We are Democrats. Our Leaders (for the most part) Are Not.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

Sorry, I feel they have been bought and paid for by the same people that paid for the repugs.

A Dem is the working man or woman. A politician is a wealthy person beholding to the powers that took him or her to office.

This is simple. This is true.

It has been for a long time.

There is something inherantly wrong with our political system. It's the inclusion of big money.

Until (or if) that is fixed, we are doomed as a country.

[EST]

1. One of the first orders of business must be to remove

citizenship status from corporations.
Failing that, cortions must be allowed to discorporate (die) just as must we real human citizens. The rules of life and death do not allow for re-corporating or even remaining on brain-dead life support forever.
How 'bout a nice round number, say-fifty years? Any corporation older than that have to cease, right now, and no corporate citizen may be purchased by another, subsumed by another, or continue as big as life, except for all debts, such as pensions. If they cannot pay off an amount to an account for the use of pensioners, they must be broken up and all assets used to satisfy those debts.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

2. Since they assign real person status to a corporation,

I don't see how what you propose is that far off.

[EST]

4. That's 'cause you and I are real-life, pragmatic realists, not

public teat sucking "hope nobody notices how incompetent I am" politicians.

[blm]

13. Now would be the time to resubmit Kerry/Wellstone's Clean Elections bill

and push it through as a tribute to Wellstone.

The timing couldn't be better, since people now recognize the power of the lobbyists and the fact that a few states have now adapted the Clean Elections bill for their own state elections. Seems it would have a running start now.

[TayTay]

3. Well, remedy the situation. Take out papers and run.

Change it. Make it work. It's your damn Party and your damn country. Go fix it.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

9. I do what I can.

Because of my antiwar stance and actions during Nam, I doubt they'd let me run.

[SammyWinstonJack]

5. They are not all wealthy and even if the are, it doesn't mean that they

do not connect with us. Rep Kucinich and Sen Harkin certainly fight for us. I won't give up on my Party and I won't paint them all with the same broad brush.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

6. Please notice the caveat in the OP... (for the most part)

I very much think that Kucinich is on the same page as most of us. I don't know that much about Harkin at this point.

I still feel the vast majority have debts to pay their backers.

[LibDemAlways]

7. Only people with money have the attention of

politicians. When Gray Davis was running for California Governor my brother was invited to a private fundraiser by a wealthy insider he had done some insurance-related work for. The host introduced him to Davis who cut right to the chase, "I haven't met you before. Are you a lawyer? Banker?" When my brother responded that he had met the host when he adjusted his homeowner's claim, the conversation was over. Unless you are handing over a sizable sum, you might as well be invisible.

[upi402]

8. you're right

i can't beleive there are so many Dems who don't see it.
it's been obvious for 12+ years.

[deutsey]

10. I am a democrat. That's why I left the Democratic Party.

:evilfrown:

[blm]

11. Then SUPPORT the Dems who advocate for Clean Elections and stop lumping

them in with all the others who don't.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

12. Okay, which ones haven't taken money from Big Pharm, Defense,

or the Insurance Industry?

I am pretty sure it's a short list, but I would support any of them who have not received money from these or related industries.

[blm]

14. The problem is that anyone could be twisted into that category.

Individuals who work for those companies and donate to a candidate are listed as part of that industry.

You need to specify which lawmaker does NOT accept corporate pac money for his races. One of the problems, though, is that with Presidential races there is so much money coming in and the corporations will try to get any money in there to hedge their bets so they aren't iced out totally. So even a much smaller donation gives an appearance it shouldn't have.

For example: Throughout his senate races since 1984, Kerry refused corporate pac money. In 2004 alot of money went into the presidential campaign that normally never would have found its way there, but still never in the quantities that Bush was getting. Does anyone seriously believe Rupert Murdoch's donations to Gore and then Kerry were sincere? No - they were for show while his entire corporation was actually working against them both 24/7.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

15. I respect you, BLM, but there are records of who gets what from whom...

And Pharma, Insurance and Defense have their fingers in the vast majority of our people and even more in the repugs. They got DIRECT funds from the corporate entities described.

Dean prooved that it can be done without.

:hi:
Peace.

[blm]

16. Except even his donations showed that ALL those companies were represented

Same with EVERY candidate, even Nader. You can twist and exaggerate the reasons for the donations of individuals who are just workers in those industries.

The FACTS don't change - how people choose to distort the facts is another story. Do you honestly believe that Dean would have told the Dem party and his campaign not to accept any money from any individual who worked in those three industries? Did he do that in the primary? I don't recall seeing that memo. Or even that he was an advocate for public=financing as governor or during his primary run.

He may very well be an advocate for it now, though, or at least, heading in that direction.

Are you really unaware of who the public-financing advocates are? Seems odd that someone so concerned about corporate pac money wouldn't know this information.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

18. You are right.

And therein lies the problem.

[Hubert Flottz]

17. You are 100% correct!

The Corporate Mafia owns the politicians! All corporate money should be banned from political campaigns. It's the ONLY way to fix our broken government. We see NOW, that their way is not working for 98% of America!

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

19. Thank you. That is the point of the OP

Until we destroy the infrastructure of corporate interest in American politics, we are in a Red Flyer to Hell.