There's one reason that pushing Censure is a bad idea...

[Rosco T.]

.. win or lose, the 'thugs will use it to energize the mindless drone... er.. I mean their base for '06.

SEE WHAT IS HAPPENING NOW! VOTE US BACK IN OR THE FILTHY GODLESS DEMS WILL IMPEACH OUR LORD SHRUBYA!

I still favor censure/impeachment... but I think we should have kept the power dry till after November.

[Drum]

1. I say let the chips fall where they may...

Standing back and looking for the "right" opportunity to strike back hasn't really worked too well for our Dem "representatives", has it? I mean, did stepping aside and hoping for the best work well in other developing fascist states?

Censure-->Impeach-->Convict!

[dchill]

2. I agree totally...

Bush is out to kill us all. He's gotta go.

[napi21]

3. Sure that's what they're saying, but if the majority of voters

believe Shrub broke the law, they just might be working against themselves! Them Godless Dems might do exactly what the people want!

[Demit]

4. Running away in fear is sure to keep Dem "power dry", long after November

In typing haste, there is truth.

[ginnyinWI]

5. Maybe Feingold was thinking of the elections this fall

I mean, maybe he saw this as a way to counteract moves made by Congressional repubs as they try to distance themselves from the WH. Cause this forces them to get behind * and realign themselves with him again. And then they can all sink together.

The scenario you describe would work if *'s approval ratings were anywhere near a majority opinion. But I think the ones who are through with * are going to stay through with him, and the other 33% can't do any harm.

[SoFlaJet]

6. then we're no better than them

that would be playing politics instead of adhering to the rule of law they swore to uphold-I agree-let the chips fall where they may and stop thinking so much-do what's RIGHT!!

[LZelig]

7. 70% of dem voters...

70% of dem voters back censure. Senators will follow the polls, stay tuned...

[Drum]

8. "...the power dry till after November."

As if the Rupubs wouldn't have their bulletproof legislation against anti-Bush measures in place by then? As if the GOP dirty tricks won't be smearing our best Dem voices by then??

Hit Bush (or BEGIN) hitting him now, while he's weak and unsteady...don't wait for the fight-bell to ring so he can last another round!

That "powder" is supposed to be gunpowder, I believe, yes? It's for fighting back with, not exchanging for wishes or used as moral capital....

[kentuck]

9. I would think it would have the opposite effect....?

Since they are already not very pleased with him, it seems talk of censure or impeachment would only validate their present feeling about Junior? I don't buy the argument that the Republicans are going to flock to the polls to defend Bush...

[magellan]

10. I think any Repubs who still support Bush** would worry about that anyway

It's really very hard to argue that the Repugs weren't already aware of the risk if the Dems regain control of Congress this November. Conyers' impeachment resolution has been floating around for a while, and in their black little hearts they've known all along that Bush** has broken the law several times over and the only thing keeping him safe is their majority control. Feingold won't have added to that fear...but the polls showing gaining support for censure and impeachment sure will!

Maybe we should stop polling?

[MADem]

11. Feingold is the lead dog, and the lead dog gets the best view

Of course, the lead dog is the first one attacked by any beasts lurking in the woods, too.

Remember the Murtha business? He had no traction initially, and now that sonofabitch has enough traction to pull a fully loaded tractor trailer out of a twenty foot muddy ditch--with his bare hands.

Things never happen as fast as we want them to. Keep mentioning censure; keep saying the word. Get it in the mindset of the nitwits. They can't keep attacking provinces as a distraction forever--first, they don't have the manpower; second, they will run out of provinces; and third, the people over there will start getting highly pissed off. And we don't have the logistic support in place to attack Iran....YET.

So keep saying the word. Exercise patience, but don't let the issue go away. It's highly unlikely that anything will happen before November--the GOP clowns up for reelection do NOT want their vote on the record as people head to the polls. If they vote "yes" for censure, they lose their RNC funding, and their campaigns dry up like a turd in the desert. If they vote "no" then their supporters do the same. It is in the GOP interest to stall this, make it go away, hide it.

It is in the Democrats' interest to keep this issue bob-bob-bobbing along....we don't NEED a vote today, but we do need DISCUSSION of a vote at least once a week from now to November.

[debbierlus]

12. Oh, please!

HE HAS A 33% APPROVAL RATING!

33%. LOWER THEN NIXON.

Who the hell are they going to mobilize?

The VAST majority HATE Bush.

Ever think that it could ENERGIZE the other 67%.

Like I said...

Oh, PLEASE!

[Shipwack]

13. Even if true, that is exactly why censure is a great move!

If the right-wing base is going to get riled up, let it be at a time of our own choosing. I'd rather them start getting riled up and tired now, when they have to push an unpopular President, than have them called in when the Republicans start getting some momentum.

Forcing them to attack us when we're strong is a basic tactic... Read "The Art of War" sometime... It applies to many things, not just war .

[dogday]

14. They will energize their base regardless with

baseless slanders and rumors of no merit just to get them stirred... Either we fight back or we will be framed the party with no backbone or rule or law... They will use this against us either way.. At least this way we look like fighters, and who would you rather have on your team?

[ladjf]

15. Rosco, I see your logic and it makes sense. However, I believe

that the percentage of Americans who are mindlessly devoted to Bush is decreasing. And if I am correct, it might mean that the Feingold resolution will become a rallying idea that collects followers as it gains momentum.

[Rosco T.]

16. and I have one word that makes the polls meaningless...

Diebold

all they have to do is give the IMPRESSION that the 'base' supports Shrubya... viola.. another mandate

[ladjf]

17. You are absolutely correct on this. Perhaps I'm too optimistic,

but, I believe that if the Democrats overwhelm the vote counts in November, they can prevail even in face of the rigged vote machines. I say that because I don't think they are able to rig enough of the elections to cope with a huge majority, say 10% or so. If I'm wrong on that, then we might as well quit all of our discussion about this political idea or that politician and devote full time to cleaning up elections. That is exactly what has and is happening in Latin America. They are showing the people the way.

[jsamuel]

18. if you believe that, then why oppose censure?

[genieroze]

19. Their real base is baseless.

[msgadget]

20. But, they're not saying that, they're pulling out the 'aiding the

enemy' line instead because what he's doing is indefensible. If it was baseless they could say that but calling attention to the censure motion itself could risk a voter actually reading the thing and wondering why they're not doing more than trying to cover his ass after the fact or why they aren't fighting harder for THEIR rights under the law. NOBODY likes the idea of domestic spying without oversight - nobody. It's not an us against them thing unless we continue to allow them to portray it as such. This is a betrayal of AMERCIAN trust. I'm an AMERICAN with rights and there's no room for partisanship in that statement. By not supporting the censure the democrats are actually making it political. Here is a golden opportunity to fight for the rights of all and not just for the majority. Even if they lose, they will have tried to govern.

[Rainscents]

21. They're base is scatter all over the place, so, in reality, there base

is gone.