Richard Dawkins on whether the bible is moral or not

[ProfessorPlum]

Run time: 05:40 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1cMlEvqPgVQ   Posted on YouTube: February 17, 2009 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: February 18, 2009 By DU Member: ProfessorPlum Views on DU: 1866

 
This one is just for fun - no offense to our church going brethren here on DU. Dawkins first talks about the old testament, which I think most agree is pretty nasty. But his discussion of Paul's theology in the New Testament is what interests me here. What do you think of Dawkins' conclusion?

[YOY]

1. Didn't even go into the Book of Lot.

Now THAT is a diety being a complete ass.

[Veritas_et_Aequitas]

2. Dawkins is just as bad as the countless fundie and evangelical leaders of the right.

He's got a brilliant mind, a massive ego, and God help you if you ever disagree on him with things that can't be proven by empirical processes.

[prostock69]

3. I still love him. :) n/t

[Veritas_et_Aequitas]

4. Oh, I think he's brilliant, so he's got that much more going for him

than Mr. Robertson or the like. I just wonder if he realizes he's coming off like a tool sometimes.

[roguevalley]

31. no, zealots don't see themselves on either side. ever.

[DutchLiberal]

22. The difference is Dawkins uses facts and logic, and calls out bullshit.

[MrModerate]

26. He's no teddy bear, but so what?

That doesn't undercut the morally indefensible tenets presented in the Bible.

Quantitative measures of his intellect and ego are irrelevant. And IMO, every rational person has a right (maybe a duty) to push back on people who insist that "things that can't be proven by empirical processes" should determine public policy.

[aquart]

5. I adore this man. Who is he?

He left out LOTS of good bits, of course. The Hebrews abandoning their Babylonian wives and children when they returned from exile. What the guest in that house did to his concubine after she was gang raped (he cut her up in 12 pieces and mailed one piece to each of the 12 tribes of Israel, demanding restitution) or the result of the Benjaminite rape wars that followed (you don't want to know).

As for Paul, this is the parvenu interloper who basically saw dead Elvis in the supermarket (only without any witnesses) and made a career of it. The Gospels were pretty thin after tossing the Gospel of Mary and the Gospel of Thomas, you know, the purported stories of the people who actually knew Jesus, so the early Christians eked out their book with Paul's correspondence file.

[tclambert]

24. According to Wikipedia:

Dawkins "is a British ethologist, evolutionary biologist and popular science author." He wrote the book The Selfish Gene. "Dawkins is a prominent critic of creationism and intelligent design." He "is an atheist, secular humanist, sceptic, scientific rationalist, and supporter of the Brights movement." "He has widely been referred to in the media as "Darwin's Rottweiler", by analogy with English biologist T. H. Huxley, who was known as "Darwin's Bulldog."

And to confirm what someone else posted, he did teach at UC Berkeley, from 1967 - 69.

* * *

And if you want some fun, try explaining the Adam and Eve story to a retarded guy. "So then God comes back to the Garden of Eden . . ."

"Wait, I thought He saw everything and knew everything and was everywhere all the time."

"That's right. And then He said, 'Adam, where are you?'"

"WAIT! What? Why would he say, 'Adam, where are you?'"

"Because Adam was hiding."

"Well, he must be the bestest at hide-an'-seek ever! He could hide from a guy who can see everything and knows everything. Wait, was God retarded? No, not even I'm THAT retarded. Your story's retarded."


Or you could try Noah's ark:

"Did Noah forget the unicorns?"

"Um, well, . . ."

"How long were they on the boat?"

"Okay, it rained 40 days and 40 nights, then took a long time to dry up. I think is was about 11 months total."

"That's a long time to be onna boat with a bunch of animals. What did they do with all the poop? 'Cause I was at the zoo and saw a elephant poop, and it's a lot. A guy came out wif a wheelbarrow and a shovel to clean it up, and it filled the wheelbarrow! And, and what did the tigers eat?"

"Um, I guess. . . unicorns."

[Warpy]

6. "Barking mad" about sums it up for me

It's obvious to me why Paul was given an exalted place in the NT, even though he'd never met Jesus, while Thomas, who had, was left out of it.

Justice and mercy don't serve Empire very well.

Oh, and don't get me started on poor Job.

[AllexxisF1]

7. Dawkins is an asshole.

Job giving up his daughter to the mob symbolizes in a metaphor for just how sacred it is to take a guest into your home and giving charity to those you do not know.

[Warpy]

9. And how worthless the lives of women were?

Lot was scum. There's no way to spin out of that one.

[iconicgnom]

14. totally deranged metaphor!

[YOY]

16. Not according to biblical literists...

n.t.

[laconicsax]

19. Yes, of course, only the unpleasant parts are metaphorical.

:eyes:

[KathieG]

23. Yes...amazing isn't it? Only the pleasant parts are to be taken literally.

[laconicsax]

30. It IS amazing. nt.

[Lorien]

20. If it is, it's a f*cking sick "metaphor"

so what other "metaphors" from the bible would you like to clear up? Adam and Eve? The Ark? The resurrection? Why is it that some believers pick and choose what is to be taken literally and what is metaphor?

Prostituting your daughter IS just plain immoral!

[MrModerate]

27. Given that the entire bible is an anthology of delusion . . .

I have no problem accepting that the story is -- at minimum -- allegorical.

However, if that's a metaphor, it's a metaphor coined by a psychopath.

[rurallib]

8. gotta stop by later and check this out

I love a good religulous squabble

[jimlup]

10. Love it - thanks!

Dawkins is so much fun to listen to. He doens't pull punches.

[david13]

11. I believe this guy taught at Berkeley for a

few years. He still may.
He had about 2 hours on c-span, where he spoke at or near one of the bible thumper colleges (sic) in the south.
One interesting thing he talked about was "there are no christian children, or jewish children, or moslem children."
The children have not made up their minds one way or another, it is the PARENTS who drag them along, and try to imprint the prejudices of the parents upon them. Etc.
Tnx to Dawkins & poster.
dc

[FiveGoodMen]

12. K&R!!!

[cooolandrew]

13. The holy creator of the flying spaghetti monster himself. In the presence of true greatness.

[trthnd4jstc]

15. This clip, though interesting, does not answer whether the bible is moral or not.

Thanks for the post.

[MrModerate]

28. Excuse me? The clip demonstrates by example . . .

That significant portions of the bible are sociopathic, sexist, homicidal, or preposterous.

Even if these were the only objectionable passages, the moral authority of whole anthology would be cast into doubt. And they aren't the only objectionable passages. It goes on and on. Which is not surprising since so much of it is derived from bronze age ideology untempered by anything approaching Enlightenment thought.

The fact that three major religions are founded on the old testament is a clear warning sign that those religions are fraudulent. Scientology has more consistency.

[vinylsolution]

17. I love the way this clip....

.... ends with a view of Colorado Springs - home to James Dobson and Ted Haggard.

Modern day religious hypocrites, with fascist agendas.

[veganlush]

18. awesome. thanks for this thread

professor. I like to think reality is setting in on humanity, and the dangers of fundie-ism are waning.

[bowens43]

21. Religion should be treated like pornography.

It should be illegal to expose children to religion. Years and years of brainwashing by our parents is the problem. Without it, this silly belief in invisible , omnipotent little old men sitting up the clouds smiting some and blessing others would have disappeared long ago and with it, most of the evil in the world.

[Moostache]

25. better include grandparents...

my children are all five being brought up totally free of religious indoctrination by my wife or myself (raised Methodist and Catholic respectively)...but the grandparents are taking this poorly to say the least...

I refuse to abuse my children by refusing them a fair chance to evaluate things without a childhood of fearful memories clouding everything and I really do not care what anyone else thinks of that. If someone disagrees, by all means go have five of your own children to torture and abuse as you wish, just keep the hell away from mine in all public arenas and we will have no problem (of course, the public arena includes trying to pass laws that enforce your barbaric moral codes as well...)

[Prana69]

29. Has anyone else noticed the AdBot that is attached to this thread?

"Free Bible CD - Bible Library and reference"

How ironic!