Re-post about how paying down your debt flags Homeland Security

[liberal N proud]

I posted a similar article this AM, but found another with same story...
You can't even pay off your credit cards any more.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=593840&mesg_id=593840

And all they did was pay down their debt. They didn't call a suspected terrorist on their cell phone. They didn't try to sneak a machine gun through customs.

They just paid a hefty chunk of their credit card balance. And they learned how frighteningly wide the net of suspicion has been cast.

After sending in the check, they checked online to see if their account had been duly credited. They learned that the check had arrived, but the amount available for credit on their account hadn't changed.

So Deana Soehnge called the credit-card company. Then Walter called.

"When you mess with my money, I want to know why," he said.

They both learned the same astounding piece of information about the little things that can set the threat sensors to beeping and blinking.

They were told, as they moved up the managerial ladder at the call center, that the amount they had sent in was much larger than their normal monthly payment. And if the increase hits a certain percentage higher than that normal payment, Homeland Security has to be notified. And the money doesn't move until the threat alert is lifted.
Walter called television stations, the American Civil Liberties Union and me. And he went on the Internet to see what he could learn. He learned about changes in something called the Bank Privacy Act.

"The more I'm on, the scarier it gets," he said. "It's scary how easily someone in Homeland Security can get permission to spy."

It isn't America any longer boys and girls...

I have an easy rule now: I figure the government keeps tabs on everything I do. Everything.

It just makes it simpler. Not exactly "American," in the way that word used to mean something. But it doesn't seem to mean that any longer.

http://powerofnarrative.blogspot.com/2006/03/holy-mother-of-god.html

[Marie26]

1. Re-posted rebuttal

I still don't think this is true. You probably don't want to hear a re-post of all the reasons. Is there another source w/this information?

[Burma Jones]

4. Just Google Walter Soehnge

this isn't some bs, it's real

[northzax]

6. all those sites reference the same article

so that's not so much help, is it?

[Burma Jones]

15. Gives it some context, other news orgs are buying it

and not Drudge and the like


you raise a good point though, it all tracks back to that columnist, nothing on Snopes either...

[northzax]

16. well, except that

those 'news organisations' you cite are all political blogs or internet sites (except the Sacramento Bee, and I'll give Salon a pass as well) not sure about the credibility of any of them. I'd like to see a consumer reporter or a financial reporter pick this up and work with it.

no one else seems to have talked to Mr. Soehnge or his wife, they just use the exact same words as the original article. I'll call this undetermined and doubtful that it is the full story until I hear more.

[northzax]

5. here's the original article

from the Providence Journal: http://www.shns.com/shns/g_index2.cfm?action=detail&pk=RAISEALARM-02-28-06

still, there's something else here, don't you think?

[Marie26]

10. Yeah, maybe

But that's the only article I've seen about it, & it's some guy's column instead of an actual news article. As far as I can tell, he never bothered to call the credit card company or DHS for confirmation of this story. So it's second-hand from one person who could have made it up, or by a credit card company that made it up to justify holding his payment. I don't doubt DHS is evil enough, but this just doesn't make sense to me. Why does DHS care if you pay off a CC? I'd like to see a little more evidence before we start taking this as accepted fact. And the story could also inspire people to hold off on paying off their cards, & that's a bad idea. You'd think, if this was common practice, there'd be a lot more complaints & a lot more stories about it.

[northzax]

13. yeah and it doesn't say how long the hold is

I know my bank puts a 3 day hold on all checks over 5 grand to make sure they clear. anything less than 5 grand is posted immediately. I wouldn't be suprised if a credit card company does the same, you know?

[Marie26]

18. CC holding payments

Yeah, I think that's what's going on, but for less legitimate reasons. Banks hold checks because they're the ones that are going to be paying out the money, & they have liability if they cash a false check. Why would a CC hold the payment? They should be glad to get the money, & don't have direct liability if it turns out to be false. Fraudulent checks are a real problem, but are fradulent credit card payments really a big problem? Are criminals & terrorists just eager to pay off other people's credit cards? I really do think that this was a scam by the CC co. to hold the payment & get a late fee out of the guy. Many other people have posted here about making large CC payments w/o a problem. I'd probably file this story under "urban legend".

[northzax]

19. my bank doesn't do it because of fraud so much

from what I can tell. They credit my account provisionally, but I don't have access to the money until the check physically clears another bank. I bet what happened was that the card was over the limit, or close to it, and during that hold time, the couple couldn't use it, because the hold hadn't been released. or something like that. I think the person they talked to said Homeland Security (do they have a name of that person?) instead of IRS, where they may report large payments (legally you have to report any transaction over $9999.99 to the IRS, after all)

[Marie26]

20. Could be

Here's one final odd thing - the article says they made a $6500+ payment on a JC Penney's "Platinum Mastercard". But there's no record of such a card either on Google. The columnist might've meant a plain old JC Penney's card, but that's another mistake. I tend to think these people might've had some trouble managing their spending or CC charges. I mean, I like Penney's, but who runs up a $7000 CC bill there? If they were over the limit or late, the CC could well have been suspended. Maybe the payment was held because it was on a suspended card. There are so many other reasons why a payment might be held.

[northzax]

21. yeah, I was thinking of that

but i didn't do the search like you did to find the evidence.

actually, it looks like Monogram Bank of GA does, or did, issue a JC Penny branded Mastercard.

[Marie26]

23. That's it - Monogram Bank is shady

Monogram Bank has a JC Penney card, and a long, long, list of consumer complaints. It's not a Master Card, it's just a card you can use to purchase stuff at Penney's. They are scam artists, pure & simple, and have a class action pending against them. The typical complaints include: failing to credit payments on time, closing accounts w/o warning, including false charges & inflated interest, hiding & changing address for the company. The Georgia BBB has received 586 complaints about this company in the past 36 months (almost all on billing issues) & has given Monogram an "unsatisfactory record".

http://www.atlanta.bbb.org/commonreport.html?compid=5968 - BBB page, note all the shell addresses.

Typical mad customers:

Larry of Annapolis, MD (1/3/01):
"I applied for and received an Exxon credit card. I received one statement and paid it. I have in the last two months received no further statements. I have called asking about my statements, none are forthcoming. I now am getting collection calls saying my card is overlimit and when am I going to pay. I have not made any further purchases as the card was cut off after about $165.00 worth of use. I have a $250.00 limit."

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/credit_cards/mono_exxonmobil.html

Kathryn of Chattanooga, TN, writes (4/20/01):
"I was probably a fool to pay in full what they said I owed, because I don't remember ever taking out a Gap card and Monogram Bank has no record of what I purchased or the date -- they just asked me to pay $135.11 for "purchases". They hounded me with over 25 phone calls on my answering machine and asked me to give them my checking account number. They were also very rude."
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/credit_cards/mono_gap.html

Consumer Affairs warning:
Additional suits charge that Monogram, Home Depot and Lowe's misled customers about six-month "interest-free" promotions. Monogram is the underlying issuer for a growing number of store-branded credit cards. Since it has insulated itself from legal action, consumers should be very careful before opening store charges at any of the merchants that use Monogram.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/credit_cards/monogram_bank.htm
http://www.cardoffers.com/introComments/posted/card.asp?idmin=716


They don't credit people w/payments they made, don't send out statements, & wait for interest and late fees to accrue on the balance people thought they paid. Then they send out collectors to harass people until they pay. A company this shady would have no problem lying to someone about why their payment wasn't credited. If this man hadn't followed it up the chain of command, it might never have been credited. I think this explains why Mr. Soehnge's payment wasn't credited. It probably was simply a shady business practice, & had nothing to do w/DHS at all.

[BattyDem]

2. Are you f*cking kidding me?

My mother is concerned about the balance on one of her credit cards, so she has been seriously considering paying it off in full because the interest charges are killing her! So ... if she does, she's going to get flagged by Homeland Security???

:wtf: :wtf: :wtf: :wtf: :wtf:


On edit: Wait a minute ... why would a terrorist PAY a credit card bill. Wouldn't a red flag be more useful on an unusually large credit card PURCHASE?? :shrug:

[liberal N proud]

17. Do you still think the Patriot Act is about terrorism?

It is more about controlling the American people than protecting them

[BattyDem]

24. I know that, but this just seems really "out there"

I have no idea why that surprises me. :shrug:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

3. I'd like to see the direct source as well

because as I have mentioned here before, I often pay off things in big chunks and I have never experienced this sort of delay. $6,000 isn't that much, really.

I'm wondering if this is urban myth?

[Burma Jones]

8. It's from Scripps Howard, not a bunch of whack-jobs

http://www.shns.com/shns/g_index2.cfm?action=detail&pk=RAISEALARM-02-28-06


Given some investigators' love of data mining, I'm not surprised.

It's not that they're looking at large payments, they're looking for unusually large payments. The data would suggest that Walter Soehnge came into a large amount of cash and the hordes of investigators we now have watching over us will notice such things.

The Big Thing here is that they're looking a lot harder for drug money than terrorist funding......

[TallahasseeGrannie]

11. That is a reputable source

I also did a google search for patriot act and found a lot of references to credit card accounts.

I'm with you. Just assume there ARE no secrets. Everything is transparent. Except your mind. So far.

Regarding your last statement... is drug money connected with terrorist funding, do you think?

[Burma Jones]

12. Only when Reagan's Boys were funding the Contras

Or when we were funding Osama as he fought the Soviets

Today, the big money funding terror comes from oil.....

[MADem]

7. Well, I recently paid off a huge balance for an unemployed relative

...so, are we both on the list???

Sheesh...I have to say, I figure that they are watching and keeping tabs as well. They'll be disappointed, though, I don't live a very exciting life.

It's a very sad concept, isn't it?

[DeadManInc]

9. I just paid a bunch on my credit card bill also!

When it is paid off I am done with credit cards. They all can kiss my ass!

[Left Is Write]

14. That makes no sense.

People cash out on home loan refis or get equity lines to pay off credit cards all the time. Every single one of them is flagging Homeland Security?

[Historic NY]

22. I must drive them crazy then...........

I run up my cedit limit in a month and then pay it completely off each month. This is both my overdraft checking and CC's . In the last 2 months I made several large deposits (checks) from a settlement. Heck the bank sent me a marble cheese server & cutter.....I've never got anything like that before. I should ask for a toaster. I did complain and they moved all my saving accounts into 6 month high interest accounts 4.10% not bad, for complaining. I did plan on using my credit union more. I know there are certain new banking regulations and things of the past do get noticed now.


http://www.fdic.gov/regulations/laws/rules/6500-1650.html#6652.09