There are plenty of reasons to oppose RUSS. The best reason is

[mdmc]

Poll question: There are plenty of reasons to oppose RUSS. The best reason is

The best reason to oppose the Russ Feingold resolution to censure the president is

[Mass]

1. I'm for censure but think that Russ did it in a messy way

Which option is that?

[mdmc]

5. messy how?

Is Russ grandstanding? Will his move make it harder for dems to get elected? Will it strengthen our enemies and hurt our effort to wage a war vs. terra?

It depends on what you mean by messy. Could you offer additional information?

[Mass]

11. I guess my point is I dont oppose censure, I am disappointed by the way

the move was done.

He should have at least informed his colleagues before talking on This Week (not necessarily waiting until they were on board), may be create a small coalition (obviously Harkin and Boxer were ready to go on board, at the minimum). It makes his move look totally disorganized, even if it was sure to please the netroots.

I cant say it is grandstanding because I dont know what his intentions were. It is certainly not going to hurt the war on terra, though?

I g

[mdmc]

14. if you had to vote in this poll, I would suggest choice 2

Russ planned this poorly, and it will make it harder for dems to get reelected.

[blm]

20. I don't oppose censure, but Russ opposes impeachment - read the transcript

from his press conference:


Snip...
QUESTION: Senator, this resolution, if it were passed, would
have no legal effect.
FEINGOLD: No.

QUESTION: So the only thing that would affect the NSA program,
if it's illegal, is to cut off the funding? You don't support that,
do you?
FEINGOLD: Well, there are several things that could affect the
program. First of all, one would hope, if this passes, that the
president would acknowledge what Congress has said and would bring the
program within FISA, which is what he should do.
Another approach, of course, is the legal system, is hoping that
we could get some kind of a court order and a response in the legal
system ordering the president to come within the law.
So I don't think that necessarily the idea of cutting off funding
-- even cutting off funding, how are you going to enforce that? If
the president has inherent power, he'll just shift some money around.
He'll just keep doing it. I mean, that's the problem with this
doctrine. If the president isn't going to acknowledge that a law we
passed, such as FISA, binds him, why should the cutting off of funding
affect him?

QUESTION: Senator, for those who are your critics who would
liken this or they talk about your central resolution in the same
breath that they talk about impeachment, and just say this is nothing
but one step ahead of impeachment. How do you counter that,
especially when they're using it as a weapon before the midterms to
say: The Democrats get in power, you're going to see impeachment.
FEINGOLD: Clearly, I chose to pursue censure rather than
impeachment, certainly at this point, because I believe at this point
it's a way to help us positively resolve this issue.
In other words, without getting the country in the middle of a
huge problem, like we had with the attempted Clinton impeachment, we
have a passing of a resolution of censure, and hopefully the president
would acknowledge it and say that he maybe went too far, and we would
be able to move forward and stop worrying about this and get a pledge
from the president that he's going to come within the law or make
proposals to change the law to allow it.
I think this actually is in the area of an impeachable offense.
I think it is right in the strike zone of what the founding fathers
thought about when they talked about high crimes and misdemeanors.
But the Constitution does not require us to go down that road,
and I hope that in a sense I'm a voice of moderation on this point,
where I'm saying it may not be good for the country to do this, it may
not be good for the country in a time of war to try to remove the
president from office, even though he's surely done something wrong.
But what we can't do is just ignore the wrongful conduct. So
this is a reasonable road. And anybody who argues this is a sort of
prelude to impeachment forgets the history of the Clinton impeachment,
where censure was offered by some, especially Democrats. Senator
Feinstein offered a censure resolution of President Clinton after the
impeachment trial as an alternative because impeachment was regarded
by many as too drastic of a step.

Snip...
QUESTION: Do you see any chance whatsoever that your resolution
would be passed by this Republican Senate?
FEINGOLD: I'd be pretty surprised. But this president,
presumably, will be president for several years. And it is very
possible that others will later on control the Congress. And this is
something that could be examined at different points.
If the president changes course and indicates that he understands
that this was not lawful and that he should not have done it, then it
becomes less important.
But if he continues to assert not only this but other extreme
executive power doctrines, it will continue to be important to push
back and to ask the president to return to the law.

[mdmc]

21. I'm with Russ on this, we can change our mind after a 2006 blow out

[jsamuel]

2. what's with all the "oppose Russ" threads?

[mdmc]

8. I'm looking to get to the bottom of it right now.

why are people not supporting Russ? Why? :shrug:

[jsamuel]

13. I know at least one person LOVES Hillary if that has anything to do withit

[mdmc]

15. we all love Hillary, but that should not equal opposition to censure

:kick:

[mdmc]

22. is this OP poll an "oppose Russ" thread

:shrug:

[NoAmericanTaliban]

3. Wimpy Dems. Will not win if they are GOP light.

Censure is a mere slap on the hand, but it's a start, I guess... The wimpy Democrats are finally beginning to get some backbone, because several REAL Republicans (as opposed to Nazi yes-men) have had enough of the bull----, too, and are joining them.

Remember? They had IMPEACHED Clinton for having an extramarital affair and lying about it...no lives were lost, no dent was made to our booming economy...Now think 9/11 and NO connection to the War in Iraq (with thousands of lives and billions of dollars lost), the Patriot Act, illegal torture, Katrina, economic depression, the price of oil skyrocketing (Bush loves big oil companies--HE'S an oil man, too, you know!), our ports being run by Arabs (why? because Bush cares more about his oil-buddies than our National Security? well, duh), relaxing or throwing out environmental laws to help big-time polluting big industries, opening our National Parks, our CHILDRENS' LEGACY, to big-industry logging and oil drilling (which will only benefit THEM, not the U.S.), illegal wiretapping, Social Security cuts, cuts to education, Medicare and Medicaid, WIC, Veterans benefits, etc, etc, and BIG tax breaks for the rich...the lies go on and on...

Like I said, Censure is a mere slap on the hand, but it's a start...

[mdmc]

19. I am curious on how you voted

care to share?

[Demit]

4. I see you've put a lot of thought into how to oppose censure.

I didn't vote b/c you don't have a category there for what I think of your poll. Why don't you put into words what your own thoughts really are? It would be more forthright.

[mdmc]

7. I think that censure is important public policy

right now, right on.

Perhaps choice 10 fits your style? :kick:

[mdmc]

17. What do you think of my response? Are we on the same page?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

6. You forgot "It makes the 'moderates' wet themselves.

[mdmc]

10. choice 2 or 3

might work

[jsamuel]

9. ROFL!!! - someone just voted "it is not polite to censure the president."

:rofl:

[Carni]

12. If he is censured can he still be impeached later?

Dumb question I know...but I want him OUT and from what I have read censuring him doesn't look like it will rid the country of him, so to me it's kind of like what is the point?

Can someone explain this in a "for dummies" fashion?

[mdmc]

16. sure, unless the censure is written to stop impeachment.

the truth is, Russ' censure movement will fail. I still support it because it is the right thing to do right now.

[Carni]

18. Thanks for answering

I was unclear on what exactly this all means.

[mdmc]

27. I'm really not sure

anyone else confirm?

[sandnsea]

24. Yes but Russ opposes that

"in a time of war".

[in_cog_ni_to]

23. GO RUSS!

:thumbsup:

[mdmc]

28. GO RUSS!

[brooklynite]

25. It was the wrong message at the wrong time...

I'm guessing that most of you didn't live through Watergate, but the impeachment phase didn't occur until nearly two years after the initial crimes were revealed, and only after investigations and stonewalling had galvanized public opinion in favor of removing Nixon (and I'm not talking about a 46%-44% margin). Rushing into a censure resolution only reinforces the still-stong but waning support Bush has in his own base, while failing to galvanize the average voter who, in my opinion, aren't concerned about this, because they don't see it affecting them personally.

What they do think affects them personally are issues like the war and health-care. Consider that Bush gave speeches on both these issues this week. The press coverage in my neck of the woods was "President Bush still has a problem with.....and gave a speech today to try and turn public opinion". Now ask yourself: what did the Democrats say this week about either of these issues? Anything you can remember? Anything that got media play? If Senator Clinton had shown up at any pharmacy within 10 miles of the President (in upstate NY) to lament the problems with Medicare Part D and promise something as simple as allowing the Government to negotiate prices on drugs, think of the press we would have gotten. Instead, the only airtime I saw on the Dems was "disarray" and "distancing" on the Censure motion, an issue that, sadly but true, doesn't resonate with my Grandmother and Aunt in Kansas.

[mdmc]

26. I didn't live through watergate, but I lived through whitewater

we will never have a soapbox like the pres. has.

[madokie]

29. I support Russ and there was no way to do it politely, so get over it.

he said what needs to be said and done what needs to be done.

[Swamp Rat]

30. SUPPORT FEINGOLD!!! ... SUPPORT CENSURE!!!

STRIKE WHILE THE IRON IS HOT!!!

SUPPORT FEINGOLD!!!

:patriot:

[mdmc]

31. while it is HOT !!!