you're coming from. One thing's for sure. The way things are going, the military is going to be completely demoralized and broken soon.

It almost seems.... planned.
:tinfoilhat:

[havocmom]

3. ITT Tech running ads about training for 'careers in law enforcement'

Since state, county, and city governments are starving for funds, I doubt the growth will be in real police jobs. Look for a lot of hiring by 'private contractors' for job titles which are all euphemisms for "mercenary"

They don't want soldiers who are loyal to the nation. They want soldiers who will be loyal to THE COMPANY

[Canuckistanian]

4. And they'll only work for the ones that can pay the high salaries

And that ain't the taxpayer.

[havocmom]

6. Plus, jobs like that appeal to all sorts of people who don't pass

the psych tests for real law enforcement. Somehow, I think that is all part of the plan too. Lots of bad apples with a little authority = Rights? You don't need no stinking rights!

[Canuckistanian]

8. We're a cheerful bunch, aren't we?

:P

[havocmom]

10. Hear the one about the study showing depressed people + reality

are better acquainted than happy people and the real world? :D

I have learned to pretty much remain neutral when looking at the facts and how things are connected. Cheerful or sour no longer enters into it much for me. I just choose not to live in a deluded state anymore. That was killed for me some time ago.

Life is better with nothing to lose. That is freedom ;)

[politicat]

5. Looking at data from Desert Storm....

Desert conditions beat the hell out of equipment, and National Guard units tend to have the oldest of the old equipment anyway. So the fact that their equipment is not coming home with them (or is taking months to get back because it's low priority) or is not being refurbished is to be expected. It took about 3 months for my husband's Guard unit to get their equipment back in 1991-1992, and much of it ended up being junked when it finally made it back to the states. Just too beaten to be repaired. (His unit was there for a year.)

While what you're saying is valid, if I had to guess, the bigger threat to the safety and freedom of the citizens is not a power grab so much as a foreseeable vacuum. As we saw with Katrina, communities that fall apart end up with problems everywhere, from law enforcement to traffic handling to supply distribution. We have forest fire season coming up, and Arizona is going to be bad this year. Colorado's looking pretty flaky, too, if we don't get a decent amount of rain through the season. There's also a heavy potential for flooding in the Arkansas and Platte river systems due to high levels of snow melt in May or June. There's a good chance for fires, earthquakes and mudslides in California this year; Mt. St. Helen's is having indigestion, and there's been an increase in the activity on the New Madrid as compared to other years. Flooding in that region will make a quake more likely.

We know these are problems that are, if not certain, likely to happen, and the National Guard's supposed to handle these kind of things. That's what it's for. I think we're looking at Katrina II: The Wrath of God, Katrina III: Tantrums on Olympus and Katrina IV: Rage at Ragnarok before the end of the summer, 2006.

But I don't think it's going to be a power grab because that would require foresight, competence and the ability to actually be effective, three things that this administration bats .000 on. A power grab would fail because there's no one to enforce it, and nothing to enforce it with. National Guard and Reserve units are either in Iraq, without equipment or understaffed by 30 to 60% because recruitment is down. Regular military units are in a not significantly different position, according to Jane's and Global Security. In the case of a disaster, enforcement is going to be minimal. There can just be anarchy. Which may be worse in the long run.

One of the few things I'm grateful for in this whole Iraq mess is that for once, the National Guard does not significantly outgun the other 98% of the population.

[libhill]

9. I may get flamed for this

but, I don't think there's much to fear from the National Guard. We need to keep in mind, that most Guard members are just ordinary citizens like the rest of us, who join the Guard for either job training, extra income, or out of a (possibly misguided) sense of patriotism. In other words, the Guard is pretty much just a part time job for most of these folks. I can't picture these citizen soldiers allowing themselves to become a tool of the B.F.E.E., in order to tyrannize over their friends, families, neighbors, co -workers. I may be wrong, but I just don't see it happening.

[havocmom]

11. Agree

:hi:

[libhill]

17. Howdy, Havcomom -

n/t :)

[politicat]

16. No real argument here...

My husband may differ with you, but that's because he knew the people in his unit. :eyes:

But effectively, yeah. Most Guard are just doing it for the education and the paycheck.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

20. Can you imagine regular Army doing it, even?

I sure can't.

[libhill]

22. Yes and no -

I think the rank and file are too patriotic, but I don't know about the Big Brass - those wonderful folks who brought you Operation Northwoods. Or tried too. Kennedy shot them down.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

26. Actually, McNamara shot them down.

Not that it makes up for all of his other bullshit.

[Dunvegan]

12. Sounds familiar....

politicat wrote:

"In the case of a disaster, enforcement is going to be minimal. There can just be anarchy. Which may be worse in the long run."

Sounds like the "Iraqi Model."

[politicat]

15. uh. Yeah.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results....

*sigh*

[libodem]

7. Quietly folded up a few military bases around the country, too

Chimpy doesn't give a crap about people or the country. Tax dollars are his personal trust fund. Treasury raider. Pales Enron. We're getting shit on because of that 34% hardcore idiots who fund his election campaign and he supplies their special interests. Buying government. Buying justice, Buying health care, Buying religion, Buying education, Buy all of our major institutions. When you can be bought you are a sell out. I guess everything has a price. Everyone has a price. Nothing is sacred.

[Dunvegan]

13. I think Bush's base is more like a fraction of 1% of the population.

The rest of the 33.(rounding error)% are the gullible/hateful/oblivious that are "o-tay" with things as they are today.

[libhill]

14. Yup -

The 1% are the obscenely wealthy, who put money and their own interests ahead of everything else. The rest, to put it somewhat differently, are fucking ill educated redneck morons, who don't have enough grey matter between their ears to realize that they are being used by the Repukes, who really don't give a damn if they starve in the streets, just "give us your votes".

[Dunvegan]

18. Basically...but some are just old folk that believe what Fox tells them...

...because they remember Cronkite and investigative reporting that looked out for them.

Others are people working WallyWorld triple shifts with kids and are too exhausted to spend hours a day online reading political blogs.

The "Education of Average America" is a slow train indeed.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

19. What military power?

All of our military power is currently rotting away in Iraq.

[converted_democrat]

21. I think it's odd for the reason you gave and another..

I only know a handful of people that have ever served.. 2 were Army and the other 3 were Marines, every time we talk about Iraq and Afghanistan the one thing they always bring up is the Guard serving there the way that they are.. I'll be the first to admit that I know nothing about the service, but they always point out how odd the current make-up is over there.. My one friend (Marine 48 years old) doesn't think it's an accident, and he'll tell anyone that will listen.. He talks about it all the time.. He constantly brings up natural disaster scenarios and what if scenarios where he says we'd be left with no protection.. He says the Guard is supposed to stay home and look after the country from the inside..


The other thing that freaks him out is the way that the Air Force, Marines, Navy, and Army are forcing the Christian religion down the enlistee's throats.. He said it didn't used to be the way that it is now.. He says there isn't enough tea in China or money in the banks to convince him that his grandchildren should sign on the dotted line.. The other funny thing he says when he's had a few too many is.. "I joined the Marines for the US of A, not the Lord's Army."

[libhill]

23. Actually

there are some precedents for use of the National Guard to bear the brunt of military adventures. Off the cuff, the first thing that comes to mind is the so called "Mexican Punitive Expedition" of 1916-17. General Pershing was sent into Mexico (why do we think we have the right to invade sovereign nations with impunity?) with a large military force, the majority of whom were National Guardsmen from New York and a few other states. The National Guard was always used to beef up regular forces in a crunch. Not saying it's a wise policy, but it has happened before.

[newspeak]

24. I have my hat on

:tinfoilhat: Let's go back in history at the planned coup of FDR. Didn't Gen. Smedley Butler state that he was approached by certain industrialists who already had an army prepared? I think of the Pinkerton Agency who were the paid thugs of certain industrialists to bust union creation and tamp down dissent because of mining safety and wages. To me, this government is all about privitizing everything, and that means that the corporations will not be accountable to the people but to their masters. These corporations, as they have in Iraq, can hire thugs from all over the world and they do not have to follow the Geneva Convention or any other law for humanities sake. Because they aren't accountable to the people, they can get by with committing atrocities, then be given a hand slap or monetary fine; unlike a governmental entity being accountable to the people. I've worked in a governmental agency in the past (wouldn't dare work there today), and I've seen files "red flagged", meaning a senator or rep. was inquiring into the case. That meant that the claimant had gone to their Senate or Rep. for representation--response from our agency was immediate. Would that happen under privatization? NO!!! This administration is selling us off one piece at a time. My tinfoil hat is staying on.

[Fire Walk With Me]

25. Just sparking conversation regarding the number of checks existing

between the public and the military, or an assembled paramilitary group, while much of the national military is currently overseas.

I warned ye, I've got an active imagination.

Partly spurred by the Kristian and Korporate power grab, our rapidly vanishing civil rights, and ties between the Bush family and the two countries the 9/11 hijackers hailed from. Well, there's a bit more, but you get the picture. Forgot to mention a chemical attack warning in Congress just after Republican members were warned to keep the party line no matter what, then Cheney shoots someone...

Nah, you're right, I'm completely alarmist, and there are plenty of checks and balances in place regarding stolen elections, corporate no-bid profiteering, etc. ;-)

[radfringe]

27. Chertoff's balancing act

he said homeland in-security is based on risk assessment...

seems to me he doesn't consider our ports much of a risk...

on the other hand - it's important to spy on Americans because there is a risk of a terror attack being planned...