Palestinian State NOW! Free Mumia! and by the way...the Occupation of Iraq

[Earth_First]

What are the chances that A.N.S.W.E.R. stays on topic with the Occupation in Iraq this weekend? I understand that these are all issues of important significance and concern, yet they are concerns in and of themselves which I believe should be seperate from what should be the focus this weekend.

[Just Me]

1. Are you suggesting squeezing them out or throwing them away?

:shrug: They have been fabulous at mobilizing people.

I just do not understand why liberals/progressives keep demonizing this incredible organization, especially on the basis of having numerous positions on human rights.

The right-wingers, just like that fucker McCarthy, have labelled ANSWER a front for communism and socialism and islamofascists and so on and so forth. So, I find myself especially disturbed at "liberals" or "progressives" attacking ANSWER, as well.

They are entitled to participate in the anti-war march as much as you or me.

[Beelzebud]

2. Answer has NO FOCUS. If you are having an anti-war event,

STICK TO THE MESSAGE.

[Just Me]

5. Human rights is precisely the basis for anti-war.

Condemning others in such a way, effectively chilling their freedom to participate, is wrong, in my progressive view. Cutting people off because their basis for participation may differ from yours is NOT liberal IMFO.

That's all I'll say about this matter.

[meganmonkey]

3. God forbid anyone recognizes the big picture -

that much of this global violence is related, and that a true solution would involve dealing with the root causes of many, many issues.

But hey - if it provides people an excuse not to get into the streets than they can just stay home, AFAIC. Or they can organize their own events. Let's see them get 500,000 people into the streets on one day!

(and for the record, the march in my sig line has nothing to do with ANSWER so I hope everyone who is afraid of the Big Truth won't stay away from NYC next month ;) )

[cali]

4. None.

and it drives me nuts every time. Last time I was in DC, speakers focused on almost everything but Iraq, and I hate to say it but I could care less about Mumia.

[meganmonkey]

6. Why don't we hear what ANSWER has to say in their own words

instead of your misrepresentation? Because there is nothing about Mumia in their statement, and anyone who doesn't think these issues are all related is in complete denial and apparently doesn't want to really solve the problems:

____________________________________________________

Call to Action

This is not our war. The Bush administration has sent hundreds of thousands of young people in the armed forces to Iraq to kill and be killed in a war for Empire. Iraq has the second largest oil reserves on earth. It has been targeted for destruction by the imperialists because the Iraqi people dared to nationalize their oil and other natural resources. Every rationale provided by the Bush administration for the war has been exposed as a lie. Iraq possessed no weapons of mass destruction. Iraq had no connection to the events of September 11.

The U.S., on the contrary, has nearly 10,000 nuclear weapons, has a military budget of $500 billion per year, constituting half of all arms production in the world. The U.S. government is the only one in the world that has ever used nuclear weapons, which it did against the civilian cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki in August 1945. More than 100,000 Iraqis have died since March 2003. Their country has been destroyed. Electricity, food, medicine, drinkable water all the things necessary to sustain life are now in a state of ruin. More than 2,000 U.S. soldiers have been killed and 20-30,000 have been horribly wounded. The U.S. government has spent $300 billion to carry out this war of aggression; that comes to more than $200 million every day.

The war and occupation of Iraq cannot be seen in isolation. The U.S. is actively attempting to destroy every government that resists the Empire. People in Iraq, in Palestine, in Haiti, in Venezuela, in Cuba, in the Philippines are resisting but the people of the United States must become their allies. Their resistance is part of the universal aspiration to live free from foreign domination or threats of a military or economic character.

While the Bush administration and Congress allocate limitless resources for their war for Empire, these so-called elected representatives of the people are carrying out massive cutbacks in Medicaid, Medicare, tuition aid, food stamps and other vital social programs. Of the $50 billion in projected cutbacks in the coming fiscal year, more than 1/3 are targeting programs designed to help young people, especially education programs.

This is a racist war. The Bush administration has targeted and demonized Arab and Muslim peoples. It is a racist war too because it constitutes a systematic diversion of resources from African American, Latino and other oppressed communities directly into the coffers of the corporate and banking establishment through the agency of military spending.

While the Bush administration cut hundreds of millions of dollars from flood and hurricane relief and from the restorations of the levees in New Orleans between 2001 and 2005, the same government reallocated these resources for the so-called “war on terrorism.”

Our massive mobilizations will not simply target the Bush administration. Bush and the neo-conservatives share the same fundamental class interests with all sectors of the leadership in the Republican and Democratic Parties. It is naïve and an exercise in misleadership to focus all of the attention of the rising progressive movement against the Bush administration. Such an orientation implies that the removal of Bush and his replacement by a Democrat will fundamentally alter the imperialist war drive and the assault against working class communities and young people at home. The Republicans and the Democrats alike are the twin parties of the war machine. They share the same corporate and banking contributors, their real constituents are big oil, the big banks and the military-industrial complex.

We have learned the lessons of the civil rights, women’s, LGBT, labor, and anti-war movements: Real change comes not as a gift from the politicians but from the sustained mass mobilization of the people. In order to realize the demand “Money for jobs, housing, education, and healthcare, Not for war and occupation” we must create a national grassroots movement.

* From Iraq to New Orleans, Fund People's Needs - Not the War Machine
* Stop the War in Iraq - Bring all the troops home now
* Military Recruiters out of our schools & communities
* End Colonial Occupation from Iraq to Palestine to Haiti
* Support the Palestinian People’s Right of Return
* Stop the Threats Against Venezuela, Cuba, Iran & North Korea
* U.S. out of the Philippines - U.S. out of Puerto Rico
* Stop the Racist, anti-Immigrant and anti-Labor Offensive at Home, Defend Civil Rights

http://www.internationalanswer.org/

[Earth_First]

7. Don't attack dog me.

I offered an opinion, and in your best attempt to discredit my opinion, you resort to O'Reilly style tactics that I "apparently don't want to really solve the problems"

Touche.

And yet you expect me to justify my opinion after deploying GOP style shout tactics?

Yet I will.

It is of my opinion that by allowing ancillary issues to take forefront at events that are clearly labeled as anti-war events is that you marginalize individuals like my father who is borderline right now. I guarantee you that there are literally tens of thousands of individuals who are just like this RIGHT NOW. Yet you get them to an event, and you are going to throw seven different issues at them all at once, and you are going to overwhelm a majority of them, and alienate the minority with messages that that they may not agree with, after all, they are here to voice their concern about the war, not a coup against a Democratically elected leader in South America.

RIGHT NOW, the focus needs to be on one thing and one thing alone: the Occupation of Iraq.

I'm sorry you do not agree with my opinions, and distressed that you intend to attack them in the manner you choose.

[meganmonkey]

10. I can respectufully disagree about whether or not

the focus of the protest should be one thing or another.

I don't see where I shouted, or used GOP tactics. I stated my opinion (which I have a right to even though it isn't the same as yours, no?) and posted/linked ANSWER's statement about the event. That's it. I never attacked "your opinions", I merely pointed out what I saw as a flaw in your method and tried to fill the gap. Don't take it personally. It isn't about you. It's about the innocent people suffering at the hands of Americans and with our tax dollars.

The 'other side' (eg ANSWER) should be honestly represented so that people can base their opinions on facts, not misleading statements from someone who has already made up their mind.

Peace.

[MadHound]

8. So, are you ready and willing to step up to the plate

And mobilize, organize, and put together a comparable number of anti-war people for a massive rally? Are any other organizations or people out there doing this?

Until a replacement for ANSWER can be found, then ANSWER is the only game in town.

[Earth_First]

9. It's simply constructive criticism and suggestion...

Read into this all you'd like.

[MadHound]

11. No, it is a regurgitation of RW talking points,

I'm not accusing you of being a winger, just falling for the spin, that's all.

Yes, there are some off point messages being put out at anti-war rallies, but in any rally, on the right or on the left, you are going to have some off point messages for the simple reason that it is a national platform and people can get across messages that they wouldn't have a chance to otherwise air.

This same phenomenon occurred during the Vietnam era protests, and it isn't suprising that it is happening here. And as with the Vietnam era RW demagogues are seizing upon those very minor views in order to smear the entire anti-war movement as a whole. Don't fall for this tired old dirty trick. Sure, it might give ammunitions to the Freepers and the Dittoheads, but it isn't like were going to convince them anyway. Meanwhile, the big anti-war message is indeed getting through to people loud and clear, witness the fact that the vast majority of Americans now want our troops home now.

Don't fall for this BS friend. The RW spin machine is trying to provoke strife and divisivness amongst the anti-war movement, and they're seizing onto this minor point like a drowning man seize a life preserver. It isn't getting any traction, and if we allow this minor point to break up the anti-war movement, then we're all fucked.

ANSWER is the only major player who is organizing these demonstrations. Sure, they have their fringe hangers on, but you're going to find those with any major group like that. Kick ANSWER out now, without a capable replacement and we're all screwed.

[Poll_Blind]

12. A.N.S.W.E.R. has its own agenda. Their agenda is not apparently yours.

A.N.S.W.E.R. is always on message- its message. A.N.S.W.E.R. has 7-10 points which are essentially their "party planks".

You would like them to focus only on one of their planks, the one you're interested in, the one you think counts. I have no earthy idea why you expect them to do this. It is nonsensical.

PB