So, it takes an immigration bill to mobilize 500,000 protesters?

[Joe Fields]

We here at DU are fully aware of all the aggregious transgressions that the Bush administration has perpetrated against our citizens and the rest of the world. The list is as long as I am tall (6'1"). And there are many items on that list that are impeachable offenses.

It is hard for me to fathom that millions of peasants with pitchforks haven't yet descended on the White House to run Bush and his cohorts out of town. But it takes an immigration bill to mobilize a coordinated dissent of over 500,000 people in Los Angeles?

Just what is it going to take for Americans to say "ENOUGH!" Do we have to have corroborated photos of Bush and bin Laden laying naked in bed together snorting lines of cocaine for us to mobilize? Has the jack-booted mentality of this administration cowed the public so much that we are afraid to stage numerous massive demonstrations demanding Bush's impeachment?

It's clear that our Democratic leadership is that cowed. I am ashamed to call them my leaders. They are not representing me, my views, my dissatisfaction or outrage, as they should. So everyone, it is clearly up to us to put a stop to the illegal war, the illegal wiretapping and all other fascist actions of this administration.

I hope we can learn from all of the good immigrants who have taken to the streets to protest unfair legislation.

I am not for violence, but I have to say that at least it is heartening to know that when the French get pissed, they sure let their government know it.

Having said all of this, I know that there ARE many here at DU who are actively protesting on a regular basis in their communities. They do actively coordinate letter writing campaigns and letters to the editor campaigns and e-mail petitioning campaigns. But on the whole, Americans cannot wait any longer. We, as a nation need to wake up and get off our asses and DEMAND that our leaders be held accountable.

[Deja Q]

1. What do the Dem leaders know or want, a result of which is their impotence

that we are all observing? :think:

Also, the best way to hold elected people accountable is to write when you disagree with them. If that fails, vote the careermonger out. Assuming it is merely careermongering.

[ET Awful]

2. See, the thing is, that most of the ill-informed masses would never

get up to protest about a matter which doesn't, in their minds, directly affect THEM.

In this case, it's people who will be personally adversely effected by this ridiculous law.

In the Vietnam era, the draft is what got people up off their asses.

Apathy is a huge hurdle to overcome, especially with the masses under the effect of the strongest anasthesia known to modern man, the television.

[Joe Fields]

8. Are you saying that this war doesn't affect everybody?

While we spend billions of dollars over in Iraq, we spend less and less money on social and domestic programs. The military is a vacuum cleaner, sucking up all money which could be better spent in many other important areas. If THAT doesn't affect millions of Americans, then please tell me what does.

[niallmac]

13. Not in a way that cannot be ignored.

The citizens arise in the morning, have breakfast, watch TV, go to work, chat with workers and friends about everything but the war for the most part.
They make plans for the weekend. The hand of war is nowhere to be felt on a gut level.
Gas is still affordable. Sometimes a hometown soldier is killed or returns wounded and the story is alive for a day or two but
it really hasn't caused a ripple in the personal lives of the citizens.
Looming financial ruin death and destruction overseas what's that? It's a story, a TV picture.
Pretend to be outraged or not. No one is taking to the streets with any passion as long
as there is no advantage seen in rocking the boat.
For the poor the military is still a way out even now.
Social programs taking a hit? That's not new if you are poor. Is war the excuse today?
When the draft is breathing down everyones neck then reality starts to become palpable.
When a politician in DC votes for war he or she votes for an abstraction that will not
affect them personally to any meaningful degree.
The war is not real, yet.

[ET Awful]

16. BINGO.

Most people won't pay attention to a war until they or a family member are at risk of dying from it.

[Joe Fields]

23. What you say is true to a point. But it is only because ....

The corporate media's tentacles have wrapped themselves around the brains of the comfortable men and women in "Our Town" America.

And yet, gas prices rise, with no end in sight, the general cost of living continues to rise, while wages are stagnant, we are losing all of the safety nets that were put into place to help ALL who are less fortunate recieve a quality education, the needy are being booted off of life supporting welfare, and the list goes on. I haven't even touched on the budget cuts for EPA, housing, or other programs. In short, this war is sucking damned near every dollar from very important domestic programs.

MAKE NO MISTAKE. THIS IS A CRISIS! And again I will ask, what will it take? How much longer can Americans keep their heads buried in the sand? There can no longer be doubt in the minds of the silent majority of Americans that this administration is wholly corrupt. Where is the outrage? I saw it with civil rights and Vietnam in the 60's. I saw it with Watergate in the 70's. Have we become so shellshocked and immune to public corruption that we just don't flat care anymore? This attitude is what is allowing fascism to creep into our governance. I only hope that ALL of America wakes up before it is too late.

And again, I will repeat that what you said is true to a point. At least that is many peoples false perceptions to maintain their comfort level. But the truth is that EVERYTHING that the Bush cabal has done, since taking over the government has affected every American citizen's lives, as well as the lives of people around the world.

[Rude Horner]

17. But think of World War 2

Americans were asked to sacrifice for the war effort. This is from Wikopedia:

***
Franklin D. Roosevelt stated that the efforts of civilians at home to support the war through personal sacrifice was as critical to winning the war as the efforts of the soldiers themselves. "Rosie, the Riveter" became the symbol of women laboring in manufacturing. The war effort brought about significant changes in the role of women in society as a whole. Upon the end of the war, many of the women were replaced by returning veterans.

Labor shortages were particularly felt in agriculture. At the same time many agricultural commodities were more needed for the military and for the civilian populations of allies. In some areas with specialty crops, such as potatoes or apples, schools were temporarily closed at harvest time to enable students to work.

Metal parts of weapons were coated with a protective layer of beeswax to prevent rust while en route on ships; at one point the government considered confiscating the nation's beehives to melt down for additional wax. However, after consultation with the department of agriculture, the pollination loss was understood with corresponding loss of crop production. Beekeepers were simply encouraged to expand, and given preferential treatment in some areas, including draft deferments and extra ration coupons. Many commodities, such as sugar, gasoline, and tires were rationed, and this was generally supported by the civilian population, although there was some black marketing.

Automobile plants ceased production of passenger cars, creating a shortage of them in the consumer market. Wartime efforts were focused on trucks and tanks. Industrial production of wartime needs was established more quickly than any time before in history, however it was not without problems. In many plants, periodic shortages of parts would bring the assembly lines to a halt, then require overtime from the employees (to meet quotas) when the parts arrived.
***

The Iraq war is a war that is easily escapable. Americans can turn off their tv and it goes away. I truly believe that this is one of the reasons that the Bush adminstration doesn't want to raise taxes, in fact they want to make tax cuts for the rich permanent. See, if Americans were asked to sacrifice for THIS war, like they did in World War 2, I believe they would be a lot more upset about it because this war is illegal. Most people know it, but since it doesn't really "effect" them, a lot of people ignore it.

[rucky]

20. That's because we had FDR, and he told us what we need to do.

We don't have to wait for something to personally affect us. We do need to get organized, and the best way to do that is to listen to a leader with a plan.

The one thing we never hear out of the "opposition party" is a call to action. It should included with every message.

[Notoverit]

3. Nah...Media just had permission to report real numbers for a change...

I'm sure the same number protested the war, * - only they came in print as "hundreds' or "thousands"...

[TallahasseeGrannie]

4. Yeah, what's up with THAT?

we can't 1000 people for a protest and they pull this together overnight, it seems.

Is THIS the biggest issue facing us? I personally wouldn't have said so.

[fasttense]

5. I think there is something fishy about these protests.

We had over a quarter of a million protesters surrounding the WH and we got fifteen minutes on the news. These folks are regularly reported.

Also, I just find it hard to believe that immigration laws are what has finally spurred on the masses. It just doesn't make sense.

Does anyone know who is organizing these protests? My suspicious mind tells me it would be easy for a corporation to bus their illegals to the locations. Yet I would like to think these are a spontaneous outbursts of dissent. If so, we need to find out how they are doing it.

Anyone got details on the organizers?

[Minnesota Libra]

6. Correction: It takes an immigration bill to mobilize................

......500,000 people for this one issue and this one issue alone.

The real eye opener would be trying to come up with another issue - that would actually BENEFIT THIS COUNTRY - those same people would demonstrate about.

[blondeatlast]

7. The march against the racist immigration bill was the coming together

of many different, well-organized groups who coordinated their efforts (I know someone who helped organize the Phoenix march).

Also keep in mind that the Hispanic community has a press that focuses it's reporting from that POV. We have corp-whore media that continually trivializes us and our concerns.

I don't see this as a Democratic issue at all.

What I do see is a buch of Left-wing factions who can't get their acts together well enough to organize a scavenger hunt.

On the left, it's ME! ME! ME!, not US. On the Left, we see OUR pet issues as the most important, we don't see how ending the illegal occupation in Iraq or denying civil rights for GLBTs or marching for health civil rights or stopping global warming threatens every one of us in our daily lives.

The Friday marchers saw that all too clearly. It's a damn pity the Left can't make that message as clear as the orgs. behind Frfiday's march did. When they do, we'll be a force to be reckoned with.

[Joe Fields]

9. Often, I believe that we dems are our own worst enemy.

I'm not sure if we could even agree on what day it is.

[Poppyseedman]

10. Here's why

Has the jack-booted mentality of this administration cowed the public so much that we are afraid to stage numerous massive demonstrations demanding Bush's impeachment?

Afraid ? No. Apathetic? Yes.

People's political activism is primarily motivated by economics. The American people vote with their pocketbook.

Want to get rid of chimpboy. Crash the economy.

[Joe Fields]

11. This is the overriding point of my post.

With the litany of misdeads that Bushco has done, why are we still so apathetic? One issue has mobilized immigrants, while mainstream Americans whine and yawn.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

12. Politicians don't lead. They follow. Vote issues and they'll come to you

I don't see any politicians among those hundreds of thousands of people fighting back.

[Tsiyu]

14. Sorry, but there have been many protests around this nation

The corporate whore media do not report them, and people begin to lose hope that protesting will matter.

It does matter.

[Joe Fields]

24. Sorry, but there have NOT been the kinds of protests....

like what we have witnessed in Los Angeles, San Francisco and Pheonix this past week. And certainly nothing like the protests and marches for civil rights, the war in Vietnam and the draft, like I saw in the 60's.

[UTUSN]

15. Yip, just like passing a DRAFT *would* mobilize millions who now stay home

[bigtree]

18. not the reaction supporters of immigration reform were expecting

I expect

[Squeech]

19. Identity politics

It's not quite all that matters, but in the wake of the Me Decade, it's the easiest motivator, as well as the easiest way to frame the story.

And yeah, Democrats are among the worst offenders. We don't get a lot of professionals protesting labor issues, suburban whites protesting racism, testosterone-Americans protesting the crackdown on abortion rights, etc.

On the other hand, I'm currently reading What's the Matter with Kansas, and while it looks like the Repukes can easily mobilize their forces for tax cuts or profitable wars of aggression, it seems that the crowds actually believe they're marching for "the sanctity of life" or some such thing. At least we attempt to make our real agenda crystal clear.

[dusty64]

21. This is good.

The rethugs are making hispanics and females this years demonic group. Last cycle it was gay people, fine let them piss us off one group at a time.......

[fasttense]

22. Very informative group here. Thanks all for posting. n/t

[slaveplanet]

25. Cecilia Munoz just said on Cspan Washington Journal

that this was mobilized by La Raza radio and other radio, but turned spontaneous(she claims)

Who mobilizes LA RAZA?

she answered that as well

Where do you get your money from?

posed to Cecilia Munoz (LA RAZA)Vice President
from WJ host

answer:

CORPORATIONS
FOUNDATIONS (FORD?)
FEDERAL GOVERNMENT


It would be nice if the Anti WAR effort got some government and Corporate funding ... mightn't that pay for some serious airtime and put a few more bodies in the street?

[dogday]

26. As I remember, it took the RNC and Abortion

to bring the masses out... RNC saw at least 750,000 people, I watched it for hours on C-SPAN and there were abut 1,250,000 marching for choice last year... The problem is the media does not give them this kind of attention.....

[cap]

27. what will it take for Democratic and liberal activists to

start working with these folks and form an alliance. These kids are the future. Let's work with them.

Why didnt this happen? Why did we not know about these marches and participate?

[lonestarnot]

28. absodamlutely! I would recommend but am tooooooooo late!

[RagingInMiami]

29. When push came to shove

The immigrant community stood up.

For most Americans, push hasn't come to shove yet.