Want To Lose Your US Citizenship? Lots of Luck!

[leftchick]

Someone asked on one of the "I am leaving the country" threads how hard it is to Lose American citizenship. Apparently it is extremely hard, to the point I doubt it ever happens. This is amazing...

Can You Lose Your US Citizenship?
By Masood Khan, Esq.
CA

This column is of a general nature and is not to be construed as legal advice. Be sure to consult an attorney for your specific legal issues.

As an immigrant community in the United States, obtaining citizenship in the US for Pakistanis becomes extremely important for developing roots in this country. Once citizenship is acquired, one is free to avail himself of all the rights and privileges that this country offers. Although rarely done, it is important to know what acts may result in a US citizen become de-naturalized. Below I will discuss some of the bases upon which automatic loss of citizenship may take place as opposed to government act revoking a person’s citizenship.

Under the Fourteenth Amendment of the United States Constitution, passed in the 1860s, “All persons born … in the United States” are citizens of the United States. That is, any person born in the US, regardless of his/her parents’ immigration status, or of the circumstances that led to his/her birth in the US, is a US citizen.

There are however, other laws dealing with the circumstances that could lead natural born citizens to lose their citizenship as well. There has been significant development in these laws over the years, but as it stands today under the law, a person must voluntarily engage in an affirmative expatriating act with the specific intention of relinquishing US citizenship in order to lose his or her US citizenship. The key element under the law is intent. Also, regardless of the law in effect at the time of the act or acts in question, that act must result in the loss of citizenship under the law currently in effect.

http://www.pakistanlink.com/Commentary/2005/April05/15/03.HTM

[helderheid]

1. but is it easy to lode?

;)

[leftchick]

3. hey I fixed it!

:) and yes it is much easier to lode.

[no_hypocrisy]

2. Faster way to lose your citizenship: become an enemy combatant.

However, the fringe detriments suck.

[leftchick]

4. apparently not...

<snip>

Service in the armed forces of a foreign country
Serving in a military training program or defense forces alone that must specially be called out for military service, by itself, is not considered a renunciating act, nor is service in an insurgent or revolutionary military group.

[northzax]

9. unless that military or insurgent group

is currently engaged in military action against the United States. Taking up arms against the US is pretty much a killer.

interesting to note that John Walker Lindh did not have his citizenship revoked.

[leftchick]

12. yes indeed

enemy combatant Lindh still is a US citizen.

[northzax]

16. he was not technically an enemy combatant

since he was tried by a US court.

technicalities matter here.

[mcscajun]

5. How to Lose Your US Citizenship.

Now *there's* something I can never imagine doing. Wow.

ANYWay...

Although current US law forbids the government from taking your citizenship from you against your will, it does permit you to give it up voluntarily. This has placed the US State Department in the complex position of determining whether someone who claims to be a US citizen has, in fact, given up that citizenship by his voluntary statements or actions.

In the early days of court-mandated acceptance of dual citizenship, State Department officials (hostile as most of them were to the whole idea of dual citizenship) tended to play hardball with people who claimed dual status, looking for almost any excuse to revoke US citizenship, and frequently ruling that a person had voluntarily forsaken his US ties despite steadfast protestations or even convincing evidence to the contrary.

On 16 April 1990, though, the State Department adopted a new set of guidelines for handling dual citizenship cases which are much more streamlined and liberal than before.

The State Department now says that it will assume that a US citizen intends to retain (not give up) his US citizenship if he:

1. is naturalized in a foreign country;

2. takes a routine oath of allegiance to a foreign country; or

3. accepts foreign government employment that is of a "non-policy-level" nature.

Apparently, a "routine oath of allegiance" to another country is no longer taken as firm evidence of intent to give up US citizenship, even if said oath includes a renunciation of US citizenship. This represents a dramatic reversal of previous US policy; it used to be that any such statement was taken rigidly at face value (as in the Supreme Court's 1980 Terrazas decision).

This presumption that someone intends to keep US citizenship does not apply to a person who:

1. takes a "policy-level" position in a foreign country;

2. is convicted of treason against the US; or

3. engages in "conduct which is so inconsistent with retention of U.S. citizenship that it compels a conclusion that intended to relinquish U.S. citizenship."

The State Department says that cases of these kinds will be examined carefully to determine the person's intent. They also say that cases falling under the last criterion mentioned above (conduct wholly inconsistent with intent to keep US citizenship) are presumed to be "very rare."

http://www.richw.org/dualcit/faq.html#losing

[xchrom]

6. we will never let you go!!!

:rofl:

[leftchick]

8. no shit!

:crazy:

[northzax]

11. you can easily renounce your citizenship

it's just hard for the government to take it away from you without your consent.

you want out? go to a consulate outside the United States, walk up to a consular officer (any FSO will do), hand them your passport and a letter renouncing your Citizenship. voila! you're out.

[MercutioATC]

13. Exactly! Hovever, Patriot Act II makes it easier to take it away.

This was one of the issues that I found most serious...

"It would permit the Department of Justice to strip Americans of their citizenship and seize their assets if they contributed to organizations — even inadvertently — or associated with individuals that the attorney general determined were affiliated with terrorism."

http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0819-08.htm

[leftchick]

14. wow isn't that lovely?

I totaly missed that fascist outrage!

[MercutioATC]

18. Scary stuff...

Donate money to a charity that helps provide food and medical care to children in Africa. Unbeknownst to you, some of that money is redirected to the PLO. You've just provided material support to a known terrorist group (having knowledge that you're providing support is no longer required) and, according to Patriot Act II, you've just renounced your U.S. citizenship.

[FloridaPat]

7. There is always registering to vote in a foreign country. A US citizen

did that once in England not realizing the consequences. She had her citizenship canceled. She was very suprised.

[northzax]

10. not neccesarily true

remember all the Iraqi polling places in the US? the only real way to have your citizenship revoked without your consent is by being convicted of active treason, or serving as an officer in a foreign military.

[Sgent]

15. sounds supsicious

I imagine it is possible, but according to the law she must have intended to give up her citizenship as well as register.

[LostinVA]

19. False -- I vote in Italian elections

I have dual citizenship. It is legal and allowed by the US government. I received it about a year ago. Someone with dual US-UK citizenship can certainly vote in the UK. There are one of the countries the US has the dual citizenship agreement with.

About the only thing I can't do is hold certain Federal jobs.

[Sgent]

17. The US Government also has to agree

Its not only a personal act -- but an affirmation by the State Department or other departments.

Even if you lose your passport, you are still responsible for taxes.

[CTyankee]

20. If your grandparent was an Italian and never became a U.S. citizen

you can claim a right to become an Italian citizen under Italian law. This is how I understand it. I am not a lawyer, but I have heard this on many occasions. My understanding is that there are Americans of Sicilian and Italian descent going to Italy and Sicily with documents proving that they can become citizens there (mostly because they want the social benefits that they can't get in the U.S.).

How sad and disgraceful that we can't take care of people in our country sufficiently, so that they have to resort to this loophole to have a decent retirement!

[LostinVA]

21. That's what I did -- there's like an 18-36 month backlog right now

And, not just your grandfather. It can go back as far as you want, as long as the line is paternal and the line is unbroken. They also can have been a Naturalized citizen: the trick is that if the person who came from Italy couldn't have become a citizen BEFORE their son was born.

Also, it can go through the mother's side, but that's a recent law with a bunch of restrictions.

It takes about 8-18 months to get all the documents, and will cost you approximately $400-1200 US.

(FYI: Sicily is part of Italy, not a separate conutynbry... no matter how badly they both wish it).

Other countries also have this.

And, FYI: you aren't becoming an Italian citizen -- you were legally one at your birth. You are just proving it.

And, you don't do it in Italy, you do it at your local Italian Consulate.

It is a pain in the ass, btw.... but I like having the EU Passport!

[CTyankee]

22. An acquaintance of mine is from Canada

but I think she has US/Canadian citizenship. Anyway, she claims her children have the same deal and will head to Canada if if looks like the draft will be reimposed (her kids are in their early 20s). Otherwise, they are staying here.