AK-47 inventor: U.S. troops in Iraq prefer my rifle to theirs

[NNN0LHI]

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/706780.html

Mikhail Kalashnikov, designer of the world's most popular assault rifle, says that U.S. soldiers in Iraq are using his invention in preference to their own weapons, proving that his gun is still the best.

"Even after lying in a swamp you can pick up this rifle, aim it and shoot. That's the best job description there is for a gun. Real soldiers know that and understand it," the 86-year-old gunmaker told a weekend news conference in Moscow.

"In Vietnam, American soldiers threw away their M-16 rifles and used {Kalashnikov} AK-47s from dead Vietnamese soldiers, with bullets they captured. That was because the climate is different to America, where M-16s may work properly," he said.

"Look what's happening now: every day on television we see that the Americans in Iraq have my machine guns and assault rifles in their armored vehicles. Even there American rifles don't work properly."

Some U.S. troops in Iraq have reportedly taken to using AK-47s in preference to the standard-issue M-16.

[NewJeffCT]

1. it's been over 30 years since Vietnam

You'd think they would have come up with a way to solve the shortcomings of the M-16 in that length of time... but, I guess not.

Supposedly, they are coming out with a new standard issue gun for the army within a few years... so, maybe they are just waiting for that?

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

30. It's more fun to spend megabillions on hi tech fighters and subs to

maintain supremacy over all our rivals in the air and under the sea :sarcasm: than to invest in some low tech pimple faced 19 year old gladiator from Georgia.

[leftchick]

2. so what is the US taxpayer arming the Iraqi army with?

anyone know what this is?



or these?....

[Renew Deal]

7. Here's a picture of the AK and US soldier using it.

And another picture.



And another

[Coexist]

3. anyone here see "Lord of War"?

the opening sequence was an homage to this firearm.

[atreides1]

4. It's a good weapon

It's simple and easy to maintain, and you can use the NATO 7.62mm round too.

[Jackpine Radical]

24. No, not the NATO round.

The AK round is shorter.

[Solo_in_MD]

26. Nonsense

A 7.62 NATO round will not chamber in and AK-47

[Rex]

5. It doesn't give you away, sounds like the insurgents weapon

and not an M-4 or M-16. I got out after they released the M-4, although I did like the M-249 and saw (haha) it as an improvement to the M-60.

[Neil Lisst]

6. he's right, it is better

I've always loved the sound it makes.

[Jackpine Radical]

25. That sound freaks me out.

Probly because of the AK holes I collected in my carcass one night.

[bmbmd]

8. You go to war

with the rifle you have, not the rifle you wish you had.

[Buns_of_Fire]

9. The secret is in the tolerances...

...or, perhaps more accurately, the lack thereof.

...Kalashnikov broke with conventional wisdom and designed the AK-47 with loose or even 'sloppy' tolerances, limiting metal-to-metal contact and the need for lubricants that could gel and freeze.

http://kalashnikov.guns.ru/wwwboard/board4/messages/2181.html

[Toots]

13. Plus everything on the inside is stainless steel not blued steel like ours

Try cleaning carbon off stainless compared to blued metal. That is the main difference..

[a conservative]

27. Not

umm, no, the AK is NOT stainless.

[Bandit]

31. Yes it is

Everything inside is stainless. all the operating mechanisms are stainless. The bolt, the bolt carriage, the chamber, the barrel, the gas chamber and the buffer are all stainless. I carried the damn thing for many many months..

[Ebaum]

34. It's not stainless steel, it's just steel... that's why they are painted,

so that they don't rust... The inside of the barrel is cromed...

[Mr. Nobody]

38. um. No they. are not.

While I'm sure some AK's have stainless bolts and bolt carriers most do not. The only part of mine that is stainless is the gas piston.

It's not uncommon for guns to have bare steel bolts. I have a couple of Mausers that like that. But they are not stainless.

[tabasco]

42. Go get an M-16, conservative.

www.goarmy.com

Taking recruits up to 42 years of age now.

Prior service welcome.

Maybe you have to stay here with Rush and fight the culture war. :rofl:

Coward.

[Submariner]

10. I think it was the M-14 or M-16 in the early days of Viet Nam

jammed easily when it got wet or got wet in combination with silts from the rain forest muds. If I recall correctly, the manufacturer took his damn time making the fix, meanwhile our troops in country were being killed or wounded because their firearm, their life support instrument, FAILED at the worst possible moment. If a ground-pounder Nam veteran wanders by this thread I'm sure he will know a heck of a lot more about the jamming M-14/M16?

I believe this was one of those incidents of a prototype being pushed out in the field before adequate testing in all intended use conditions. More rethug profit motive incentive rather than looking out for the country's best interest.

[Spider Jerusalem]

11. The M-16A1...

1965 - 1967. Field reports from Vietnam began to look much more pessimistic. M16 rifles, issued to US troops in Vietnam, severely jammed in combat, resulting in numerous casualties. There were several causes for the malfunctions. First of all, during the introduction of the new rifle and its ammunition into service, the US Army replaced the originally specified Dupont IMR powder with standard ball powder, used in 7.62x51mm NATO ammunition. The ball powder produced much more fouling, that quickly jammed the actions of the M16 unless the gun was cleaned well and often. This combined poorly with the fact that the initial M16 rifles were touted by Colt as "low maintenance", so, for the sake of economy, no cleaning supplies were procured for new M16 rifles, and no weapon care training was conducted for the troops. As a result, soldiers did not know how to clean their rifles, and had no provisions for doing so. To make matters worse, the ball powder also had a different pressure curve, so it produced higher pressures at the gas port, increasing the rate of fire, and, thus, decreasing accuracy and accelerating parts wear.

(source: http://world.guns.ru/assault/as18-e.htm , moderately edited because the original author is obviously not a native English speaker )

[Submariner]

18. Thanks, I didn't get to see much news

when I was mostly at sea between '65-'69, but that one story of the rifle jamming and the slowness to remedy the situation has always stuck in my mind as symbolic of the U.S. war machine greed....like the slowness to get armored vehicles to Iraq...."support the troops" is nothing but a figure of speech to these slimeball neocons.

[aikoaiko]

12. Its a good intermediate range rifle.

I wish the import ban and machine gun ban would be lifted so that US civilians could own these.

[derby378]

16. Until then, at least we have the semi-autos...

They'll save your life in a pinch just like the full-auto versions.

[madokie]

14. Yea I remember the m-16 jamming a lot, think about shitting your pants

when it happened too as you think that thought. Another advantage is the fact you can use the us ammo in the ak 47 if you need to, not very accurate but better than nothing.

[a conservative]

28. m16 ammo in AK?

um, no,, not even close

[madokie]

33. sure it does, it ruins the cartridge but it fires just fine

[Mr. Nobody]

37. Um. No it does not

The AK-47 shoots the 7.62x39 cartridge which is relatively short and fat. The M16 shoots the 5.56x45 which is relatively long and skinny. These are both bottle necked cartridges. The distance from the base to the shoulder (where the case gets skinnier) is 1.201 inches for the 7.62 and 1.438 for the 5.56. So the 5.56 is to long to fit into a 7.62 chamber. There is no way that an AK-47 could possibly shoot ammo made for an m16.

Even if it could, the round would be ineffective. The bore of an AK is .310 inches. The bullet of an M16 is .224 inches. The gas would simply escape from around the bullet. The bullet would leave the barrel at too slow a speed to be effective. Also without the bore being sealed the gas pressure would not build to the point were the rifle would function.

madokie you are misinformed.

[TheBaldyMan]

43. maybe he is mixed up with the AK-74

I'm not a gun nut, but doesn't the AK-74 use a .22 round, I'm not sure if the cartridges or magazines are compatible.

[Mr. Nobody]

45. Nope same reason

The 5.56 is longer than the 5.45x39. It still would not fit in the chamber.

If you could get it to fire it has a decent chance of blowing up the rifle. The bullet of the AK-74 is .221 inches vs the .224 for the M16's. Squeezing the bullet down to size will increase the pressure dramatically. The 5.56 is already a higher pressure cartridge than the 5.45. It would likely last for a while but eventually all that excess pressure will cause the gun to fail.

[wakeme2008]

15. There is a new weapon coming out that

is better than the AK for US troops. Just do not know


Meet the XP8 The XM8 is a derivative of the Heckler-Koch G36


Write up on it

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m8-oicw.htm

[Hobarticus]

17. Kalashnikov designed his rifle to be dragged behind a truck....liiterally.

Heard an interview with him on the fiftieth anniversary of the introduction of the AK-47, it was very interesting. He had his first prototypes dragged behind a truck for miles, cross-country. If they couldn't be picked up and fired, they started over. He based his stamped-steel design on the German's SG-44, which was pioneering but had too many finely machined parts, like every other German-engineered weapon.

The interview also talked about the development of the B-52, and how the introduction of both heralded the start of the Cold War. Fifty-some years later, both are still in service. Amazing. They don't build them like they used to.

[rfkrfk]

30 caliber is different that 22. so what?

there is no ideal caliber

[RaleighNCDUer]

19. Knowing this crew, I think it's more likely that if US troops are

picking up AKs it's because 1) they are plentiful 2) parts are plentiful 3) ammo is plentiful.

If we can't get them decent armor or edible food, why should we believe they are getting the parts and ammo they need?

[slackmaster]

20. Not for long-range shooting

I have a news clipping that includes a photo of a Marine sitting on a tank in Iraq. He has two firearms visible - An M60 machine gun beside him, and in his hands a Mauser 98k type bolt-action rifle, probably captured.

You can take pot shots at things at 500 yards with an AK. You're more likely to hit your target with an M16. If you want do actually inflict some damage, something bigger is more approprirate.

[Ryano42]

21. Sadly, our troops have been under-equipped since...

The Garand left service. I shot both the M1 and M-14 in competition and in comparision the M-16 is a travesty. A ^&%$ing TOY. :(

But it seems that giving our troops substandard is ok...at long as you "support" them! :mad:

[LynnTheDem]

22. He is correct; More US troops using confiscated AK-47 rifles

More US troops using confiscated AK-47 rifles
http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:BawVtn5xdnAJ:www.sacbee.com/24hour/special_reports/iraq/story/978295p-6862352c.html+US+troops+using+AK-47&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1

Defense Tech: US SOLDIERS USING IRAQI GUNS
http://www.defensetech.org/archives/000541.html

[Mr. Nobody]

39. He was correct in 2003

That's when those articles you link to were written. The military did not issue enough rifles to vehicle crews so they picked up AK. They have since increased the amount of rifles issued.

[LynnTheDem]

40. He is STILL correct. I know. My husband is one of those soldiers.

As are most the men in his unit.

[aikoaiko]

23. On some of the gun boards, veterans are saying they have them as BUGs

I've heard some sayiing that they kept underfolders and a couple of magazines in their vehicles just in case it was needed. I've not heard anyone talking about using it as primary weapon.

[TheBaldyMan]

29. That agrees with what I heard after the first gulf war

you could drop it, drive over it in a truck, immerse it in sludge then pick it up, dust it off and it would still fire. Not the most accurate rifle but it very rarely jammed and was very robust.

[bigtree]

32. They say it'll shoot under water

It's good for the sand conditions too. It resists jamming like the other rifles constantly do.

[Ebaum]

35. where did you hear that from?

regular rifles won't work under water, I'd like to see the person that said this try it :P

[bigtree]

44. it's an exaggeration, of course

but, the things are really durable and reliable. That's why a lot of soldiers prefer them for close defense and other close targeting.

[Earth_First]

36. Next week they'll report that anyone using the weapon will forefit

any SGLI benefits.

[Hobarticus]

46. Quite a slap to the ego of American military might, isn't it?

Nope, I'd much rather use a fifty-year old Soviet weapon, thanks.

[BlooInBloo]

41. My AK brings all the grunts to the yard......

they're like
it's better than yours!
damn right
it's better than yours!



My apologies to all decent people everywhere. Dunno what came over me.

[Buck Turgidson]

47. Voila... the ZF1.

"It's light, handles adjustable for easy carrying. Good for both righties and lefties. Breaks down into four parts, undetectable by x-ray. Ideal for quick, discreet interventions. A word on firepower. Titanium recharger. 3,000 round clip with bursts of 3 to 300. With a replay button, another Zorg invention, its even easier. One shot and replay sends every following shot to the same location. And to finish the job, all Zorg oldies but goldies. Rocket launcher. Arrow launcher with explosive poisonous gas heads. Our famous net launcher. The always efficient flame thrower. My favorite. And for the grand finale, the all new ice cube system."

-Zorg, Fifth Element