What do you think of this Flight 93 movie?

[MikeNY]

It has been nearly 5 years since 9/11. Hollywood is now making a movie about Flight 93 which was allegedly downed by the crew members on the plane. We can conclude from some evidence that the people on the plane intentionally took it down, but there is no way to be totally sure. We do not know the specific events.

What do you think of this movie? Is it a way to honor the people who lost their lives on 9/11? Is it a shameless way to make money? Too early to make this movie?

Personally, I think this shouldn't be made. We do not need Hollywood blockbusters turning the story of 911 into a heroic tragedy. 9-11 was caused by people who hate our country, and GROSS mismanagement and negligence by the Bush administration.

I do not want to dishonor the people who were on that flight, or any of the people involved in 9/11. But the whole concept of it "going Hollywood" doesn't exactly make sense to me..

[FormerDittoHead]

1. Hmm - Hollywood shamelessly making money? NOOOooo! n/t

[soothsayer]

2. devious plan to freshen the 'terra! terra! terra!' the pukes think they

need to win in the fall elections. Also shameless and of course they won't show our jets blowing it to smithereens, so what's the point of this fairy tale?

[madinmaryland]

3. I have no desire to see the movie.

After being through 9/11 in lower manhattan and seeing the aftermath, I have no interest whatsoever in it. The matter has been explored in depth already in the news.

[Maraya1969]

4. I don't like it at all and I would never watch it or any like it.

[Davros]

5. Well there is also the Oliver Stone movie about the Towers...

We are going to have at least 2 movies about 9-11 coming out. Hollywood is damned if they do produce such films and damned if they don't for various reasons. It all depends if you, the viewer, is ready for such movies. Personally I have no intentions of seeing either of them. I interviewed for Cantor Fitzgerald in NYC in June of 2001 for a HelpDesk position and luckily I didn't get the job due to the fact that I wasn't A+ Certified. That saved my life. The person who interviewed me and even the security guard who was planning on retiring later that year both perished.

[rman]

13. Hollywood is damned all the time by the RW.

for obvious reasons.

[Iris]

18. I think it's a story that needs to be told. . . in about 20 years.

I think this is the sort of history that needs to be revisited when we can do it with a little reflection and perspective - and also when we can look back at it and see how it will affect the next 20 years or so.

[Sinti]

20. Glad you're still here :)

Should have been at the Pentagon, myself. Missed the bus. Oops...

[Beaverhausen]

47. Info about Oliver Stone's film "World Trade Center"

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0469641/

[CJCRANE]

6. Has it actually been resolved

how and why the plane came down?

If not, then it's too early to do a fictionalized version if all the details aren't known.

[marmar]

8. Exactly...

...or any of the other fictions of that day.

[Atman]

10. That pissed me off seeing the trailer.

It was shown on KO last night, even though theaters have already pulled it. It left the clear impression that fighters had been scrambled to shoot it down. Maybe it was, maybe it wasn't. (It was, btw ;-) ) But you're right...it does a disservice to history if we allow a huge movie like this to cement the impression in the public's mind one way or another until the truth finally gets told. If we know anything right now, it is that we don't know jack shit about what actually happened. But once this movie comes out, that is what the public will perceive to be the truth.

[flpoljunkie]

16. Ted Rall on the Legend of Flight 93 and the upcoming movie.

Closing paragraphs of article...

http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0308-26.htm

What happened to United 93? There was almost certainly a passenger uprising. Did it succeed? Probably not.

The 9/11 Commission Report says that "at some time between 10:10 and 10:15" Dick Cheney ordered the Air Force to shoot down the plane, which had turned east towards Washington. The plane had already crashed at 10:03. But the regional air traffic control center in Cleveland asked the FAA whether military fighter jets should be dispatched at flight at 9:36, giving the Air Force more than enough time to intercept before the fatal plunge into the field at Shanksville. Was United 93 shot down, despite the official story?

Local media accounts offer some evidence of that possibility. The September 13, 2001 Pittsburgh Post-Gazette reported, for example: "In a morning briefing, State Police Major Lyle Szupinka confirmed that debris from the plane had turned up in relatively far-flung sites, including the residential area of Indian Lake ."

Flight 93 "headed down...rolled onto its back," and crashed, leaving a smoldering crater. The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette again: " Fleegle said he climbed on the roof of an abandoned cabin and tossed down a burning seat cushion that had landed there. By Wednesday morning, crash debris began washing ashore at the marina. Fleegle said there was something that looked like a rib bone amid pieces of seats, small chunks of melted plastic and checks." Seats and bones don't fly two and a half miles from a crash. Their location could indicate an initial explosion, such as that from a missile hitting a plane.

If the Air Force shot down Flight 93 to protect the capital, it was the only time on 9/11, or since, that the Bush Administration has done something to keep America safe. Whether they were concerned about being second-guessed or for the financial health of the airline industry, we'll never know. We do know that they've become knee-jerk liars, even covering up the rare occasions when they do something right. Perhaps they don't really know what happened up there. If so, they ought to say that rather than promote more fairy tales about Flight 93.

The passengers did try. The only thing that takes away from their heroism is Bush's lies. So. Now that Zacarias Moussauoi has been convicted, where's that tape?

[Marie26]

37. Ted Rall, that bastion of accuracy & fairness. nt

[The Wielding Truth]

54. Is your point that if all evidence was turned to dust and no one

could bare wittiness to any collaborations, then this is a set up & well conceived plan to anger us into war? Nothing but dust.....
Maybe a strange conspiracy thought, but anything is possible with this MOB.

[bunkerbuster1]

17. Fully agreed.

Until we are certain that our own fighter planes didn't shoot down UA93--and there's good reason to believe that they did--I think it's incredibly irresponsible to present a fictionalized account of it that won't give that possibility.

[rman]

19. Nothing about 9-11 has really been resolved

Official reports (NIST, FEMA) contradict one another wrt the exact mechanism of the "pancake theory", and the collapse of WTC7 remains unexplained (FEMA).
Wrt the Pentagon it is not clear if the plane "evaporated" on impact (initial claim), or that it has been partially rebuild in a hangar from parts that were recovered (secondary claim).

[Viva_La_Revolution]

23. pancake theory - I can't buy it...

they figured out that if you dropped an apple from the top of the first tower that fell, it would take 9.8 seconds to hit the ground. The tower fell in 10.1 seconds. That's near freefall speed. no time to make pancakes, imho.

[CTyankee]

7. The filmmaker got all of the Flight 93 families' endorsement

to make the film before he started.

I don't know if I'll see it. Knowing it is based on what really happened just magnifies the horror. I don't know what good seeing that movie will do. Maybe catharsis...

[Atman]

9. As I wrote to Jack Caffery yesterday (did anyone see him read it?)...

As seems to always happen when I manage to write a short, succinct letter he might actually read, I got called away and didn't see the rest of his show. But anyway, his question yesterday was "Is America ready for a film about 9-11." My reply...

"Jack, we already had a movie about 9/11, and not only weren't Americans ready for it, the GOP pilloried the filmmaker for telling the truth. Perhaps you've heard of Michael Moore's "Fahrenheit 911?" - Sign me ATMAN from Connecticut."

Something tells me it didn't make it on the air.

[mcar]

11. I saw the trailer the other day

and it looked way too melodramatic, "movie of the week" to me.

[rman]

12. I understand it reveals there is no plane at the supposed crash site,

so i understand that certain individuals (mainly coincidence- and incompetence theorists) would think this movie should not have been made, and that "we" should just get over it and forget about it.

[greyl]

24. You misunderstand.

I think you're repeating a falsehood from another forum.

Fact is, the movie does not "reveal that there is no plane at the supposed crash site".

Some people enjoy lying and making people crazy for their own twisted reasons.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

14. Psyops. No one knows exactly what happened and if you look at

the photos of the crash site...where is the plane? Why was an engine found 8 miles away? Of course these questions haven't been answered.......

[johnnie]

15. I don't see anything wrong with it coming out

They already had one running on cable.

As for the question of the plane being shot down or the "official" story, they made movies about Pearl Harbor too. There are still questions about that attack.

I heard the trailer and it still was sickening to soak it all in. It *is* part of history and as I said, they already had a movie out on it, so why not release another one?

[laruemtt]

21. just watched the trailer and

just personally speaking, i am not ready for the movie. too soon? i don't know. maybe it's a good thing it has me shaking and weepy. not that it's done so spectacularly well, just the subject matter...........

[JStuart]

22. looks well done.

I just hope it isn't made with a political "spin"

[OutsidetheBox]

25. Anyone with a brain knows 93 was shot down

Too many witnesses saw multiple planes, saw 93 smoking before it crashed. Pics show no large crater, no large debris field. Parts of plane were found up to 8 miles away, etc... It was shot down, the rest is pure psychops designed to create patriotism and nationalism in the belief in fictional heroes, right in the middle of 9/11, uniting a nation behind the "Let's Roll" bullshit story. When you read the entire 93 narrative you have to ask yourself, "Who writes this shit??" This movie is pure propaganda designed to glorify and give credence to the so called war on terror.

[JStuart]

26. come on...

tin foil hat lefties give us a bad name.

[OutsidetheBox]

28. and brainwashed, unthinking lefties contribute to Bush's vision

How about you think for yourself sometime. Is it that hard to imagine your government does not care about you and that it commits terrible crimes?

[XemaSab]

27. I thought they released cockpit tapes

That showed that the terrorists were in the cabin and the passengers were trying to break through the door and the terrorists intentionally crashed the plane.

WTF???

[JStuart]

30. yes

they forced their way into the cockpit, but with the craft in a steep dive, gravity and inertia worked against the people being able to wrest the hijackers from the controls. The passengers caused the crash, but the terrorists were behind the stick.

[XemaSab]

31. That's how I remembered it

And if the movie changes that part, I'm gonna be peeved.

Welcome to DU!!!!

[CJCRANE]

49. Did the passengers

actually make it into the cockpit?

I thought there some dispute over that from an analysis of the transcript of the voice recorder.

[sabra]

29. hasn't there already been a few made for tv versions?

I saw the preview, and was turned off immediately for many reasons..

[kitkat65]

32. I have to wonder what the "Let's roll" widow thinks of everything now

She was at the following State of the Union address sitting near the shrub and he acknowledged her husband's heroics in his speech. She later came out with a book called "Let's Roll" or something like it which I didn't read. Surely she must be aware of the evidence that conflicts with the given script. Does she still believe that the passengers brought it down? Does she feel used?

I'm not casting any judgements or anything like that. It's just that so many media outlets focused on her and a few other bereaved families. and I just wonder, that's all. What do they think now?

[JStuart]

33. well...

they DID bring it down. Indirectly. They didn't want to die and if they knew they'd die they preferred it be at their time and choice. The hijackers basically said, we're gonna fly to DC and hit something but if the cockpit is stormed, we're going straight down. So if cockpit was NOT stormed, 757 goes to DC, instead ends up in Pa field.

the passengers WERE heroes. there's not really debate to that.

But did the passeners grab the controls and say "Were bringing her down to save the capitol and our vaunted leader GWB"?

Ha, nope.

[OutsidetheBox]

38. I see you know exactly what the so called hijackers were thinking

It was more like this: Plane originally got delayed before takeoff, putting a wrench into striking DC at or near the same time as the other strikes. Plane was on course to DC, flying over sparsely populated land. By this time fighter jets were everywhere, radar picked up that 93 was headed straight for DC (White House or Capitol) jets were sent over, got there quickly, told 93 to disengage trajectory, plane did not. Opportunity to bring down with missile in rural area in order to protect DC. Order given to shoot down while in air, hence the scattered debris field. Hero myth is concocted for the nation to absorb and for unthinking drones to still believe in today. Psych-ops works to perfection, whitewash insures cover-up, Bush and war on terror continues, American people remain ignorant to the truth, mostly because most refuse to believe government can do wrong. Fabricated myth allows the mind to relax and not be stressed at most uncomfortable truths, thinking is allowed to remain black and white, inside the box. Don't worry, be happy.

[rinsd]

40. LOL

For someone who accused others of mind reading, you sure pulled quite a tale from your rectum.

Yet another person on the internet who knows the real "truth" and anyone who disagrees is stupid or worse.

[OutsidetheBox]

41. It's called common sense, logic and reason.....

You should try it sometime....Think for yourself...It works. All the evidence is out there for sheeple to find. Don't believe me or any other "tin foiler". Do your homework.

[JStuart]

43. To believe that...

flight 93 was shot down and NOT crashed you have to believe:


1) Dozens of phone calls from passengers to families detailing the plan to rush the cockpit were made by CIA voice simulation computers.

2) Eye witness reports were wrong.

3) Cockpit Voice recordings were faked.

4) Gov't lied (well that ones not a stretch) plus military conspiracy.

5) The radar maps showing NO FIGHTERS on the screen were FORGED too.



you want to take that path?

[OutsidetheBox]

45. The path less followed....

Proven....cell phones at 30,000 feet do not work. Have you ever tried this? (And on board phones were not used) Check out the recent studies saying there is less than .06 percentage chance of one phone working at this altitude, much less multiple phones at the same time.

Eye witness reports not reported (for obvious reasons) tell of fighter jets and of a large debris field. But of course you only listen to what MSM tells you, don't you?? Coroner interview says he did not find one body part, one drop of blood. Investigator says crater is only 8-10 feet deep. Have you ever seen pics of crashes? I suggest you research these.

I guess you also do not believe your eyes nor reason when you see WTC implode by demolition. Can you explain WTC 7?? Didn't think so.

Why has government never released pics or video of plane hitting Pentagon when they had cameras from every conceivable angle? What is there to hide when a plane hits a building?

Were you aware of the NORAD war games conducted during 9/11 that basically convuluted fighter jets all throughout the eastern seaboard, making it possible for planes not on normal route to strike?

Were you aware that more and more government officials of high respect, including decorated officers, as well as very respectable intellectuals, engineers, etc... have all concluded that their eyes did not lie and their minds did not decieve and have concluded that after test after test and research after research 9/11 is not what it seems?

I guess you have yet to escape the system...do yourself a favor....take the red pill, enter reality.

You want to take THAT path?

But, when it helps put your mind at ease...Ignorance is bliss...

[rinsd]

55. Get thee back to prison planet

"intellectuals"

Like Charlie Sheen?

"Proven....cell phones at 30,000 feet do not work. Have you ever tried this? (And on board phones were not used) Check out the recent studies saying there is less than .06 percentage chance of one phone working at this altitude, much less multiple phones at the same time."

Got a link for that....and you are wrong on the airphones. Here's a DU discussion gon the possibility of cell phone use

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=125&topic_id=48029&mesg_id=48029

"I guess you also do not believe your eyes nor reason when you see WTC implode by demolition"

Wow because you saw a special on Discovery Channel. I guess you convieniently ignored how long and how many man hours were needed to set up demolitions.

"Why has government never released pics or video of plane hitting Pentagon when they had cameras from every conceivable angle? What is there to hide when a plane hits a building?"

Hmmm...eyewitnesses for Pentagon plane do not count. Eyewitnesses for Flight 93 do count!

Another full of shit foiler bites the dust!

[OutsidetheBox]

57. To the weak minded and gullible gov't fictions are the stuff of escapism

Did you notice I did not include Sheen in the discussion? He is no intellectual, but at least he has a free thinking mind. How about the myriad of others, including, most recently, the man in charge of Star Wars under Ford and Carter, Dr. Robert M. Bowman, Lt. Col., USAF, ret. who flew 101 combat missions in Vietnam. He is the recipient of the Eisenhower Medal, the George F. Kennan Peace Prize, the President’s Medal of Veterans for Peace, the Society of Military Engineers Gold Medal (twice), six Air Medals, and dozens of other awards and honors. His Ph.D. is in Aeronautics and Nuclear Engineering from Caltech. He chaired 8 major international conferences, and is one of the country’s foremost experts on National Security. I guess you want to dismiss this person as well?

Just because you saw this Discovery Channel show doesn't mean the entire world did as well. Never seen it personally. I see reality, not some MSM bullshit whitewash designed for lemmings. I see steel reinforced buildings collapsing only after 40-50 minutes of a not-hot enough fire when one in Spain burned for 24 hours without falling. I see clips of the actual event, including WTC 7, fall in classing demolition form. Care to actually elaborate on why 7 fell and how it fell when nothing hit it? Classic demolition, or do you conveniently whitewash building 7? You ignore evidence of building 7 because that is what your MSM masters tell you to do. Nothing to see, move along.

How nice of you to completely ignore the Pentagon simply because "eyewitnesses" do not count. Ah, cameras are not witnesses, they actually recorded what happened but we can't see them for what reason??? Makes no sense, and I think you know this. If you have nothing to hide then show us the videos. But somehow I don't think you care about the Pentagon because there is too much being hidden, too much unexplained.

Have you looked at pics of flight 93 in Pennsylvania yet? Have you seen the crater size? Have you seen the debris? And you still think it crashed intact into the ground?

Lemmings are lemmings, sheeple are sheeple, and, no matter how hard you try to tell them the truth, they remain, forever, grazing on the fields of ignorance, ready to be tipped come slumber time.

Pathetic.

[rinsd]

58. To the weak minded? LOL

I see your lone nutter and raise you Popular Mechanics!

Let's see I poked a few holes in your theory and your response is to ignore those points, insult me and then claim I am ignoring something we haven't even got to yet. Brillaint persuasion strategy, how is it that so many more have now rallied to your cause?

"Lemmings are lemmings, sheeple are sheeple, and, no matter how hard you try to tell them the truth, they remain, forever, grazing on the fields of ignorance, ready to be tipped come slumber time."

Yes, only you know the truth....hurry tell the people. I think there may be a free street corner near you!

[OutsidetheBox]

60. Kool-aid! Kool aid! Get your delicious sheeple Kool-Aid!

Did you know Popular Mechanics and its 9/11 whitewash story was overseen by Michael Chertoff's nephew? You poor soul, you probably think the 9/11 Commission Report is an honest interpretation of what happened. Guess the Book of Genesis is the true story of how we came to be too! The forces at play are much larger than you can ever contemplate. I guess you think Iraq was invaded because of WMDs? Oh, sorry, for freedom and democracy, right? No, ah, because Saddam was a tyrant. And Afghanistan war plans did not exist months before 9/11 either, right? Taliban did not want to allow the US to build a very, very important pipeline through their nation so, conveniently, 9/11 happened, a new Pearl Harbor. Or did you not read the PNAC? Man are you brainwashed!! Take the damn red pill, enter the rabbit hole, leave naivete and ignorance behind. Right now you are a slave of the system...Sad, how very, very sad.

[rinsd]

61. Cool a matrix reference....

I don't think I could get thru one of these dicsussions/"enlightenments" without one.

I think your special deflector helmet needs a few rachets to the left, it appears to be on far too tightly.

[OutsidetheBox]

62. Must obey teevee! Must think like teevee! Need to listen to teevee!

[CJCRANE]

51. As per my previous post..

did the cockpit voice recordings prove that the passengers made it into the cockpit?

I haven't heard the whole recording or read the trasncript but AFAIK there was some dispute about that.

[Pastiche423]

39. Hook. Line. Sinker.

[OutsidetheBox]

35. Bereaved families look to make heroes out of loved ones

In pure psychological terms, many of them will never deviate from the hero status their loved ones have been given even though reality differs. This way they can accept their death, giving death meaning, in their diluted belief that they died for a "worthy" cause. It is quite sad because everyone from government to MSM used her and others too bereaved to think clearly. She will never think differently about what has been told about her man. At the same time she has made money off of her husband's death, first from a book and I wonder, will she get anything for the movie? It is quite sad that these families have been used like condoms to protect the Bush cabal. And she doesn't seem to know it.

[lonestarnot]

34. Those offended should just stay home. What's the big deal?

[Balbus]

36. The beautiful thing about this movie and all other movies..

is you don't have to watch it if you don't want to. If you don't support it, don't give them your money - and if enough people feel the same way, Hollywood will get the picture.

[Rainscents]

42. Didn't Rummy said... Plane was shot down?

How did he knew this? I believe, he slipped, when he said this. This was said by him during 2004 Bush re-re-election.

[gatorboy]

44. This film is being made by the same man,

that directed "The Perfect Storm". Another movie which was supposed to be based on true events but had to fictionalize a bulk of the movie because no one really knew for sure wha had happen to that fishing boat.

[Radio_Guy]

46. I have no problem with it

as long as their is a disclaimer at the beginning saying what they are showing is fiction or at best has not been proven.

[Solly Mack]

48. I'm surprised it's taken this long to materialize

but I have no opinion one way or the other on the movie...I will say that I won't be viewing it.

[lectrobyte]

50. Will it show the F-16 shooting it down? I'd like to see that movie.

I already saw a TV movie on A&E or one of those channels, way too propaganda-ish.

[Shakespeare]

52. I think Americans are hyper-sensitive grief junkies....

...and that this is just a movie. Now, whether that movie reveals anything important remains to be seen, but it's a movie, and the theaters have every right to promote it.

I am sick to death of the people who keep whining that they want to be shielded from these images (and ideas). Grow the fuck up, and stop with the grief mongering.

Sometimes I am completely ashamed of my fellow Americans.

[Janice325]

53. I saw the trailer on Olbermann's Countdown

I didn't lose anyone I knew personally during 911, but I started to cry during the trailer. Afterwards, I felt like I was going to have an anxiety attack.
I'm a very liberal person. I love movies. I understand that there were quite a lot of families who lost loved ones during this flight, and they are supportive of the film.
I just don't want to see it.
It's funny, but I can understand and support people taking tours of New Orleans to see Katrina's devastation, but I can't see them paying to see this movie.
That's just my two cents.

[noonwitch]

56. It should be a movie in 20 years, not 5

They really should wait a little longer before making it.

[DearAbby]

59. Personally I will not be seeing this

For me it feels sorta goulish, there will be no documentary facts to the film. I figure they would go along the "reported" story that has been accepted. So it would for me be tasteless to find "entertainment" in a real life tragedy. I guess it is too soon for me.

[Dorian Gray]

63. They can make it if they want,

but I think that they will be sadly shunned by the general population. I don't want to see it, and I don't know anybody who wants to see it. It's a bad idea, most likely brought about by greed and the hope to make a buck off of the suffering of other people. It's in bad taste, and I want no part of this film.

[mitchum]

64. Propaganda