In court they ask him IF he ever belonged to a union (as in that is a bad thing)

[Omaha Steve]

This is from the court fight over a group trying to recall the Mayor of Omaha. From email and allowed to post the entire transcript.




This is the deposition Vince Powers conducted on Friday; transcribed by Saturday.



It is a very powerful read. When the recall attorneys couldn't get the young man to alter his description of the paid-by-signature violation of Nebraska law, they tried to attack him as unproductive, when that didn't work, they tried to link him to Forward Omaha, which they call MoveOn Omaha, or to Mayor Suttle. On page 27, the attorney attacks Baca for potential labor union ties, as if union membership would be a mark of shame or criminal intent.



Attorney J.L. Spray of Lincoln: Carry a union card?



Juan Baca: Union, no.



Spray: You ever worked for any union shop of any kind?



Baca: No, sir.



Spray: You have any skills by training?



Baca: No, sir. I'm going to school right now.



Spray: What for?



Baca: HVAC.



Spray: Have you ever been contacted by somebody in the HVAC union?



Baca: No. I just started actually December 1st was my first day of classes.



Spray: Okay, where are you going?



Baca: Elkhorn.







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baca depo.txt



1


1 IN THE DISTRICT COURT OF DOUGLAS COUNTY, NEBRASKA

2 STATE OF NEBRASKA, EX. REL. ) Case No. 1113-497
JIM SUTTLE, AND JIM SUTTLE, )
3 Individually and in his )
Official Capacity as MAYOR )
4 OF THE CITY OF OMAHA, )
NEBRASKA, )
5 )
Plaintiff, )
6 )
v. )
7 )
DAVE PHIPPS, Individually )
8 and in his Official Capacity)
as the ELECTION COMMISSIONER)
9 OF DOUGLAS COUNTY, NEBRASKA,)
) TAKEN ON BEHALF
10 Defendant. ) OF THE
) PLAINTIFF
11

12

13

14

15

16

17

18 DEPOSITION OF JUAN BACA, JR.,

19 3716 Lake Street, Omaha, NE 68111, taken at

20 3:33 p.m. on December 3, 2010, by Deanna L.

21 Maley, RPR, CCR, CSR, and General Notary Public

22 in and for the State of Nebraska, at 909 Civic

23 Center, Omaha, Nebraska.

24

25


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


2


1 APPEARANCES:

2 Mr. Vincent M. Powers For Plaintiff
VINCENT M. POWERS & ASSOCIATES
3 411 South 13th Street
Suite 300
4 Lincoln, NE 68508

5 Ms. Diane M. Carlson For Defendant
DEPUTY COUNTY ATTORNEY
6 909 Civic Center
Omaha, NE 68183
7
Mr. J. L. Spray For Jeremy Aspen
8 MATTSON RICKETTS
134 S. 13th Street
9 Suite 1200
Lincoln, NE 68508
10
Mr. John C. Chatelain For Mayor Suttle
11 CHATELAIN & MAYNARD Recall Committee
12111 Anne Street
12 Omaha, NE 68137

13

14

15

16

17

18

19

20

21

22

23

24

25


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


3


1 JUAN BACA, JR.

2 Of lawful age, being first
duly cautioned and solemnly
3 sworn as hereinafter certified,
was examined and testified as
4 follows:

5 DIRECT EXAMINATION

6 BY MR. POWERS:

00:00 7 Q. Sir, can you tell us who you are.

00:00 8 A. Name is Juan Baca.

00:01 9 Q. And your address, sir?

00:01 10 A. 3716 Lake Street.

00:01 11 Q. And I take it you got a subpoena and

00:01 12 you've come in response; correct?

00:01 13 A. Yes, sir.

00:01 14 Q. My name is Vince Powers, and I have

00:01 15 some questions for you.

00:01 16 A. All right.

00:01 17 Q. Basically let me just kind of cut to

00:01 18 the chase. My understanding is you were a paid

00:01 19 circulator, you were hired by someone to --

00:01 20 A. Yeah.

00:01 21 Q. Do you know who hired you?

00:01 22 A. It was a guy named Richard Muldrow.

00:01 23 Q. And how did he get a hold of you, do

00:01 24 you know?

00:01 25 A. I just met, I just met the dude at a


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 4


00:01 1 gas station.

00:01 2 Q. Tell --

00:01 3 A. I was in there paying my phone bill,

00:01 4 and some dude was like, hey, you know anybody

00:01 5 that's looking for a job? I was like, man, I

00:01 6 need a job. You know what I'm saying?

00:01 7 Q. Sure.

00:01 8 A. Started -- then called him up the

00:01 9 next day, went and started doing that. I didn't

00:01 10 even know -- you know what I'm saying?

00:01 11 Q. Sure.

00:01 12 A. I thought it was a hoax, to be honest

00:01 13 with you.

00:01 14 Q. But it turned out to be real?

00:01 15 A. Yeah.

00:01 16 Q. And so where did you -- after you

00:01 17 called him, where'd you meet him?

00:02 18 A. Met him down at their little office

00:02 19 on 129th.

00:02 20 Q. Okay. And what did he say to you

00:02 21 your job --

00:02 22 A. Matter of fact, I didn't meet him

00:02 23 down there. I met him like on 120th where that

00:02 24 Menards is.

00:02 25 Q. Sure.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 5


00:02 1 A. Yeah, I met him right there.

00:02 2 Q. And what did he tell you to do?

00:02 3 A. Just pretty much told me to -- got to

00:02 4 stand there, people -- you know what I mean?

00:02 5 People come by, read it, read the thing to them,

00:02 6 and you know what I'm saying, they sign it. I

00:02 7 mean, he really -- to be honest with you, I

00:02 8 thought the whole thing was pretty much like a

00:02 9 joke, because how he was explaining it, you know

00:02 10 what I'm saying, he didn't really tell me how to

00:02 11 do it and everything, you know what I'm saying?

00:02 12 He just was pretty much -- just a dude from out

00:02 13 of town too, you know what I'm saying?

00:02 14 Q. Sure.

00:02 15 A. And they wasn't paying me right, so I

00:02 16 ended up just saying forget it, you know what I'm

00:02 17 saying, and stopped doing it.

00:02 18 Q. What do you mean they weren't paying

00:02 19 you right?

00:02 20 A. Because they said you ain't supposed

00:02 21 to be get paid by the signature in the state of

00:02 22 Nebraska, you're supposed to get paid by the

00:02 23 hour, and he was trying to get me to get paid by

00:03 24 the signature. You know what I'm saying? So I

00:03 25 was like forget that.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 6


00:03 1 Q. Well, actually I don't know what

00:03 2 you're saying, and that's why we asked you to

00:03 3 come down. And I'm not trying to be a smart

00:03 4 aleck --

00:03 5 A. Yeah.

00:03 6 Q. -- when I say I don't know what

00:03 7 you're saying, but tell me what -- what do you

00:03 8 mean by trying to get you to be paid by the

00:03 9 signature?

00:03 10 A. Because he was like saying like say

00:03 11 every 10 signatures, you get $10. You know what

00:03 12 I'm saying?

00:03 13 Q. Sure. That I get.

00:03 14 A. Yeah. Instead it was supposed to be,

00:03 15 you know, $10 an hour like he said how it was

00:03 16 supposed to be.

00:03 17 Q. He changed the deal on you after he

00:03 18 got you there?

00:03 19 A. Yeah, changed the deal on me.

00:03 20 Q. I take it, sir, just like anybody

00:03 21 else, a deal's a deal and if you're not going to

00:03 22 honor the deal, I walk?

00:03 23 A. Right.

00:03 24 MR. SPRAY: Objection. Foundation.

00:03 25 Q. Is that fair?


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 7


00:03 1 A. Yeah.

00:03 2 Q. All right. You did gather a number

00:03 3 of signatures though --

00:03 4 A. Yes, sir.

00:03 5 Q. -- prior to that time. How did you

00:03 6 figure out -- excuse me. Do you know -- what

00:03 7 would you say to people? How would you do it?

00:03 8 A. Like people would come in and be

00:03 9 like, hey, where do we sign that? Be like just

00:03 10 sign right here, down here. And they'd come, be

00:03 11 like how you doing today, and I'd read it to

00:04 12 them, read the red letters to them, and you know

00:04 13 what I'm saying, read that, and then they'd just

00:04 14 sign it.

00:04 15 Q. And unfortunately all mine are -- my

00:04 16 petitions I don't have any red letters.

00:04 17 A. It's the reason for the recall and

00:04 18 then his defense.

00:04 19 Q. Okay. And you would read all that?

00:04 20 A. Yep.

00:04 21 Q. All right. And we just -- we have an

00:04 22 original here for you, sir.

00:04 23 A. Yep.

00:04 24 Q. Did you always read the defense?

00:04 25 A. To be honest with you -- I mean, I


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 8


00:04 1 would still read it to them, but, you know, they

00:04 2 really ain't supposed to give them the pen

00:04 3 until -- you know what I'm saying? He didn't

00:04 4 even explain this to us, but you know what I'm

00:04 5 saying? Like I'd have it and someone like -- say

00:04 6 someone would have their own pen or something, be

00:04 7 like, well, I have to read this to you, be like

00:04 8 oh, yeah, I know, I know, I know. You know what

00:04 9 I'm saying? I don't care about all that, I just

00:04 10 want to get that rat bastard out of here --

00:04 11 Q. Right.

00:04 12 A. -- you know, stuff like that. You

00:04 13 know what I'm saying?

00:04 14 Q. So --

00:04 15 A. But I'd still be reading it to them.

00:04 16 Q. You were trying to do what --

00:04 17 A. Yeah.

00:04 18 Q. -- you were supposed to do, but

00:05 19 sometimes they didn't want to hear it?

00:05 20 A. Right.

00:05 21 Q. Let's go back to the being paid by

00:05 22 the signature. When did he try to switch the

00:05 23 thing on you?

00:05 24 A. I mean, like first two days was cool

00:05 25 and he, you know what I'm saying, he paid us for


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 9


00:05 1 that. But then like the third day like he

00:05 2 started, he started that stuff. And I was like,

00:05 3 man, it's cold out here, I'm not about to do

00:05 4 this. You know what I'm saying?

00:05 5 Q. You were outside?

00:05 6 A. Yeah, standing outside and stuff.

00:05 7 Q. When you said we, who were the

00:05 8 others?

00:05 9 A. It was me, and to be honest with you,

00:05 10 my brother was doing it.

00:05 11 Q. And what's his name, sir?

00:05 12 A. He's right out here. His name is

00:05 13 Cirilo, Cirilo Baca. And to be honest with you,

00:05 14 after we got done with it, come to find out he

00:05 15 wasn't even supposed to be doing it.

00:05 16 Q. Why not?

00:05 17 A. Because I think you supposed to be

00:05 18 19, ain't you?

00:05 19 Q. Actually, I'm not sure. How old's

00:05 20 Cirilo?

00:05 21 A. He's 18.

00:05 22 Q. All right.

00:05 23 A. And I think on the thing it said you

00:05 24 got to be 19.

00:05 25 Q. Okay. And then what did he -- what


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 10


00:05 1 were his words -- and I should ask you, have you

00:06 2 ever had your deposition taken before, sir?

00:06 3 A. What's that?

00:06 4 Q. This stuff, you ever had a lawyer ask

00:06 5 you questions under oath before?

00:06 6 A. No, not like this.

00:06 7 Q. All right. And I should have told

00:06 8 you, if you don't understand my question, just

00:06 9 tell me you don't understand it, I'll repeat it,

00:06 10 I won't be insulted. But this is important, if

00:06 11 you can recall the words he used to say I want to

00:06 12 do it by signature.

00:06 13 A. Yeah. Well, he was exactly like --

00:06 14 MR. SPRAY: Objection. Foundation.

00:06 15 Q. You may answer. Go on.

00:06 16 A. He was like, well -- first he's

00:06 17 like -- you know, when I first met him, $10 an

00:06 18 hour, everything was all good; right?

00:06 19 Q. Right.

00:06 20 A. But then that third day he was like,

00:06 21 well, if you stand out here, he was like if you

00:06 22 get -- no, matter of fact he called me up and he

00:06 23 was like, hey, he was like how many signatures

00:06 24 you got? I was like 10. And he was like you

00:06 25 been out there for about four hours, huh? I was


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 11


00:06 1 like yeah. He was like, well, you could either

00:06 2 go home now or he was like we're going to

00:07 3 start -- you're going to have to get

00:07 4 eight hours of -- 10 hours -- 10 signatures to

00:07 5 get -- in order to get paid the $10. Then at

00:07 6 first I was like all right. You know what I'm

00:07 7 saying? But I just needed the money so I was

00:07 8 like all right.

00:07 9 Q. So you did it?

00:07 10 A. Yeah, I did it for like a day, like

00:07 11 two more days, and then after that I was just

00:07 12 like, man, this shit ain't paying off. That's

00:07 13 exactly how he said it though.

00:07 14 Q. And then, sir, I got a question, did

00:07 15 you get paid for all your time, by the way?

00:07 16 A. No, I didn't.

00:07 17 Q. How much do they owe you?

00:07 18 A. Be honest with you, man, they owe me

00:07 19 like for all the hours I was putting in and

00:07 20 stuff. I mean, they -- I'd have to say at least

00:07 21 like three days.

00:07 22 Q. Okay.

00:07 23 A. And this dude's from out of town too

00:07 24 and he was working with them from Colorado or

00:07 25 something.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 12


00:07 1 Q. Was he collecting signatures too?

00:07 2 A. Yeah.

00:07 3 Q. Okay.

00:07 4 A. And he's the one that had hired me

00:07 5 and my brother.

00:07 6 Q. Did you see him get signatures, the

00:07 7 guy from Colorado?

00:07 8 A. Most of the time I seen him just

00:07 9 driving around, you know.

00:08 10 Q. All right. But -- and he was the one

00:08 11 who didn't pay you though?

00:08 12 A. Yeah.

00:08 13 Q. Okay. Do you know -- besides your

00:08 14 brother, do you know anyone else who was paid to

00:08 15 do this?

00:08 16 A. Personally?

00:08 17 Q. Personally, yeah.

00:08 18 A. Personally. I mean, I don't know

00:08 19 anybody personally, but, you know what I'm

00:08 20 saying, I met some people doing it.

00:08 21 Q. Okay. Do you know their names now?

00:08 22 A. No.

00:08 23 Q. Maybe a better way, any way I could

00:08 24 find them?

00:08 25 A. I think they were hiring people from


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


DIRECT - BACA (Powers) 13


00:08 1 the temp service.

00:08 2 Q. Do you know which one?

00:08 3 A. I think the one out of South Omaha.

00:08 4 Q. Okay.

00:08 5 A. They were hiring people out of there.

00:08 6 Q. Okay. What happened when you asked

00:08 7 for your money for the three days? How come he

00:08 8 didn't pay you?

00:08 9 A. I mean, because he made it seem

00:08 10 like -- because I didn't know this until, you

00:08 11 know what I'm saying, I was reading the paper.

00:08 12 And it said under something, something, something

00:09 13 that they're not supposed to be getting paid by

00:09 14 the signature, it's by the hour in the state of

00:09 15 Nebraska. You know what I'm saying?

00:09 16 Q. Yeah.

00:09 17 A. That's when I figured it out, but by

00:09 18 that time, you know, it was already over with.

00:09 19 Q. You were already -- what I hear you

00:09 20 saying, sir, and if I'm wrong tell me --

00:09 21 A. All right.

00:09 22 Q. -- I hear you saying you didn't like

00:09 23 the fact he changed the deal on you --

00:09 24 A. Yeah.

00:09 25 Q. -- so you quit, and then later you


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 14


00:09 1 read he wasn't supposed to be doing that anyway?

00:09 2 A. Yeah.

00:09 3 MR. POWERS: All right. I got

00:09 4 nothing further. Thank you.

00:09 5 CROSS-EXAMINATION

00:09 6 BY MR. CHATELAIN:

00:09 7 Q. I've got a few questions. One, what

00:09 8 did you say your address was?

00:09 9 A. 3716 Lake Street.

00:09 10 Q. And how long have you lived at that

00:09 11 address?

00:09 12 A. Lived there for about two years.

00:09 13 Q. How long have you lived in Omaha?

00:09 14 A. Pretty much my whole life, but I

00:09 15 went -- graduate -- I did a year of high school

00:09 16 in South Dakota and then I came back.

00:09 17 Q. How old are you?

00:09 18 A. Twenty.

00:10 19 Q. I'm not quite clear on what your

00:10 20 testimony was. You said you were -- you started

00:10 21 out being paid by the hour?

00:10 22 A. Yes.

00:10 23 Q. And who, who was it that was paying

00:10 24 you by the hour?

00:10 25 A. Name was Richard Muldrow,


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 15


00:10 1 M-U-L-D-R-O-W.

00:10 2 Q. And how many, how many days did you

00:10 3 work while being paid by the hour?

00:10 4 A. Two days.

00:10 5 Q. Two days?

00:10 6 A. Yes, sir. And the first day was like

00:10 7 six hours, and I still got it written on my

00:10 8 calendar, second day was like nine, then that

00:10 9 third day, you know what I'm saying, he paid us

00:10 10 for our hours and stuff and then everything just

00:10 11 switched up after that.

00:10 12 Q. And on the -- after the --

00:10 13 MR. POWERS: Excuse me, everything

00:10 14 switched up?

00:10 15 A. I mean, that's when he started trying

00:10 16 to get us to go by the signature.

00:10 17 Q. Okay. Did he say I'm going to pay

00:10 18 you so much a signature, or did he say you've

00:10 19 either got to get a certain number of signatures

00:11 20 a day or else we can't have you as an employee

00:11 21 any longer?

00:11 22 A. No, he didn't say it like that. He

00:11 23 was pretty much saying like it's up to you, you

00:11 24 know, how many signatures you could get. You

00:11 25 know what I'm saying?


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 16


00:11 1 Q. Did he ever offer you a certain

00:11 2 figure per signature?

00:11 3 A. Yeah, $10 -- in order to get $10 an

00:11 4 hour, you'd have to get 10 signatures an hour.

00:11 5 That ain't even right, man. You know what I'm

00:11 6 saying? Ain't going to get 10 signatures an

00:11 7 hour.

00:11 8 Q. Did you, did you work at all under,

00:11 9 under those terms? Did you work at any -- at all

00:11 10 when you were offered $10 an hour for 10

00:11 11 signatures an hour?

00:11 12 A. See, he was like, well, do you want

00:11 13 to go home or do you want to keep on doing it? I

00:11 14 was like, well, you know, I needed the money, so

00:11 15 I'm like, well, I'm going to keep doing it. And

00:11 16 I did it for a little bit, and then, you know

00:11 17 what I'm saying, that's when it kind of started

00:11 18 getting real cold and I was still out there and

00:11 19 he wasn't paying me. You know what I'm saying?

00:11 20 I'd be out there for eight hours and get paid 20

00:12 21 bucks. I'm like, man, you know what I'm saying,

00:12 22 I can't do this. You know what I'm saying?

00:12 23 Q. So you're talking about two days

00:12 24 where you worked by the hour?

00:12 25 A. For the hour, yes.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 17


00:12 1 Q. And then the third day you felt that

00:12 2 the terms were changed --

00:12 3 A. Yeah.

00:12 4 Q. -- that you were going to be paid

00:12 5 only if you produced a certain number of

00:12 6 signatures per hour?

00:12 7 A. Yeah. And I didn't know if --

00:12 8 Q. And did you -- how many hours did you

00:12 9 work that day?

00:12 10 A. That day, probably worked about

00:12 11 eight.

00:12 12 Q. About eight hours?

00:12 13 A. Yeah.

00:12 14 Q. And how many days did you work all

00:12 15 total in the program?

00:12 16 A. Total? Let's see. You got a

00:12 17 calendar or something? Let's see, all

00:12 18 together -- I think I got one on my phone. The

00:12 19 19th they was done, 11-19; right? Ain't that

00:12 20 when they was done, when they got done, when they

00:13 21 had to put in all the papers was the 19th, wasn't

00:13 22 it?

00:13 23 Q. You have to answer the question.

00:13 24 A. All right.

00:13 25 Q. How many days all total did you work?


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 18


00:13 1 A. Let me see. Trying to figure out

00:13 2 exactly the exact date. If I had my calendar, I

00:13 3 could tell you.

00:13 4 Q. So do you know or do you not know how

00:13 5 many days you worked all total?

00:13 6 MR. POWERS: Let's let him look.

00:13 7 Sir, I got a calendar here if that helps you at

00:13 8 all.

00:13 9 THE WITNESS: No, it's cool.

00:13 10 MR. POWERS: All right.

00:13 11 A. At least about, about nine, 10 days.

00:13 12 Q. You worked about nine or 10 days?

00:13 13 A. Nine or 10 days.

00:13 14 Q. So then you testified that the first

00:13 15 two days you worked on an hourly basis?

00:13 16 A. Yeah. And after that --

00:13 17 Q. And starting the third day you were

00:13 18 being paid by the signature?

00:13 19 A. Yes, sir.

00:13 20 Q. And, and so you worked under those

00:14 21 terms then for would have been about seven days?

00:14 22 A. Yes, sir. Yep. I told him, man, I

00:14 23 was -- you know, people would ask me too, he's

00:14 24 like, you know, to be honest with you, I don't

00:14 25 even care about the politics. You know what I'm


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 19


00:14 1 saying? I'm just trying to get paid, and that's

00:14 2 that.

00:14 3 Q. Uh-huh.

00:14 4 A. I didn't know I'd be sitting here

00:14 5 today.

00:14 6 Q. Are you grinning for any reason other

00:14 7 than the fact that you thought that was funny?

00:14 8 MR. POWERS: Now, I object to that.

00:14 9 That was not a fair representation. I was also

00:14 10 grinning when he said he didn't think he'd be

00:14 11 here having lawyers ask him questions, I found

00:14 12 that --

00:14 13 A. Just kind of, you know, because, you

00:14 14 know, what I realized is a lot of people are real

00:14 15 serious about it, you know, they take it to

00:14 16 heart. I had people sitting there trying to

00:14 17 harass me and stuff like that. You know what I'm

00:14 18 saying? So people are really for him or against

00:15 19 him. You know what I mean? And me, I'm neither

00:15 20 for him or against him. I don't even --

00:15 21 Q. When you worked the first two days

00:15 22 and you were supposedly working on an hourly

00:15 23 basis, approximately how many signatures would

00:15 24 you garner in a day's time?

00:15 25 A. Let's see, the first two days was


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 20


00:15 1 actually running pretty good. I was on that

00:15 2 Hy-Vee at -- Hy-Vee right by the Post Office on

00:15 3 30th. First day I got about -- I was out there

00:15 4 about, let's see -- first day I was out there

00:15 5 about six hours and I got about like a good 40

00:15 6 something, 50 signatures. Second day was

00:15 7 something like that too, but I put in more hours.

00:15 8 And you could probably look at my sheets, it

00:15 9 would probably tell you that.

00:15 10 Q. You testified that some supervisor

00:15 11 told you that you wouldn't be able to continue

00:15 12 working unless you generated a certain number of

00:15 13 signatures; right?

00:15 14 A. Yeah.

00:15 15 Q. Would that have been because they

00:15 16 felt that you weren't working hard enough or you

00:15 17 weren't being productive enough?

00:15 18 A. It was that I wasn't getting enough

00:16 19 signatures. You know, and some spots would be

00:16 20 hotter than other spots. You know what I mean?

00:16 21 That's when I was just like, man.

00:16 22 Q. So might it have been possible that

00:16 23 they actually were not paying you per signature,

00:16 24 but they were just saying unless you start

00:16 25 producing more work, then we can't continue


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


CROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 21


00:16 1 hiring you?

00:16 2 MR. POWERS: Object --

00:16 3 A. No, it was not like that at all. It

00:16 4 was by the signature. And it wasn't like we was

00:16 5 sitting there. He didn't even tell us we get two

00:16 6 breaks. You know what I'm saying? Until, you

00:16 7 know -- I mean, I already knew you get a certain

00:16 8 amount of breaks.

00:16 9 Q. Was there, was there anything in

00:16 10 writing with respect to the terms of your

00:16 11 employment?

00:16 12 A. I filled out the W-2 and all that, or

00:16 13 whatever the court -- I mean, the work papers.

00:16 14 Q. Was there anything in writing to show

00:16 15 that you were going to be paid by the hour versus

00:16 16 by the signature?

00:16 17 A. It was more than -- I ain't got

00:16 18 nothing in writing, but I guarantee that there

00:16 19 was a lot of people that I talked to, and I was

00:16 20 like, man, we supposed to be getting paid and

00:16 21 they'd tell you, you know, you're supposed to get

00:17 22 paid by the hour. They even had the temp people,

00:17 23 you can use that as evidence, you know what I'm

00:17 24 saying? They get paid $10 an hour no matter what

00:17 25 because they working out of the temp so the


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 22


00:17 1 temp's got to pay them. You know what I'm

00:17 2 saying? So the committee had to pay the temps in

00:17 3 order for them to get their money.

00:17 4 MR. CHATELAIN: I don't believe I

00:17 5 have any further questions.

00:17 6 FURTHER CROSS-EXAMINATION

00:17 7 BY MR. SPRAY:

00:17 8 Q. I have a couple, sir.

00:17 9 A. All right.

00:17 10 Q. How did you keep track of your hours

00:17 11 those nine days?

00:17 12 A. The first, first two days, you know,

00:17 13 we were keeping track and I would just write on

00:17 14 my calendar.

00:17 15 Q. On your calendar?

00:17 16 A. Yeah, on my calendar. And he'd write

00:17 17 it --

00:17 18 Q. Do you still have that?

00:17 19 A. Yeah, I do.

00:17 20 Q. Where is it?

00:17 21 A. It's at home. And he would --

00:17 22 Q. Can we get a copy of it? Can I look

00:17 23 at it?

00:17 24 A. Send you like -- it's at home, I'd

00:17 25 have to --


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 23


00:17 1 Q. Could you drop it off back here

00:17 2 tomorrow?

00:17 3 A. Yeah, I could do that.

00:17 4 MR. POWERS: No. Tomorrow's

00:17 5 Saturday, so I don't think --

00:17 6 Q. Let's do it Monday. Could you drop

00:17 7 it back off here Monday?

00:17 8 MR. POWERS: I don't think anybody's

00:17 9 working here tomorrow.

00:17 10 A. What is it -- you know, I just wrote

00:17 11 it down, but then after that we were going by a

00:17 12 signature, number of signatures. And he would

00:18 13 say -- my brother would tell you the same thing.

00:18 14 You know what I'm saying?

00:18 15 Q. But you didn't then keep track of

00:18 16 your hours?

00:18 17 A. He wrote them down too because he had

00:18 18 a little section --

00:18 19 Q. Richard Muldrow?

00:18 20 A. Yeah. And he had little pieces of

00:18 21 paper too that, you know what I'm saying, he'd

00:18 22 put down how many hours we worked and, you know,

00:18 23 this and that, but I knew in the back of my mind

00:18 24 this dude is messing with us, he's messing us up

00:18 25 on our money. I just never really -- you know


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 24


00:18 1 what I'm saying? I was just going with it like

00:18 2 all right, man.

00:18 3 Q. You've never reconciled, and by that

00:18 4 I mean you've never sat down and -- with

00:18 5 Mr. Muldrow and showed him the hours you've

00:18 6 worked and how it compares to your paycheck?

00:18 7 A. Yeah, actually I did. You know, I

00:18 8 sat there, it was one day, it was cold, real cold

00:18 9 day. You know what I'm saying? I was like --

00:18 10 Q. I understand what a cold day's like.

00:18 11 A. Yeah. I was like, man, I was like,

00:18 12 dude, I was like I've been out there for -- I've

00:18 13 been out there for eight hours and I was like --

00:18 14 because he was only going to give me two hours'

00:18 15 worth of time. You know what I'm saying? So

00:18 16 I've been out there for eight hours, man. I was

00:19 17 like, man, let me get at least half of that, 40,

00:19 18 you know what I'm saying? And he was like, no,

00:19 19 man, I can't even do that, you know what I'm

00:19 20 saying? And the dude, the dude was actually --

00:19 21 Q. Richard Muldrow?

00:19 22 A. Yeah. I mean, this dude's sitting

00:19 23 there, you know what I'm saying, the dude ain't

00:19 24 no professional, first of all, you know, he's

00:19 25 sitting there dressing -- you know what I'm


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 25


00:19 1 saying? He don't even dress like a professional.

00:19 2 The dude actually, you know what I'm saying,

00:19 3 smoking weed and stuff like that, you know what

00:19 4 I'm saying? So he ain't no professional, so the

00:19 5 whole thing was pretty much a joke. You know

00:19 6 what I'm saying?

00:19 7 Q. So how did he -- the day you got

00:19 8 40 -- did you say $40 for two hours?

00:19 9 A. He actually gave me two hours, so it

00:19 10 was $20.

00:19 11 Q. $20.

00:19 12 A. And I would try to ask him for --

00:19 13 Q. What day was that, I mean the first,

00:19 14 second, fifth, eighth?

00:19 15 A. It was probably about the, about the

00:19 16 fifth day.

00:19 17 Q. So on the fifth day he was trying to

00:19 18 pay you by the hour?

00:19 19 A. Yeah, because my mom was telling me

00:19 20 too, like, this ain't right, man.

00:19 21 Q. Wait. I don't know what your mom's

00:20 22 involvement is in this.

00:20 23 A. Oh, yeah.

00:20 24 Q. I don't want to know right now.

00:20 25 A. Yeah.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 26


00:20 1 Q. Just hang on.

00:20 2 A. All right.

00:20 3 Q. I'm trying to understand on the fifth

00:20 4 day that you worked for Mr. Muldrow --

00:20 5 A. I went and complained to him, yeah.

00:20 6 Q. You worked for however long --

00:20 7 A. Yeah.

00:20 8 Q. -- and he said you only worked

00:20 9 two hours?

00:20 10 A. Yeah.

00:20 11 Q. And he paid you $20, which would be

00:20 12 $10 --

00:20 13 A. Yes, sir.

00:20 14 Q. -- for two hours?

00:20 15 A. Yes, sir.

00:20 16 Q. And you complained?

00:20 17 A. Yeah.

00:20 18 Q. And he doubled the money and gave you

00:20 19 40?

00:20 20 A. No, he didn't.

00:20 21 Q. You asked him to?

00:20 22 A. Yeah, I asked him to, but he said he

00:20 23 couldn't do it.

00:20 24 Q. Do you know how many hours you worked

00:20 25 that fifth day?


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 27


00:20 1 A. About eight hours.

00:20 2 Q. Do you have a record of that? Did

00:20 3 you keep that on your calendar?

00:20 4 A. Yeah.

00:20 5 Q. And that's the calendar you're going

00:20 6 to drop off here on Monday?

00:20 7 A. Yeah.

00:20 8 Q. Okay. And Ms. Carlson's going to

00:20 9 give you a card, and you can just attach it to it

00:20 10 when you drop that back off. Is that okay?

00:20 11 A. Yep.

00:20 12 Q. Now -- I'm just going to need a

00:21 13 minute here.

00:21 14 THE WITNESS: You got to do this for

00:21 15 every circulator?

00:21 16 MR. POWERS: We might.

00:21 17 THE WITNESS: For real?

00:21 18 BY MR. SPRAY:

00:21 19 Q. Besides getting this subpoena from

00:21 20 Mr. Powers, has anyone else talked to you about

00:21 21 this matter?

00:21 22 A. Nobody.

00:21 23 Q. Do you have any idea how Mr. Powers

00:21 24 could have known to send you a subpoena?

00:21 25 A. How --


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 28


00:21 1 Q. Did you contact him and tell him you

00:22 2 had a story you wanted to tell?

00:22 3 A. No, sir.

00:22 4 Q. So you've never --

00:22 5 A. To be honest --

00:22 6 Q. -- talked to Mr. Powers before today?

00:22 7 A. -- never seen him in my life.

00:22 8 MR. POWERS: It's okay.

00:22 9 Q. How about somebody from the mayor's

00:22 10 office?

00:22 11 A. No. And to be honest with you, my

00:22 12 mom called me yesterday said, hey, man, some

00:22 13 people just delivered some paper, you got to go

00:22 14 to court. Back of my mind I'm thinking, man, you

00:22 15 know what I'm saying, I got -- you know what I'm

00:22 16 saying? Now I got to go to court, man, what they

00:22 17 trying to hit me with, you know what I'm saying?

00:22 18 That's what I'm thinking. That's when she told

00:22 19 me, she was like, no, some guy said it's

00:22 20 something about that Jim Suttle stuff, you got to

00:22 21 go to court tomorrow at 3, you know what I'm

00:22 22 saying?

00:22 23 Q. So no one from MoveOn.omaha or the

00:22 24 mayor's office has ever talked to you about this

00:22 25 circulation business?


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER CROSS - BACA (Spray) 29


00:22 1 A. No, sir.

00:22 2 Q. No one's ever talked to your mom

00:22 3 about it?

00:22 4 A. No, sir.

00:22 5 Q. And after November 19th -- that's the

00:22 6 last day you circulated; right?

00:22 7 A. Uh-huh.

00:22 8 Q. Yes?

00:22 9 A. Yes, sir.

00:22 10 Q. Have you spoken with anyone about

00:23 11 circulating petitions prior to today?

00:23 12 A. No.

00:23 13 Q. Not a soul?

00:23 14 A. I mean, my brother, you know, we

00:23 15 might have said something like, yeah, man, that

00:23 16 was a joke or something like that, but you don't

00:23 17 go sit there and go talk to your friends. Yeah,

00:23 18 man, you know, I went and did this, because to be

00:23 19 honest with you, I ain't too proud of doing that

00:23 20 stuff, you know what I'm saying?

00:23 21 Q. Carry a union card?

00:23 22 A. Union, no.

00:23 23 Q. You ever worked for any union shop of

00:23 24 any kind?

00:23 25 A. No, sir.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


REDIRECT - BACA (Powers) 30


00:23 1 Q. You have any skills by training?

00:23 2 A. No, sir. I'm going to school right

00:23 3 now.

00:23 4 Q. What for?

00:23 5 A. HVAC.

00:23 6 Q. Have you ever been contacted by

00:23 7 somebody in the HVAC union?

00:23 8 A. No. I just started actually

00:23 9 December 1st was my first day of classes.

00:23 10 Q. Okay. Where are you going?

00:23 11 A. Elkhorn.

00:23 12 MR. SPRAY: Good. I wish you well.

00:23 13 I think that's it.

00:23 14 MR. CHATELAIN: Just a couple more,

00:23 15 is that possible?

00:24 16 MR. POWERS: Well, I'll ask a

00:24 17 question, then you can.

00:24 18 MR. CHATELAIN: You go ahead.

00:24 19 REDIRECT EXAMINATION

00:24 20 BY MR. POWERS:

00:24 21 Q. Just so we're clear, sir, you've

00:24 22 never met me?

00:24 23 A. No.

00:24 24 Q. You've never talked to me?

00:24 25 A. No.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


REDIRECT - BACA (Powers) 31


00:24 1 Q. You don't know who I am and you

00:24 2 don't -- in fact, I guess I did say I do

00:24 3 represent the mayor on this thing, but --

00:24 4 A. To be honest with you, I really don't

00:24 5 even care about all that.

00:24 6 Q. That was going to be my next

00:24 7 question. You don't care one way or the other,

00:24 8 do you?

00:24 9 A. I met the guy.

00:24 10 Q. Okay.

00:24 11 A. I used to work at the stadium,

00:24 12 Rosenblatt, he was there all the time.

00:24 13 Q. What'd you do?

00:24 14 A. Catering, bartending.

00:24 15 Q. Ever meet Ed Sobczyk, the guy who

00:24 16 sold the tickets?

00:24 17 A. One day he came in the elevator with

00:24 18 SOB hat on, and then he was like -- you know,

00:24 19 when I met him he seemed cool, you know what I'm

00:24 20 saying?

00:24 21 Q. Sir, please don't feel insulted by

00:24 22 this question, but have you told us the truth

00:24 23 today?

00:24 24 A. Yes, sir.

00:24 25 MR. POWERS: Thank you very much.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


RECROSS - BACA (Chatelain) 32


00:24 1 Thank you.

00:24 2 RECROSS-EXAMINATION

00:24 3 BY MR. CHATELAIN:

00:24 4 Q. Just a couple more, if I might. You

00:24 5 indicated that you got some paperwork and that

00:24 6 your mother said you've got to go to court?

00:25 7 A. Yeah.

00:25 8 Q. Have you been in court before?

00:25 9 A. Yes, sir.

00:25 10 Q. Like how many times would you say?

00:25 11 A. Let's see, I had -- got an MIP last

00:25 12 year, minor in possession, and then all the other

00:25 13 stuff, just juvenile stuff, juvenile court.

00:25 14 Q. And has anybody ever offered you any

00:25 15 pay with respect to this matter other than what

00:25 16 you've talked about?

00:25 17 A. No, sir. Wish they could offer me

00:25 18 some money, man, because I need some damn money.

00:25 19 I should have tried to sue --

00:25 20 Q. Your contention --

00:25 21 A. I should have sued that dude, had me

00:25 22 standing out there in the cold for all them damn

00:25 23 hours.

00:25 24 MR. CHATELAIN: I think nothing

00:25 25 further.


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER RECROSS - BACA (Spray) 33


00:25 1 FURTHER RECROSS-EXAMINATION

00:25 2 BY MR. SPRAY:

00:25 3 Q. One more question. When was the last

00:25 4 time that you had work at Rosenblatt?

00:25 5 A. Last time was -- wasn't the last

00:25 6 Nighthawks game, it was the one before that, like

00:26 7 about a few weeks ago, three weeks ago or

00:26 8 something.

00:26 9 Q. Was that that championship game?

00:26 10 A. Yeah.

00:26 11 Q. You worked at that?

00:26 12 A. Yeah.

00:26 13 Q. And did you see the mayor that night?

00:26 14 A. No.

00:26 15 Q. Did you see this Mr. Ed --

00:26 16 A. No.

00:26 17 MR. POWERS: Ed Sobczyk, he sold the

00:26 18 College World Series tickets for 40 years. One

00:26 19 of my good friends is his son who helps do it,

00:26 20 and he's always at the College World Series.

00:26 21 MR. CHATELAIN: I wish I could

00:26 22 object on grounds of relevance.

00:26 23 MR. POWERS: You can. But it's

00:26 24 S-O-B-C-Z-Y-K.

00:26 25 THE WITNESS: SOB. Man, he seemed


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


FURTHER RECROSS - BACA (Spray) 34


00:26 1 like a cool dude, man.

00:26 2 MR. SPRAY: Thank you, Juan. Wish

00:26 3 you well in school, that's great.

00:26 4 MR. POWERS: Sir, real quick. You

00:26 5 have the right to read this and sign it which

00:26 6 means -- or you can waive it. And I tell you go

00:26 7 ahead and waive. She knows what she's doing.

00:26 8 THE WITNESS: All right. Waive it.

00:26 9 (The deposition was concluded at the

00:26 10 hour of 3:59 p.m.)

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THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


35


1 - C E R T I F I C A T E -

2

3 STATE OF NEBRASKA )
) ss.
4 COUNTY OF DOUGLAS )

5 I, Deanna L. Maley, RPR, CCR, CSR, and

6 General Notary Public in and for the State of

7 Nebraska, do hereby certify that JUAN BACA, JR. Was

8 by me duly sworn to testify the truth, the whole

9 truth and nothing but the truth, and that the

10 deposition by him as above set forth was reduced to

11 writing by me.

12 That the within and foregoing deposition

13 was taken by me at the time and place herein

14 specified and in accordance with the within

15 stipulations, the reading and signing of the

16 witness to his deposition having been waived.

17 That I am not counsel, attorney or

18 relative of either party or otherwise interested in

19 the event of this suit.

20 IN TESTIMONY WHEREOF, I have placed my

21 hand and notarial seal this 4th day of December,

22 2010.

23 _____________________

24 GENERAL NOTARY PUBLIC

25 COST: $


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]


36


1 IN THE DISTRICT COURT OF DOUGLAS COUNTY, NEBRASKA

2 STATE OF NEBRASKA, EX. REL. ) Case No. 1113-497
JIM SUTTLE, AND JIM SUTTLE, )
3 Individually and in his )
Official Capacity as MAYOR )
4 OF THE CITY OF OMAHA, )
NEBRASKA, )
5 )
Plaintiff, )
6 )
v. )
7 )
DAVE PHIPPS, Individually )
8 and in his Official Capacity)
as the ELECTION COMMISSIONER)
9 OF DOUGLAS COUNTY, NEBRASKA,)
)
10 Defendant. )
)
11
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER
12
I, Deanna L. Maley, RPR, CCR, CSR, and
13 General Notary Public, do hereby certify that I
served as the Court Reporter at the deposition of
14 JUAN BACA, JR. on December 3, 2010, at 909 Civic
Center, Omaha, Nebraska, in which the costs of
15 reporting and transcribing the deposition were
$ , and that such costs are to be paid by
16 counsel for the Plaintiff.
I further certify that the original and
17 copies were sent to: Original and 1 copy to
Mr. Vincent M. Powers; 1 copy to Ms. Diane M.
18 Carlson; 1 copy to J. L. Spray; 1 copy to Mr.
John C. Chatelain.
19 Dated this 4th day of December, 2010.

20 Delivered: __________

21
____________________________
22 GENERAL NOTARY PUBLIC
Deanna L. Maley, RPR, CCR, CSR
23 Thibault, Suhr & Thibault, Inc.
6818 Grover Street, Suite 107
24 Omaha, Nebraska 68106
[phone]
25


THIBAULT, SUHR & THIBAULT, INC.
Omaha, Nebraska [phone]