Lou Dobbs is hurting America

[NNN0LHI]

http://www.dailytexanonline.com/media/storage/paper410/news/2006/04/05/Opinion/Lou-Dobbs.Is.Hurting.America-1783245.shtml?norewrite200604102139&sourcedomain=www.dailytexanonline.com

<snip>On Monday, Dobbs began his show, "Illegal aliens are already influencing our society. They may also be threatening the structure of our democracy."

Other show starters include: "Illegal aliens not only threaten our economy and security, but also our health and well-being. Many carry dangerous diseases, contagions, and the damage they cause to both our crops and public health cost this country billions each year." And "Tonight, our national parks are under siege from illegal aliens and drug smugglers."

Dobbs refuses to use the term illegal immigrant, because he feels "immigrant" reminds people of families and hard work. He prefers "illegal alien" and spends a lot of airtime on the "illegal alien invasion." snip

Dobbs constantly insists that "millions of aliens are crossing our borders." This is used to create fear among the American public that any moment now, an immigrant will fall out of the sky and snatch their job.

However according to the CATO Institute, a non-profit public policy research foundation, the rate of illegal immigration is agreed by experts to be about 250,000 to 300,000 per year. More than half of illegal immigrants enter legally and become illegal by overstaying their visas and permits, they say.

This paints a different picture than the same clip Dobbs uses on his show every night of a brown person hopping a fence in the desert.

[marmar]

1. Lou Dobbs has some race issues, methinks....

:scared:

[President Jesus]

2. perspective please

Just because you, I, and the others in this echo chamber watch Dobbs does not mean all of America is watching.

In fact, last week's ratings showed him to have 717,000 viewers (and this during his hottest week in years). That is not even one-tenth of what lowly CBS News gets, and only amounts to something like .5% of the Americans who voted in 2004.

The fact that anyone is even taling about Dobbs frankly tells him he's on the right path. His shtick is 'populism', and you can't be a populist if no one is talking about you.

The only way to end lunatic crusading journalism like his is to record all of his statements now, then when the issue cools down, remind the public (and the network) of his ridiculous remarks.

But really, he only 'hurts America' if people actually pay attention to him. And at .5% of voting adults, he's really not having the impact we think he is.

[OhioBlue]

3. well...

I don't know that I would trust figures from the CATO institute - aren't they a "think-tank" bent on pushing libertarian and corporate type propaganda?

[The Traveler]

11. I was just about to post that thought

If the Cato Institute sez it, doubt it. Basically a propaganda organ of the Ayn Rand crowd.

[ShaneGR]

4. Checks and balances..... Dobbs has every right

People who come to this country illegally, who don't pay taxes, who operate under the rader unless injured and end up in our federally insured healthcare programs, are a major problem for the economy, for our healthcare system, and for our judicial system. So Dobbs has every right to come out on the side of working United States Citizens who bear the burden of the problem through lowered wages and higher insurance costs. While I believe that there should be some sort of longterm beaurocratic solution involving the patriation of the illegals to a legal status, I have no problem with someone like Dobbs who at least puts the issue in the forefront. He's not following the recent trend of immigration stories, he has been talking about it for years. I support some form of an immigration bill, just not one that has anything to do with the Bush Administration.

And may I add, he's been consistently critical of the Bush Administration on labor issues for the last several years.

[montana500]

15. I agree

"People who come to this country illegally, who don't pay taxes, who operate under the rader unless injured and end up in our federally insured healthcare programs, are a major problem for the economy, for our healthcare system, and for our judicial system"



Thisis absolutely correct. Lets be perfectly honest with ourselves- overpopulation in the U.S. will reduce quality of life for *everyone*. And illegal aliens are the major reason for or population increases.

[lovuian]

25. Lou Dobbs is for the AMERICAN WORKER!!!

and the AMERICAN MIDDLE CLASS... his opposition to outsourcing is outstanding...

We love you Lou keep ponding at them over and over again...

He's destroyed Bush's chances to get the Dubais deal and now he's cause the Senate to rethink Amnesty

and he definitely is howling about outsourcing...

AMERICAN WORKERS want a decent wage to live here...

thats all their asking

people who opose LABOR and the worker are needing a reality check...

[Andromeda]

45. I'm glad somebody gets it!

Some people on this board don't understand that Lou Dobbs is trying to stick up for the middle-class American workers!

The main thing he's been talking about is the outsourcing of our jobs.

[Bill McBlueState]

63. your "workers" has too many qualifiers

I want leaders who stand up for all workers, regardless of class or nationality. Some gasbag TV host isn't going to do that.

[LosinIt]

56. Damn, thought you were going to come out with the Dan Ackroyd line

from Tommy Boy. I can't exactly remember it. "Cause that what he is and that's what he cares about."

[madokie]

57. Our son just started a new job yesterday, a job he is so happy to have

He starts at $10.25 and hour, hell I was making 10 bucks an hour back in '75. I just don't know how these young people can make ends meet. I was having a hard time way back when. I would litterly starve to death at that wage.

[magnolia]

58. He's critical of Bush regarding...

...immigration. But that's about it. He was very quick to defend Bush regarding the leak situation this past Sunday on the Chris Matthews show. He basically said that Libby was already a proven liar so he was probably lying about Bush and Cheney too. Why should we believe a liar.

I haven't bought into Bush's fear tactics. Which is why I don't see immigration as being a national security issue, anymore than the Dubai deal was a national security issue. Lou Dobbs just adds to the "lets be afraid of foreigners" crap. If he's so concerned about national security then he should look into our addiction to oil and global warming. Those are the real threats.

[Kutjara]

5. After a number of years living overseas...

...I recently returned to the US. One of the biggest shocks for me is that racist, xenophobic, chauvanist buffoons like Lou Dobbs can get national airplay on a channel as widely viewed as CNN. In Europe, CNN and Fox (or the Murdoch-owned Sky Network that is its international equivalent) are viewed as something of a joke. Good for the pretty pictures of smart bombs exploding; not so good for actually reporting what's going on. But they offer a level of commentary that, while right-biased, is still recognisable as news.

Dobbs is on an entirely different level. If I was in the same room as him, I'd be frightened. He seems unhinged to me. Recently, in the UK, there has been a lot of debate against the government's plans to make certain types of hate-speech illegal (anti-religious speech in particular). Typically, civil libertarians are worried about free-speech issues, while the left are concerned about creating a safe environment in which diversity can flourish. The right, predictably, just froth at the mouth and look angry and dangerous.

But there's nothing like Dobbs. He'd be considered a neo-Nazi in Britain.

What the hell has happened to my country?

[ShaneGR]

6. That's totally ridiculous, Dobbs a Neo-Nazi?

Why? Because his show has consistently been about protecting American workers rights? How can you compare Lou Dobbs to a Neo-Nazi?

[Kutjara]

9. Well...

...I may be wrong, based on the fact that I've only been watching him for the past month or so, but I consider his hysterical reaction to the Dubai ports deal and subsequent hysterical reaction to the Immigration issue to be excessively right-wing.

From the perspective of the rest of the world, we see the US talking alot about 'globalisation' and the importance of labor and capital mobility. Yet, when other countries jump on the band wagon and ask America to walk the walk, they're met with protectionism and a level of paranoia ill-befitting a country with the wealth and power of the United States.

To me, Dobbs typifies this view. If American wants to protect its workers, then kindly stop using the WTO and World Bank to force other countries to abandon theirs. If America's borders are sacrosanct, kindly honor other country's borders.

While its noble and laudible to protect American workers, Dobbs hyprocacy strikes me as disingenuous.

So yes, a lot of Europeans would consider him a neo-Nazi. Or at least a fascist.

[havocmom]

14. Dobbs has LONG argued against illegal EMPLOYERS

who exploit illegal immigrants, pay poor wages, driving down wages for workers in general, avoiding things like payroll taxes and workers comp. He has continually come to the defense of workers, not just white guys.

Fascists are those who unite government and corporations while oppressing workers/citizens. That does NOT describe Lou Dobbs. He harps daily about illegal EMPLOYERS and how they hurt the nation.

He is pretty ornery about the issue of corporate greed and the shrinking worker paycheck. He knows America does better when the working people earn a decent income, can pay taxes and make purchases. He knows the people who want cheap, powerless labor (illegal immigrants) are creating many social and economic problems. It is them he is really after. He asks often about enforcing the laws the illegal employers are breaking.

[ShaneGR]

16. I find that to be a short-sighted foreign view....

Every day in America you can turn on the television and catch the people from the Fox Network, trumpeting whatever right-wing line they found that day. Dobbs on the other didn't have a "hysterical" reaction to the Dubai Ports deal (Why would my country need to hire a middle-eastern country to defend its ports instead of American workers???) to the current immigration bill. DOBBS HAS BEEN TALKING LABOR ISSUES SINCE HE FIRST WENT ON THE AIR YEARS AGO.

You talk about the US not honoring agreements abroad with the WTO, World Bank, etc. That's a fair criticism. But the fact remains that the US has had an import/export DEFICIT (Meaning we important more goods from other countries labor force than we do our own)........... for decades. That, bottom line, means that more and more Americans earn less and less money for the goods they produce. That means the steady erosion of our middle class which increases the divide between the rich and the poor, and thereby their education levels, and just happens to contribute to the ease by which a crazy Rebublican can trick the most powerful country in the world into the mess we currently find ourselves in.

The United States to date has spent more than all of the other countries in the world combined on foreign aid over the last century. But people compare some guy talking about our immigration problem to a NEO-Nazi. I'm sorry, but my country has also accepted the immigration of individuals (legally and documented) of more immigrants than the rest of the world combined too.

Bush is terrible, but don't compare Lou Dobbs to a Fascist or a Neo-Nazi, it's ridiculous. It's a legitimate debate that needs to be ironed out in this country.

[Kutjara]

23. Understood.

I take your comments entirely. As I said, I've only had a relatively short time to see him in action. I will retract my comments until I have a better understanding of the man and his views over a longer time period.

I do, however, think the ports deal debacle was an overreaction. I feel that the US places undue emphasis on the "foreignness" of companies when making decisions about whether they should grant them access to strategically important facilities. After all, before the ports were sold to the Dubai company, they were run by Brits. Nobody made a peep about that.

Secondly, companies like Microsoft, HP, Oracle run a large part of the world's strategic infrastructure. Should other countries be worried that a 'rogue state' like the US is running large portions of their strategic industries?

The knife cuts both ways. If America really doesn't want foreign companies involved in its key industries, then perhaps other countries should insist that the US is not involved in theirs. Now, to be clear, I don't think they should take this view. Neither do I think we should.

The Dubai ports company has an excellent safety record. It's takeover of P&O will bring state of the art security and cargo management technology to a formerly moribund company. Considering that Dubai Ports World runs a significant number of foreign ports that ship goods to the US, and considering that US Customs only scans about 5% of containers it receives, it is arguable that Dubai Ports World has been providing US port security for some time now.

That apart, I am happy to concede that Dobbs is a righteous fighter for the rights of the worker.

[ShaneGR]

27. I think overall it's just important to remember Immigration is GIGANTIC

For Americans. Huge. And always has been. We are the immigration nation. A great melting pot. And just because some American TV personality happens to be opposed to the Dubai ports deal or illegal immigrants in general doesn't make them a Nazi. The Nazis were responsible for the death of well over 20 million people. Dobbs is just talking labor issues. :-)

As for the Dubai ports deal, you say the British were in charge of that beforehand, well personally I oppose that too. These are US ports, no foreign companies should be protecting them. They should be operated by American companies. It's a security issue, just 1 cargo container could contain a nuclear bomb. And I'll feel much better about it if it was American's watching those containers. If 1 of those bombs gets through (nuclear, chemical, teaspoon of sarin, etc etc) at least my country was responsible for it and not some British or Middle Eastern Firm. And if one doesn't, at least an American got paid to protect his own country. That's my personal take.

[Kutjara]

29. Fair points

And the immigration issue is huge in Europe too; it is driving people to vote for far-right parties and put neo-nazis in power (I was careful to say neo-nazis rather than the real thing; the neo's have a slightly different agenda - at the moment- from the capital 'N' ones). That is the background underlying my classification of Dobbs. He sounds just like the anti-immigration, protectionist, fearmongers on Murdoch's Euro-channels. From a European perspective, views similar to his serve to inflame an already inflamed issue, and to give ammunition to far-right groups.

In a wider context, the mass migration of people we're currently seeing around the world has been largely caused by the enormous imbalances in wealth between the US/Europe and the rest of the world. But its not just confined there. I was working in China recently and one of the customs officers told me that his biggest problem was heading off illegal immigrants from Southeast Asia. China gets millions a year, too.

The only way to fix the immigration problem is to change the trade policies that have caused it in the first place. As long as tariff barriers mean that, for example, African countries can't sell finished cloth in America, but American companies can dump their products in Africa, there will be an enormous wealth imbalance. That will motivate people to migrate to where their money has gone. And they tend to get resentful when the very countries that have rigged the deck against them, now deny them even a small share of the riches their labor has produced.

Halting mass immigration isn't easy, but building walls isn't the answer. We have to make it attractive for people to stay at home. And we need to do this quickly, before environmental pressures and declining fresh water supplies add to the reasons people need to migrate.

[ShaneGR]

35. Well, I don't think anyone is asking to build a wall...

And I actually know for a fact we'll never build one. That's the thing, our border is crap. Anyone on this earth if they knew where the checkpoints were could get into the US. And that doesn't even include the people who come into the country legally via visa but stay illegally past their visa time period.

The eventual issue is how to patriate the illegals who have been in the US for "x" amount of years, and cutoff those who aren't coming in legally in the future. Basically you satisfy the longtime illegals who may have established roots in their communites, and prevent a further rush of undocumented illegals. Hard to do. And everlasting.

As for China, which owns a huge portion of my countries debt and is poised to rule the world economically for the next one or two centuries, I'm sorry that they're importing millions of workers to meet the demand of cheap labor necessary to supply the US and the rest of the world with cheap goods.... and outpricing the rest of the world not just the US... that's their problem.

Since this is my last post on the this for now, I'd like to point out. There's all kinds of criticism of US Labor positions, but the real question is what will happen if the US economy completely collapses Russian 1990s syle. Real poverty overall in America. A great depression. Eventually if we continue down the current path, it's going to happen. So where are the real solutions for world prosperity? As of now all I'm seeing is bickering, hatred, and misunderstanding. Doesn't make me feel too could for the year 2026. I'll be 50 years old then, ready to enjoy the prime of my life. Hopefully people will stop acting like asshats before then.

[Kutjara]

36. Someone's just posted an article...

...that I think has a bearing on our discussion:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x202944

We can't view the immigration issue in isolation. It is part of a much large global trend that requires international cooperation to manage.

By 2026, a significant proportion of the US will be retired (I'll be an ornery 64 year old myself) and, if projections are to be believed, the working population will be insufficient to support the Social Security system. Since many Americans will have made insufficient provision for retirement, SS may be the only income they have.

Secondly, by 2026, the effects of climate change will be obvious to all but the most blinkered. While the effects are unpredictable, it could be that rising temperatures and increased equatorial aridity will lead to a flight from the tropics that will make today's immigration problems a seem an elysian memory of happier times.

I agree that the effects of an economic collapse in the US would be catastrophic. Not just for US but, because of the US$'s position as the world's reserve currency, for the rest of the world as well. It would be a global depression.

Interestingly, my view of China's anticipated dominance has changed in the past couple of years. It's current rapid economic expansion is based on fradulent accounting and the complicity of the global banking system. I predict that the Chinese economy will collapse within the next ten years. In the long term, it may well become an economic powerhouse, but not before it makes some painful reforms.

And I'm not sure China is importing "cheap" labor, as you say. They have plenty of their own. That's why Taiwan is outsourcing much of its electronics component fabrication to the Pearl River delta, where labor is dirt cheap. No, the immigrants are trying to get in, but China is trying to keep them out.

To conclude, I don't think the future is going to be anything like we think it is. The human race is notoriously bad at extrapolating even five years ahead, let alone 20. The current immigration 'crisis' will not make or break America. There are much bigger problems down the road. We should view the current problem as a gentle introduction to the law of unintended consequences.

Anyway, you've probably gone off to do other things by now, so let me close by saying that I've enjoyed debating with you immensely and hope to do so again!

[BooScout]

51. Don't retract your comments....

They are dead on accurate. I watched Dobbs for a long time and am of a firm belief that he suffers from Xenophobia. Most poeple don't listen hard enough or comprehend what his message actually is.

As to another poster's comment that yours is a 'foreign view'......my view is that of an American fed up with Xenophobes like Dobbs (and before they come to accuse me of having a foreign view after seeing my location (the UK).......I just moved here last fall. My view is home grown American, just different from theirs.

[Brigid]

39. Question . . .

What kind of immigration laws are on the books in the countries you've spent time in?

[Kutjara]

41. Europe

I've predominantly lived in Europe, the immigration policy of which is increasingly defined collectively by the European Union.

While the EU's approach to immigration is broadly similar to the US, Europe is facing a special issue of its own. As it adds more countries from the former Soviet Bloc, the citizens of those countries automatically get the right to work anywhere in Europe. No visa necessary. Legally, it isn't even an immigration issue. These are EU citizens exercising their rights to work in the EU.

The source of conflict, however, is that the new countries have significantly lower wages and living costs than the more developed nations of the EU so, for example, a worker from Estonia will happily accept 20% of the wages of a UK worker for the same job.

Additional pressures come from the countries bordering the new EU members. People on the borders in Belarus or the Ukraine are now separated from their former neighbors across a border of motion sensors and surveillance cameras. Naturally, they feel unfairly excluded from the Euro gravy train. A flood of migrants from North Africa and the Middle East come through Turkey and the Medeterranean ports of France and Spain. Their labor in the European agricultural industry is key to its economic viability.

So every European state has lots of lovely "detention centers," just like here. And the Europeans are going through the same soul-searching as we are. On the one hand, a strong liberal tradition in countries like Holland, Denmark and the UK feels that we should be welcoming. On the other, the French and Germans treat their "guest workers" like crap. Perhaps that's why Europeans are more sensitive to inflammatory rhetoric like Lou Dobbs'. Memories of the 1930s and 40s are still fresh enough to ignite concerns of racist policies. The issue is a powderkeg and it won't take much more than a spark to ignite it.

[Brigid]

43. 20%?

Doesn't the EU have minimum wage laws?

[Kutjara]

44. Yes they do, but...

...that only really helps the unskilled. Let me give an example.

A skilled UK construction worker will earn, perhaps, $50k per year, which bumps up to $85k with completion bonuses (this is an all-in figure, including company contributions to the State pension and National Health Service). A similarly-skilled Latvian would do the same work to the same standard for $17k per year. If they get it in cash and cruise under the tax-radar, they'll do it for less.

So they're still getting the minimum wage (currently about $8/hour), but undercutting domestic workers by a massive margin.

That $17k per year will allow the Latvian worker to live very well indeed back home. Many Eastern Europeans will work in the UK, Germany and Spain for six months and then return home for six months to live on the proceeds of their labor. Of course, much of this is fuelled by the bouyancy of the property market in these countries. Construction jobs are easy to get almost anywhere. When the bubble bursts, it will be a big problem for the economies of the former Soviet Bloc.

[Andromeda]

46. How can you say that?

Lou Dobbs is no neo-nazi or racist.

He's simply a man who is verbalizing the fears of the average working American whose wages are stagnant; whose health-care costs have risen dramatically; whose dreams of getting ahead and living the American dream has vanished.

Dobbs is just saying what some people don't want to hear. He's not against anybody, but he is FOR people who play by the rules and work hard.

[BlueEyedSon]

7. so almost 1000 illegal immigrants PER DAY is not a problem?

let's import chip designers and doctors, ok?

[CatWoman]

8. *snarf*

:D

[Berserker]

21. I agree 100%

One poster told me today that I should give up my job to and Illegal and not wallow in pity over losing it. This is the first time in over two years on DU I have disagreed so strongly with other members.

[Cobalt Violet]

22. I think we need lots more doctors , dentist ,and lawyers.

To drive their wages down to about $6.00 hr. :sarcasm:

[BlueEyedSon]

38. your heathcare would be cheaper

see how immigration benefits employers (i.e. YOU)

no sarcasm

[Cobalt Violet]

53. Cheaper is better than no existant.

I can't help it good the jobs that had insurance have been outsource or insourced. What did any doctor, dentist or lawyer do about it.

[Andromeda]

48. Yeah, you'd get great healthcare...

at $6.00 hr.

[Cobalt Violet]

52. Better than nothing I get now .

[TomInTib]

10. I don't mind him banging the drum. This is killing the 'pubs...

Nothing (major) is going to happen outside of the status quo.

I know quite a few Mexicans on both sides of the issue and one thing is certain - if this stays on the table, the GOP will be screwed for decades to come. The Hispanics are totally galvanized and unified.

If one needs any proof, just consider the events of today.

500,000 in the streets of Dallas? Nothing has ever happened like that in Texas before. Nothing.

[alcuno]

13. Lou has been ranting about border security for years now.

I think he could live with amnesty if he thought that the government was doing ANYTHING to control the borders. I refuse to get on Lou's case about this. He was one of those hammering the administration over the Dubai Ports deal and he constantly hammers them over the destruction of the middle class.

[TomInTib]

19. Whew!

So there is someone here without an agenda?

Thanks for the reply.

It is what it is and it is not going away. I have been around this issue all of my life and we are sleeping in the very bed we made.

When the Hispanic vote is finally stimulated and activated, the collective adversarial poltical party will be doomed for the next 50 years.

If Dobbs is the one who paints the GOP into that fatal corner, I will forever worship at the Shrine of Lou.

[mitchtv]

31. Bwahahahahaha

Shrine of Lou.
:headbang:
one for Pete Wilson too!
>>>...."doomed to repeat(history)"

[alcuno]

34. By "someone," do you mean me?

I'm a huge fan of his. I especially like any sentence he begins with the words, "What in the world is going on with.........?" The man is a national treasure because you just know that he's totally pro-business, but he can't take it anymore; he clearly thinks this administration is nuts.

[TomInTib]

59. That "someone" is, indeed, you.

I am consistently amazed at the negative stance so many here take on Dobbs.

I believe that stance is largely due to a lack of real-world experience.

And it has been quite interesting to watch the scales fall from Lou's eyes.

I will support all the noise he can generate on this issue. He gets mention in MSM for his hell-raising and that just focuses right back on the GOP.

[Andromeda]

49. LOL...

metaphorically speaking, I,too, worship at the Shrine of Lou.

[BlueEyedSon]

12. CHEAP-LABOR CONSERVATIVES are hurting America. nt

[havocmom]

18. And illegal EMPLOYERS avoid payroll taxes and workers comp

They often cut corners on safety rules and too many of their exploited illegal immigrant workers are hurt because of it.

Illegal EMPLOYERS put greed ahead of paying decent wages, payroll taxes and contributing to funds to insure workers who are hurt doing their jobs. They basically are making all workers, legal and otherwise, support their lifestyle.

Depressing wages also means less total taxes paid by workers making decent money. It all adds up and hurts America.

[Swamp Rat]

17. ¡Bésamelo Lou Dobbs!

Jus' keep yo' whitebread ass outta my town, unless you want to be offended every 5 seconds by all the different colored people speaking other languages. Enculeur de porcs! :eyes:

[ShaneGR]

20. Dobbs has never, ever, mentioned race....

He talks about nationality. if you're an American worker (White, Black, Hispanic, Asian) he has consistently backed your rights. If you're an illegal Mexican, Canadian, Chinese, Australian, South African, English, French, German, Pakistani, Iraqi, Iranian, Israeli, Palestinian, etc etc etc NOT AMMERICAN etc who entered the country illegally than you're probably not going to like Dobbs views. That's fine. But he is not a racist. He has consistently for years now supported American labor, which by the way has been pretty much the #1 consistent supporter via large amounts of money to the Democratic Party. He's not a corporate shill. He's not a racist. He does however invite the wrath of many a partisan overreaction. Both sides.

[Swamp Rat]

26. Lou, is that you?

You seem to know him so well.

[ShaneGR]

28. Ya, I've watched him at least 4 or 5 times a week for about 3 years now...

Have you?

[Swamp Rat]

37. HAHAHAHA!!! Is this a pissing match?!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[fujiyama]

24. Dobbs does a service

when disacussing the practices of cheap labor conservatives and the poor border security.

However, he seems to have become obsessed with this "invasion" concept, and the hysteria is borderline xenophobic. He's not making it clear enough that poor people will do everything they can to escape poverty, including sneaking into a neighboring country where living standards (even at the very bottom) are higher than those back home. It is near the point where he's blaming the illegal immigrants themselves, rather than the conditions that created the demand for them in the first place.

[Deja Q]

30. I disagree with the disease part.

People come here, legally or otherwise, from all over the world.

Chances are inevitable, regardless.

Any one of us can die at any time.

For economic issues, however, he is correct. It's about exploitation and maltreatment of workers.

[Telly Savalas]

32. While I agree with your general premise...

the CATO institute are a bunch of right-wing "libertarian" freaks. I'd try to find a better source to corroborate your facts, but I'm feelin' kind of lazy right now.

[Strelnikov_]

33. The Iron Law Of Wages

The Iron Law of Wages was an alleged law of economics that asserted that wages can never rise above the minimum level that will enable the laborer to survive. The alleged law was named and popularized by the German socialist Ferdinand Lassalle in the mid 1800's.

According to Lassalle, wages cannot fall below subsistence level because without subsistence laborers will be unable to work for long. However, competition between laborers for employment will drive wages down to this minimal level.

During the mid-1800's, when Lasalle articulated his theory, wages for both manufacturing laborers and agricultural workers were in large part quite close to subsistence level.

So much for the reality based community.

The Corporatists are smiling.

[EFerrari]

40. I don't understand how you can tolerate him long enough

to retrieve his message.

You're a better man than I am. :)

[leftstreet]

42. Lou Dobbs asks questions that are hard to answer

Er...hard for politicians and corporate apologists to answer anyway.

They're the same questions I'd like to see answered. I've only watched him a couple of times, but his transcripts indicate he's all about Border Security.

So...

Who will protect undocumented workers from the millions more waiting to come here and compete for THEIR jobs?

Will La Raza, the Catholic church, and latino radio/television mobilize the amnestied workers back out into the streets for immigration reform that protects THEIR jobs?

Will Bill Gates go BACK to DC and ask for a cap on H1B visas so that his newly hired cheap techie workers won't have to compete for THEIR jobs and wages?

I don't think so.

The Corporation is winning.

[Andromeda]

47. I've heard Lou Dobbs use the term...

"illegal immigrant" many, many times.

Maybe if you listened to ALL he has to say instead of cherry-picking all the stuff you don't like, you might get an accurate picture of what he actually is saying.

[nonconformist]

50. What are you talking about?

He uses the term "illegal immigrant" all the time.

[Bassic]

54. Dude, the structure of you democracy has already been destroyed

and disposed of by rich white men. Not by immigrants.

[Vinca]

55. Lou Dobbs is a small island of sanity in all of this.

He doesn't want to ship 12 million illegals back across the border, but he doesn't think they should immediately become naturalized. I agree. They broke the law by entering the country improperly and that shouldn't be rewarded. Thousands and thousands of people, following legal channels, are waiting to immigrate to America and it's not fair by any stretch of the imagination to wave a magic wand over the 12 million who didn't stand in line. Lou thinks the first thing that should happen is that borders should be secured. How can you disagree with that?

[NNN0LHI]

60. So Dobbs talking about them "diseased" immigrants is just fine with you?

Is that right?

Don

[watercolors]

61. Lou Dobbs is doing a great service

for this country. I admire his sticking to his guns about the problem. I think he he great and we agree with him most of the time, it does not make us traitors to our party, I do not care how he votes. I care about someone being honest about whAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR COUNTRY!

[Bill McBlueState]

62. *these,* my friends, are illegal aliens