Scientology?

[benburch]

Poll question: Scientology?

Operation Clambake - The inner secrets of Scientology

[TallahasseeGrannie]

1. I recently opined that Scientologists

were a bunch of loons, but I got righteously spanked for that and so I will just say they have a very intriguing philosophy, but I personally believe they are wrong about psychiatry.

[MichiganVote]

2. Well I think they are loons and batshit crazy.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

5. shhhhh

[file83]

17. LOL

:rofl: :rofl:

[LostinVA]

27. I agree with you, Grans

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

3. I refuse to answer until I finish reading this excerpt...

...about L. Ron Hubbard attempting to impregnate the Whore of Babylon in an attempt to give birth to the AntiChrist.

I'll get back to you on this.

:evilgrin:

Hubbard always imagined himself a great man of history. "All men are your slaves," he once wrote in a diary entry unearthed during a 1984 lawsuit. He reportedly once claimed to have written a manuscript that contained such brutal truths that anyone who read it went insane or committed suicide. He fancied himself a nuclear physicist, never mind his lack of training, and posited that fallout from Cold War nuclear tests were interfering with Scientology therapies. (Hubbard even wrote a book titled All About Radiation—a swell read, according to one reviewer on Amazon who says, "I understand radiation better and feel like I could survive an atomic explosion somewhere on the planet, if it wasn't, of course, really close to me.") He reportedly constructed the myth that he was a World War II combat hero, when in fact the Navy reprimanded him after a San Diego-based ship he commanded shelled some nearby Mexican islands for target practice.

Hubbard's version is understandably preferable to the reality, which was a dark farce. Hubbard was born in 1911 in Tilden, Neb. After flunking out of George Washington University, he became a pulp science-fiction and adventure writer. In the mid-1940s, he fell in with John Parsons, a wealthy and brilliant young rocket scientist in California, who also happened to be under the tutelage of the infamous satanist Aleister Crowley (no relation to yours truly, thankfully). According to Russell Miller's damning biography of Hubbard, Bare-Faced Messiah, Parsons was a science-fiction fan who briefly hosted Hubbard at his Pasadena, Calif., mansion, which featured a domed backyard temple and a rotating cast of occultists and eccentrics. Parsons described Hubbard as his "magical partner," and together the men engaged in a rite in which Parsons tried to impregnate with an antichrist child a woman he considered the whore of Babylon, a goal that Crowley had long promoted. With Rachmaninoff's "Isle of the Dead" playing in the background, Hubbard allegedly chanted spells over the copulating couple, according to Miller and others. (Ultimately Hubbard would steal Parsons' girlfriend and allegedly bilk him in a Miami yacht venture.) Years later, when Hubbard had grown famous and realized the antichrist episode didn't comport with his image as a man of culture and wisdom, he would reportedly claim to have been working on an undercover mission for U.S. Naval Intelligence to investigate black magic.

Dabbling in (or investigating) witchcraft didn't pay the bills, and by the late 1940s Hubbard was in debt and despondent. Then in 1950 he published Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health, which he billed as "a milestone for man comparable to his discovery of fire and superior to his inventions of the wheel and arch." The theory of Dianetics promised to cure almost any physical and mental ailment—including wrinkles—by cleansing people's memories of traumatic past experiences so they could arrive at a "clear" mental state. Well poised to capitalize on a growing national fascination with psychotherapy, the book was an instant best-seller. Dianetics groups and parties sprung up nationwide.

Hubbard became an icon, and thousands of fans sought him out. In 1954, as the book's success—and his income—began to fade, Hubbard founded the Church of Scientology. His son Ron Jr. claimed in a 1983 interview with Penthouse that money was the motive, saying his father "told me and a lot of other people that the way to make a million was to start a religion." Hubbard made his millions quickly and used them to style himself as a sophisticated aristocrat, relocating to an English country home dubbed "Saint Hill Manor."

http://www.slate.com/id/2122835/?nav=ais

[TallahasseeGrannie]

6. Oh my

well, in my religion we eat our God once a week, so who am I to talk?

[benburch]

21. You need to read the text of Crowley's Gnostic Mass...

And look at what the eucharist there is made of...

:evilgrin:

[TallahasseeGrannie]

22. Gnocci?

[MichiganVote]

9. LOL!!!

[NoodleyAppendage]

10. Hubbard had raging Bipolar Disorder & Delusion Disorder, Grandeur Type.

His, and his fraud of a church's, opinion about modern psychiatry is borne from his fear of rightfully being labelled as a loon.

J

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

18. Four helpers...

One to HOLD his pack of cigarettes.

One to LIGHT a new cigarette for him as soon as the one he was smoking reached the end.

One to HOLD his ash tray.

One to PLACE his seat under his ASS as he was about to sit.

One time the ashtray girl missed an ash. She got hard labor...but hey, let's have a former Scientologist tell you what "punishment" and "discipline" were like...

http://www.lisamcpherson.org/cos/hr_abuse.htm

My name is HANA ELTRINGHAM WHITFIELD.

I was in Scientology for 19 years from March 1965 to August 1984.

Then in 1978, I was assigned to the Rehabilitation Project Force at the Fort Harrison, the Sea Organization's slave labor camp. I was assigned to it because I had evil thoughts about Hubbard and the Sea Organization. I was utterly shocked and devastated. I was escorted to the RPF location between two heavy men, both well over 6' tall. I was locked up for about 24 hours in a room with no windows. I was under continual guard during that time and slept on a mattress on the floor without sheets or blanket. I was shocked and awake the entire night sometimes weeping and other times completely numb, devoid of all feeling or thought. I had a crazed urge to escape but knew I could not, that I had to finally confront myself and discover how evil and truly bad I was. I felt I was split into several people - one of them a kind, loving person who was in deep shock, the other a cold, calculating, evilminded person who was intent on harming others for the fun of it, and yet another person who was terribly confused and did not know which of the other two was correctly me. I felt my mind was being ripped apart, that I could not think or feel anything. I forced myself blindly through the routine of having to run continually (RPF members were not allowed to walk at any time), of having to talk to non-RPF staff only when spoken to, of having to address everyone as "Sir", of having to do menial work of cleaning toilets, of having to wear old, torn and tattered blue overalls, of having to be seen running in the Florida heat, perspiring and without makeup or hairdo, doing menial and embarrassing work in front of all the public - in pain all the time. I requested to go in front of a Review Board. The Board was disinclined to see me personally. It found my assignment correct and ordered I remain in the RPF.

RPF members at that time were completely segregated from "normal" staff and slept, lived and often ate in the Fort Harrison garage in the midst of continual exhaust fumes. They were not allowed to talk to, mix with or eat with "normal" staff. They wore old, tattered, ripped up navy jump suits or boiler suits and looked like derelicts from skid row. Women were not allowed to use any makeup or have any hairdos. No jewelry was allowed. Even in the incredible hot and humid Florida summers, women were not allowed to wear short cut-offs but had to wear longer shorts or skirts or long trousers. No clothing lighter than the heavy material the jump suits were made from could be worn intitially.

RPF members had to run all the time. They were not allowed to walk. They had to run while doing their cleaning assignments in bathrooms and toilets, while doing the garbage details or while going up and down the 12 flights of stairs in the Fort Harrison building carrying buckets, brooms and heavy cleaning equipment, and sometimes buckets full of heavy construction material. RPF members were not allowed to use the elevators, not even the service elevator. To prevent zoning, health and other city inspectors from seeing the RPF conditions as they really existed, all RPFers were practiced and skilled in transforming their normal RPF sleeping areas into what looked like a regular furniture storage space, and doing so in a very short period of time. I often wished that someone from the city would spring a surprise visit on the Fort Harrison kitchen or garage or nursery but it never occurred.

[MichiganVote]

19. Exactly right. The guy was a nut job.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

23. Bipolar? Really?

Hmmmm. I have a lot of experience with that particular disorder.

[LostinVA]

28. Also, very sexist

[Endangered Specie]

4. A big corporate style scam, fraud, thieves...

They worship the almighty dollar, nothing more.

[bryant69]

7. One of the few targets larger than a battleship?

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[KittyWampus]

8. L Ron Hubbard stole his schtick from Aleistar Crowley

bad juju using Esoteric Science to influence others soley for ones own personal, egotistical benefit.

[benburch]

13. If Hubbard had really stolen from Crowley...

...it would have made a whole lot more sense.

[slackmaster]

Best choice ever in a poll...

"A combination of seditious criminal conspiracy, confidence racket, and a cult, all rolled into one ball of nastiness."

:toast:

[Beaverhausen]

11. How many scientologists do you know personally?

If it works for them, why does it bother you so much?

For the record, I know many scientologists and they are all normal, hard working, successful, creative people who never try to convert me.

[slackmaster]

14. I've known only one

He was a very successful chriropractor.

One day he just took off and disappeared. He didn't cancel appointments, didn't tell anyone where he was going. Left patients waiting and bills and payroll unpaid.

It turns out he moved to Clearwater, Florida and became a Scientology minister of some kind.

I guess it works for him, but he screwed over a lot of patients, employees, and business partners.

[benburch]

24. I've known two.

And though they were undoubtedly productive members of society, more and more of their money was going to Scientology...

[Beaverhausen]

26. So what? again, why does it bother you so much?

If it works for them who are you to judge?

Why don't you worry about all the money going to Halliburton?

[benburch]

31. When I see people being fleeced of their money...

that bothers me.

Apparently seeing people fleeced doesn't bother you?

[Beaverhausen]

32. I don't see it the way you do

As I said, I know a lot of scientologists and they are some of the most well-adjusted people I know.
Who am I to judge them? Why would I care where they spend their money?

"Christians" are the most fucked-up people I know. They are the ones I'm worried about. But still, it really isn't up to me to judge them.

on edit - and by the way, did you say anything to the scientologists that you say you knew? Did you tell them you thought they were getting "fleeced?" Did you try to convince them that they are in a "cult?" How'd that go?

[Dorian Gray]

33. Scientology bothers ME

because of the people who have tried to leave. They've been met with threats. People who speak against it are met with lawsuits, or worse.

The philosophy behind scientology is also very selfish. It's about becoming some sort of uber-self. There is nothing selfless about it. There is nothing that indicates giving to charity is a good thing. It's about promoting yourself above everyone else.

[file83]

12. There is nothing "scientific" about Scientology....

scien- is Latin for "having knowledge".
-logy is Greek for "study of" some discourse, topic, or science.

So, "Scientology" implies "The study of science" which is completely misleading. Some argue it means "The study of having knowledge" but that is equally misleading. Their "knowledge" that they study is fictional doctrine written by L. Ron Hubbard, a science-fiction writer.

In all actuality, their church cult should really be called "Science-Fictionology". (No offense to you "Trekkies" out there!)

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

15. You know, we could apply this poll to any "religion," but the thread

would be locked post haste because one or two of them think they are better and righter than all the others.

[benburch]

20. Some religions are not cultic...

And some are not seditious criminal conspiracies.

And some are not confidence rackets.

But all are in some way BS...

[Canuckistanian]

16. My mother bought me Dianetics when I was about 22

She thought I might be interested in it. She had no clue what it was really about.

I started reading it and became more and more alarmed at the utter nonsense of it. I was appalled that so many people could be taken in by... gobbledygook. I finshed reading most of it, mostly with my mouth hanging open :wow: but just got sickened by it and tossed it.

For anyone to call this a "religion" is nuts. It's pseudoscienctific BS with a lot of self-help philosophy.

[SomewhereOutThere424]

25. I too have read Dianetics, yet I seem to have a vastly different opinion?

In all actuality, unless I'm missing something and scientology is the religion of repeating your point over and over and over again and droning about the reactive mind, it does not even talk about dianetics.

I went to amazon, where I purchased the book, and found hordes of people knocking it. Was it people here at DU? Looked more like a lot of random freepers to me...maybe this is the one point DUers and freepers can agree on :p

As far as the book is concerned, I will say this. I have read the bible, both king james and NIV, and dianetics. Where I disagree with both and agree with both in different parts, I find the bible to be way more out there. One book states the reactive mind, an area where past, painful memories are stored when the mind reaches a traumatic state where the analytical mind moves to one extreme or the other (apathy or excitement), will create a distorted memory where you start to believe random nonsense which can slowly drive you insane based on what traumatized you. The other book claimed loaves of bread fell from the sky feeding the people god decided to hate after freeing them from people using locusts, blood and plague, after parting a river of course, because he suddenly decided he had no home for them.

As far as scientology goes, can anyone actually explain it instead of jumping in to the fag dance here and fanning the flames of the individual being burned at this witch hunt? I am not defending it, and as far as I have heard it is quite cooky. As far as I have also heard, dianetics is a sound book which does not use the fundementals of scientology nor is it scientology.

As far as a money making, confidence racking cult? I only have two names you need mention. Benny hinn? Pat robertson? I am certain there is a huge repetoire of things they attempted to do. I already know benny claimed saddam would die in 1990 for his sins (shame, woulda prevented the war).

I guess I'm greatly disappointed in DU, again, for stating facts about a book without stating facts and, jumping to conclusions based on the assertions of fanatic deprivation in one or another group's leaders. Dianetics is a self help book. One that uses lots of psychology. I did skim some areas of it -- perhaps where the voodoo lay theirin. But otherwise I find it a lot more believable than a man who's considerable he-man because he never shaved his beard. Yet that religion gets fame and attention ^_~

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

29. "The way to make money is to start your own religion." L. Ron Hubbrd.

"There's a sucker born every minute" - (Credited to) P.T. Barnum

[Blue-Jay]

30. "I'd like to start a religion, that's where the money is"

Lloyd Arthur Eshbach attributes that quote to L Ron "meat body" Hubbard during a 1948 conversation.

I mean, COME ON!! Seriously... COME THE FUCK ON!!!

The evil interstellar entity Xenu threw a bunch of ETs into earth's volcanoes, and their restless souls are responsible for all of the mental/spiritual problems that humans suffer from. How does one rid themselves from these nasty habits (or "engrams", a "made-up" word)? From what I've been able to gather, it costs money. Really! It costs money. Lots of it! Unless, of course, you're a high-profile dumbass like Tom fucking Cruise or John fucking Travolta, neither of which could be considered to be a person of intelligence. (Unless you're a big fan of Top Gun or the "sweathogs")

Xenu! Volcanos! "Engrams"!

These people really believe this stupid shit!

If there's an afterlife (doubtful), L Ronnie is laughing his ass off at the level of stupidity that he set into motion.

As an aside, I quite enjoyed the novel Battlefield Earth way back when I was 14 or so years old. I was an OK swashbuckler sci-fi opera, not unlike the other literary turds that Hubbard shat out. the difference is that I wasn't stupid enough to base my life on such dreck, unlike genius-boy Cruise.

[Moderator]

34. Locking

Please do not post broad-brush attacks.