Will you defend your way of life?

[Squatch]

Poll question: Will you defend your way of life?

As (US) Americans, would you take up arms to violently defend your way and others' ways of life?

Do you think that your way of life, and others' ways of life (even those you don't agree with) here in the USA are worth defending, fighting, killing, or dying for?

Just curious

Definition of "way of life" = the sum total of everything you do in the pursuit of happiness.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

1. Huh?

Killing whom?

Jeez. I'd just as soon share a doobie or a beer or maybe even some large group sex with Rick Santorum.

Wait.

No, if I were forced to have sex with Rick Santorum, yeah, I'd kill something.

I just lost it here, didn't I?

[Squatch]

2. Just a simple question, lady.

Nothing to read into.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

8. I'm not a man

And there's no such thing as a simple question.

[Squatch]

14. OK, man, chill out.

Apologies.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

27. No need for apologies,

but phrases like "chill out" really are unnecessary.

Be as graceful as I'm sure you are.

Peace.

Dude.

[Squatch]

28. The problem with these fora is that humor and sarcasm are rarely

adequately perceived. "Chill out" was just an attempt, albeit an admittedly lame one, at humor.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

31. Oh, OK.

In my world, it's quite a dismissive phrase, and quite offensive.

No offense taken, and let's shake on it, OK?

:toast:

[Squatch]

34. Okie dokie.

[driver8]

54. The "exchange" above reminded me of this classic film --

From Monty Python and the Holy Grail:

King Arthur: Old woman.
Dennis: Man.
King Arthur: Man, sorry. What knight lives in that castle over there?
Dennis: I'm 37.
King Arthur: What?
Dennis: I'm 37. I'm not old.
King Arthur: Well I can't just call you "man".
Dennis: Well you could say "Dennis".
King Arthur: I didn't know you were called Dennis.
Dennis: Well you didn't bother to find out did you?
King Arthur: I did say sorry about the "old woman", but from behind you looked...
Dennis: What I object to is you automatically treat me like an inferior.
King Arthur: Well I am king.
Dennis: Oh, king eh? Very nice. And how'd you get that, eh? By exploiting the workers. By hanging on to outdated imperialist dogma which perpetuates the economic and social differences in our society.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

3. I will fight to defend my life, my children's lives...

but not our "way of life". We're spoiled, lazy, mass consuming, tv watching Americans.

American values, the ones this country was founded on... probably.

[walldude]

11. Man, that answer is so close to what I was going to write it's freaky

right down to the values the country was founded on. The idea of America is a wonderful thing. What it's become is a horror....

[Viva_La_Revolution]

40. Great minds, and all that

:)

[0007]

29. I'll fight these stupid bastard until the end. The end will

probably be after more devastating damage humans we do to the earth.

[driver8]

56. Amen!! I will protect my family, but f*ck the "way of life."

Americans have had it good for so long...I am sick of lazy, whining, people who believe that they are entitled to anything that their heart desires.

[ulysses]

4. define "way of life"

[Squatch]

6. Your way of life entails all those things you

do in the pursuit of happiness.

[ulysses]

16. let's break that down a bit, then.

Freedom of speech and a nice stereo both make me happy, but I'm not fighting over the stereo.

[Squatch]

21. How about we say all those things, taken, as a whole = way of life

The whole kit and kaboodle (sp?) of all things you do in the pursuit of happiness is your "way of life"

[ulysses]

30. how about we not?

Sugar snap peas, sauteed in olive oil with maybe a little soy sauce, make me happy. Fight over them? No.

[Squatch]

33. Are you just trying to be obtuse?

A meal hardly a "way of life" makes. But, if it did, I would be very surprised to find out that you would not be willing to fight for the *only* thing that makes you happy.

[ulysses]

35. not at all.

I just don't agree with you premise that every aspect of modern, industrial life is worth killing for.

[Squatch]

39. Gotcha.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

22. If you're asking me if I'd kill a guy...

to defend my habit of picking up a pack of gum after lunch and sitting in the library reading magazines for a couple of hours on friday afternoons- then no. I probably wouldn't kill a guy for that.

[Squatch]

26. Those are just two aspects of your greater "way of life"

which entails ALL those things you do in the pursuit of happiness.

[H2O Man]

5. Other n/t

[porphyrian]

7. Caveat

Yes, they're worth it. However, I'm afraid I'd be a lousy killer without being pushed really, really far.

[Squatch]

10. Understood.

Thanks for the explanation.

[killbotfactory]

9. If by way of life you mean

the ability to drive inefficient vehicles, and buy cheap goods made by cheap labor, under crappy conditions in oppressive totalitarian states... No.

[Squatch]

12. Post #6

Read it.

[H2O Man]

13. If we throw in

a "buy one - get one half-price" sale at Wal-Mart, would that make a bit of murder and mayhem seem a better investment?

[Squatch]

15. "murder and mayhem"?

[H2O Man]

19. Read post #6, n/t

[Squatch]

24. These cryptic posts aren't helping.

Would you mind explaining a little more?

[H2O Man]

32. Sure.

Let's start with "pursuit of happiness." People who pursue happiness don't tend to find it. Those who pursue a committed life create their own pleasure. Thus the question that another DUer asked: are you talking about the Bill of Rights, or the bill of sale from a stereo? Also, who or what do you think of as an invading force threatening our lifestyle? Some folks think that Mexicans meet the description. Are they more of a threat to your life than, say, the neocons? Which one threatens the Bill of Rights? The stereo?

[Squatch]

37. Hmmm...

"People who pursue happiness don't tend to find it. Those who pursue a committed life create their own pleasure."

So people who are pursuing a committed life, presumably because it makes them happy, will not "tend to find it"...namely happiness *or* the committed life. :eyes: So, people pursuing happiness and committed lives are screwed, either way.

[H2O Man]

41. Now you are

the joker.

[Squatch]

44. Not at all. Your argument was quite circular.

[H2O Man]

46. And your's square.

[killbotfactory]

17. Hmm... now we're talking

How could you not get violent over a deal like that?

[H2O Man]

25. It's as American

as cherry pie. If foreigners insist on apple pie, they are asking for it. Hopefully in English.

[conflictgirl]

18. No way

I'm mostly a pacifist and can only consider killing in the name of self-defense (and I mean immediate self-defense - someone is trying to kill me or my family, I would fight back including to the point of death). But even without that as a factor, I don't think the American way of life is anything worth killing over. That's blind nationalism, as opposed to patriotism, and nationalism usually leads to bad ends. I somewhat reject the postmodern idea that all things are just different and it's all culturally relative.

There are some good things about America - and there were a lot more of them before the neocons took power. But fighting to defend our American way of life would mean a lot more if our country still held to some of those standards upon which it was founded. And quite frankly, there are a lot of things about the American way of life (materialism, the food supply, the education system, the lack of an adequate social safety net, I could go on and on) that I'm fighting to change, so I'd be a hypocrite if I said that I would fight for our way of life. If your way of life is really so great then I don't think there would be many threats to it.

[mike_c]

20. definitely "other...."

Would I fight to defend corporatism and for-profit-government, over consumption of resources, a "western lifestyle" propped up by an exploitative foreign policy, disregard for the environment, again in the name of unbridled profits, etc? Hell no-- I'd fight to destroy that way of life! That's the American "way of life" as I see it-- a nation of shallow consumers and TV watchers who know more about the contestants on American Idol than they know about world geography or human affairs.

[bryant69]

23. I like having Record Shops

I don't know if I'm willing to kill for them.

I don't know if the Democratic Party is going to get anywhere promising to make people's live's worse off than they are now.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Atman]

36. You should be ashamed if you don't say YES!

One of the strongest points I've always been able to make when arguing with Republicans, when then try to tell me that I'm just a leftist looney regarding my views about "forcing" democracy on another country, is that I don't care who is sitting at the fancy desk in the Oval Office, I will defend MY COUNTRY. I won't fight for George Bush, but I sure as shootin' hope America will be here long after he's become an asterisk' underneath Richard Nixon's name.

Therefore, no matter what the hell happens, I'll defend the AMERICAN way of life, even if at the moment it appears to be one very fucked up way of life indeed. It wasn't always that way, and it can be made enviable again.


.

[Porcupine]

58. I would be ashamed if I didn't say NO!!!

Frankly I'm ashamed of "AmeriKa" and the "American Way of Life"

Would I kill for the right to have endless strip malls from Florida to Maine? Hell No!! Would I kill for endless traffic jams that lead to jobs with no security and no respect? Hell NO!!! Would I kill for the right to pollute, bulldoze and destroy prime farmland so that another developer can have a third house in Tahoe? HELL NO!!

WOULD I KILL TO DEFEND A NATION THAT LET'S CHILDREN SLEEP IN CARS? HELL NO!!

I would however kill to defend farmland, free flowing rivers and salmon spawning grounds.

Hayduke Lives!!

[Atman]

62. Then you have the wrong idea about what the American way of life is

You're bought into the REPUBLICAN CORPORATIST way of life.

That isn't what this country is about. It doesn't reflect the ideals it was founded upon. It doesn't honor the memories of our grandfathers and fathers and brothers and sisters and all those who fought to build up what the republican corporatists are hell-bent on destroying.

I wouldn't fight to defend BushCo. But I wouldn't walk away from what my ancestors fought for just because George Bush is a fucking dickwad and people have been taught that NASCAR drivers are bigger heroes than than the actual patriots who built a country in 200 years that the rest of the world envied...up until Bush came along.

[loveable liberal]

38. thats what is so pathetic about "fighting them here".

the theory that terrorists would actually invade is so pathetic, it's unbelieveable. the expected lifespan of a invasion force in this country would be about 8 minutes. fighting terrorists here is a lame idea. they would have to come up with something big in order to do battle, like a dirty bomb. no sense in checking all cargo though..... oh, and lets cut the funding to track russian nuclear material too. hey....wait a second.......

[American Tragedy]

42. Sure, I would fight for liberal democracy and civil liberties

Every time I read about world history, and hear contemporary religious authoritarians on the news, I am reminded that it could still be far worse than it is. I'm not necessarily proud of every aspect of my life. That doesn't mean that I would be just as happy to let somebody like Pat Robertson dictate my private decisions and force me to pretend to believe everything that he does.

[HamDon]

43. I think this would a better worded question

"If this country were invaded by another country:"

[Squatch]

45. "by all enemies, foreign and domestic"

People like GWB can (and have) threatened our ways of life.

[Inland]

47. You mean, the whole enchilada? Yes.

But in reality, choices aren't made like that. Even under a ruthless dictatorship I would still have some part of the sum total, like coffee, and alcohol, and bad TV, and my family. You have to realize that you may lose everything with your life if you fight over a part. So it's rarely so simple.

[Squatch]

49. That's a good point.

Then the next question should be, which is more valuable to you: your way of life, or your life?

[Inland]

50. I already answered that one

using the definition of "way of life". It's easy.

In real life, only part of your "way of life" is threatened, so you have to decide whether to risk the whole thing for that part. If that part threatened is coffee and morning paper, then no.

[Deja Q]

48. Why?

I've been mocked, laughed at, beaten up, threated with death... all my life. No love. Just scorns and stares.

If those are examples of pursuing happiness - hurting others for pleasure - then I choose to do nothing. Or even understand the phrase "if you can't beat them, join them."

Convince me where I am wrong. I will listen.

[nonconformist]

51. I would only violently defend my own life and the lives of my family

I would peacefully fight for our way of life, but I would only take up arms in direct self defense or defense of my family.

[BlooInBloo]

52. I voted no....

... because I'll fight for and defend a BETTER way of life.

Stagnation and status quo (and even devolution) are stock & trade of republicans.

[SmokingJacket]

53. Killing people so that I can sleep in on Sundays, for example?

Question is too general. I won't kill anyone except in defense of innocent lives -- if I can be equally general.

[Nicole]

55. Yes I would

Many of my ancestors died fighting for the American way of life. Some died trying to get here to live it, others died defending it after being born here. Some of my ancestors fought each other for what each believed to be the right side.

I would dishonor them if I willing gave it all up without a fight. How would I explain to my descendents that I didn't think they deserved the same efforts from me?

[JanMichael]

57. Hey if it's predicated on the exploitation of other people then no.

If it's based on invading other countries then no.

If it's based on keeping the rest of the world poor then no.

How about no?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

59. I'll stick with what Gandhi had to say about such nonsense.

“What difference does it make to the dead, the orphans and the homeless, whether the mad destruction is wrought under the name of totalitarianism or the holy name of liberty or democracy.” - Gandhi

[CRK7376]

60. I do on a daily basis

I'm a soldier and although I can't stand the current administration, I firmly believe in the opportunites we, as Americans have. I would not want to live permanently in any other country.

[mike_c]

61. here's a DU thread on that "way of life...."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2234806