Am I being selfish?

[CatWoman]

I highly resent all of the billions being poured into Iraqi reconstruction.

Look around here in the United States.

Roads full of potholes, shabby; inadequate levees "protecting" New Orleans, over crowed schools, outrageous property taxes, inflated gas prices, ever increasing home heating and electric bills, overcrowded school classrooms, dilapidated hospitals, faulty power grids. The beat goes on..........

And I'm supposed to give a flying fuck about a school being built in Iraq?

If that's the "good news" that I'm supposed to care about, perhaps I'm being a selfish bitch.

Why can't Iraqis build their own schools?

Aren't they sitting on the second largest oil reserves in the world?

We are spending trillions of much needed revenue to rebuild a country that has oil flowing out of its ass. And I'm supposed to feel GOOD about that?

[Sammy Pepys]

1. No....n/t

...

[madmom]

No, while I'm upset that we blew their country to bits, I think our

infrastucture need those billions of dollars spent here.

[pitohui]

2. i feel the same way

rebuild the gulf coast, don't ask me to give a flying fuck abt schools in iraq when we don't have schools in orleans parish or plaquemines parish or cameron parish

don't tell me abt hospitals in iraq when our entire public hospital system was destroyed in a single day

besides, all they're building stuff for in iraq is to bomb it down again, it's just a revenue churning deal anyway, who do they think they're kidding?

[tandot]

3. "after we rebuild Iraq, can we rebuild our schools?"

A bumpersticker I saw.

I don't get that either. All the oil they have and we have to pay for rebuilding Iraq. They still have to explain that one, don't they?

[kstewart33]

4. It bothers me too, but...

we went in and blew up much of their country, so we have a responsibility to fix it. Just another dimension of this totally tragic and very costly in all respects war.

[CatWoman]

6. a responsibility, yes

but can't they fucking pay for it?

[Bridget Burke]

13. Louisiana has oil, too.

Can't THEY fucking pay for it?

[CatWoman]

14. apples and oranges

or are you "trying" to be funny?

Besides, are the Gulf States not required to repay the federal government for reconstruction?

[Binka]

19. Give The Reconstruction Contracts To France They Were Right About This War

Reward them for their wisdom and refusal to participate. Give them the contracts in LA as well they birthed much of the culture of NOLA. Cut fucking war profiteering Halliburton & Bechtel out of the kitty. France deserves the contracts.

If we cut the BFEE out of the kitty they have NO reason to continue this illegal immoral insane crusade. They only keep blowing shit up because they are making a MOFO fortune over there. Bring the taxpayers money back to the fucking taxpayers. The citizens of the USA.

End of rant. :mad:

[pitohui]

31. yes louisiana has to repay -- even tho we don't get fair royalties

maybe the know-nothings wwho would like us to do w.out rebuilding forever could do their part and do w. out oil, gas, coffee, and food until such time as the state of louisiana is allowed to collect royalties on oil leases proportionate to what alaska and texas gets

we are supposed to pay back 25 percent of what fema spends -- even tho fema does not control or direct its spending properly and even tho the state has little resources or tax revenues to pay any of this money back

ignorance must be bliss, thanks for standing up for us, catwoman

[Astrocloud]

64. All Money Flows back to Halliburton

Common -you're being too reasonable.

Don't you know that rebuilding Iraq (and Louisana) is all about moving American Dollars into Halliburton's wallets.

[DUHandle]

26. Ms. Burke,

We are total agreement here.

Respectfully,


DUHandle

[Binka]

27. Oh Barf n/t

[DUHandle]

32. Please correct me if I'm wrong

I have yet to read about a tax or fee increase in LA to pay for some of the reconstruction.

Any information you could provide to the contrary would be appreciated.

[pitohui]

34. tis pity some can't keep up

the state has already been presented w. a bill for $150 million from the federal gov't from fema

and this is just for starters -- the first billing period !

this is why the (democratic) governor is saying there will be an end to new oil leases offshore louisiana as of august if something doesn't change in a hurry, for years, BILLIONS of dollars has been stolen from this state by the federal gov't, we need fair royalties such as texas gets, and we need a windfall profit tax, big oil had the biggest profit of any industry of all time in human history because of hurricane katrina and by the damn they can chip in

and all for what, so shitheads can have our oil and gas and then shit on us in our time of need


the individual working people you would like to tax have lost their homes and have been scattered across 50 states and are not conveniently there to be jacked for any lint that might be remaining in their pockets, the rich neighborhoods of lakeview, tax base of orleans parish, have been destroyed and the people scattered even over the world

i say again, people who don't know what they're talking abt, perhaps should refrain from comment, they only embarrass themselves

unless you are calling for a windfall profits tax or a fair royalty -- and somehow i don't think you are -- get out of the way of people who have progressive and productive answers

[DUHandle]

45. Taxing the people who lost everything, no, no

separate the damaged parishes, counties, and so on from a taxing district.

Said district would only tax undamaged areas.

[Bridget Burke]

52. Start fixing things up, first.

After all, it's been six months.

I thought you guys were AGAINST taxes?

[Binka]

35. Read Post #34 And More Barf On You

Sorry to be so rude to a newbie but you are just a hoot! HOOT! LMAO. Oh welcome to DU I am sure this will be a fun ride for you. HOOT!

[DUHandle]

44. Google, perhaps

on a ranking of Federal Dollars returned to States, and I think you'll find that before Katrina, LA was getting back about $1.20 for every buck of Federal Tax paid.

Take a look at some of the other States while you're at it.

If your memory is good, you'll recall that shortly after Bush went into office, FL was increased to $0.99 and a few months ago, Arnold went to Washington to petition for $0.99.





no problems with hoots and all that either

[Binka]

53. Oh Goody Goody Thanks For The Insight

I just do not know what I would do without you.

[pitohui]

33. i'll second that barf EOM

.

[Bridget Burke]

37. Nope. Guess you can't understand snark.

Iraq needs to pay to reconstruct what WE destroyed. "After all, they have all that oil."

Or, at least, that's what some say.

Louisianans (& others on the Gulf coast) have paid plenty in taxes. They need help now--actually, they've needed help for 6 months. Didn't Bushie make some promises?

[Radio_Guy]

40. I agree to a point

It would benefit the corporations a whole heck of a lot to have New Orleans rebuilt. Tax the oil companies, the pro sports teams, Lockheed-Martin, and every other major corporation that benefits from a rebuilt New Orleans. Put that money back into the city for roads, their employees houses and what have you. The average worker shouldn't have to bear the burden themselves.

[pitohui]

30. give us the damn royalties on our oil

and we'd be happy to pay for it

suggest if you don't know what the hell you're talking abt to just stop talking for a minute

[Bridget Burke]

36. I was answering the post that said the Iraqis should pay....

For their reconstruction. Because they have all that oil!

I don't think either Louisiana or Iraq should have to pay.

[CatWoman]

41. Louisiana is a part of the United States

the last time I looked, anyway.

I think it's a huge stretch to think that the US has money to build entire countries -- countries that have vast oil reserves.

[Bridget Burke]

51. Who has control of Iraqi oil?

The Iraqi people? If we ended the war, we'd have plenty of money left over.

Why don't we STOP destroying Iraq--then see what to do next.

[CatWoman]

63. I agree with you there

[DUHandle]

46. how about

revenue from shipping on the mighty mississippi while we are at it?

[Binka]

54. Has Any Body Told You How Naive You Sound?

If not consider me the first. You sound like an uniformed kid. How old are you?

[DUHandle]

56. Question for you

What’s wrong about looking at existing Federal monies going to the various States?

For that matter, why not look at the difference in personal tax burden, by State?

[Binka]

58. Boo Yah

See Yah!

[cynatnite]

5. Without a war raging...

we could probably take care of business here at home and help abroad as well. By all rights, bush should have accepted the help after the invasion, worked with a variety of countries to help Iraq build a working government, had other companies besides Halliburton assist in the reconstruction and a million other things to get the country going again.

If this hadn't been one gigantic cluster fuck from the beginning, Iraq and the US would be a hell of a lot better off even with the illegal invasion.

[petronius]

7. Not selfish, exactly

When it comes to Iraq, I think we have an obligation to fix what we broke. The problems you list here are at least equally important, and they've been neglected for too long (instead, we get a tax cut!)

It isn't a question of either/or (Iraq/domestic), but rather the fact that we have failed to correctly prioritize at home. We need to fight for a government (and society) that fulfills its responsibilities at home as well as abroad, but I'm not fully comfortable with your construction of these as competing priorities...

[CatWoman]

10. my property taxes have almost doubled

I'm paying three times as much to fill my gas tank. It cost me $10 when I bought it in 1998.

Just got notice my electric bill will be increasing.
AGAIN.

the hell you say.

[petronius]

16. Perhaps I used the word "we" a little loosely...(nt)

[Bridget Burke]

38. I'm a renter & use mass transit more than I drive.

I guess I'm not prosperous enough to want to let Iraq go to Hell.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

55. Just because you rent and use mass transit

don't think that you don't pay those taxes. The person that owns your property pays taxes on it. When the taxes increase, so does your rent (eventually). The higher the cost of fuel, the greater will be your cost of using mass transit. Even if you don't pay higher amounts for the mass transit, someone is. Tax payers subsidize mass transit, and if money is scarce, then either mass transit suffers or some other valuable program gets cut.

[Bridget Burke]

57. Yes, I know I pay those taxes indirectly.

I've used the same argument against those railing against the undocumented workers who "don't pay taxes."

I just think that we need to end the war FIRST. Complaining about spending money to fix Iraq while we're still blowing it up is a bit short-sighted. Complaining about rising property taxes & expensive gas is just a bit suburban. Are those the worst problems facing Americans?

[EvolveOrConvolve]

61. I agree with you

I was just pointing out that everyone pays taxes whether they own real estate or a car. You know that, but a surprisingly large number of Americans don't.

I think we should get the hell out of Iraq and contract the clean-up to another country or organization like the U.N.

[Solly Mack]

8. It's not selfish to wonder why US dollars can't be used to help Americans

I, personally, don't believe that US dollars are going to the Iraqi people to make their life better. I think it's going to defense contractors, foreign investors, and those Iraqis that will yield power in any government. It's also going to the "coalition of the willing" members.

Also, even if Iraq wasn't happening, I do not think that a single dollar would be going to those in need in America - not under a Bush. Bush would squander that money just as he is doing now - still pay it out to defense contractors, give the wealthy a larger tax cut, give more to corporations and faith based organizations with right wing ideologies.

[elehhhhna]

9. They aren't rebuilding stuff, they're painting it. The $'s being STOLEN..

If they did it here we'd see it.

[Nikki Stone 1]

22. I'll bet it's happening in NOLA right now

.nt

[serryjw]

11. I don't want to upset you further

but try reading this
quote........
Every month, 80-year-old Sally Shaver pays someone to drive her to the Harvest Hope Food Bank in Columbia, S.C., to pick up a box of fresh produce, baked goods, dry cereals, juice, canned goods and cheese. "It really helps me out because after paying for my rent, phone bill and medication, I barely have enough for food," she says. "If I could work, I would, but I have an artificial knee and a pacemaker, and I can't get around."

Shaver, who worked as a nurse's aide for most of her life, brings in $451 a month in social security. Her fixed income qualifies her for the Commodity Supplemental Food Program (CSFP), which is designed to improve the health and nutrition of low-income senior citizens, pregnant women, postpartum mothers, infants and children.

Last year, CSFP provided 536,196 people with a monthly box of food. Bush's proposed budget for 2007 calls for a nationwide elimination of the entire program.

end quote...........
http://www.alternet.org/story/33808/

[CatWoman]

12. Oh.......my.....God!!!

he wants to fucking ELIMINATE it?

Bush is a goddam monster :grr:

[bigscott]

15. he is not a monster

he is the devil himself

[serryjw]

18. Unfortunately, he's not alone

A food bank for low income seniors is not a priority when you need to give your buddies tax cuts and Halliburtin more war contracts,

[ArbustoBuster]

17. I don't think you're being selfish.

I personally reject the Pottery Barn theory of Iraq ("You broke it, you bought it") because I think it's a neocon talking point meant to keep us in Iraq forever. In my opinion, Iraq won't get repaired until we leave and stop shooting up the place.

The trillion dollars that the neocon Bushites have wasted in Iraq should be taken out of their own personal pockets and poured into repairing the damage they did to our country.

[Binka]

24. The Pottery Barn Theory Works If The YOU Is The Neo-Cons

The problem is the YOU the Neo-Cons want us to believe is ALL of us. Fuck that Jack. We did not break it THEY did. I agree we should get the fuck out and make THEM pay for it. The PB theory works if one is dealing with responsible adults. Malignant narcissistic Neo-Cons are not adults. They are demented five year olds playing with a chain saw. They ripped the shit out of Iraq and now want some one else to burden the blame. The citizens of the USA. Fuck that nonsense. Neo-Cons broke it, Neo-Cons bought it.

[opihimoimoi]

20. Why YES, you supposed to feel good about that..don't you know everyone in

the World is first and us Americans, we have so much, we could do with LESS...less Freedom, Less Rights, and Less Repair...

But wait, we do have more Potholes, More Hunger, more sad Families, and more Misery....and now, more Debt too.

Of course I being facetious...LOL

Heres to you Cat.... :yourock:

Sending Roses and Fine Wine....You go Girl....

[foreverdem]

21. No , you are not being selfish

I don't see anything selfish in wanting your tax dollars to go toward fixing what needs to be fixed here in our country, be it our schools, our roads, helping low income and seniors with food and heating costs, tax relief, the list goes on and on. There is plenty wrong right here at home. There's nothing wrong with wanting to get something out of what you are paying in.

[nonconformist]

23. If you are selfish, so am I

I can't tell you how much it pisses me off that our tax dollars pay for universal health care in Iraq.

[MADem]

25. Hey, all politics is local, and charity begins at home n/t

[Binka]

29. Right. But Neo-Con FuckJobs Have No Time For Charity It's Profits Baby

[Yollam]

28. Remember Bush INSISTED we GIVE the rebuilding money to Iraq.

Rather than loan it to them as democrats had pushed for.

Just think, if Kerry had explained his position on this one issue coherently, instead of saying "I voted for it before I voted against it", we might have a wishy-washy quasi-liberal president making cautious moves toward withdrawal from Iraq right now instead of an ultra-right-wing moron reaffirming his determination to stay there FOREVER.

[WildEyedLiberal]

59. Amazing how you manage to come into this thread and attack Kerry.

Truly amazing.

Kerry called for withdrawal before Murtha. Betcha didn't know that.

Way to use Rove spin, buddy; way to go.

I am disgusted by some of the people who claim to be "liberals" here.

[Yollam]

60. Just because I don't worship at his altar as you clearly do...

does not make my post an attack on him. I characterized Kerry and Bush accurately. Don't get on my case because you and other Kerryites have decided not to hold him accountable for any of his colossal screw-ups.

Rove spin was that Kerry was antiwar and pro-gay-marriage, when he was neither of those things. Better check again who produced YOUR Kool-aid.

[Bridget Burke]

39. Lets end the War, stop the next ones already being planned...

And get Military/Industrial spending under control. Also, let's ensure the Rich & Corporations pay their share in Taxes. There will be plenty of money left for our needs. Plus money to meet our responsibilities in Iraq.

Do you really think the Iraqi people are seeing any of that oil money?

[Cleita]

42. I know how you feel. Back in the Jurassic era, I used to

resent foreign aid. There was so much that needed to be done in this country and yet we were giving money to banana republics to build roads and infrastructure. I knew for a fact that the money was going into the Swiss bank accounts of corrupt politicians and no roads, bridges and other infrastructure that the aid was intended for was being built.

I do believe that once we get rid of the criminals in our government, we are going to owe Iraq more than just apologies. That I don't resent.

[walldude]

43. Did you see Anderson Cooper yesterday?

Did a story on poverty in America. 37 million people living at or below the poverty line in America. Maybe it's time we cleaned up our own house before we start telling people that they should be following our example. BTW 37 million is approximately, the population of Canada.

[laylah]

47. Absolutely not!

Not when our own infrastructure is crumbling right before our eyes, school funding keeps declining, seniors getting butt fvcked on their meds, etc. :mad:

Jenn

[scorpiogirl]

48. I agree with you!

After Bush slipped up yesterday and said we would be in Iraq until the end of his term, I started really thinking about the money aspect. If they're already cutting social programs to pay for Iraq, what's going to be left of our country and people by the time we get shithead out of there. It's so obvious that he doesn't care that he's leaving generations to come with crippling debt. He's the selfish one, not you! I am so fucking pissed off I can barely type! And...so does us staying through the end of his term have any basis in reality. I mean, so he's not relying on what the generals on the ground there say (as he said yesterday), he's just staying there cause he wants to. What a mofo! I really am just so pissed off!!!!!

Rant over.

[lonestarnot]

49. I'm with you CatWoman!

[closeupready]

50. There's an interesting parallel between Bush I and II

Bush I lost re-election, in part, because it was popularly believed that he cared more about foreign countries than the US, that he was out of touch. I think you could argue the same thing about Bush II, that he perhaps didn't initially take that approach, but that 9/11 brought it out.

[LostinVA]

62. Make the Native American reservations actually habitable