Say goodbye to Moussaoui - jury says he can get death penalty!

[BlooInBloo]

Thoughts?

http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/04/03/moussaoui/index.html

I don't myself know enough about the specifics of the case to know whether the death penalty is deserved (more or less), or if it's a kangaroo court railroading a defendant.


EDIT: Spelling, put more info in as it became available

[Derailer]

1. baaaaaaaaa?

[newyawker99]

39. Hi Derailer!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[patdem]

2. Either they voted FOR the death penalty or not..that he CAN is not

one of their decisions! OOPS..he is eligable for? what the fuck does that mean? Will there be ANOTHER jury to decide if he IS put to death or not?

[BlooInBloo]

3. The phrase they keep saying on the news.....

... is that he's eligible for the death penalty....

You don't like that phraseology, argue with them, not with me.

EDIT: The also use that EXACT phraseology on cnn.com. Argue with them too, not with me.

[patdem]

8. I edited my post as soon as I heard 'eligible'..WTF does that mean?

Only a jury can decide if a person GETS the death penalty? I do not know what this means!

[BlooInBloo]

11. Not sure... maybe it's a conviction jury and a sentencing jury?

Dunno though...

[Nutmegger]

14. There's going to be a new phase where additional evidence will be entered

eom

[BlooInBloo]

16. The additional evidence being for sentencing purposes?

Or something else?

Thx for the tidbit!

[Nutmegger]

19. Additional evidence to bolster the DP

This was the first phase, to determine between life in prison without parole or the DP.

A federal jury found al-Qaida conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui eligible today to be executed, deciding that his lies to FBI agents led directly to at least one death in the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.

The only person to face charges in this country in the nation's worst terrorist assault, Moussaoui now faces a second phase of his sentencing trial.

The nine men and three women of the jury will hear testimony on whether the 37-year-old Frenchman, who was in jail at the time of the attack, deserves to be executed for his role.

The testimony will include families of 9/11 victims who will describe the human impact of the al-Qaida mission that flew four jetliners into the World Trade Center, the Pentagon and a Pennsylvania field.

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/3767573.html

[RaleighNCDUer]

4. Seriously

was there any doubt?

The government was NOT going to let this guy not get the DP. He is the chosen scapegoat, and must play out his part.

[BlooInBloo]

9. I don't know enough about the specifics of his case....

... to be satisfied in my own mind that it was a kangaroo court railroading him to the death penalty.

Maybe it was, just sayin I don't know enough to have that conclusion...

[underpants]

5. No big surprise

It would have taken a miracle for him NOT to get the death penalty and his testimony didn't help other than to create a legacy in his own mind.

[Selteri]

6. THis whole trial stinks to high heaven for being a potential farce.

I'm very critical over this, it doesn't completely make sense why someone would act that way.

[kenny blankenship]

7. Sayonara, Shitbag.

that's the correct form of farewell according to Emily Post.

[patdem]

12. Why do you INSIST on keeping up your 'Political Correct' language

Just askin? :rofl:

[kenny blankenship]

37. Compulsive politeness, the burden of my upbringing, urges brevity

And accordingly, "Sayonara Shitbag" is much more to the point (while staying within the bounds of decorum) than saying something more copious, like:
"We were deeply saddened to learn of your recent confession to conspiracy in the murder of what was sure to be hundreds--and what in actuality turned out to be thousands--of unsuspecting people. Given the opportunity to sacrifice your own life for your beliefs, you chickened out like a bitch ass punk; and while unwilling to give your own life to salvage a modicum of honor, or perhaps having changed your beliefs about the necessity of violence, you nevertheless silently allowed thousands of others to perish in this heinous quadruple act of air piracy and murder--now prepare to die anyway, a coward's death, at the hands of a bloodthirsty, raging mob.

Yours Very Truly,
The Blankenships"

[patdem]

42. Technally you are wrong..he did not chicken out..he was arrested BEFORE

9/11..AND..we did not examine his laptop..in fact..if HE is put to death for his failure to confess..we should investigate and put to trial all those who REFUSED to get a FISA warrent to examin his computer!

[ShortnFiery]

10. By doing this we (the USA) are buying into Bin Laden's DREAM

Can't the powers that be understand that this man was NOT involved in 911?

This will make him a Martyr and do much more to recruit OODLES more Al Quaeda than having him spend the rest of his life in jail.

But in Bush-World it's all about posturing, power and revenge.

I'm disgusted. :puke:

[Rocknrule]

26. In Bush's world it's about who has the biggest dick

[Jara sang]

13. A Federal case tried in Alexandria is the fast track to the electric chair

That is why the federal giovernment tries so many terra cases there.

[Casandra]

15. Not surprised

So many...are still looking for someone (alive) to blame 0/11 on. Now they've got someone! ..and we find out that ommiting information is now considered a lie that caused all the deaths of all those people. Im certsin Moussoui is glad to see this verdict, as that was his plan all along. He knew he had the choice of rotting in an underground solitary confinement jail or dying as a 'martyr' for his beliefs...dying was the obvious choice.

Additionally, this brings to memeory how our own government had all the information they had PRIOR the attacks on 9/11 and still wouldn't pay it any attention..how they would have suddenly sat up and 'acted' on Moussoui making a statement. Too much...but oh so typical of the mood of this country.

[RaleighNCDUer]

18. As MIHOP as I am, I believe they NEED to have someone

to blame -- if it's his fault, it CANNOT be the government's fault.

Works for LIHOP, too.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

22. We seem to have done a lot of that throughout our history.

[patdem]

24. Can we leave Iraq now that we have THE guilty party? n/t

[The_Casual_Observer]

17. Is this supposed to deter future suicide terrorists?

Or is it revenge?

Either way, I think it's pretty dumb.

[RaleighNCDUer]

20. Oh, yes, it sends a clear message.

Don't become a terrorist martyr, or we will make a martyr of you!

That'll sure scare them.

[darkism]

21. @OP: The death penalty is NEVER deserved.

Ever. By anybody. Not even this guy.

Especially since it will only make him a martyr for the cause.

[BlooInBloo]

27. I had intended to say "more or less deserved"....

... so as not to exclude the anti-death penalty crowd. Maybe I forgot.

I'm one of the anti-death penalty crowd, btw.

[Ksec]

23. Good bye and good riddance

I think his trial showed how clueless our government is. They completely blew it and left the country vulnerable to a bunch of third rate religious fanatics.

[htuttle]

25. I think Moussaoui himself wanted the Death Penalty

Everything I've read indicates that, apart from his over-inflated description of his role in the 9/11 attacks, Z. Moussaoui was a fuckup. In his mind, I think he's hoping to still be made a martyr for something he was unable to do. To be honest, like Richard Reid, I don't think the group that actually did the attacks on 9/11 wanted much of anything to do with him. He's quite obviously nuts.

In one sense, this whole trial was probably the most expensive case of 'suicide by cop' in history.

[BlooInBloo]

28. Are we in agreement that the convicted's wishes....

... regarding his or her sentencing are the most irrelevant wishes in the world?

[htuttle]

34. Sure, but is their actual guilt or innocence relevant?

Moussaoui confessed to being more important than it's been shown that he was by the evidence. He's a crazy person. Crazy people confess to things they didn't do all the time, especially high profile criminal cases. Ask a detective how many bad leads and false confessions they get on highly publicized cases.

There has been numerous tips from other 'real al-Queda guys' that they all thought Moussaoui couldn't be trusted, because he was nuts. However, this 'al-Queda groupie' named Moussaoui might still be able to make himself useful to his cause if he can be martyred for it, even if it hardly had a hand in it.

Now I ask you, how does that help *us*?

[BlooInBloo]

38. Not any more it isn't - his guilt is a fait accompli....

right?

I mean: his desire to die/be a groupie/martyr might have been relevant during the guilt/innocence court case. THAT case is over, and those wishes are no longer relevant.

When sentencing comes, are juries allowed to sentence based on not being convinced the convict is actually guilty? Or are they required to sentence based upon the assumption of the convict's guilt? If the former, then I stand corrected.

[htuttle]

43. There wasn't really a guilt-or-innocence phase of the trial...

...since he pled guilty.

In a rational world that works like it is supposed to, crazy people who confess to things they didn't do are filtered out by first the detectives working the case and finally the Prosecutor/DA. They usually try to avoid charging people like that, since they usually are more interested in getting who ACTUALLY committed a crime (so they don't do it again), rather than just scoring political points for punishing someone, even if the people actually behind it got away.

But this whole farce of a "trial" has been a political puppet show from start to finish, with BOTH SIDES playing it for PR. Executing Moussaoui for 9/11 makes him Relevant, and I think that's what he wants the most. As a side benefit, al-Queda gets another martyr for "free", since they lost no operational capabilities due to his capture (nor will they from his execution). And the Bush administration gets to say "they got one", when they really didn't.

You might say Moussaoui failed the audition for al Queda, though he still had part of the 'script' for 9/11 with him when he was picked up. It's THAT mistake the Bush administration wants to avoid talking about again. Giving Moussaoui the DP helps to ensure this isn't a problem.

[radio4progressives]

29. "suicide by cop" is aptly put...

this guy had nothing whatsoever to do with 9/11, althouth he may have wished he did - just another red herring to distract us from the truth..

[BlooInBloo]

30. Random theory just occurred to me....

Could it even be like the movie Minority Report? Where the guy agreed to get killed in exchange for his familiy getting a bunch of money or whatever?

Complete tinfoil-hattiness - just speculatin...

[pdxmom]

31. What this amounts to, from my understanding, is that if you know

a crime might be committed and someone dies, you face the death penalty if you don't tell someone about it.

This is a precedent that is scary, IMO.

[Disturbed]

32. It is obvious that he is mentally deranged.

He wants the DP and the Bush Regime wants to execute anyone that seems to have involment if the 911 Attack. A perfect match. I don't think that he was directly involved and was a real minor player in al Q, a driver that wanted to be a major martyr. Of course, most Americans are going to be pleased when he recieves the DP.

[pdxmom]

44. Maybe my old brain is forgetful, but didn't we know that the majority

of the 9-11 hijackers didn't know what was going to happen? Or at least, that was the general assumption - that they were kept in the dark about the actual plans?

Moussaoui's story has changed each and every time he's taken the stand. He's looney as can be.

The Government was afraid the whole case was going to fall apart just a few weeks ago, because of the misconduct regarding the TSA witnesses. They were going to say if they had known what Moussaoui knew, they could have stopped 9-11. Well, maybe if they had known what BUSH knew from the PDB, or if they'd known what was on Moussaui's computer, which the FBI didn't bother to look at, they could have stopped it, too. Of course, we're not going to see anyone held accountable from that end, much less face the loss of their lives.

I'm just stunned at how this administration is destroying our judicial system.

[BlooInBloo]

35. Sort of a bigger, badder Good Samaritan law huh?

[Sinti]

41. Thought crime

This and Padilla (there are probably others) will make good case law in the future.

[stop the bleeding]

33. I thought that Octafish said that this is suppose to happen in accordance

with the BFEE?

Did I missremember that?

[Octafish]

36. Dead men tell no tales.

The FBI didn't even want to investigate Moussaoui after the flight school phoned in their suspicions. It was only after Minnesota Democratic Congressmen Oberstar and Sabo intervened in Washington was he arrested. Then, after he was arrested on an immigration charge, they were going to deport him. All the while, the Minnesota FBI wants to search Moussaoui's laptop and the FBI in Washington denied their FISA warrant application.

Here's my 2 cents:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=364&topic_id=602016

[warrens]

40. How do you get the DP for wanting to kill someone?

From what I understand, the other guys didn't want anything to do with him, considered him a nut (them being completely sane, of course) and cut him out of all planning.

The death penalty should be reserved for heinous acts, not for wanting to perform one.