My take on Rep. Cynthia McKinney

[usregimechange]

If the capital police are racially profiling black women with afros the answer would still not be to hit them. I am a strong Democrat but you were wrong and you should resign right now.

[400Years]

1. so you saw it all go down eh?

can you give us some more info since you were there?

[usregimechange]

4. Are her or her lawyer alledging that the cop grabbed her ass?

WWMLKD?

[400Years]

11. nice dodge Tex, now I'll ask you again

Since you were there can you tell us what actually happened?

I mean you were an eye witness and all.

[CatWoman]

12. *snicker*

:rofl:

[Warpy]

2. There is a tape of the event that nobody is releasing

to the public. Until we see that tape, we can't really offer much of an opinion, can we?

My first response was the same as yours, but the continued suppression of the tape leads me to believe the story isn't what the right says it is.

Capitol cops have never been known for being particularly gentle, and I imagine it's gotten worse with post 9/11 paranoia.

[CatWoman]

3. ....

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=06/04/04/1419259

[oasis]

14. Thanks for the link Catwoman. "Democracy Now" Rep. Sheila Jackson

Lee and "Able" Mable Thomas relate their experiences with capitol cops in light of the McKinney issue.

[tnlefty]

16. I wasn't aware of the GA legislators not being allowed entry to the GA

capitol while Mrs. King was lying in state there. I'm stunned. That is just unfucking real.

Thanks for this link. jeeesh

[aikoaiko]

22. haha, she should be remembered because she is black.

astonishing.

my post title paraphrases McKinney's and Lee's defense.

[oasis]

25. It's the job of the cops to know the members of congress. You are

misrepresenting what was stated by Lee and Mckinney. Maybe a review of the video would aid your memory. If your faculties for recollection are still impaired after doing so, you may be eligible for an appointment to the capitol cops corps.

[aikoaiko]

36. like I said I paraphrased.

so here is the text:

AMY GOODMAN: Congressmember Jackson Lee, I know you have to leave soon to catch a plane. This is also the anniversary of the assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King, and I wanted to ask you about this controversy that is brewing in Washington with the Capitol police saying they were seeking a warrant to arrest your fellow congress member, Cynthia McKinney, for an altercation with a police officer last week. Congressmember McKinney spoke on CNN with Wolf Blitzer yesterday. And I wanted to get your response. This is Congressmember Cynthia McKinney

REP. CYNTHIA McKINNEY: There are only 14 African American women members of Congress. So I don't understand what it is about my face that certain members of the Capitol Hill Police Department can't remember.

AMY GOODMAN: Your response, Congressmember Jackson Lee, to what has happened to her?

REP. SHEILA JACKSON LEE: First of all, I think all of us, including Congresswoman McKinney, respects the Capitol police and respects them for their responsibility and their job. But I believe that she is quite accurate in the fact that there are very few of us who happen to be African American women, and there are very few of us who would be so, if you will, difficult to be remembered, if you will, or to be able to be noticed.

My paraphrase is not that far off -- albeit she's saying that there are so few black congressmembers they think they should be remembered better than they are.

Yes it probably is the job of the capitol police to recognize members but if they don't I'm sure they are directed to ask for identification if someone steps around the metal detectors. AND it was McKinney's job to wear her pin which she admits she wasn't.

Tell me, why would it be required for the police to remember comgressmembers' faces and still require congressmembers to wear the pin when they enter the building?

[CatWoman]

26. just like your post should be remembered

because it's so lame.

right?

[Catrina]

55. Ehh, no, your post title shows you fail to grasp McKinney's and Lee's

points. They should be remembered in the same way white representatives are remembered, because they are members of Congress. Comprehension is a marvelous tool.

[aikoaiko]

86. Reading is fundamental.

Why even mention that they are african-american if the capitol police should remember them just like any other congressmember? No, they are making a different case than the one you claim. They are saying that because they are African-American, they should be more recognizable than the other congressmembers.

AMY GOODMAN: Congressmember Jackson Lee, I know you have to leave soon to catch a plane. This is also the anniversary of the assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King, and I wanted to ask you about this controversy that is brewing in Washington with the Capitol police saying they were seeking a warrant to arrest your fellow congress member, Cynthia McKinney, for an altercation with a police officer last week. Congressmember McKinney spoke on CNN with Wolf Blitzer yesterday. And I wanted to get your response. This is Congressmember Cynthia McKinney

REP. CYNTHIA McKINNEY: There are only 14 African American women members of Congress. So I don't understand what it is about my face that certain members of the Capitol Hill Police Department can't remember.

AMY GOODMAN: Your response, Congressmember Jackson Lee, to what has happened to her?

REP. SHEILA JACKSON LEE: First of all, I think all of us, including Congresswoman McKinney, respects the Capitol police and respects them for their responsibility and their job. But I believe that she is quite accurate in the fact that there are very few of us who happen to be African American women, and there are very few of us who would be so, if you will, difficult to be remembered, if you will, or to be able to be noticed.

[Maat]

46. Good find, CatWoman!

Thanks for the post. I found that transcript very enlightening! I'm one of the ones that has withheld comment until I was privy to more facts.

[tatertop]

5. Are you making with the jokes?

You cannot be serious

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

6. Could someone tell me

if there is a provision either in the Constitution or in the statutes that says that a member of Congress is immune to arrest and prosecution while travelling to their seat in the House or Senate? I thought I saw such a law cited when this story first broke. If this is so, isn't this all a tempest in a teapot?

[NaturalHigh]

7. Immune while traveling to the chamber if Congress is in session.

There is nothing to give them immunity for actions they COMMITTED WHILE Congress is in session. In other words, if you hit a cop while traveling to the chamber, you can't be arrested then, but you can be arrested for it later. BTW, Congress is not now in session, so none of this applies. She was on her way to a meeting, not the chamber.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

9. Thanks for clearing that up!

You made it clear and I appreciate that.

[ShortnFiery]

24. Someone, you don't know exactly who, grabs you INAPPROPRIATELY

from behind, and you are to blame just because he happens to be a cop?

Bullshit! IMO you've all watched too many "law and order" episodes.

[NaturalHigh]

91. This has nothing to do with the post to which you replied.

BTW, yes, Law and Order is my favorite show.

[slaveplanet]

30. Bullshit- don't pretend to know matters you know nothing about

Byrd used immunity in 1999 after he got into a traffic accident, he had to file for exemption, just to pay the fine which was his fault.

Immunity is for everywhere
------------------------------

http://www.c-span.org/questions/week145.asp

Members of Congress are permitted to assert a constitutional privilege known as the "arrest clause," contained in Article I, section 6, clause 1 of the U.S. Constitution. It reads:

Senators and Representatives . . . shall in all cases except Treason, Felony and Breach of the Peace, be privileged from Arrest during their attendance at the Sessions of their respective Houses, and in going to and returning from the same;

The origins of this provision stemmed from fears that Members of Congress might be arrested or detained in order to prevent them from casting a specific vote, or out of sheer harassment by their enemies. comprende

On May 7, 1999, Senator Byrd had a traffic accident in Fairfax County, Virginia. The Senator ran into the back of a van when the traffic in his lane came to an abrupt stop. He was cited for the accident; the police then voided the citation when they learned Senator Byrd was a Member of Congress; several days later Senator Byrd asked them to reinstate the ticket for his voluntary compliance; a court date has been set to hear the case on July 19, 1999.

The reason the arrest clause became an issue in this incident is that the ticket issued Senator Byrd by Fairfax County police included a mandatory court appearance, which implies delay, and not just payment of a fine. It remains unclear at this point whether it was Senator Byrd or the police who first raised the issue of privilege under the Constitution to avoid the delays inherent with a court appearance. Some local area police departments, which all have Members of Congress within their jurisdictions, have included this constitutional waiver in their internal regulations and training material. Others have not. The Fairfax County police had consulted their Commonwealth Attorney on the matter immediately after the accident, while Senator Byrd was still at the police station. Senator Byrd's spokeswoman stated that Senator Byrd accepted immunity at the time of the incident because he hadn't immediately realized he had the right to waive his constitutional privilege voluntarily.
------------------------------------------------------------

The capitol cop had no right touching her

Breach of peace was "rioting" when that was written

Felonies were "very" serious when that was written

Treason is self explanatory

and there are excuses for assaulting a peace officer in DC Code

The DA has to prove premeditation on her part

NO CHARGES HAVE BEEN FILED

-------------------------------------------------

AMY GOODMAN: Has this ever happened to you, where you were not recognized?

REP. SHEILA JACKSON LEE: Oh, on several occasions. And, of course, you have to suffer the indignity and sometimes handle it in a way that you don't care to handle it, because of the fact that you believe that you've served in the United States Congress and that you should be identifiable. So there is merit to the points that she is making. And there certainly may some concerns about securing the Capitol, which we understand has taken a whole different tone after 9/11.

But I think cooler heads can address this question in a way other than the criminal justice system of issuing an arrest warrant for a member of the United States Congress, who was within her right to be in the building and was within her right to be rushing toward the House floor to vote, as I understand the facts, and certainly should have had the courtesies of the Capitol police, as we should extend courtesies. So why can't this be resolved, where we learn who each other happens to be and we improve the picture book, if you will, and the training, so that we all can be fully identified.

There is no requirement, by the way, for any member to have an I.D. We do have them. But we may have been rushing from somewhere and not carrying the I.D., and there is no requirement for us to have a pin, which is our identifying pin, which I happen to be wearing at this time. But there is no requirement, as a understand it, for members to have that at this time.

(...)

And in this incident it was unfortunate. But it is the role of the Capitol police, of whom we respect, to basically know the members of the United States Congress. And if you are rushing toward a vote, a House vote -- and I think people should understand we have 15 minutes to cast a vote no matter where you might be in the entire capital of Washington, D.C. You might be in meetings off the Hill. You still have 15 minutes to vote. It's very difficult then to be stopped, while the clock is ticking, for to you cast your vote.
-----------------------------------
Today is the 38th anniversary of the assassination of Coretta Scott King's husband, Dr. Martin Luther King. We speak with one of those State Legislators denied entry to see the body of Coretta Scott King at the Georgia Capital. "Able" Mable Thomas is a Georgia State Representative.

* Rep. "Able" Mable Thomas, Georgia State Representative.

[NaturalHigh]

90. Good grief. Chill out, will you?

I was explaining the clause as I had it explained to me in my US Government II class in college. I have a bachelor's degree in history/government, and my professor had a PhD. If you'll notice in the story that you posted Byrd wasn't exempt from anything. He just didn't have to make a court appearance at that time because he was on his way to the session.

I don't know what has you so worked up about this, but I wasn't even there when McKinney hit the cop. I'm not part of the great conspiracy that you tin-foil hat types have dreamed up.

[Catrina]

54. So, why haven't they arrested her?

[NaturalHigh]

89. They've filed for an arrest warrant.

[SeaBob]

8. C. M

I am Not Non Violent. Sometimes the police need to physically stomped so they learn a little respect

[oasis]

10. Mckinney's going to expose the shabby treatment of black elected

officials by capitol cops. See the Democracy Now link/video on Post #3.

[autorank]

13. Rediculous point. n/t

[greekspeak]

15. Oh come the hell on.

You know as well as I do if this had been any white male, especially any REPUBLICAN white male, the issue would be gone--if we heard anything about it at all. McKinney is a woman, black and a Democrat. Thus, it is still an issue. I wonder how often stuff like this goes down and is never reported. It would not suprise me if the whole thing was staged to take heat off the flaming wreck of Republican controlled government. Provoke McKinney deliberately. Push her buttons. Then attack. And that is if this alleged attack happened as the Librul MSM is reporting it. Thanks for the flamebait. Been nice really nice seeing your true colors.

[confludemocrat]

17. OP summarizes very well alot of DU opinion on McKinney-joke or not

I'm starting to think the Dem party is in trouble with typically 40% of even DU saying stuff like this

[BooScout]

41. No he doesn't....

There's a poll on here somewhere that shows the vast majority here either supports Mckinney or has not formed an opinion. There's merely a few very vocal people here who can't stand the thought of Mckinney getting a lot of support here at DU.........hmmmmmmm........why is that???

[MisterP]

88. interestingly, a lot of them are the "loyalists" that declaim on the

importance of voting for any D no matter what. Sort of like how the DLC and its pod people yell about "purists" withdrawing support, when that turns out to be how they got power (there was a nice article on this last month here).
Really, it's not about "compromise" or getting back in power, but destroying anybody to the left of Francisco Franco. If you're not enthusiastic about Hannitized, Boll-Weevilly, Blairite neolibs--especially at the expense of real liberals--they want you out of the "big tent."

[Gregorian]

18. Only if the Republicans give us back the trillions of dollars they stole.

They do that first, then I'm sure McKinney can find a way to reclaim her soul for whatever malice she may have exhibited. That is, IF she did anything wrong. But to be honest, it kind of pales in the darkness of the shadow of republicanism. I'd focus on that.

[aikoaiko]

19. Did you see McKinney on CNN with Soledad O'Brien? Horrible.

McKinney evaded questions and had to have TWO lawyers jump in to save her from making herself look even worse.

Soledad O'Brien hammered her asking for her recollection of the events -- instead McKinney went on a ramble about sociological factors.

I've been waiting to see the video before making judgement, but even if the cop was completely in the wrong (which is looking more doubtful with McKinney admitting she wasn't wearing her pin), McKinney is still handling this so poorly that I am embarassed. If she was in my district, I'd be writing her letters of complaint, but alas she is from another GA district.

[oasis]

21. Soledad was rude and condescending. Cynthia was attempting to put

her incident into context with the past history of racism within the ranks of the capitol cops. Soledad was more interested in shilling for her corporate bosses than getting the real story.

McKinney's not one to back down from the fight for justice, so prepare yourself for even more "embarassment".

[aikoaiko]

23. that's just it, she wouldn't talk about the incident so she couldn't ..

...actaully put it in context.

[oasis]

28. Background. It's helpful to know the background when discussing an issue.

Don't you agree? :think:

[aikoaiko]

31. of course, then why wouldn't she answer the question

As soon as she answered the question, she could have contextualized it. Instead, she looked evasive. Letting her lawyers jump in and say she wouldn't answer the question made her evasiveness look worse.

[oasis]

37. A person who speaks truth to power can still be wise enough to heed

the advice of legal counsel. There are certain facts Cynthia cannot reveal at this time.

[Catrina]

32. What?? She gave her statement as to what happened. Why hasn't the

cop?? You should stop reading RNC talking points and wait for two things that will help determine whether or not the 'rumor's being repeated are facts. One, let's hear the cop refute Cynthia's account of the incident, if he ever emerges from his hidey hole. And two, where's the video?? Last I heard there is a video but it stops right before the 'incident'!

By the time Cynthia went on television, she already knew they were planning to charge her, if they could come up with something, so naturally her lawyers by then, had advised her not to comment any further.

Why are you applying different standards of behavior to Cynthia McKinney than are granted to everyone esle?

Has Scooter Libby spoken on television about the charges against him?

Has Conrad Burns spoken on tv about the investigation into his affairs?

Has Rep. Ney spoken on tv about the investigation into his affairs?

Has Doolittle spoken on tv about the investigation into his affairs?

The answer is 'no', nor should they. Funny how the standards for Cynthia are different!

[aikoaiko]

38. right ...anyone who criticises our own or wants more from our own ...

...must be reading Republican talking points. I see you expect very little.

Efforts to make the rank and file conform are in effect I see.

[Catrina]

45. No, anyone who, without evidence and comes to a conclusion about our

own or anyone elses has little credibility.

[aikoaiko]

49. I saw the CNN broadcast and thats the subject of my subthread

What are you talking about?

[zbdent]

20. Until I see the video, I can understand how "striking a policeman"

can be blown out of proportion.

If you're used to being recognized and walking through somewhere, and someone says something to you and you're not paying attention, then they grab your arm, you'd probably spin around in shock - and possibly "strike" the person grabbing your arm, ergo, the poke.

Now, I admit that's speculation . . . but in nearly every case where someone does something newsworthy and there's a video, it's been in the media - especially if it was a dem (well, when "newsworthy" means illegal/questionable) . . .

Also, remember how a bunch of cops beat the crap out of Rodney King and said "We were telling him to stay down, but he was fighting us!" - but then the video surfaced . . . which put it in a whole new light . . .

[monobrau]

27. She's a fool and a disgrace

I don't know what happend that day but I've seen enough of her evasion and bullshit now to throw her over the side. I don't accept that crap from ANY politician, regardless of party.

[Catrina]

52. So, you don't know what happened, but 'I'm ready to throw her over the

side'?? That makes perfect sense ~ :rofl:

[monobrau]

58. It's her behavior after the incident

You would not accept the line of BS she is serving up if she was a repuke. If we want to win and lead this country back to the light, it will require honest and ethical Representatives held to standards that don't shift because it's "one of ours".
We have to clean our house while we watch the house of Delay burn down.

[Catrina]

63. Oh, yes, we do have to clean house. We have to get rid of those who

supported this administration's policies. We need more Cynthia McKinneys, Conyers, Feingolds, Boxers and as for behavior?? If we want to win, we need to stop electing wimps to represent us and get more people with the guts to tell the truth, as Cynthia McKinney has always done. Too bad when she did speak the truth, her cowardly colleagues did not back her up.

I love her 'behavior'. I love that she goes to anti-war demonstrations with the 'little people' that the rest of this government ignores. I love that she speaks the truth on Capitol Hill regarding election fraud, 9/11 and issues that are important to the PEOPLE, not corporations.

What exactly about that behavior is it that you don't like?

[monobrau]

85. Meet Barbara Lee

http://lee.house.gov/
No one else in congress has more integrity or courage than my congresswoman does going by the criteria you value. Compare and contrast. I expect my congress person to fight for me and put their ego in check for 4 years. I expect my congress person not to embarrass me or my country with personal drama and grandstanding.
I value McKinney's service and the fact that she has spoken up while others remain silent. But as soon as a politician makes it about them, they aren't fighting for you anymore.
The republican majority may very well fall by the end of this year and as soon as that fight is over, we have a lot of work to do. Let's get busy and knock off this playground crap.

[noonwitch]

29. I don't know the whole story, but the woman has crazy eyes

She's nuts. You can tell by looking at her eyes.

I don't know what happened between she and the capitol police, but my guess is that there was wrong done on both sides.

[obnoxiousdrunk]

33. I know

she kinda looks like a noon witch.

[ShortnFiery]

35. I wonder, based on the venom

How much of this is sexism?

How much of this is racism?

OR

How much of it is jealousy that this brave woman stands up for the poor and downtrodden.

I don't give a damn if you consider her both ugly and bat shit crazy, she's aces to me and a significant number of liberals. Next time you DLCers want the favor of our votes - we won't be there for YOU.

All your trashing her ad nausea says far more about YOU than it does about her. And BTW who in Congress is not arrogant or more than a little bat shit crazy?

[obnoxiousdrunk]

43. I was

responding to Post #29. I love CM don't get me wrong.

[ShortnFiery]

60. Ok, I'm sorry for that ...

It's cool by me as a fellow democrat, if you don't like her looks or personality, I only request we refrain from cheap shots? It only adds fuel to the republican's spin campaign to destroy her politically.

We all hate it, but we all must fight within ourselves the tempation to over-stereotype or judge someone sane on the basis of their manners.

[oasis]

40. You "don't know". You may have revealed all we need to know. About you.

;-)

[Catrina]

57. If a bad photo causes you to conclude someone is 'nuts', you must

think Laura Bush belongs in a lunatic asylum!! You have seen Laura's 'crazy eyes' haven't you? :rofl:

[proud2BlibKansan]

74. You judge her based on her eyes???

Good gawd. :eyes:

[Name removed]

34. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[The Stranger]

39. Did I accidentally log on to Free Republic?

You want her to resign for resisting illegal racial profiling?

[dogday]

56. You know I have been wondering about that very same

thing??? Past couple of weeks I have seen some opinions that are far right of right here...:evilgrin:

[Bridget Burke]

64. I've stopped wondering.

I'm fairly certain.

[proud2BlibKansan]

77. This place needs fumigating

Every day there is another shocker like this. WTF is going on?

[proud2BlibKansan]

75. She has creepy eyes!!

That's it - her eyes. They can tell she's guilty by the look in her eyes!
:sarcasm:

[Catrina]

42. I thought for a minute I had accidentally wandered over to that

board ~

'she has crazy eyes'???? I guess you would have the same problem the incompetent cop had recognizing a US Congresswoman. Now, if you were talking about Laura Bush :rofl:

As for the OP. She should resign?? Based on righwing allegations with zero proof? No strong woman would even consider resigning any job based on the ever-changing stories we've heard so far.

Go Cynthia!! They hate you for your incisive questioning of Donald Rumsfeld.

They hate for you for representing the 9/11 families when their requests for an investigation were being ignored.

They hate you for mentioning the unmentionable, blackbox voting.

And from what I'm seeing, perhaps most of all because you are strong, truth-telling, 'uppity' black woman!

I doubt she'll resign ~ I hope she continues to expose the lies in DC for a very long time.

[cali]

44. Your post is shameful.

You don't know the facts and yet you call for her resignation. That's wrong. How do you know she didn't just react and in swinging around to confront the cop, hit him accidentally. Convicting her this way doesn't say much for you. Alas, reading through this miserable excuse for a thread, there are a number of posts that I find deplorable.

[Maat]

47. You're right, Cali!

It would be ridiculous for her to resign at this point. They need to drop any consideration of charges, and address the true issue. Congress needs to address what ID they want presented, and what pins or whatever they want a Congressperson wearing at what time. They need to make adequate rules, and consistently enforce them.

[slaveplanet]

48. Alway speak truth

to thuggery...It's the only way to cure the infection

right on cali

[AtomicKitten]

50. Why the scorched earth rhetoric?

I don't think what went down was right (Ms. McKinney should have stopped when asked) particularly since Al Gore gracefully submitted to security procedures when they searched him in airports on more than one occasion, but to call for Ms. McKinney's resignation over this bullshit is way over the top.

[ShortnFiery]

59. I'm delighted to hear you agree AtomicKitten ...

You are a dignified and thoughtful kind of poster here on DU and I respect that. However, to some of us, demanding steadfast decorum and CLASS acts from all of our candidates is not practical nor is it wise.

Yes, she's a real character and I can understand how some people would not take to her personality. Like myself, there's no in between, you either love her persona or get "put off" by it. There's no shame in that.

Some of the best bosses I've had the opportunity to work for were real jerk-offs personality-wise. However, some of these men and women treated me FAIRLY and did not take advantage of my employment.

Regardless of her personality - she's quite a spitfire who one will either love or hate - we all should admit that she was one of the few steadfast voices for both the investigation into 9/11 and the pre-invasion marches.

You and I, AtomicKitten probably are opposites personality wise because I can't stand the personalities of some of the moderates. But yes, it takes BOTH classy moderates and fiery liberals to make a healthy and every-evolving Democratic Party.

Whatever we think of her persona, I ask in all humble regard that we do not pile onto the right wing's character smear campaign?

She's ours, and like her *spice* or not, she has done GOOD for OUR PARTY.

[AtomicKitten]

66. Indeed she has a wonderful history of speaking on issues that matter

when nobody else would. The heart-wrenching plea of the House Dems for a senator to sign the challenge to the vote in 2000 particularly before a man I adore, Al Gore, still makes me weep. And perhaps you can understand that I remain livid over the purposeful manipulation of the black vote, and don't get me started on Katrina.

I just don't see this as a cause worthy of the same indignation. There is such a thing as the appearance of impropriety, and I just wish Ms. McKinney on this particular security issue had submitted simply as an example that all Americans must be inconvenienced if asked under the guise of security. Maybe it was bullshit, but again Al Gore submitted, and that most certainly was bullshit.

FTR, I am not a moderate, as a matter of fact wrote for a Green paper for a while. I consider myself a liberal. I separate myself from the progressive movement because some (I emphasize some) seek the demise of the Democratic party and I don't subscribe to that notion.

I'm not piling on the RW smear campaign, and indeed they have dragged this issue into the gutter on many levels, I'm just stating how I view this. Security particularly in today's world is something we can't afford as a nation and a party to screw around with. I believe there are racial inequities even in Congress and I believe Ms. McKinney is a target. But in my view she gave them the ammunition by defiantly not stopping when asked by the guard. We need to move on from this.

That's just how I feel about this. I am perhaps less emotional about this issue and more analytical; there is so much to be outraged about these days, I try to apportion my fury so my head doesn't explode.

But thank you for acknowledging I'm not completely bereft of humanity on this subject. :)

[ShortnFiery]

70. Indeed you have a gift of expressing yourself -

And albeit I don't concur with all of your points, you have my utmost respect as a fellow democrat. I am glad that you also believe: She may need a little refinement, but Congresswoman McKinney is FAR more of a service to us than an embarrassment.

<while in the hell am I having flashbacks to the movie "GiGi?> :P

Although I'm more of a bare-knuckles kind of communicator too often, I do try to soften at times and I appreciate those who can practice the gift of diplomacy.

Thanks! ;)

[AtomicKitten]

72. Hey, I'm fully into sassy congressfolk.

Paul Wellstone remains my hero as does John Conyers.

I despise the GOP with every once of my being and I hate giving them fodder for their hate-fests. Had Ms. McK's behavior been beyond reproach, I'd be right there with you with all the ferocity I could muster.

I hope this whole affair dissipates into the breeze soon because it's not a winner for anybody on our side of the aisle, and I resent the bastards cackling about this.

Have a great day.

[Laughing Mirror]

68. Al Gore, handsome as he is, is not a black woman with an Afro

Nuance...

And Al Gore was not racing to the House floor to cast his vote.

Another nuance.

[AtomicKitten]

69. that has nothing to do with it

The point is he submitted and as an example so should she. It is incumbent of those in leadership to behave in such a manner. Al Gore could have claimed the screeners were Republicans that just wanted to harass him because surely he should have been recognized. But he didn't.

Yes, he is handsome, isn't he?

On edit: Allow me to share a vignette. I was stopped by the police (also handsome :)) here in SF because my tags were lost in a move. Amazingly he let me go with a warning, but told me to be careful because a Republican cop could and might impound my car (I have liberal bumper stickers). The liberal gave me a break, but if a Republican cop took action, I still would be at fault. That's my point.

All sorts of inequities exist in our world - racial, political, etc. The point is that rules are for everybody regardless of the things that divide us.

[Laughing Mirror]

76. Has Al Gore been harrassed the way Cynthia McKinney has been?

Has he been called "bitch" on the floor of the House by a white Republican congressman from North Carolina?

Racism and harrassment, the silencing of a wonderful empowering voice for a lot of people who don't have a voice, is what this is about.

This has everything to do with it.

[AtomicKitten]

81. apples and oranges (race vs. politics)

I agree she has been harassed, in a disgusting manner I might add. And most likely stopping her was an extension of this. HOWEVER, it was incumbent upon her to submit because it was a security checkpoint.

GOP protesters outside Al Gore's house in December 2000 following the judicial coup d'etat demanding he vacate for Dick Cheney was harassment too. Maybe it was a jackass fascist Republican that stopped him in the airport. HOWEVER, he submitted to being searched at the security checkpoint because he was asked.

A person in leadership can never go wrong obeying the law and following the rules and doing so gracefully. That's genuine leadership.

I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. :)

On edit: So there's no midunderstanding, I fully admit that racial harassment is infinitely more egregious than political harassment. No contest. But still it's harassment and not a reason to exempt oneself from protocol.

[Jersey Devil]

51. Resignation? Don't you think that would be overkill?

For Christ's sakes, Congressmen have choked and punched each other on the floor of Congress and no one ever resigned or was thrown out over it.

Here we don't even have all the facts yet and you are calling for her resignation. At most, from what I've read, she pushed him away by shoving him in the chest with her cell phone in her hand. Oh, the humanity.

[Catrina]

53. A strong Democrat believes in the Constitutional right to due process.

I am a strong Democrat and even though many Republican congressmen are under suspicion of being involved in crimes, I don't believe they should step down until there is some proof the allegations are true. They have a right to due process, which includes a gathering of facts, not innuendo, before a charge is made or someone loses their job. Should we treat Cynthia McKinney differently?

[Charlie Brown]

61. So if a jury of her peers convicts McKinney

will you accept the verdict?

[Jersey Devil]

71. Jury? For a petty assault case?

At most this would be a petty assault and there would be no jury trial. This entire thing has been blown so far out of proportion that it is ridiculous.

[Catrina]

73. I was referring to the OP's demand that McKinney should step down now

Do you agree with that?

But to answer your question, first I would have to see some evidence that she did anything wrong. So far, I have not. I don't believe in political prosecutions, no matter which party they belong to.

It's possible in this case, that the cop himself may have done something wrong. He certainly was incompetent although that's not a crime. We don't know the facts yet, but the OP thinks McKinney should step down.

As far as accepting a jury verdict, if we have the money to waste on such a trial, I would accept it. Juries generally do try to sort out the facts. But I doubt this will happen in this case, because if the cop laid a hand on her for no reason (she did have her ID, she was in the process of legally doing her job and she did show him her ID) which may very well have happened, they will not pursue it.

Cops are NOT allowed to inappropriately manhandle citizens despite the claims of some on these boards. We'll have to wait to see whether there is any evidence of wrongdoing, on either her part or his.

[Charlie Brown]

78. No I don't

I was just pointing out that a principled belief in due process (jury or not) would require the resolve to convict McKinney if an objective weighing of the evidence concludes that she did indeed commit assault.

If the Cap Police cannot justify the officer's behavior, or if there are several conflicting accounts, I don't think there's grounds for any trial.

You make an intersting point about "political prosecutions." If the DA decides to charge McKinney and arrest her under pressure from the House vote, or the freepers' phone calls, she may fit the criteria of a political prisioner.

[Marie26]

62. Resign?

Cheney shot someone in the face & he's not going anywhere. If she's wrong, she should apologize, but on the scale of Congressional offenses right now, this is pretty minor.

[Bridget Burke]

65. Resign?

Is that what Limbaugh is pushing today?

[misanthrope]

67. All I know...

...is that in my life, I've found there are usually three truths to every story: Your truth, my truth and the whole truth.

"It takes two to tango," in most cases. I have a feeling there are no completely innocent parties in this scenario, just two stubborn folks bumping heads.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

79. I Don't Think She Should Resign But I Do Think She Was Wrong And Should've

apologized in a simple and straightforward manner as soon as the story hit the wires, rather than calling press conferences and escalating the incident to the frenzy it has now become. I know some vehemently disagree with that, which is ok, but I actually am more disappointed in the aftermath response than the actual incident itself. Cynthia is a stand up congresswoman though who has done countless positive things, and I don't think this one incident should undermine that and force her resignation.

[Catrina]

80. Cynthia is a smart woman. She understands, having already experienced

it, that is a target of the radical right. Once the story got into the news, she knew full well that the smear machine would go into full swing, as indeed it has. Therefore, she got out in front of it and pre-empted any lies they would certainly tell ~

Her strategy so far, appears to have worked. They know she's no push-over. If they want to go ahead and prosecute her, she's let them know, it will not be a one way battle. I wish Kerry had done that the minute the Swift Boat liars launched their attacks. By the time he did, they had control of the story.

We still have no idea whether she did anything wrong or not, but we do have some new information that many of us in these forums didn't have yesterday. Apparently the cop himself may be in trouble, depending on exactly when he 'grabbed' her.

It seems that all the 'experts' who were here yesterday claiming that cops can abuse citizens, grab them, push them, body block them etc. were wrong. It seems, as some of us tried to say, that NO, a cop is NOT allowed to put his hands on a citizen without a very good reason. If her story is correct, the cop is in trouble, imo.

The fact that there's been no arrest so far, makes me wonder if when they watched the video, it proved her story to be true. I've never known her to lie before ~ I tended to believe a woman whose MO has been to TELL THE TRUTH over an anonymous cop until I saw something to change my mind which so far, I have not.

[mondo joe]

82. Um, WHO said "cops can abuse citizens"?

What are you talking about?

[mondo joe]

83. I think she made mistakes but stepping down over this would be even

more ridiculously uncalled for than what we've had already (barring any major new revelations).

It's political hay, and it's being exploited by DeLay, by McKinney, and by the media.

Isn't that enough?

[New Government]

84. Even The Congressional Black Caucus is running from her

The woman has next to zero friends on the hill. She is arrogant and thinks she deserves deferential treatment after an assault because she is used to her staffers treating her like a Queen. From what I hear, NOBODY in the House likes this woman. Not for her views, but for her arrogance, blatant open-hands, and rude bahavior. This isn't about race. It's about Cynthia McKinney. Those that support her here, obviously don't know her.

[Catrina]

87. Hi, I take it you know her personally? I'll tell you what I know and why I

support her. I'll be interested in your opinion on the ISSUES, rather than on the politics of personal destruction.

She stood up for the families of 9/11 who questioned the official story of that tragedy.

She marches with anti-war protestors, and actually mixes with the people she represents. They LOVE her, and they are why she is a congresswoman. Why are you so concerned about anyone else liking her?

She stood up for the right of a US soldier to refuse to participate again, after having been there once, in Bush's illegal war. She was kind and wonderful to his family, when others of her colleagues, were afraid to speak out.

She unflinchingly questioned people like Rumsfeld which it is her duty to do, and forces those who are employed by the people to answer uncomfortable quetions on the record.

Of course they on the right in the House, hate her for that ~ the truth is not their friend.

Proof please of your claims that she is arrogant, because they fly in the face of what people have to say who have met her personally and found her to be warm, kind and anything but arrogant.

I don't need to know her. I know she is tough and can handle the rightwing thugs (and we now know, criminals) in Congress who have hi-jacked this country for the past decade ~ and we need more with her spirit. What she does in her private life, I have no interest in.