I'm watching the movie Brazil (1985)

[mdmc]

I just caught it halfway through. "A man rebels against the system in a totalitarian society." I think DU would like this movie.

[sleipnir]

1. It's a great film. In fact, more relevant than 1984.

Some people believe we are destined to become the Orwellian world of 1984, but I disagree. I believe that we are starting to live in the world of Brazil and it's a far more realistic treatment of what society can easily become.

[donco6]

2. I really think it's my favorite movie.

Just everything about it is at once funny and scary.

Like the phone in his house - the one with all the wires coming out? Technology is supposed to make things simpler, and yet it often does just the opposite.

[John Q. Citizen]

3. Great film n/t

[MrPrax]

4. Great one...

Hope you are watching it commercial-free...because of it's odd length, TV cuts out bits that they figure are irrlevent...Gilliam tends to put a lot into his movies...

That one is chock a block full of semoitics...like 13 monkeys

[mdmc]

8. yo! 13 monkeys gave me nightmares for a long time

This is the same director?

[MrPrax]

15. Oops...

LOL nawh he didn't direct that one...he directed one called 12 monkeys...LOL...

Me use brain and type goodly...

[mdmc]

16. with Bruce Willis right?

That was the movie!

[MrPrax]

20. Yeah...

I dunno why I always think it's called 13 monkeys...probably because 13 has a connotation with 'freaky' which is what that movie was...Brad Pitt was funny as a crazy guy...

[mdmc]

23. yup

good times

[glitch]

26. I still haven't gotten over Fisher King

I could only watch it once.

[mdmc]

31. that psychology stuff got to you?

I don't remember the movie ... just robin williams and some guy lying naked in central park... homelessness...
Please refresh my memory.

[glitch]

34. The restaurant scene where Robin's wife is massacred (along with a lot of

others) and the horseman in his nightmares who looks like a giant splatter of blood.
{{shudder}}

[mdmc]

80. thanks for the memory

tough stuff

[FatDave]

51. TV edits are far worse than that actually

I believe they use the "love conquers all" version, that ends with Sam living happily ever after in the country with Julia. It was edited by a person who understood nothing about the film.

[chatterboy]

5. One of the greatest movies ...

... ever. And yes, we are living it:

JILL
Who is this war against, Sam?

SAM
Well, terrorists of course.

JILL
How many terrorists have you met? Actual terrorists?

SAM
Actual terrorists? Well ... it's only my first day.

http://chatterbyrondavis.blogspot.com/

[mdmc]

9. lol

I just watched that scene!

[donco6]

50. Classic!

And there are dozens more in that movie!

[wake.up.america]

6. Saw this movie in Palo Alto California. Outstanding!!

[PeachyDem88]

7. *jealousy*

lol... i always wanted to see it...

our local blockbuster didn't have it...

[mdmc]

10. I never heard of it before. I only got to see the last half

I watched the end of Ferris Bulers Day Off before switching over. :mad:

[htuttle]

11. "Here's your receipt for your husband..."

"...and here's my receipt for your receipt."

[gulliver]

12. Could you fix my air conditioning?

;-)

[htuttle]

13. Only if I don't have to fill out a 27B/6 form first

[hootinholler]

21. I need to rent this one...

Haven't seenit in about 15 years, DeNiro is great!

-Hoot

[Taxloss]

14. Fantastic film! (Small spoiler here.)

However, as in 1984, the system does win in the end ...

[mdmc]

17. the movie just ended

At first I thought that the combine lost. I was wrong.

[undeterred]

30. Saw this movie in 1985 with someone who had never heard of '1984'

which added to the surreal feeling of the movie.

[donco6]

44. Did you know, though, that . . .

the film company DEMANDED that Gilliam rework the ending to give it a happy ending?

[Taxloss]

59. Yes. He was furious. It was a huge stink.

Full-page adverts in Variety slandering the studios, as I remember. Gilliam didn't take much shit.

[donco6]

62. I remember now - a lot was on his DVD "extras".

I think that's the first time I've watched a whole movie with commentary. It was fascinating. They wanted him to cut the movie right at the part just before the torture guy peeks over the glowing sunset and says, "Looks like we lost him." Can you imagine how utterly pointless the whole movie would have been?

[Taxloss]

65. Yeah, and the studio refused to release the version he wanted.

For a long time, anyway, until he started trying to publicly discredit them. What a mess.

I'm pleased to see this thread. It's a film that deserves a wider audience.

[applegrove]

18. Especially the part in a totalitarian society where no "other example"

is allowed to exist. And Robert Deniro plays a "terrorist" who intercepts repair calls for major appliances and mechanical systems, sneaks in a repairs them efficiently. And for doing so is hunted down.

I would say that is the first sign of totalitarianism. Where examples of "other systems" or "other ways of thinking" have to be debased and stopped.

Reminds me of neocon desire to put a cork in the example of the "public good".

If pure capitalism is so good - it would show itself to be. It doesn't need "help" in the form of: mistakes, incompetence, mis-directed resources, etc. forced upon the systems it competes with.

This attempt to change perceptions (or control all perception in the case of totalitarianism) is marketing and marketing is not capitalism. In capitalism (the theory) the best idea wins on its own merits when the public is well informed.

I think the neocons should just own up to it all and say - "hey - we are not for unfettered capitalism, we are for unfettered marketing".

[mdmc]

33. i've always thought of marketing and capitalism as one in the same

an extension of one and other.

[applegrove]

70. The basic assumption of Captialism according to Adam Smith et

al - is that given perfect information the markets will perform correctly and distribute things in an efficient way. Says nothing about equality - though getting the money out of the landed gentry and the churches was a huge part of capitalism's appeal in the 1700s. It opened up all sorts of jobs. Not just in factories. You could open your own business. You could buy some land (or immigrate and get some free land taken from somebody else). You could maybe get a loan. Buy a house. Go to school.

These days economics professors study what "information" means. And how it is skewed.

Marketing is just an adjunct to capitalism. But it seems to be the be all and end all of neocons. Funny - cause it was politics and special access to information that was how the church and gentry kept a hold of so much of the resources for such a long time. Before capitalism.

I think capitalism is just the economic side of the enlightenment. And if neocons say they hate the enlightenment - then they really mean they hate capitalism too.

Keep in mind that there never has been pure capitalism. That it is always a mixed market economy you are talking about when you talk about capitalist countries.

[mdmc]

72. what would make it a mixed market economy instead of pure?

What "mixes" it up?

[applegrove]

74. Any government spending. Any government spending at all. Any

charitiable spending.

[mdmc]

75. thanks for the explanation

[applegrove]

76. Bush chooses to spend on military and hegemony. Others would

choose to spend on kick=ass public schools or national health care.

Your military spending is like 50 times higher than the nearest country (or something). That isn't market. No one person in the USA would have the wearwithall or the money to buy a 30 million dollar jet. No market.

mixed market economy

http://www.cssd.ab.ca/tech/social/tut9/lesson_25.htm

[applegrove]

77. Regulations too.

[mdmc]

81. yup

yup

[TheBaldyMan]

43. De Niro's character makes me think about something I heard about Iraq

when a US military spokesman said they identified a insurgent stronghold because they had working elecricity 24/7 and a water supply so couldn't possibly be under control of the Iraqi government. The rationale was the bad guys were sabotaging the power lines - ergo they must be terrorists !

[applegrove]

68. That makes perfect sense. People who blow up power lines are

not good. Keep in mind the pile of dead Iraqi civilians. They are the innocent ones. Those creeps in the insurgency don't want democracy. As bad as the invasion was handled - the US are not the most evil thing in Iraq. The terrorists who kill civilians are. Rummy's crime is that he liked war so much he saw no need for a short one - and put in too few resources. Bush crime is that he had Saddam Hussein willing to sign up for retirement somewhere or elections. And Bush chose war.

[kid a]

19. i wacthed that this morning too - love it

[Skarbrowe]

22. I've had the song "Brazil, Brazil" running through my head since 2001.

Actually, since after 9/11. I would put "Brazil, Brazil" at the end of my posts every now and then and no one ever commented. :)

Yes, it's a great but sad movie. The ending always gives me goose bumps.

[donco6]

45. For some reason, I like their version of "Brazil" better . . .

. . . than any other.

[leveymg]

24. The torture scene is hideously funny. Eerily prescient.

Only Cleese (or is it Palin?, it's been several years) could pull that off and still make it humorous.

The concept of routine torture in a western country seemed so other-worldly in 1985. Today, it's all too familiar.

[donco6]

47. It's Palin in the one scene . . .

. . . where he's out in the waiting room and the secretary is transcribing ("AAAAAGGGHH, NO, NO, NO MORE PLEASE, SCREEEAAMM").

I think it's also Palin in the final scene.

[FatDave]

52. No no no, not torure!

It's "information retrieval". I wonder if that's what they call it at Abu Ghraib.

[applegrove]

69. I don't remember the torture scene. I just remember breaking out

into laughter when the Deniro character showed up to repair. The rest of it was mind-numbingly dark.

[tlsmith1963]

25. V For Vendetta Reminded Me of Brazil

If you have seen V but not Brazil, you *have* to see Brazil! Terry Gilliam is one of my favorite directors. He is a genius!

Tammy

[suffragette]

27. Brazil is an amazing film

But now you're going to need to rent the dvd so you can see the 1st half. Also, it's well worth playing the commentary track so you can hear about how the studio tried to force Gilliam to make a very different film.
Thank goodness that he prevailed.

[donco6]

48. Yes! It marks his first of many run ins with studio execs.

He still has one project shelved because of that.

[suffragette]

66. Do you mean "Don Quixote"?

And isn't it a supreme irony that film, of any, would be shelved?

Looks like he hasn't entirely given up though:

Gilliam plans Don Quixote revival

Director Terry Gilliam is planning to revive Don Quixote, which was set to be the biggest European film made but was shelved five days into filming.

"If we can get the film out of the hands of the lawyers, then that will be my next project," he said.

The $32m (£18m) movie was due to star Johnny Depp but was aborted in 2000 after financial problems and the poor health of lead actor Jean Rochefort.

Events behind the film were documented in the 2002 movie Lost in La Mancha.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/4425970.stm


I hopes he gets it made.

[donco6]

67. Yes, that's the one.

Johnny Depp, huh? That would be great.

[burythehatchet]

28. In my top 10

[0rganism]

29. Mine too

I remember the day I saw that movie back in the '80s, as the credits rolled on the final scene, I knew I'd had a life-changing experience.

A lot of people I know hate it with a passion, tho. Maybe they don't like movies that strike too close to home?

[FatDave]

54. A lot of people just don't get it. (possible spoiler!)

It's a lot to wrap your brain around. Toward the end the movie becomes Sam's mental-defense fantasy (see also the short story "An Occurence at Owl Creek Bridge" and Scorsese's "Last Temtation of Christ"), and it took me a couple viewings to fully understand that.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

32. I just got the dvd and my son stole it from me! BTW mdmc

I just saw your journal and a pic of the Woody Guthrie Memorial Concert. Did you go? I had the privilege of being there! :)

[mdmc]

37. no WAY!

I've seen Pete and Woody together in Carnagie in 98. I was born in 71.

That is so cool that you were there!:yourock:

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

38. Way! PS...

I hope that you mean Arlo and Pete! Woody died before you were born. :-( Although in my belief system I wouldn't be surprised if Woody's spirit was right there with them.

Yes, it was very cool! I was 16 at the time and went with a couple of my friends. I lived in Queens then. I must say that it was one of the best concerts I had ever attended. The music and presentation were sublime. Will Geer (aka Grandpa Walton)and Robert Ryan played hosts. I believe it was during the intermission that as I was going down a corridor I ran into Tom Paxton and asked him if I could give him a kiss and he didn't turn me down. :-)

I also saw Arlo's first Thanksgiving concert at Carnegie Hall and have seen him a couple of times after that. Living where I do, I have seen/heard Pete many often, vendored at his boat club's festival a few times,where I had the privilege of meeting him!

[mdmc]

57. I did mean Arlo

the magical hudson valley...

[rman]

35. one of my favorites

[Media_Lies_Daily]

36. Excellent movie when it first came out, and highly relevant today.

[lectrobyte]

39. Yes, excellent movie. I'd also recommend "They Live".

I'm all out of bubblegum.

[Swamp Rat]

40. One of my all-time favorite movies ... Terry Gilliam roolz!

[Richard Steele]

41. Excellent film. I had a private screening of that back in 85....

Which is to say, I went to an afternoon showing and was the only
person in the theater.

One of my all-time favorite films, but it turns out
that actually LIVING it in 2006 kinda sucks.

[donco6]

49. Ha! Good point.

Watching it on the silver screen always seems better than the real thing.

Is that irony or just sarcasm? Can't decide which smilie to use.

How about just disgusted.

[blogslut]

42. piping in

I Must give love to one of the finest films ever made:

Sam Lowry: My name's Lowry. Sam Lowry. I've been told to report to Mr. Warrenn.

Porter - Information Retrieval: Thirtieth floor, sir. You're expected.

Sam Lowry: Um... don't you want to search me?

Porter - Information Retrieval: No sir.

Sam Lowry: Do you want to see my ID?

Porter - Information Retrieval: No need, sir.

Sam Lowry: But I could be anybody.

Porter - Information Retrieval: No you couldn't sir. This is Information Retrieval.

http://imdb.com/title/tt0088846/quotes

[otohara]

46. I TiVo'ed

can't wait!

[HughBeaumont]

53. "Remember, we're all in this together!"

Some of the best and most panoramic visuals I've ever seen in a movie. He uses depth and dimension so well, and the story is still quite relevant 21 years later. GROSSLY overlooked movie. Murka needs to get smarter and realize not every movie has to be ironically gore-soaked or pompously and unrealistically wordy to be a classic.

[FatDave]

56. There's a democratic campaign slogan for you!

Gilliam is a genius, and it's never been more apparent than in this film. 12 Monkeys was great, as was Baron Munchaussen, Fear and Loathing, Time Bandits and the Python films, but Brazil remains his masterpiece.

[FatDave]

55. Honestly, this is the first time I've connected Brazil with today

It's been one of my favorites for so long (and I haven't seen it in a long time), so the obvious connection to modern-day America didn't occur to me until I read this thread. But yeah, it completely fits, doesn't it? It seemed so over-the-top in 1985. Things like that could never happen here!

Now the thought of calling torture "Information Retrieval" (and billing the victim's family for it) seems all too plausible.

And how far is "bad sportsmanship" from "they hate our freedom"?

[mdmc]

58. I'm willing to watch it again.

:kick:

[KamaAina]

60. Are there blacks in "Brazil", too?

Incompetent minds want to know. Bush** wants to know!

[Strawman]

61. I just Tivoed that

I remember a coworker telling me it was his favorite movie years ago, but I've never seen it.

[sendero]

63. I bought a DVD ...

..... of the 142 minute version a week or two ago (after another thread here about it). I saw it when it came out, but I don't remember that much of it.

I'm looking forward to watching it, maybe tomorrow :)

[annabanana]

64. I caught it just in time to tivo

I want to watch it when the house empties out a bit, so I can enjoy it without interruption.

[mdmc]

71. I only caught the last half

It reminded me of Catch 22.:kick:

[Beelzebud]

73. We're all in this together!

[Warren DeMontague]

78. You may recognize my avatar, then.

"How many terrorists have you met, Sam... Actual terrorists?"

"um... actual terrorists?
Well, it's only my first day"

[mdmc]

79. too cool

for school

[drbtg1]

82. Please note there are two DVD versions

The first was released by Universal with a runtime of 131 minutes.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0783225903/qid=1143468227/sr=8-2/ref=pd_bbs_2/103-7504413-8315856?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance&n=130

However, the superior version was a three disc set that was released by the Criterion Collection. It has the 142 minute director's cut w/ Gilliam's commentary, the aforementioned "Love Conquers All" edited version with a separate commentary, a documentary narrated by Jack Matthews (the author of "The Battle for Brazil"), and tons more extras.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0780022181/qid=1143468227/sr=8-1/ref=pd_bbs_1/103-7504413-8315856?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance&n=130

I'd strongly recommend the Criterion version.

[baby_mouse]

83. It's a hideous movie that made me feel ill for days.

And it's all coming true.

At the time (you will know this line from wathing the movie) it seemed satirical to make jokes about "plastic surgery gift vouchers", these days YOU CAN ACTUALLY GET THEM.