If you think your place is cluttered.....

[BrklynLiberal]

check this out..

http://www.auctions-registration.com/ebay/

[OldLeftieLawyer]

1. There's a name for what Mom as

Obsessive-compulsive disorder.

I wonder where the cats are hiding........

Ewwwwwwwwwwww.

[HereSince1628]

22. Your mom took lessons from my mom...

But so did my father. The basement and the garage were just as bad with all his stuff.

We filled 2 loads of an 8ft x 8ft x 16ft dumpster to getting rid of half the stuff when my mother died. Unfortunately, my sister and my older brother split the other half and carted it off to their houses and garages which now seriously resemble those of the parents.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

30. Not my Mom

She was GREAT at cleaning stuff out, giving it away to people who needed things we no longer did. What I learned from her about not getting weighted down with crap and material goods has served me very well all my long life.

It is, though, a really fascinating syndrome/pathology, that need to hold onto stuff.

[Radio_Lady]

81. I'm constantly recycling stuff to lots of organizations. I still have

a great deal that I've picked up along the way, but much of it is of use to the families who are trying to make their way out of homelessness here in Washington County, Oregon.

All those baby clothes, clothes of all sizes, potty seats, they could be of some use to someone. I don't understand this illness but I see it on "Animal Planet" where people amass tons of animals that they know they can't care for. It's seriously sad.

[Radio_Lady]

48. Right. OCD demonstrated by hoarding behavior.

She should be receiving treatment, not any derision.

Sad.

This is a Maryland group that treats it. Other links from Google for HOARDING BEHAVIOR or HOARDING DISORDER.

http://www.anxietyandstress.com/sys-tmpl/hoarding/

[The Backlash Cometh]

67. That woman is in desperate need of a man like Adrian Monk.

A match made in heaven.

[Radio_Lady]

78. Oh, Tony Shaloub! He's an actor -- no OCD there, really!

I guess you were being sarcastic.

[The Backlash Cometh]

89. No. Not sarcastic.

Adrian Monk is a fictitious person, however, his OCD involves excessive cleaning. So, it's a match made in heaven.

[Radio_Lady]

113. I see what you mean. I've never watched that show, although I

think he's a great actor.

[Jara sang]

2. I have a friend that blows glass, what's their number?

just kidding, their is a pathology at work in that house.

[napi21]

3. Dear Lord! I'm not the neates person in the world, but after that

I feel like a perfect neatnick!

How the hell can anyone live like that?????

[Booster]

4. My aunt, who just recently died, was like this only worse. She

had 3 houses at the time she died; each one piled from floor to ceiling with boxes. It's really some kind of sickness. My aunt, for instance, had about 15 place settings for eight people and she would never allow anyone to come into any of her houses, mainly because you couldn't get in - so what does someone like that need with 15 place settings? I have clutter, but it's mostly damn paper; things I think I should read, but never seem to get around to. My aunt's daughter is exactly the same as my aunt was, and my mother is almost as bad. I WILL NOT get this bad, I promise.

[Cleita]

12. I always thought that about my mother (who was neat) who

had all these porcelain china and silver services for just about any social occasion, yet she never entertained. When she made holiday meals for my dad and me we ate off the regular everyday dinnerware.

[Booster]

38. I have 4 plates, 4 saucers and 4 mugs that I have had since the

60's, and I recently told a friend, who has lavish dinner parties, that I have never used all four of these items at one time. ha My friend and I were shopping the other day and she was looking at some place settings and said "wouldn't you like to have some nice dinnerware?" I said "what for, everything I eat comes with it's own plate, and when I'm finished, I just throw out the plate". Guess I won't be storing place settings.

[marions ghost]

57. yes what is it about women

of an earlier era who had to have all these formal services for fine dining, while they popped the frozen pizzas in the oven and served it on plastique.

I have noticed that, and I think it has to do with being caught in that June Cleaver dream of the perfect housewife making jello molds early on...but then the reality was that there was never enough time to do all that entertaining and roles for women were changing radically. Convenience foods overtook them but they kept the fine dining items as a nostalgic symbol.

Kind of like the way I kept a hammock around for years as a symbol of the leisure that I never have.

[Virginian]

5. Uh, I gotta go now and clean my sewing room. n/t

[eleny]

8. My thoughts exactly. Are you a fabricoholic, too?

[ms liberty]

91. she who dies with the most fabric wins! my family motto! n/t

[Virginian]

112. Incurably.

My Sister-in-law just brought me a dozen more fat quarters for my stash yesterday.

I do machine embroidery and there are so many cute applique patterns out there that I have to have a scrap of just about everything I see.

[marions ghost]

51. LOL

yeah --I had that same thought

Urge to clean, immediately. Hmmm, maybe it would be good to look at these pix periodically if it has that effect...

Seriously, this is an interesting photo essay by the son. Ebay was not a plus for this poor woman.

My own Mom had the opposite compulsion--everything must go. There was not a shred left from our childhood except for photos. We learned to hold on tight to whatever we didn't want to disappear forever. She always said "It's not about things " (meaning this life on earth). Actually I think she's right, but I don't have her relentless zeal about it.

I live with a neatnik. So we have agreed-upon clutter-free zones. But the flotsam collects around the edges and creeps out periodically...

bye, I have to go clean out a couple of closets now.

[Kerrytravelers]

6. Pure gluttony. There is no excuse for this.

I am not perfect. I do try my best to purge. I toss out junk, I recycle, I give a ton of clothes and household items away. I don't buy more than I need. I have some boxes in the closet I should go through. My filing cabinet need to be purged. But all I see here is nothing but foolishness (to quote Niecy Nash http://www.stylenetwork.com/ssms-site/style.do?showId=6130 ) This person has a psychological reason for keeping all this stuff that they aren't ready to deal with yet (Helen Buttigeig http://www.neattv.com/home.html ) And they really need to get honest about the need for holding on to all this stuff so they can free themselves and free whatever is holding them from moving on with their lives (http://tlc.discovery.com/fansites/cleansweep/cleansweep.html )

Whenever I'm holding on to too much stuff, I watch Buttigeig, or if she's not on, The Clean House or Clean Sweep team and ask myself why I'm holding on to stuff. I always feel much better once the chaos is off my shoulders.

I feel sorry that someone is forcing themselves to live like this.

[annabanana]

33. It's not gluttony

It's an illness. Irrational attachment to unneeded items that don't have a specific emotional componenet is a manifestation of anxiety.

Note: the old food should be thrown out... now

[Kerrytravelers]

49. You're probably right. I am being way too harsh.

People are so addicted to things, sometimes the illness that the clutterbugs face gets tied in with the shallow materialism of gluttony that seems to be taking over many people in this country.

[marions ghost]

53. right

compassion is in order here. This is not gluttony per se.

Actually this person doesn't seem to have so much of the usual clutter that most people have "because I might use it someday." In other words the usual problem is not being able to throw anything away for at least the logical reason that you might just have a need for it in future.

But this woman is actually compulsively adding to her useless possessions in a very efficient and orderly way it looks like. That's a different kind of need. It's about a somewhat primitive compulsion to fill emptiness or barricade herself in. She's literally building walls of things that make her feel secure. This activity is psychologically very important and would take some skillful intervention to deal with it.

The compulsive "lining up" things behavior is typical of OCD, I believe.

[Kerrytravelers]

63. I'm wondering about her family.

At this point, even with things lined up orderly, isn't it still a fire hazard? ISn't she putting lives at risk by being so cluttered? One can't escape if a fire starts, and with the pile up, a fire would quickly spread. I'm no fire expert, but I would think that it would be very hard to even tell where the fire is coming from. I'm assuming that the smoke detectors work and are free of clutter surrounding them. If her home rages into a firey inferno, with all the papers and materials, would it be more likely to grow faster and spread to the neighboring homes quicker than a home that is much more clutter-free? Or am I way off base in my thinking? This is one of the first thoughts I had. I am a fire phobic. I hate hate hate fires. Even camping, I am a total freak out about watching the sparks and keeping distance from the fire. I admit, it can be a bit maddening for those camping with us. Perhaps I'm projecting a bit of my hysteria on her...

I look at this and wonder how it happened? Where is her family and her friends? Are they doing anything to help her? Many of my students are pack-rats. I am a tyrant when it comes to keeping desks, work areas and backpacks clean. I try to instill good work habits into my young children all year long. I'm probably giving them more anxiety! I hope I don't drive them to a home that looks like this someday!

I've had kids with OCD. It has always revolved walking to class a certain way, touching something a certain number of times, this kind of thing. I've never considered clutter-bugs suffering from OCD. That's why I love DU. You learn something new everyday!





P.S. I didn't mean to come across as not being compassionate. I really wasn't being anything except mortified at what I saw, even though on a second read through I did realize how harsh I came across (shame we can only edit for 1 hour, huh?) If this is a symptom of OCD, than this really is very sad. The three shows I mentioned in my first post really make light of being a pack-rat/clutter-bug (what is a better terminology here?) Perhaps that is where I derived my formerly flippant attitude from.

[marions ghost]

69. I understand your mortification

It really is quite a sight to behold, and the way he took pix from every angle makes it overwhelming. You actually get a sense of being IN the house, almost as if he took a video. Interesting that your first reaction was about fire, I didn't even think about that. My first instinct was claustrophobia as I dont like feeling hemmed in, like on elevators. (I'm sure I'd be one of those special anxiety cases if I had to have a closed MRI). I probably couldn't spend a night in that rabbit warren house if you paid me. Yeah, funny how we project our own phobias.

As for OCD I had a friend with it and his thing was lining everything up perfectly on shelves, closets,etc. There was always a very specific order and he would know and be upset if a single item was moved.He had relatively fewer things than this woman, but they were all extremely critical to him. He was able to control the OCD but it took some effort. Really nice guy.

I have actually seen a house that would compare with this one in the pictures. The woman had 4 kids, so how she kept the piles arranged so neatly must have been a constant job. But every room was lined with storage bins and boxes of all kinds, filled with everything from toys to sewing to cooking supplies--down to the most minute bead and button--it was as though she had decided to "file" her entire house in plastic containers and drawers on shelves. It was actually very neat but strange to experience. Come to think of it --it was bordering on this same compulsion.

Yeah I've seen some of those anti-clutter shows on cable. I think perhaps it might inspire people to work on their own junk. Sometimes they go into the mental blocks the people have about it. So I could see where there's a self-help benefit. (Gosh, if they did it, I can too). There are services--professional organizers --who can help. After all there are compulsive cleaner-uppers out there too--seems like the perfect business for them!

[Kerrytravelers]

70. Mr. kt actually suggested that I start a local 'de-clutter" business.

I've been doing it with students for years. He thinks I should do it as a business and get paid for it. But can you imagine my reaction when I walk into someone's home?!?! I better remember to take a deep breath. Although I think if face-to-face with someone, I wouldn't have the heart to be cruel (that's what Internet message boards are for! :evilgrin: )

I wouldn't even know where to being in terms of setting up a business like professional organizing. The idea does intrigue me, though.

[Radio_Lady]

77. Google "declutter companies" and you'll come up with others who

are promoting business as well as personal clutter assistance.

However, the originally posted pictures cross the line into something psychological, IMHO.

[Kerrytravelers]

90. I think if I were to walk into a house like that, I would admit my

limitations and not worry about an ego.

Thanks for the advice! :hi:

[Kerrytravelers]

71. ooopsss. Self-delete. I must have hit post message was twice.

[Kali]

104. we still burn our paper trash

(no recycling in this county and out on a ranch) and my thought when posters started mentioning fire was maybe not - that place is so packed with stuff it might just smolder for a long time - no oxygen for burning ya know? I am certainly no professional, but I do know its a lot easier to burn fluffed up paper than big stacks of it....as for getting out - any building has its risks there, that is for sure - if windows and doors are accesable it probably wouldn't be that much more of a risk than any other house with a lot of furniture or (yikes) security barred windows.

Still its a thought, any firefighters reading this?

[electron_blue]

79. anxiety, really? Good to know. I've come across 3 people like that now

And always wondered what could lead them to that state. Question: if you somehow cleaned out her house, would her anxiety go down? Or would she be even more anxious?

[marions ghost]

94. she would be more anxious

...often this situation is intractable and family members cannot do anything about it. It would take a complete restructuring of her life. It's not just a matter of "cleaning up." A person like this is not likely to want that done nor be pleased if anybody does it. Read never cry wolf's brave posts here -- --posts #39, 50 --he tells of his wife's rejection of any 'disturbance in the force' and how if he tries to throw anything out, she retrieves it from the garbage.

It would be unusual for a person this deeply connected to her collection of precious life-affirming objects to hire a professional organizer. She would have to see it as a problem first. Unlikely. Not to say it can't be done, but not easy. As somebody here said, it's like an addiction. And we know how hard those are to break.

[spuddonna]

110. She'd probably be more anxious... just like my mom was...

My mom and dad live in a house like this with my sister...

My mom has OCD and was at one time a 'neat freak', and obsessive cleaner, and the house was spotless. When my brothers and I were little, all I remember was my mom cleaning. In fact, she would over clean everything. But once my sister was born, everything changed. My sister was born with a major genetic defect which necessitated dozens of surgeries; she spent the first year of her life in the hospital, and my mom was often there with her. As the year went on, we had relatives coming and going, all helping out to watch us, and I can honestly say my mom and dad busted their asses so that we could have as normal a year as we could while they also devoted as much time to my sister as they could. (We really didn't know for a long time whether my sister would survive.) The only thing that 'gave' during this year was how my mom would clean the house.

By the time my sister came home, the place was not dirty, but extremely cluttered. Clothes from all our relatives that wanted to help out (we had a huge extended family), books that were donated, etc. Anyway, my mom tried to go back to her old cleaning ways while at the same time battling her impulse to horde stuff AND caring for my sister, who was still quite sick. Eventually, she spent less time obsessively cleaning and more time hording. Many times my brothers and I would try to sneak garbage bags full of clothes, papers, etc out of the house and several times we were sucessful. But many times she would catch us, and drag the garbage bags back into the house to 'inspect' them.

We also tried to do an 'intervention' about a decade ago. We rented a dumpster and started hauling stuff out of the house. We made excellent progress (or so we thought) in cleaning the place up. I will never forget the look on my mom's face at the end of the day. She looked heartbroken. It was also then that I knew that unless my mom decided she wanted to change this behavior, there was little that we could do to help. My father and sister have since done their best to toss things that would pile up but it is a constant battle that often gets put on hold as they deal with my sister's illness.

My mom has reached the point that she now realizes the behavior is obsessive, and actively fights against it. But it is extremely hard for my mom, as the behavior gives her a sense of 'control' over her life which is extremely comforting to her.

I used to be so frustrated and angry that the house looked like this. But as I have grown, and now have my own kids, I have nothing but compassion for my mom and people who are horders or have OCD. Most of the people that I see who have houses like this know that it is 'unusual' or 'abnormal' and are embarrassed and ashamed.

I try now to see with eyes of compassion and offer only help and support when I can. That's just my two cents... :) Peace everyone!

[eleny]

7. I remember this site!

Someone posted about this a long time ago. I'm prety sure it was here at DU. So the woman hasn't done a thing since. Maybe even got more "stuff". Makes me want to declutter whatever I have stashed away in the shed.

Thx!

[WePurrsevere]

15. Same old pictures I saw posted on an auction board I was active on. Made

a huge impact on a few ebay sellers I know... it scared them into cleaning out their homes, garages, etc. (Wild clutter, packed garages, etc is the norm for many ebay sellers I know.)

The woman in the story wasn't a seller even ... just a buyer who became horribly addicted.

I don't think I've heard any updates on what happened to the woman... maybe if I ask around though... it was quite the story on the auction boards a few years ago so I'm sure some would remember it.

[eleny]

16. Come to think of it - it may have been on a Yahoo group

It may have been a thrift shop group.

[WePurrsevere]

27. It made the board rounds I'm sure. I feel rather sorry for folks that find

themselves in situations like this.

[jbnow]

60. Just looking at the pictures

before I started reading the words I assumed she was a wildly disorganized seller.
But a buyer only? Unopened boxes? It's hard to think of what to say.

Years ago I had a client with a house so filled with things there were just narrow paths to walk through, boxes stacked high with "stuff". She became my client because of people's concern with her "things". The sheriff called to see if we could help her. She was old, sweet and obsessive.
It was a long. slow process and really some of it was tricking her into donating to people or causes that really "needed" what she had. But some of the boxes/bags were filled with musty/moldy clothing, books or magazines that were donated to trash piles.

Still she felt better to be helping voluntarily, felt proud she had saved them so they could be put to use.

This lady is years younger then that lady was...I can't imagine where she'll be in another thirty years.

[BrklynLiberal]

9. It is very scary. The bookshelves and the closet that she once used

were very neat, so at one time she was neat. It is like the OCD got really short-circuited. I think she needs some meds.

I hate to think what would happen if they had to get out of that house in the case of a fire or something.

I think the child posting these pics is a call for help.

[Kali]

20. a fire would probably be a GOOD thing!

wow I thought I was bad. At least my junk is conncted to real events in my life (travels, family, etc)

and how can you not open boxes?

[BrklynLiberal]

24. It is an addiction. Like gambling or drinking.

[Kali]

26. oh I can totally relate to buying stuff

and getting it in the mail, but where is the "reward" here? I would have to open the boxes. With drugs or gambling there is the occasional "reward" - the high or loss of pain or winning etc...

[BrklynLiberal]

32. The thrill is the buying, the receiving of the package. I guess there is

no thrill in opening.
Maybe even just the perusing the eBay site looking for stuff.

[yorkiemommie1]

44. my sister used to order things and not open the boxes

she was diagnosed OCD as well as schizophrenia.

[Radio_Lady]

76. Some web sites say OCD can be linked to anorexia and bulimia.

The whole thing is just so very sad.

[BreweryYardRat]

98. That makes sense.

My mom had a tendency to hoard stuff-not to a ridiculous degree, but to the point that it's a pain in the ass. Furniture, clothes, papers, and a bad tendency to buy a ton of plants...which never get planted, and she didn't keep the place very clean hygiene-wise. She's kicked most of the habit through therapy (except for the occasional plant-buying urge) but there's still junk everywhere.

She also bitches about how fat she is at least once every two days. My mom is about 5'9" and weighs, at the absolute most, 150, and I'd bet money it's closer to 145.

[politicat]

111. They're all related.

As well as self-mutilation. Compulsive behavioral disorders that reward the sufferer with endorphin boosts, thus reinforcing the behavior. The behaviors allow the sufferer to create a sphere of control in an unpredictable, stressful or dangerous environment, and the sense of control creates gives the sufferer security, which boosts endorphins and restarts the cycle.

Very hard to treat. OCD, OCD-Hoarding, Anorexia, Bulimia and self-mutilation do not respond well to drugs, though underlying depression may. Cognitive Behavioral therapy is somewhat effective, but especially in OCD-H and Anorexia, there are a lot of behavioral changes that don't necessarily correspond to a change in belief (i.e. the client agrees to eat or give up the collections, but does so because the conflict the behavior caused was too great to endure). And there are reasons that times of stress bring back the behaviors.

[jasmeel]

102. My childhood home was much worse than this- we did have a fire

and my parents lost it all. Kind of ironic really. Throughout my life we were always assured all the junk was VERY VALUABLE. Then they would proceed to let stuff get all beat up. It wasn't about the investment at all-it was about having the stuff forever!

[TahitiNut]

64. Actually, I think the fire marshal can require a clean-up.

That place is a total hazard. It it lit on fire, it'd kill anyone inside, pose a hazard to firefighters, and a hazard to the neighborhood. The sheer volume of flammable materials would make the fire difficult to extinguish.

Someone should report it to both County Health (mental and rats) and to the Fire Marshal. The woman needs treatment. Bad.

[LuckyLib]

105. Neighbors in my folks upscale neighborhood hoarded, and lo and

behold, the house caught fire when they were on vacation. Damn near burned down the block. My parents were terrified, as they heard firemen saying they didn't know if they could contain it. It was so "fueled" by piles of boxes that it was an inferno. The next door neighbor's house was damaged (they had to move out for 6 months) and the hoarders lost their house completely. The fire chief told neighbors you'd be surprised how many houses have that level of crap in them. What I'm curious about, is how does this woman have the time, and more importantly, the money to buy like that? Only in America. She no doubt bitches about welfare Moms with their food stamps. But let loose, on e-bay and "let 'er rip." It's sad that there is no family to get this woman help.

[acmavm]

10. That was disturbing and just EXACTLY like my ex-father in law. But

he doesn't do E-Bay. He does garage sales, goodwill, and newspaper ads.

[Critters2]

11. I wish my mom were still alive

"See, Mom. THAT is a messy house".

[NEOhiodemocrat]

14. hey mycirtters2

I can relate to that. My mom used to come into town to visit and I would find her on her hands and knees washing my kitchen floor...then she would show me the water and say..."look at the dirt" I would go "Hummm, why would you wash it if it were clean?" I do keep too much stuff but I am outclassed here!

[Critters2]

17. I finally learned to use her to my advantage

She'd come a couple of times a year, for a week or 10 days. I'd go to work during the day, and she'd stay home and obsessively clean my house. I'd go home at noon, take her out to lunch, go back to work...more cleaning...somewhere nice for dinner or a movie, etc. We had a nice visit, my house got cleaned, and she got to work out her cleaning compulsion. A win-win!!

[BrklynLiberal]

18. That is definitely making lemonade out of lemons!!

:thumbsup: :D

[Vinca]

13. I'm an ebay seller. Interesting to see where the stuff is going. Yike!

[partylessinOhio]

19. The house looks like it would be fairly spacious without all the stacks of

boxes. The shelves are neat, just dusty. The mother is a nice looking woman. I wonder if she works, does she have time? Where does she get the money to buy constantly from EBay?

My neighbors collected a lot of stuff. They both ended up in a nursing home. Relatives came and took the best of it. Their church came and put most of their stuff in at least two dumpsters. The garage is still half full and may never be cleaned out. The house has been for sale for years but nobody will buy it. It has a terrible odor that can be smelled in their yard with the windows closed. They had no pets so we cannot fathom where the smell is coming from since the house has been emptied.

I have too much clutter myself but it came from being disabled and not being able to keep up for some time. I thought my house was bad but my rooms and floor spaces are open and there is room to function. The house in the photos is completely unlivable. How could you prepare a meal, vacuum, scrub, do laundry, bath, or wash dishes in there? I feel better about my house after seeing this one but I'm going to pack more boxes of stuff to donate again, real soon.

[Raksha]

21. I have a friend whose house would make that place look normal...

...especially her old house, which she was forced to sell by the city because it was that cluttered (or worse) AND she was keeping about 33 dogs in it. She used to breed cockapoos and sell the puppies, and after she lost access to the kennel she rented, she moved all the dogs into her house! Nobody including me knew about this until after she was raided, because she wouldn't let anyone into the house. Now she has only one dog, but her new place is rapidly becoming a replica of her old one, and it breaks my heart to see it.

[BrklynLiberal]

23. That is sad, for the puppies and for her.

[mdmc]

28. ocd sucks

:shrug:

[seabeyond]

36. in all her mess it she appears incredibly clean and neat in some

respects like the folding of clothes, and counters and things. she also has some plant in a pot to plant

well,.... your mom is just simply beautiful. i got claustrophobic just looking at the pictures. i have pack rats. i am the one that gets rid of the stuff. i have a brother that is this only his place is a pig sty on top of it and i wont let kids in. he is comfortable. it works for him, though i could never never be that. i dont think he would be comfortable otherwise. so who am i to project and tell him otherwise. he just has to visit us. we dont visit him

[mdmc]

43. i wonder what your brothers motivation is?

[seabeyond]

45. ooops meant this for original poster. what is brothers motivation?

probably the same, ocd. he is also adhd before they knew this about kids. i say lazy. this person at least appears organized in having boxed. his is total chaos and disorganization. his truck a person cant even sit in it. feet have to be way up because of all the stuff. never let things go. i know when he was little we would ride a bike down a street and he would stop and pick up trash on the road (his treasure) and bring home.

just who he has always been

when he stays with me he does it..... things grow. i have gotten pissy enough he works hard and not being that. but he can only do so much.

i dont know. not my problem and i dont have to live it. he got his daughter after fighting years for her, so i tell him now he has to teach her, adn that means working on his thing. she cant live like that. so.... he is doing much better, but.... only cause he knows i will kick his butt, and he knows it isnt something to teach daughter. but,.... she is just as bad. willl be staying with me. have something in hand, done with it and just drop it.... on the floor it sits. pick that up i yell.... lol lol

[mdmc]

58. growing up, was his room his own? Did he fight with your folks

about cleaning up stuff?

I know that depression causes similar behavior. Environment (ex. living through the depression) can also cause some similar behavior.

:shrug:

just trying to make sense of it all.

peace and low stress

[seabeyond]

62. we all had our own rooms. his wasnt bad

my middle brother obsessively clean. would rake the rug. my room,..... it was the one. the only thing i consistantly got in trouble for. i started outgrowing it in my twenties. he started getting into it in hsi twenties. oh that is funny. now.... i can having anything lying around or mess or pile.... eeeew. my mama would be proud.

on the depression part. he went thru a decade fighting for his daughter. a lot of the stuff is things he would buy for when he got her. like a bedroom set.... huge ass and sat in living rooom. all her stuff.... waiting for her. very very depressive situation. i often think thank god he made it thru that. you may have something on that. thank you

*one of the reasons i dont automatically side with women in these cases. i saw how they treated brother, the father. was more about money than allowing him to be father. it was he is great parent but hte mom....... she isnt THAT bad so child went to her. very very hard. it was when mom kidnapped daughter and put her in a child psych ward that brother finally got her at 11 and 150k later. whereas the mom had free legal fee.,

just an add on

[mdmc]

92. well that makes a lot of sense, regarding motivation

My original on-line diagnosis was that your brother was trying to keep (someone. his daughter?) away by keeping his place cluttered... I thought it was his shield.

I'm glad that he finally got her.

I must ask - how did she like the psych ward? Did she go anywhere other then a hospital (foster home, youth residence?), or was it an in and out hospitalization.

:kick:

[seabeyond]

96. the mother did a lot of manipulation of judges, lawyers, doctors.

they would figure things out eventually but in mean time she would cause a lot of problems for everyone. then she would go onto a new doctor or lawyer. my niece was afraid. her mother told doctors niece was going to kill herself so they admitted her. mother never went into her room with her, or consoled her. just left her. niece says never said she was going to kill herself. was another game by mom to get the courts to say niece too afraid to be with her father. she would have this child since 5 say all kinds of things. then niece would tell us otherwise. it was very very hard. the doctors immediately realized she wasnt suicidal and didnt want her to stay there so they sent her to a home for troubled children for the weekend. until mom picked her up. she was afraid. it was horrible for her

after experiencing this woman for 7 years and watching what a mother would do to her child because of her hate for brother was odd, i had never experienced anyone like this woman

[barb162]

82. reminds me of my sister-in-law

[Raksha]

40. The dogs were confiscated and sold, of course...

...but even before that they were always well treated. The city tried, but they couldn't make a charge of "animal cruelty" stick so they had to settle for "animal neglect." She always did the best she could for the dogs under the circumstances. It would be more accurate to say she was cruel to herself for the sake of the dogs, and because of her own compulsive hoarding tendencies.

I could never begin to describe what that place smelled like when she finally gave me access in a desperate last-ditch attempt to clean it up. You don't want to know and I don't want to remember!

[jwirr]

25. I have a suggestion. Why don't you get her selling on ebay?

She has the stuff. I am a seller and I first got into it when I realized I had many more books that I had room for.

[barb162]

84. some people may go there with the intent to sell, but just BUY

once they see all the goodies

[jwirr]

87. Yeah I occasionally accompany my daughter and grand-

daughter to the mall. They are absolutely crazy! I have tried to say to them "stop" but they just laugh and say "We are SHOPPING"/

[dogday]

29. If she is happy living that kind of a life

then it is up to her.. Hard to find happiness as it is... The only thing is that it might be a terrible death-trap if a fire were ever to occur, it would go up fast....

[Triana]

31. Your mamma needs help...

...she's afflicted.

[SheWhoMustBeObeyed]

34. I was looking to see if she bought any of my stuff

Didn't see anything familiar. Maybe it's still in the box.

Seriously though, this is an illness, one that is very hard to understand. I was once in a serious relationship with someone who collected all kinds of stuff, but he kept it clean and organized.

His mother, though, did not. While the main living areas were fairly tidy, the basement and attic were crammed with old stuff that had belonged to her family, her in-law's family, the families of aunts, cousins, friends...

The enclosed back porch was piled with stacks of margarine tubs and Lean Cuisine trays that she washed and stored away, along with plastic cutlery from carry-out joints, smoothed sheets of used tinfoil, women's magazines from the 50s and 60s and other junk. Her bed was surrounded by piles of old TV Guides and National Geographics. I should have taken the hint then.

At one point this man and I planned to marry. Then we grew apart though we remained friends. After his parents died, his collections of stuff took over the house. When the house was eventually sold, he moved the entire contents - old stuff, mom's stuff, his stuff - to a tiny house where his grandparents had lived - which was still filled with their stuff.

He sold some of it at flea markets. The sets of ruby glass dinnerware, left over from the days when his dad had managed a movie theatre that held dish nights, fetched a good price. The old TV Guides sold well. But eventually he became ill and couldn't sell it, couldn't manage the clutter, and wouldn't let me clean it up. I would devote whole weekends to cleaning his place, only to hear him complain that I had thrown out something he wanted to keep, like 20-year-old cans of paint. On my next visit I would find that the spaces I had cleared had been filled up again.

I tried to get him to let me sell stuff on eBay, like handpainted china from occupied Japan that was in a room so full of junk that you couldn't even see it anymore. He could have used the money, but he refused. I found valuable vintage stuff stored with piles of unused drawing pads and drawers full of drinking straws salvaged from fast food joints. He didn't even know it was there. I should have just taken it and sold it for him.

Well, he became more and more ill and eventually passed away at the untimely age of 48. :cry: I don't know what his brothers and SILs did with everything. They were GOP snob assholes who were relieved that he wasn't around to embarrass them anymore, and they didn't even give me back my love letters (of course he kept them), much less the valuable things that I had given him over the years.

A shame. I would have sold them.

[Ivan Sputnik]

35. My wife's aunt's house is the same way

and she lives in an earthquake zone. It's extremely dangerous, because the junk is piled up high everywhere. The family has tried to hire people to help her clean out the house, but she always ends up firing them. All of her stuff is "valuable" too. It's a sad manifestation of mental illness. There's a clinical term for it that I can't remember right now.

[skids]

37. Well, I definitely don't have that beat, but...

...between the Anime Home Invasion and my own pile of gutted computer parts We're lucky to have one housemate that DEMANDS the public areas stay clean.

[never cry wolf]

39. Sighhh, all too familiar... my wife...

our house isn't there yet but my wife has the same disorder. NOTHING gets tossed... Anyone need some boys 3 yo old toddler clothes? We have em, my son is 20 now. Attic is full, garage thankfully still has room for both cars but one has to be backed in and the other pulled in forward and parked about 3" apart so there's enough room to open the driver's side door. Any passengers have to wait until we pull out. Boxes 4' deep line both sides filled with children's books, broken toys, McD kids meal toys, etc. Both cars have small dents and scratches from various minor pile avalanches.


What used to be my office, about 12' x 12' is filled head high with God knows what, the spare bedroom is the same way. The mud room/laundry has a pile of boots and shoes, some of which go back 10 years and there are smaller piles here and there. The screened in porch is now a screened in storage area, chest high. The problem is that whoever built the porch (before we bought it) placed it adjacent to the laundry room so the dryer vent empties into it. Thus everything stored in there has a 1/4" coating of lint on it.

The 2 remote corners of the living room have piles 4' high, maybe 20 sq. ft. each. She buys lladro statues on ebay. Thank goodness they're more costly than what the lady depicted in the OP buys because she can't afford as much clutter, however the curio cabinet and 3 section wall unit are packed and may collapse under the weight, she must have a couple of hundred figurines. And yes, she too saves all the boxes they came in.

The kitchen isn't too bad I guess, half the space under the table is full and the counter in the corner next to the microwave has a 3' high pile of old paperwork and mail. The cabinets and drawers are all maxed out, it is quite common to open a cabinet and have 4 or 5 things fall out. She like cups, I bet we have well over 100 cups and glasses of all sorts. Oh yeah, the top of the fridge has a pile that includes some sort of gift sausage that has been there at least 5 years.

The upstairs is also not so bad except for the above stated extra bedroom. My daughters walk in closet is full of her baby clothes (she is now 16) so she is at a disadvantage with her current wardrobe. She recently filled 3 large garbage bags and somehow managed to fit them into the spare bedroom but she is still pressed for space. Our bedroom has a pile in the corner between the dressers 4' high (i can't open the bottom half of my dresser drawers and my closet and dresser top have become the final resting place for much other floatsam and jetsam. Bathroom cabinets are about the same as the kitchen. She has a habit of using shampoo, toothpaste, etc. until it is 80% empty, open a new one and save the remaining 20%.


I have never been the neatest or most organized person but I am not a pack rat. If it hasn't been used in a year, it is not needed... I have tried to clean from time to time but somehow she senses a disturbance in the force and screams bloody murder, assuring me it's all good stuff worth keeping. Then she goes thru the garbage and puts it all back. I don't try anymore....

[seabeyond]

46. oh no just the toddler clothes and you hae me laughing. 20 huh

my mother in law even had the training potty. told her NO i was NOT going to take that HOME. lol

you cant get rid of it to shelters can you. i think it is so important to give,.... GIVE not sell that stuff. i have lots to get out now, but regularly i get those clothes to people that can use them

[never cry wolf]

50. I'll wager if I do an archeological dig

down under a few layers I'll come across our training potty too. I'd LOVE to give it away, have the salvation army send a platoon over and clean it up. But, they would need a squadron to hold my wife at bay.

[Kerrytravelers]

52. I'm sorry, but Mr. kt and I are totally cracking up at your pain.

You gotta have a sense of humor about it, or you'd be hanging at the end of a rope. My God, all that you described would drive me out of my mind!

Have you attempted to get her any professional help? i don't want to seem catty, but I"m afrid one day, you might get lost and we'd never get a never cry wolf post again!

kt

[never cry wolf]

54. LOL, I won't get lost

So far there is free walkable space everywhere but my office and the spare bedroom, it would take many years to get like the house in the OP.

She has been to a psych for depression but if anyone mentions she is not a June Cleaver type suzy homemaker, she goes into conniptions.

I am just hanging around for the kids, a few more years and they are out of the house, and I am afraid I will be too.

[skids]

66. JESUS CHRIST DUDE. Hope for another hurricane...

...then beseech your spouse to send all that clothing to the poor victims. I know, that would be horribly mean spirited and an awful thing to hope for, but noone will blame you. Desperate times call for desperate measures.

[Radio_Lady]

80. Urgent message to Never Cry Wolf -- you are enabling this!

Your wife has a treatable illness! Are you kidding me? That description nearly blew me away....

If this were diabetes, wouldn't you try to get her some professional help?

Monday, you should call a physician and get her into some therapy. This really goes WAY BEYONG being a pack rat, don't you think?

This is not funny at all. I feel sorry for you and anyone who lives with you.

I don't know what you situation really is, but please PM me if you want some TOUGH LOVE and support.

In peace,

Radio_Lady

[never cry wolf]

93. I doubt it's treatable

very complex... lil sis of a close friend, she always had a crush on me... soon after her 18th b-day (and her older sis' wedding where we danced, and she was all growed up)she was in a serious accident. Her head hit the rear passenger window and she was in a coma for a month...

don't care to go into details but she clung to me during recovery... even to the point of sneaking out of her parent's home to visit me... her family didn't like that, 18 yo mentally disabled seeing a 26 yo... i thought i could help her return to normal, my intentions were honorable.... i also tried to prove it by proposing....

some brain damage was permanent, i thought she'd recover to who she was... she has reduced motor skills on the left side, a loss of alot of memory and a sort of epilepsy that manifests in the form of temper tantrums... 5 years ago i had a more mature discussion with my then 11 yo daughter than i had ever had with my wife....

I made a boo-boo but we had kids, the 1st 19 months after i stood up and gave an oath in front of friends and family in church and said i do... i am, and always be there for my kids and have stuck it out for 20 years....

like i said, complex... to top it off i have no medical currently... i am a self employed architect and we got rescinded by blue cross for past history... they call the shots and only bet when they have an apparent winner for them...

no regrets, they are awesome and amazing humans and well worth 2 and a half decades...

[Radio_Lady]

109. Sorry, wolf. Life is complicated, isn't it?

God's grace be on you for the rest of your married life.

[marions ghost]

95. she needs help but also

he might need some serious support himself. As with most people who are making the best of a bad situation like this, the need for help for both parties is often overlooked and the "enabling" partner is judged all too harshly. This case might be intractable (like a severe alcohol dependency for example) and sometimes the best you can do is be supportive to the partner who has lived with it, sometimes out of the best of intentions.

[riona]

41. Dust Mite Central

[VolcanoJen]

42. Jeebus!!

Wow, I feel much better about myself... thank you! :-)

[DesertRat]

47. Very sad

I hope that someone can get this woman some help.

[Bombero1956]

59. dangerous

We call this a heavy fire load. She could kill herself and everybody else who lives with her. Even with smoke detectors in place and operational, a person would be hard pressed to escape without getting trapped behind those boxes and no Incident Commander would be crazy enough to send any of his people in there for fear they'd be trapped as well. Hell the woman even blocked windows which could offer a means of escape. It's wrong for her family to stand back and do nothing while she fills her house to the brim with what she considers valuable stuff.

[tabasco]

55. Well, at least the place appears generally clean.

It is very crowded and cluttered, but I don't see rotten food and garbage all over the place. I have seen much worse.

[Stephanie]

56. thank you! I saw this a few years ago and couldn't find it again!

Now it's bookmarked. :hi:

[Blue_Tires]

61. my parent's place comes pretty close!

[Sydnie]

65. WOW

Time to take mom's bank card/paypal away maybe??

[Canuckistanian]

68. And I thought our place was a shrine...

To those who never throw anything out... "just in case".

[troubleinwinter]

72. At least she is somewhat organised, unlike this Freeper computer room:

[Radio_Lady]

83. Ugh. Maybe sign should read, "Christians for Clutter" ---

Really, that is so disgusting it's hysterical.

[NJCher]

73. a friend of a friend story

But it's for real. I've known this person for 30 years and followed this story over that time.

The friend owns five pieces of valuable San Francisco real estate. She lives in one, which is filled with items like in the OP.

The other properties are filled with garage sale stuff, too. She cannot part with it! She could be getting rental income from these properties but can't bear to get rid of the "stuff."

We are talking several million in properties and a significant amount of rental income that has been lost for decades.

This woman, whose name is Karen, is incredibly neat and clean. The places are regularly cleaned and the "stuff" is kept clean, too. But she cannot part with it.

When her own mother died, she couldn't bear to part with the house, which had deteriorated significantly. She put in a lot of money for repairs and was unfortunately ripped off by con artists. Thus another useless house on which she pays real estate taxes and gains no income.

My friend, whose name is Gini, visited SF one summer with the intention of helping her clear out the stuff and get the properties rented. While she had Karen's full support at the beginning of the trip, Karen could not part with all these things.




Cher

[Radio_Lady]

85. Wow. That IS a sad story. Again, some therapy is called for.

But unless there is someone who WANTS it, it will never happen.

[0007]

74. Looks like a factory and a shipping & receiving port

Does anyone live there?

[SmokingJacket]

75. I have a great deal of trouble getting rid of stuff...

but I manage to maintain a kind of equilibrium by not acquiring stuff in the first place.

I feel like I have a certain amount of insight into this condition: once you "get rid" of something, it doesn't evaporate into thin air; it goes somewhere, and you can't really control where it goes. Will it be used by someone who needs it and appreciates it? Or will it be thrown into a landfill, where it will be wasted and unappreciated? One's lack of control in this area can create a lot of anxiety.

And the fact is: if you acquired a thing in the first place, you must have had a need or desire for it -- what if that need or desire comes back?

I'm not a materialist -- I've worn the same shoes every day for five years. But I become very committed to the objects I possess. I wouldn't be surprised if by the time I'm an old woman I'm living in a house with a few little paths marked through the piles of stuff... and that will feel okay.

A little tolerance and understanding for different ways of living can go a long way...

[NightOwwl]

86. She lives in Folsom...

that's where I live, also. I wonder if she is a neighbor of mine.

[Haole Girl]

88. I don't remember the last time I laughed so hard!

I know that woman must have one of the worst cases of Obsessive-Compulsive I've ever seen, but that was so funny.

Thanks for the post.

[OneBlueSky]

97. would someone PLEASE get this lady some help? . . . n/t

.

[TorchTheWitch]

99. My sister's husband has an illness similar to this

It's some form of OCD. Although he finds it hard to part with "things", he doesn't compulsively buy things or keep things no longer useful to the family (like the kids' baby clothes, etc.), his problem manifests itself in what he calls his "paperwork".

He writes little random meaningless details about ANYTHING on scraps of paper and keeps them in boxes perpetually "organizing" and "catagorizing" them. He spends nearly all of his free time outside of work on this "paperwork". Examples of some of the things he notes down are:

"John likes corn on the cob" (he has no idea who John is and whether or not John still likes corn on the cob since he has probably had this scrap of paper with this information for decades).

"Adam once pissed in the family tv when he was a kid just to see what would happen" (he has no idea who Adam is and why he finds this information significant)

"Lisa got an A" (he has no idea who Lisa is or what she got an "A" on or even if this "A" is a grade value of some kind)

Much of these bits of trivia are noted on such scraps of paper as old matchbook covers, backs of old receipts, and his personal favorite, that bit of blank newspaper that constitutes a margin.

You would never know he had a problem since he's so compulsive about "filing" each new scrap of trivia away immediately... there are never scraps of "notes" filling his pockets and left on furniture or otherwise lying about the house.

There are boxes and boxes filling the basement that are filled with these scaps of paper. He spends hours every day after work and hours on weekends "organizing" and "catagorizing" this trivia to the point of making several copies in order to cross-file them. Half if not more of this trivia is probably copies he's made in order to cross-file.

My sister has long since given up trying to make him understand he has a problem. And unfortunately, due to the amount of time he spends on his "paperwork" she's the one that has to do everything for the kids and the house.

Because of the fact that he finds this "paperwork" so vitally important, he misses out on the kids' sporting events, plays, family gatherings at holiday time... you name it, he's too busy for it because of this "paperwork". The times that my sister has managed to force him to attend some function, he's surly and resentful that he's being kept from what he believes is vitally important work and can't wait to leave so he can get back at it.

He absolutely refuses to believe he has a problem. He insists that this information is important and absolutely requires the time and attention he pays it. If it were up to him, he wouldn't work for a living and devote ALL his time to his "paperwork". EVERYTHING else is a disruption and an inconvenience since his sole existance is meant for doing this "paperwork". They've gone for marriage counseling, and when the subject of the "paperwork" comes up, his response is always the same... it's important, necessary and everyone who thinks it's a problem (including the counselors) just "don't understand"... in other words, it's the rest of the world that's cracked up, and he's perfectly normal. The counselors (they're on their third solely because he thinks the ones that went before are unqualified because they say he has a problem) have done everything they know how to make this guy seek help and are unsuccessful... the current counselor will get dumped just like the other two who went before for the same reason. Eventually, he'll refuse counseling at all since he'll go from what he now feels is a run of bad luck with "unqualified" counselors to believing that all counselors are crackpots.

I absolutely see a divorce in their future, and if/when that happens he'll go to his grave believing my sister was to blame for "not understanding" how important his "paperwork" is.

Once again, he was absent from the family Easter festivities because he just had all this vitally important "paperwork" needing attention. I actually haven't even seen the guy myself since my dad dies eight years ago. Haven't spoken to him either since if I go to their house he can't be disturbed from his "paperwork" to say even say hello, and he's long since stopped answering the phone since it interupts his "paperwork".

It's all so very sad and very frustrating.

[Haole Girl]

103. Wouldn't it be ironic

if some day all of those little notes could make a rather interesting coffee table book? But, more likely, they're just a fire hazard. It is very sad, and I hope his family doesn't have to suffer too much from his illness.

[LuckyLib]

106. No doubt your sister will divorce him. And should. Life is too

short to suffer living with someone who is that "out there." He needs to be alone, in his own place, doing his paperwork.

[displacedtexan]

100. Future Curb Ornaments Of America

Future Curb Ornaments Of America

FUTURE
CURB ORNAMENTS
Of AMERICA's
Rating System
Is Based On
Jean Shepherd's
(cough)
Scientifically Sound
(cough)
FRAGILE LAMP
(Is that Italian?)
Methodology:

1 Fragile Lamp
Item has at least one redeeming feature; Could be tarted up, altered or salvaged for parts

2 Fragile Lamps
Useful as firewood; Suitable for target practice

3 Fragile Lamps
Smash it on the concrete patio and put the shards back on the coffee table; Pretend you accidentally knocked it over while watering the plants in the living room; Haul it to the curb immediately
'Cause... DAMN!

The FCOOA motto: I might let you
whitewash my fence.
Maybe.
Give me your apple,
and I'll think about it.

This is my snarky-assed blog about items like the ones pictured
in the OP. It's all in fun (not meant to insult anyone's taste), even
though it may seem like it.

Anyway, I have a link in the right sidebar to a guy's site about his
parents' house, which until this OP, was the worst case of clutter
I'd ever seen.

[blue4barb]

101. Lots of feng shui books available with tips for clearing clutter.

(Not that your mother needs any more books laying around the house.)

[knitter4democracy]

107. This is what auction companies are for.

I would get her out of the house and have a company come in and have a huuuuuuggggeee auction. They could even just sell the boxes as mystery boxes or something.

Oh, btw, those glass covers to the telegraph poles tend to only by five bucks or so. They're similar to the glass bulbs on old lightning rods, which only run around five to ten bucks each. I would argue that the vast majority of that stuff is only worth around that, which, granted, is a lot of money added up, but that's what the auction company is for.

[SoCalDem]

108. The woman seems sad, depressed, defeated, demoralized

I wish her son would take her to a therapist. She must be mortified to have her illness displayed online.:cry:. he's upset, and has every reason to be, BUT he's approaching it in a very passive-aggressive way..