I know why the Bird Flu outbreak is SCHEDULED for six months from now...

[Atman]

In August 2005, the U.S. government said it would purchase millions of doses of a prototype bird flu vaccine from a French vaccine maker. The announcement came after the government said tests showed that the vaccine promoted an immune system response in healthy adults. The vaccine still needs to be tested over several months in adults older than 65 and in children. The vaccine won't be licensed until late in 2006, and it will take at least 6 to 12 months to produce useful amounts.

We

are

being

played.

Source: Mayo Clinic

[sutz12]

1. Yep, just before the election. nt

[LSparkle]

2. Also, make sure to apply for ABSENTEE BALLOTS

[mattclearing]

55. Because we all know that they get counted consistently.

:eyes:

[AndyA]

3. Elections coming up too

Perhaps this will be used as a scare tactic to keep people from voting.

Terra! Terra! Stay inside and lock your doors and windows. Bird flu is everywhere! Terra!

[Atman]

7. Actually, the ELECTIONS angle was how I found this link

I was mentioning this to my wife, who is an APRN and an avowed Bush detractor. Even still, she thought I might have had my tin foil on too tight, so she did her own research and found the Mayo link.

Do a search on DU for my posts about it, though, and you'll see that the elections have been my #1 choice, too. Now, combined with this Mayo Clinic story, I'm convinced we're being scammed.

Again.

[Virginia Dare]

4. Isn't Rummy set up to make a killing on the vaccine?

no pun intended.

[schmuls]

9. I read in my local paper that Cheney made 5 mil on the vaccine!

[The Backlash Cometh]

16. Sounds like insider trading.

[me b zola]

Not a vaccine, but an over-the-counter "flu" medication

It has been proven not to be in the least bit useful against the bird flu, but they have been pushing it anyway.

[Atman]

43. Tamiflu isn't OTC

But you're right, it was found to be ineffectual against bird flu -- AFTER they got every doctors office in America to stock up on it. Just ask the practice my wife works at. Rummy raked in $5 million from their "mistake."

[me b zola]

58. Thanks for the correction

Yeah, every now and then I see a news story that is covering the bird flu and they happen to mention Tamiflu, leaving the impression for those who don't know any better that they could benifit from it. The (intentional, IMHO) misperception about the effectiveness of Tamiflu is so wide spread that according to cnn, there is a black market for it in England.

At this point I'm not sure which Rummy has more of: blood on his hands or millions in "bonuses".

[JuniperLea]

5. Played like a fiddle

And the real deal is this: if and when the flu gets here, it will have mutated and the vaccine they are currently working on will have no effect.



But stock up on powered milk and tuna anyway, and keep it under your bed;)

I guess that stuff will attract cats and the cats will keep the birds out of your bedroom.

:shrug:

[druidity33]

51. not really...

If people stop eating chicken and Turkey, i think the population will be safe. I don't see too many birds biting people...

as far as mutating viruses, i believe that's been debunked... the 1918 pandemic strain and Avian Flu are not even in the same genetic ballpark.... sorry but i don't have links for that. I remember there being really only 2 scientists qualified to make the comparison (only 2 were given access to the original 1918 strain) and that they had contrary opinions. At the very least the mutation theory is still only just a theory...

cats are cool, but some are just no good at birding...

[muriel_volestrangler]

52. Likeness between 1918 virus and avian strains

The Nature article, by Jeffery Taubenberger and colleagues from the AFIP, reports on an analysis of the three polymerase genes in the 1918 virus, the last three genes to be fully spelled out. The researchers found that these genes closely resembled their counterparts in avian flu viruses.

"The polymerase protein sequences from the 1918 human influenza virus differ from avian consensus sequences at only a small number of amino acids, consistent with the hypothesis that they were derived from an avian source shortly before the pandemic," the report states.

Accordingly, the researchers propose that the 1918 virus was not a "reassortant," like those that caused the smaller pandemics of 1957 and 1968. In those cases, avian flu viruses traded some genes with human-adapted flu viruses to spawn new hybrids. The 1918 virus was "an entirely avian-like virus" that somehow adapted to humans, they suggest.

The report says only 10 amino-acid changes in the polymerase genes consistently distinguish the 1918 virus and subsequent human flu viruses from the same genes in avian viruses. It adds, "A number of the same changes have been found in recently circulating, highly pathogenic H5N1 viruses that have caused illness and death in humans and are feared to be the precursors of a new influenza pandemic."

A news story accompanying the report in Nature says that all eight genes from the 1918 virus differ in important ways from other human flu genes, which suggests that none of the genes came from a flu strain that had previously infected people. "It is the most bird-like of all mammalian flu viruses," Taubenberger is quoted as saying.

http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/cidrap/content/influenza/avianflu/news/oct0505studies.html

[druidity33]

54. not the article i read...

In fact the one i'm speaking of is in refute of the AFIP's (the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology?) conclusions. Ach, Mother Jones maybe? I'm sorry, i just can't look for it now... i'll check in in a few hours, see if i can find it.

Main premise was, yeah they're similar... but there are IMPORTANT differences.

Differences perhaps as small as this?
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/08/0831_050831_chimp_genes.html

[liberal N proud]

6. They will need to cancel the election because people would be

in danger going to the polls and interacting with other people, touching the computers that other have touched.
Just think, if we had paper ballots, you would not need to touch the same screen that the people who voted before you touched.

[Atman]

10. They won't be that obvious

They'll just have to float the CONTAGIOUS! meme, and people will stay away from the polls in droves.

"Stay in your homes, and especially stay away from old people and kids!" Two of the groups you're most likely to run into at a public polling place. And people WILL stay away, and therefore all the pre-election polling will be meaningless, because no one showed up at the polls, and that's why the REPUBLICANS won again...just so happens that more of them braved the flu to support their president.

[LSparkle]

11. But will they discourage people from SHOPPING or WORKING?

Are they really going to be willing to sacrifice their almighty "consumer economy" and encourage people to stay home if they're sick? It'll be interesting to see what kind of instructions people are given if/when the stuff gets here.

[converted_democrat]

18. Here's my take..

I think our economy is on the brink of collapse, and they will blame the collapse on the Bird Flu.. They'll say that all the people staying away from work and shopping was just too much for ever our "strong" economy to take.. They'll claim is wasn't their doing, it was the Bird Flu.. I think they'll play on the elections too, but I think they're trying to get cover for the coming collapse.. Dual purpose so to speak..

[PinkyisBlue]

48. I agree with you

All the signs (the real economic indicators, not Bushco's made up numbers) point to a failing economy. They can't admit that the failure is due to Bush's idiotic policies but is instead due to some unrelated outside event, like bird flu. Look how long they milked 9/11; they said for years that, because of 9/11, the economy wasn't growing as fast as predicted, tax revenue wasn't as high as they thought, etc.
This group can never, ever admit to failure. Only with this cast of characters can you have an innocent victim of multiple gun shots to the face apologize to the guy who shot him!!

[sarcasmo]

50. No need to cancel. Fear is how they won the last election and Fear

is how they will win in 06. Remember the Osama tape the week prior to the election in 04. FEAR, FEAR, FEAR.

"People need not fear their Governments. Governments should fear their people"

V for Vendetta

[uppityperson]

8. tuna and dried milk sales are up also.

store UNDER the bed, not in the pantry, for perfect bird flu rememdies.

[Fridays Child]

12. For those who haven't seen the GRAIN report on H5N1, it's worth reading.

Press Release

Full Report

GRAIN's letter to the Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations (FAO)

[Atman]

14. Can you say TYSON?

Any of these massive farming outlets are hot spots. Tyson and any of these huge producers have concentrated so much livestock into such confined spaces (MONEY!) that the normal, natural protections against such outbreaks are just overrun by the sheer volume.

[Fridays Child]

20. Yep, if factory poultry farming is the primary vector...

...and I believe GRAIN may be right about this, then the wild bird story is a red herring, designed to protect the corporations at the expense of all of us. What an incredibly avaricious and short-sighted objective. It's a classic case of cutting off the nose to spite the face. STUPID, STUPID, STUPID! But we'll all pay the price, if the lies continue.

[Radio_Lady]

39. That site is a real jolt. Amazing. Thanks for posting.

[Fridays Child]

47. You're welcome.

The briefing should have its own thread, again, so that more DUers can read it. Clara T posted it, a week or two back, in GD, and I've re-introduced it in at least a couple of related threads, since then. But it should be reprised, as its own thread, periodically, imho.

[Tsiyu]

56. Thanks for doing so

It is important to understand this issue.

:hi:

[Fridays Child]

57. Yes, it ranks among the most critical issues we're facing, imho...

...and it's hardly surprising that corporate protection at the expense of the public is the driving force. Every single time, all you have to do is follow the money. Deep Throat is one smart dude.

[depakid]

13. Try the start of next flu season....

but, conspiracy theories aside- we probably are being played, because this vaccine is unlikely to confer any substantial immunity to the variant that ultimately breaks out.

That's why the British aren't buying into the vaccine angle in their pandemic contingency plans.

[barbaraann]

15. I think they'll selectively cancel elections--"social distancing."

Sec. Leavitt was on cspan talking about social distancing in case of an epidemic and he seemed like it was forgone conclusion that it would happen.

[depakid]

21. Believe me, if it happens

according to some of the scenarios envisioned in pandemic contingency plans in countries around the world, elections will be the last thing people need to worry about....

And we won't need Bush or anyone else to tell us that.

[SammyWinstonJack]

17. Not hard to figure that out.

And when haven't we been played by bushco, either for political or monetary/profit purposes? It's what they do best, sadly.

[Minnesota Libra]

19. Of course - elections - duh!!!!!! nt

[muriel_volestrangler]

22. Who told you it's scheduled for six months from now?

Or do you just always assume the worst, when you read the Mayo Clinic piece?

[Atman]

34. Chertoff of The HSL did

Haven't you been following the news? Bird flu will be here in six months.

[Radio_Lady]

40. Channel 2 in Portland said it would be here in the Pacific NW ...

coming in from wild birds flying south from Alaska... in just a few months. It was on last night's local news KATU. I'll try to find a link.

[muriel_volestrangler]

49. I'm English; so I don't see every American headline about bird flu

But, as far as I can tell, they're talking about the arrival of the flu in birds in parts of the USA.

The virulent H5N1 strain of bird flu could reach the Americas in six to 12 months or even sooner as infected wild birds migrate toward the Arctic and Alaska, the U.N. bird flu chief said.

Migratory patterns will probably take birds carrying the virus from West Africa to the Arctic and Alaska this spring, Dr. David Nabarro said Wednesday. Some infected birds will then likely move south in the fall on a migratory route to the Americas.

"I think it's within the next six to 12 months," Nabarro told a news conference, "And who knows — we've been wrong on other things, it may be earlier."

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/09/health/main1385451.shtml

Which is vaguer, and more realistic. So the UN is pointing out migratory bird patterns to you. Would you rather they never told you anything about it?

[Atman]

53. I understand, but over here they are NEVER mentioning it is in BIRDS

Instead, we are being told to STOCK UP! Canned tuna and powdered milk under your bed! AAAKKK! (Will I still die if I put the canned goods in my pantry instead of under my bed?).

That is my point...we are intentionally being whipped into a panic, just as they've done every time Bush finds himself in serious trouble. I know they're talking about migratory birds, you obviously do, too. Tell that to the yokels in the red states!

Fear works for BushCo. They know it.

[helderheid]

23. k & r

[KAT119]

24. Bus neo-convicts using bird flu to declare martial law-no elections!!

[gordianot]

26. Get martial law, lower burden of the elderly, cut costs in schools.

Bonus, Profit, exploitation, manipulation Wonder who is investing in Flu Vaccines?

[Fridays Child]

25. kick

[niallmac]

27. Depending on a wing and a scare.

[alittlelark]

30. Great song.... it's one of the few w/ my name in it.

We played it over and over in the bar I worked in back in the 80's.......


But seriously.... IT FITS. It has fit from Reagan to the current brain-damaged WH resident.

[alittlelark]

28. I have tuna and powdered milk under my bed

I'll be sooooo SAFE!!!

Oh, and DO YOU KNOW what Jennifer Aniston said about Brad Pitt today!!!! I cannot believe they didn't make it! They are such a cute couple.............................................................................................

[smoogatz]

29. This is almost too ridiculous to respond to.

Almost. Are you suggesting that Bushco have the H2H bird flu virus in a petri dish somewhere, waiting to unleash it until just before the midterm elections? That they're willing to wipe out half of the human population around the globe in order to maintain a Republican majority in congress? Get a freaking grip, Atman.

[Swede]

31. Incredible,isn't it?

Some people need two tinfoil hats.

[Atman]

33. And some people need English comprehension lessons.

Try reading what I wrote, 'kay? Perhaps you'll point out the parts where I say BushCo is going to release any bird flu at all.

[Atman]

32. Why don't you try reading what I write instead of what you make up

Are you suggesting that Bushco have the H2H bird flu virus in a petri dish somewhere, waiting to unleash it until just before the midterm elections?

Get a grip yourself. Or perhaps, release the grip and pay attention. NO, I am not suggesting any such thing. Just read the actual words, not what you want them to say. NO WHERE in my post did I suggest anything like the bullshit words you're trying to put in my mouth.

Sorry to disappoint.

[smoogatz]

35. Mm'kay, then--

what are you implying? "I know why the Bird Flu outbreak is SCHEDULED for six months from now..." Scheduling implies capability and intent. Perhaps you could clarify instead of just insinuating.

[Atman]

36. Oh, excuse me

I didn't realize your first post to me was meant to be civil.

:eyes:

[smoogatz]

37. It was meant to be rational.

So what were you implying, if not that Bushco will use H2H bird flu to manipulate the election?

[smoogatz]

38. Helloooo....

Anybody there?

[Atman]

42. Oh, sorry. The insults threw me off.

I'm not prepared to get into a long back and forth with someone who has already started off with a bias that I'm a tin-foiler and need to "get a grip."

It is not as simple as "the government is going to release bird flu." I don't think they're going to do any such thing. Have you been paying any attention AT ALL to the way this administration operates, especially when it is in trouble? Through FEAR and PANIC and manipulating the public.

I don't think they have to release so much as a bad cold. Just lots of good press releases. AND, don't you find anything at all suspicious that after a year of drumbeating the coming bird flu, Chertoff comes out and says it will be here in six months? Now read the Mayo post again. Now look at your calendar. Any significant event scheduled for around that time?

Face it, BushCo knows everybody is on to them with the fake-o terra alerts. A year ago, many would have guessed the next panic event they'd use would be some sort of attack scenerio. But that is off the table now, pretty much, because now when Bush issues a terra alert, the nation laughs at him. And if they really tried to fake one, he'd be run out of town on rails (finally) for allowing us to be attacked again after all the so-called security bullshit, Patriot Act, NSA spying, etc, etc, etc. But bird flu, real or not, is something he ostensibly cannot control. Nature may carry it on the wind! Bush will get a chance to be a hero again and protect America!

Here is what I am saying in a nutshell: BIRD FLU is for BIRDS. It is not a human illness. So why are we being told to hide tuna and powdered milk under our beds? Are you sucking face with lots of live chickens? That six-months timetable also conveniently brings us into the regular ol' flu season. It will be so easy to confuse and manipulate the public -- and get them to line up to take these brazillion doses of experimental vaccine (for which no pharmaceutical company can be sued, btw, thanks to BushCo).

What some call "tin foil" others would call good, healthy cynism, after five years of EVERYTHING Bush does later proven to be FAKE or simply to benefit one industry or another.

So, as you see, your assumption as to the meaning of my original post was just wrong. You may still feel I'm nuts, but how about leaving the insults out of it at least until you're sure you've understood what was being posted, 'kay?

(edited for typos)

[smoogatz]

44. Easily offended, are we? Sorry.

And thanks for the explanation. But--if you look at wild bird migratory patterns, bird flu is in fact likely to arrive in the Americas in the next six months or so, yes. Officials at CDC and other infectious disease researchers put the likelihood of bird flu making the H2H jump at anywhere from 20-50%. I can't speak for anyone else, but I think it may in fact be prudent to at least keep an open mind about the possibility that this could very quickly become a serious health threat to a great many people. I also think you make a pretty wild imaginative leap when you associate the probably correct assertion that the H5N1will arrive shortly in the Americas with the unrelated fact that our elections also happen in the fall. But hey, I could be wrong.

[Atman]

45. "But hey, I could be wrong."

And hey, I could be too.

But when it comes to BushCo, that's yet to happen. That's what scares me most. I want to be wrong so badly, but these fuckers trip me up every time!

(BTW, I am not easily offended...you dove into the argument with the insults, not me. If all you wanted was an explanation, you simply could have asked for one and left out the snark. How the hell did you expect me to react? Blow you kisses?)

[Chimichurri]

41. Well, Rummy is rolling around 5 million one dollar bills right now

thanks to Tamiflu. I bet he's chuckling at us right now, too.

We are being played, big time!

[savemefromdumbya]

46. martial law