I have to know this is right -

[Joe for Clark]

That thing that happened on 911 - we want JUSTICE - don't we??

Fuck B*sh - I mean as Americans. Clearly, the guy doen't have a clue.

In the same breath I can conclude Iraq was a miserable mistake and want justice for NYC, we all do - RIGHT??

This isn't about vengance, exactly - It is about right and wrong.

Do we all want the same, or am I miserably out of it?

I have to know.

Joe

[blogslut]

1. Hussein had nothing to do with 911

How can we call an uneccessary war justice?

[Joe for Clark]

3. WELL,

You sure don't get it.

Does any one else??


Joe

[blogslut]

4. get what?

Your original question made no sense. Maybe you can explain it better.

[Joe for Clark]

7. Maybe it did make little sense.

Probably so, I had an awful lot of problems with editors -

It is a logic problem - I have no doubt that I have a serious problem with the killers in NYC 911, not at all. I watch B*sh and come to the sick conclusion he just doesn't get it -

I can still want justice - I really can.

It appears to be a problem -

So that, in the same breath, I want "revenge" (justice) for NYC - I want out of Iraq - wrong war at the wrong time. Justice appears to be the practical solution to the problem the asshole made impossible. But it is not so impossible.

Joe

[ktlyon]

14. justice is what I am after

I want the law and the Constitution stood up for

How is that for crappy syntax no editor needed?

[Joe for Clark]

16. Fine with me,

i had to get proofed six times to get published though - so take it for what its worth.

There is a right and wrong in this world, and I will believe that til the day I die,

I think the syntax is fine -


Best to you guy,

Joe

[Bluzmann57]

6. Don't think the guy was saying Iraq is just

But I also feel a need for justice for 9/11. But not by invading the wrong place for no apparent reason.

[stillcool]

2. First you need truth....

and we've a long way to go before we get that.

[Joe for Clark]

5. That is right -

Assume you have that -

Next step -

Joe

[stillcool]

8. RICO?

http://www.ricoact.com/ricoact/nutshell.asp#multiple

Many people are confused by extortion "under color of official right." Extortion under color of official right occurs when an agent of the government uses his or her legitimate governmental powers to obtain an illegitimate objective. For example, a police officer may have the authority to revoke a driver's license but he cannot offer to forego the legitimate exercise of his power in exchange for sexual favors from the driver. Likewise, a city council member may have the authority to rezone an area of town and thereby effectively put a company out of business, but the council member cannot threaten rezoning unless the company contributes to his re-election campaign. In short, governmental agents have a great deal of discretion when deciding how to exercise the powers of the government. When an agent engages in extortion "under color of official right," he is essentially using the governmental powers with which he has been trusted to gain personal or illegitimate rewards.

[Joe for Clark]

9. We are gonna get our ass kicked then -

We can't win under this law -

We will win cause we are right - and even if we could win, we lose at the end of the day.


You could believe, my premise, we are right to assume the prick got this "presumptive" war thing totally wrong. That this country is much greater than that.

Is this correct here???

joe

[stillcool]

10. Oh man....the history....

is the key. Where we've been...as a nation...and what we've done....are the only reason for where we are. It's been written about for decades, but it's way under the radar. I am 49...and am just learning my own history....and I am floored by my ignorance.
http://www.serendipity.li/cia.html
http://www.aliveness.com/kangaroo/L-overclass.html
http://www.killinghope.org/
http://watch.pair.com/cnp.html#garvey

[Joe for Clark]

13. History is the KEY,

Joe

[Tinksrival]

17. Joe listen......

On revenge.....

One day, on this earth, Osama and *ush will no longer exist. What will be left for our planets generations to come? More of the same or something better, smarter, and beyond. We must move on to the latter somehow. O. and B. are just men who need to fade fast!
Take care!
Wendy

[Pastiche423]

18. What does Osama have to do w/either

9/11 or the Iraq occupation?















It was an inside job.

[Joe for Clark]

20. Nothing,

We have an interest in dealing with them though, don't we??

Joe

[Pastiche423]

24. Don't understand

An interest in who or what? (Them)

[sandnsea]

11. Ending terrorism, sure

Much more important than justice, revenge, whatever. One would think in the process of dismantling actual terrorist groups the 9/11 perpetrators would be caught and we would then have justice.

Which has nothing to do with Iraq.

Is that what you mean?

[baldguy]

12. Bushco wanted to punish Saddam long before 911.

The sale of Iraq's oil threatened Saudi Arabia's profits, and Saddam would cooperate with OPEC to control the supply.

So they had us take him out.

"Justice" would be having US forces immediately leave Iraq & pay billions in reparations to allow Iraqis to rebuild their country. "Justice" would have the Saudi billionaire Friends Of Bush who fund & support the terrorists who attacked us pay for their crimes. "Justice" would have Bush stand trial in The Hague for HIS crimes.


I'm not holding my breath for "Justice". I'll settle for doing what's right: Leave Iraq; kick out the GOP.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

15. Why Do You Post This Every Other Week, Seriously? I Don't Get It

You keep posting this same sentiment over and over. Is there some overall point you are looking for that you just haven't gotten yet? Are you trying to justify the importance of 911 and Bush fighting the war on terror? What is the overall objective you are looking for from these "we should want revenge on the terrorists of 911 right?" posts?

[Joe for Clark]

19. I'd point out that moderate dems do not think Iraq was just wrong

Because b*sh did it - it was wrong because it was wrong--

I do not believe you could be American and not want justice for what happened in NYC - I doubt it. And I don't post very often -

I do have a certain take on it and I am trying to rationalize my being democrat with the take here - and I recognize I am not the best at explaining my positions.

I don't have an over all objective. If I did, I could sure find a better place for it.

I think one can want a justice for our people and be against the Iraq war, though.

If that is not clear, I'd like to try and make it clear.


Joe

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

21. Doesn't Answer My Question. Why Do You Keep Posting The Same

question in a thread every other week? I just don't get it. It makes no sense when you say you can't be an american and not want justice for what happened in NYC. Who the fuck ever said we didn't? Some think the justice is against terrorists, some thing the justice is against the administration, some think it's against both. What difference does it make? I mean, the premise within itself is empty. Yes, most people of any type would want some sort of justice when mass murder occurs. But what is the point of stating that over and over in threads? I'm totally perplexed at what you keep trying to get at here. You say the iraq war is wrong for more reasons then just the fact * did it. Well no shit. Has anyone here ever stated otherwise?

Sorry, I just keep seeing these threads from you and they make no sense whatsoever in what it is you are trying to get out of them.

You ask "we all want justice don't we?", yet I don't see why you have such concerns. What is it you fear we think? What is the alternative? Why is wanting vengeance so important to you that you need to make sure every few weeks that the rest of DU wants the same vengeance as you do? Sorry, but there is just something that really disturbs me about these threads.

[Hutzpa]

22. If I can respond to that...

Its not only Americans that wants justice, don't forget there where other nations at WTC, majority of the world is looking for justice, but does that mean if you want justice you go after the innocents, this shows you are being the same thing you're fighting against. To gain justice you do not become the criminal or most importantly carry out your duty based on personal preference, you go by the letter of the law.

[Just Me]

23. How many executions without trial does it take for you to "feel" justice?

:shrug:

Right and wrong? Right and wrong?

This administration intentionally CONNED this nation and her people into giving up tens of thousands of healthy lives and over $400 BILLION for an unlawful, aggressive war against a country that had NOTHING TO DO WITH 9/11. The consequences: hundreds of thousands of lives maimed or murdered; a shit load of dough poured into this administration's cronies' pockets.

Where's the justice in that? Relatively speaking, this administration has done a hundred times more damage to the American people, to our national economy, to global stability and to our future than al fuckedup did on 9/11.

Vengeance? Right or Wrong? Justice?

Yeah,...I think about that stuff a LOT.

On edit: I must add that, until we know the truth about/behind 9/11, no justice can ever be done. At this point, another 9/11 event or worse wouldn't surprise me considering the death and destruction and oppression delivered under those who lead the U.S.A. We are hated even more harshly than before by people who aren't even "extremists". So, maybe, if justice is to be discovered, we might consider figuring WHY 9/11 happened.

Thanks for reading.

[SPKrazy]

25. Joe, To Exact Revenge, You Have To Know What For

So what are you exacting revenge for on 9/11?

The deaths of Americans?

The fall of the towers?

The violation of our country?

If yes, then you have to say, WHO do we exact revenge from?

Is it bin Laden?

Was it an inside job?

Was it a "let it happen on purpose" thing where people in places that matter knew it was happening and let it happen in order for their agenda to be carried out?

Or was it something else completely?

To exact revenge, you can't just point your darts at the country or person(s) you would like to be angry and revengeful towards. You must study the facts. You must demand that the facts are actually released. You must wonder why the administration stonewalled the 911 committee. You must wonder why the 911 committee was "stacked" with Republicans, moderate Dems, and Council on Foreign Relation types in the first place. They you must demand more, and more!

You would have to change congresses. Clean house. Get rid of anyone with possible ties or interests to what happened on 911. Who benefitted from 911? Was it the military industrial complex? Was it interests that the Bush family is closely connected with? Was it the Israeli government? Was it ...... who?

Follow the money. Follow the money. Follow the money.

You can't go astray there.

What hit the Pentagon? Where are the wings? Where is the fuselage? What happened to the tons of jet fuel? Why is the lawn unscathed? Why were the cameras that filmed the crash taken by the FBI?

If it wasn't the flight 77, then what happened to them?

Why were all of the flights only partially full? Why didn't the "hijackers" names show up on the manifests? Why were they able to identify the highjackers so quickly without their names showing up on manifests? Why did several of the "hijackers" show up alive in the middle east after 911?

What really happened that day?

Until you KNOW THE ANSWERS you won't be able to exact revenge because you only know what you think you saw happen! You only think you know who did what you think you saw happen.

Remember Rodney King beating? How did the jury find the cops "not guilty"? Was it just race?

Or is there illusion in the camera's eye?

Why did the towers fall? Lots of skyscrapers that have burned with hotter fires never collapsed?

Why did tower #7 fall? It wasn't even hit, it had some fires in it, but why did it collapse?

What was the story of asbestos in the towers, and how much would it have cost to abate it?

Why do people who were at ground zero have respiratory symptoms related to asbestos when the EPA declared the air to be fine?

Go, Seek, Find the answers.

Then you can exact revenge when you find them.

Otherwise, you are just barking at treed squirrels who were easy to tree because they looked obvious.