More BS on Valerie Wilson - Anyone heard THIS one?

[Sugarcoated]

A Bushbot I cross cyber-paths with dug up this ditty from the RW Washington Times to argue Wilson wasn't actually covert. I hadn't heard this. Does anyone know of it? (nasty comment left in at the end to convey her desperation):
,,,,,,,,,,
Bill Gertz of the WT has asserted that "Mrs Plame's identity as an undercover CIA officer was first disclosed to Russia in the mid-1990's by a Moscow spy,...The article goes on to say that the Cuban government learned of Plame's CIA status 'in confidential documents sent by the CIA to the U.S. Interests Section of the Swiss Embassy in Havana....This information was used in a court briefing filed on behalf of several news agencies seeking to prevent Judith Miller and Matt Cooper from going to jail for not disclosing their sources to Patrick Fitzgerald..."

Oh and BTW, those who willfully cooperate with our enemies in disrespectfully calling the President of the United States a traitor, especially during time of war, are themselves the real traitors.
,,,,,,,,,,

[Sydnie]

1. Tell them to show you their source for this info

Where is their proof? What documents do they have to back up such a claim. Them quote poppy and his statements on the outing of a CIA agent back to them.

[C_U_L8R]

2. Then WHY was this CRIMINAL investigation

initiated BY the CIA ?????
I believe they are the ONLY one who know for sure...
and they seem to think it's JUSTFIED.
Your Bushbot and Bill Gertz .. they don't know squat..
(and I'd go so far as to say THEY are obstructing justice as well)
Outing an active agent is TREASON. Period.

[caledesi]

9. Exactly! Why a special prosecutor, money and time devoted to this? nt

[Beelzebud]

3. If she wasn't covert then why did the CIA REQUEST the investigation?

[unblock]

4. the argument is she wasn't covert, then she shows evidence that she WAS?

i guess the bushbot thinks that telling something to russia or cuba is how information is declassified?

does it not compute that russia and cuba might know and the information is STILL classified?

duhhhhh.

[rpannier]

5. Just out of curiosity

How do you respectfully call someone a traitor?

[Sugarcoated]

6. Her source was the Washington Times.

Wasn't that David Brock's first job when he came to Washington as a journalist? If I remember correctly the place was a joke it was so partisan. They would actually harass good journalists doing their job until they quit.

[madeline_con]

7. I love the way DUH-bya is a sacred cow who

can't be criticized "in a time of war". :puke:

[Canuckistanian]

8. An old, but false argument - for several reasons

First, the CIA said she was. AND she met the conditions for being officially covert, having worked in the last 5 years overseas on a mission. Further, she was a NOC (Non-Official Cover), which means that the governmnent would deny any knowlege of her if caught (just like Mission Impossible!)

Second, the CIA STARTED this investigation by demanding an inquiry. Finding that the case had merit, the case was referred to the Justice Dept. If she wasn't covert, the show ends right there.

Third, (and this is a no-brainer), what do you think the first question would be that Fitzgerald would ask? Was Valerie really a covert agent?. If the answer was negative, the criminal investigation stops there. Case closed.

So, the crime was confirmed and not in any way ambiguous.

[Sugarcoated]

12. Greatly put.

I wish I could say it as well.

[Canuckistanian]

15. Thanks

Wish I could have included the links to the stories, but I get royally pissed off by these attempts to deny obvious truths.

Let your detractors prove their stories. Odds are they can't.

[Sugarcoated]

17. I'm the same wayI

That's why I ran immediately to my DU big bros and sisters to protect me! :kick:

And the more I re-read her post, the lamer it is. It proves in no way that she wasn't covert.

[Canuckistanian]

18. We'll take care of you

There are people here who LIVE for their own little specialties. I just pay attention.

And being "covert" vs. "having your cover blown" is not a matter of opinion.

[Lorax]

31. Love that rebuttal

Do you mind posting sources for that? (About the NOC part, the other stuff is obvious.) Now I have a rebuttal for the next time the Bushbots in my family go down this road.

[caledesi]

10. SC - can I use your pic of Russ? Love it! NT

[Sugarcoated]

13. caledesi

Go for it! Though I love my husband dearly (he's a Russ kind of guy, actually) I think I have a bit of a crush on Russ. :loveya:

[Sugarcoated]

16. Liberal guys are hot.

That's the truth.

[caledesi]

22. Mee too. (don't tell my husband) LOL! NT

[Karmakaze]

11. Ok then lets use this argument for the...

Sibel Edmunds documents that were retroactively classified? They were public until the government decided to classify them, so because a lot of people know what they said, then they arent really classifed and the media can print them for all to see, right?

In fact what about all the info that was on public websites before 9/11 that was retroactively classifed and pulled off the web? That stuff can't be really classified either so we should be allowed to see them, right?

Or is it that the classified status of information has nothing to do with whether it was ever leaked, and thus claiming it was leaked before does not change its classified status?

[pinniped]

14. I have seen that BS posted on a gun-nut site.

Wilson wasn't actually covert

Also:

- this is all made up BS
- yawn
- let's move on
- she exposed herself

Those people are a bunch of sad cases.

* could rip off their heads and shit down their necks and all the while they would beg for more.

[0007]

19. Anything that comes out of the Washington Times is pure crap

The RW has been saying that for a long time now that Valarie Plame wasn't covert. Nothing new! Nothing to get excited about for sure.

[bluestateguy]

20. This strikes me as, um, well, false!

nt

[Disturbed]

21. She was covert but let's pretend that she was not.

The Operation Brewster Jennings, which Valrie Plame, not Wilson, was the CEO of, was a front company investigating WMD proliferation. This covert operation was exposed by the Bush Regime. I call that TREASON!

[Roland99]

23. Bill Gertz is 100% MORAN!

'nuff said.

[Sugarcoated]

24. Here's one response I got to my defense of Wilson's covert status:

I stated the facts, with all of your input. This intelligent response:


"blah blah blah, waah waah waah

it's always the same thing with you people - get a life already"


LOL, I guess it was pretty ironclad.

:+ :+ :+ :rofl: :+ :+ :+

[Iblis]

35. Why is this always the reply? Sad.

My mother is the same way.

"Why do you always have to argue with me using all of these facts?"

"Oh you and your facts and proof." *sigh*

Just once, I'd like to hear: "Is that so? I never thought about that. Hmm. Okay, you certainly have a point there. I'll think about it."

Oh well.

L

[H2O Man]

25. Who cares?

It doesn't matter what they think or say.

[Sugarcoated]

28. In one sense, no, I could care less.

And I went most of my life not caring, ignoring them, snickering under my breath thinking noone in their right mind would believe stuff like that. But I've come to the realization that when a lie goes uncontested, some believe it. It becomes truth - "The Big Lie". Even on the internet, if I see someone blantently putting out RW propoganda I stand up and set em straight. If nothing else, then for people who don't know much about politics, to get them to think. People lurk, young people. Some people just raised in RW bigoted households and deep down inside have some doubt about what is told to them but they don't know whare to start to find what's really going on.

[H2O Man]

32. Yet you repeat lies

without taking the 15 seconds needed to expose it as nonsense.

See: Newsweek (Feb 13, 2006) "The CIA Leak: Plame Was Still Covert," by Michael Isikoff.

[Sugarcoated]

33. I don't see it that way H2O Man

I needed some help with people who knew more about it. I knew it was probably a red herring, or even an outright lie - we all know that - I wasn't presenting it as a fact.

[Imagevision]

36. exactly H20, It truly doesn't matter what they think!

[Sugarcoated]

37. It doesn't. It's what the people standing around hearing them think.

A lie uncountered becomes a truth. You can't back down with these people - it's how they get away with so much misinformation & propoganda. At least that's how I see it.

[H2O Man]

39. Yep.

We can expect numerous pathetic attempts to create doubt. For lies are the devil's tongue, and confusion is his language.

[Beaverhausen]

26. Everyone on Fox News reports this daily

well, I don't watch Fox daily but it seems they are convinced that she wasn't covert. Or they just don't care.

[napi21]

27. I believe it's in the Fitz documents.

If I remember correctly, the CIA filed for the original investigation for that very reason.

[stop the bleeding]

29. 2X I believe that Fitz has stated in filings that Wilson was indeed

covert.

RW'ers never read anything more than fiction

[0rganism]

30. Don't push the Plame covert point, instead get them to agree on principle

The remaining bushbots are likely to be immune to facts at this time. Instead get them to agree with you on these hypothetical points:

1) If an American outs a covert CIA operative to the detriment of American intelligence operations, that person has committed grievous crimes against his/her country.

2) If an American violates the American federal laws concerning disclosure of classified information, that person has broken the law and potentially jeopardized national security of his/her own country by doing so.

When you can settle on these two issues, then you've essentially won the argument even if you continue to disagree about the facts as to whether some other foreign intelligence agencies had compromised Plame's cover.

[RB TexLa]

34. I thought she had her own last name?

If she uses one name kind of insulting to refer to her by a different name.

[Generator]

38. That's all they ever fucking do

And now after 30 minutes and my blood pressure up-I must get away from DU-

They shoot you and argue that when they shot you, you were already dead.

That's about the level of their logic and accontablity. By arguing this point over and over (which is pointless-if she wasn't covert there would be no case-like if it wasn't raining there would be no umbrella-these people are driving me insane) all they are really saying is, "YEAH we outed her and yeah we did this nasty shit-BUT now we will find a way to make it seem like it didn't matter anyway." But if it didn't matter if she was COVERT then what was the point?? AH HA-got them. (okay some in the Russian government might have known at one time years ago she was covert so she's no longer covert and we outed her but we didn't really out her) YEP, whatever you say, anything to absolve the truth. Anything.

They are telling you they broke the law and finding a retroactive way to make it okay. These people and their defenders have no, none, zero morality. That's what's wrong with this country. There is no ablity to tell the difference between right and wrong. Semantics is all this country is becoming.