Help! My son (ex-sailor) contacted by his recruiter, can change his admin

[peacebird]

discharge (failed a whiz quiz due to a moment of stupidity) to an honorable discharge now that the he has been out of service for a year with no further problems?!?!?

My son was awarded the NavyMarine commendation (something like that?) and had letters of recommendation from his supes. He was moving up the chain quickly prior to his setback.

My question - son thinks an honorable is a good thing BUT I FEAR WITH HONORABLE DISCHARGE THE NAVY CAN PULL HIM BACK INTO SERVICE? Am I right? Does anyone have info on this? Not that I don't trust the recruiter (I don't) but I need some facts to drill into my now college-going son....

As I understand it as long as he has an Admin Discharge (less than honorable) he is safe from being recalled? My thought is - keep the Admin until bush is out of office and we are out of Iran/Iraq/Afghanistan... Change it then if you want...

help?

[MadisonProgressive]

1. It's a TRAP - don't let him do it!

[TomInTib]

2. His status depends on type of enlistment.

If, indeed, he had not gotten an AD, would he still be active?

If not, what would be his current reserve status?

[peacebird]

3. he would still be active - he had a six year hitch for his training

Had only served 3 years.

So he would still be active if not for the AD


on edit - the fact the recruiter looked him up (same email since high school) I found very frightening....

[annabanana]

4. Sounds to me like they're looking

to get him back...

[TomInTib]

10. See what you can get in writing from the recruiter.

But they are looking for meat. Call his bluff and see if you can get something you can use later.

I would be worried that the Military would view his AD as a "suspension of service" and recall him the moment he made his request, even if that was 5 years down the line.

After 2 tours of combat in Vietnam, I got crosswise with the USN and was given a General Discharge. That GD never caused me a minute's problem.

But that was then, of course.

[SofaKingLiberal]

5. It sounds like a trap.

They wouldn't do anything for him, unless they were expecting something in return.

You can't trust those fuckers.

[peacebird]

6. that's what I thought, but he is more trusting than me so I need some info

web links.. Some sort of proof?

[uppityperson]

8. These guys may have some good info

Iraq Vets Against the War http://www.ivaw.net/
Veterans for Peace http://www.veteransforpeace.org/
http://www.teenpeace.org/
googlesearch "counter recruitment", here's one result http://www.campusaction.net/news/working_for_peace/Counter%20Recruitment/counter_recruitment_frontpage.htm
Good luck. (edited to add another link)

[peacebird]

17. thank you!

[flyarm]

7. your son needs to read this!

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/military/stories/MYSA040806.17A.retention_bump.12f4345e.html

Army faces a major officer shortage

Web Posted: 04/08/2006 12:00 AM CDT

snip:

The Army expects to be short 2,500 captains and majors this year, with the number rising to 3,300 in 2007. These officers are the Army's seed corn, the people who 10 years from now should be leading battalions and brigades.

"We're ruining an Army that took us 30 years to build," Republican maverick Sen. Chuck Hagel, R-Neb., told a group of reporters at a recent conference.



fly

[benddem]

9. Administrative and other

discharges can be upgraded to honorable (and should be) after a period of time...but I'd be suspicious of the intent now. The recruiter is looking to get points. BUT after * is impeached and the Democrats are firmly back in control...he should have that discharge upgraded.

[acmejack]

11. Here is a good source of info, but I can tell you now

that they can scarf him back up FOR SURE! See this or call the number and ask them! http://girights.objector.org/gettingout/discharges.html

[cynatnite]

12. Proceed with caution

Ask the recruiter these questions and get very detailed. Ask if the obligations to the military still holds if he accepts this. Also, find out if this must be done within a certain time frame. If not, then he can take it at a later time if he so chooses.

One thing to keep in mind that your son is experienced enough to know what he is doing. Any other kind of discharge other than honorable isn't good to have. Honorable is far more desirable when it comes to benefits.

I can see why this is so frightening to you. Express your concerns to him, but ultimately the choice will be his in how he proceeds.

Good luck to you and him both. :)

on edit: While some recruiters to exaggerate the truth, when it comes to the paperwork...that has to be in order. The devil is in the details and I would advise him to read it all with caution before signing anything.

[Neil Lisst]

13. it's definitely a trap. Once he gets the HD, he automatically goes into

the reserves, and they can call him back to active duty

If he were my boy, I'd say "don't do it." And I have sons in this age group, so I'm telling you my heart.

[puerco-bellies]

14. A discharge is just that.. A discharge.

It is better to have a honorable discharge then a less then honorable. He would be eligible for V.A. benefits with an honorable. He has been discharged, that means he is not subjected to active duty status.

Now the one thing I would watch is how long is his inactive reserve status? Has it expired?. If they are about to call in inactive reservist then they could be beating the bushes to bulk up the potential pool of re-inductees. If that was the case there would be a large number of similar cases like your son's. Unless they are calling back discharged personnel he is in no danger of being re-inducted, and as far as I know they only subjecting active duty personnel to "stop loss" service extensions.

[sarge43]

15. Question

Is that recruiter telling your son that the Navy needs his written approval or request in order to upgrade his discharge?

[peacebird]

18. yes - why?

[sarge43]

22. Because he can't be pulled back on active duty

until the discharge is upgraded and he must start the action.

First question to recruiter "If my discharge is upgraded to honorable, am I now eligible for active duty?" And get it in writing.

[peacebird]

23. brilliant. Thank you. I don't think I would trust the recruiter BUT if

my son has to request the change in status of the discharge in order for this to happen then he will NOT request it.

Momma still has SOME pull in the issue...!

[sarge43]

24. Recruiters have a bad rep, but

they're under terrible pressure. They have a monthly quota to fill. If they don't load the cattle cars two or more months in row, it is, as they say, reflected on their performance reports, ie report cards. Given the red in fang and claw promotion system, even one bad report can ruin their chance for promotion, yea onto the fourth generation.

If the recruiting climate sucks, they just about have to lie or at least not be forthcoming with the truth to survive. It's one of worst non-combat service jobs going; I'd rather wrangle the off loads from the cattle cars.

Yup, tell him wait. There's time.

[sarge43]

21. Answering my own question

According to the VA site, an individual has to request the upgrade. Further and again, according to VA, there is no difference in benefit eligibility between an honorable and a general. Apparently, it's court martial convictions which pull most, if not all, vet bennies.

In the 20 plus years since I retired from the AF, I've never been asked about type of discharge, just branch, rank and the dates of service. Practically speaking, your son can lead a successful life with a general discharge.

Thinking on it, it's pretty clear the five sided circus has run the list of general dischargees who would still have a service commitment and told the recruiters to find them and bs them. Just remind your son that recruiting stats have been circling the drain for close to a year now; the recruiter has other priorities way over and above your son's best interests.

Your son would like an honorable pour l'honour , but there is no honor in serving Bush's pernicious purposes. Tell him to wait until Smirky et al are a bad memory or his service commitment is up, then apply for upgrade.

[Berserker]

16. Strange

I have an other than HONORABLE DISCHARGE from the Navy and I have never received a letter like that. Although it's common knowledge that you can get it changed if you want to. I have never wanted to I am happy with what I have. I have never had the need to change it. Other than that whats the rush to have it changed? I have never been asked at a job interview for my DD214 or my discharge status. I will not apologize they can still kiss my ass.

[peacebird]

19. when did you get out? My fear is that they are desperate for meat

and will have him back in the "ready reserve" (I think that is what it is called) if he gets this discharge upgraded to honorable....

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

20. Sounds a bit like a scam so they can recall him to service. Suspicion is

appropriate.

Just tell him to get good grades.