New Video Shows Japanese Boat DELIBERATELY rams Ady Gil

[FourScore]

Run time: 01:44 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72zPS8jFaLo   Posted on YouTube: January 06, 2010 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: January 08, 2010 By DU Member: FourScore Views on DU: 2892

 

[flvegan]

1. Yup. Someone please call the whaling apoligists to this thread?

Come on, idiots. Another chance to look stupid.

[Devil_Fish]

3. +1

Only problem I have is that the Title dosn't fit the title on Youtube. Other then that this was a diliberate attack by the Japanese "research" vessel.

[FourScore]

4. I wanted everyone to know this was not the first video that was released -- that it is new.

DU gives you the option to give the video a new title. A title is required, but it does not have to be the same as the YouTube title.

[Devil_Fish]

5. oh, sorry, didn't mean to be acusitory.NT

[FourScore]

6. Not at all, but it is very nice of you to say that.

I am actually wary about changing titles. Some people really don't like it. I just thought it better to change it this time since there are a couple of different Sea Shepard videos already posted here.

:hi:

[AllenVanAllen]

7. I agree with the name you chose for the post.

It does appear to be a deliberate act by the Shonan Maru. I wonder if they had a cam on the Ady Gil. It may not shed much light on the situation anyway, as the water cannons continue to blast throughout.

[Prana69]

2. The video is pretty clear...

Yes, video clearly shows the Shonan Maru turning to starboard to line up the Ady Gil and it only veered away to port once it was clear a collision was about to occur. The Ady Gil appears to be stationary at the time of the collision.

Pity my Australian government is so gutless when it comes to this issue. All talk prior to the election (international legal action) and all fawning to the Japanese now.

Peter Garrett. I know I'm not the first and I won't be the last - you are a sell out. What happened to "I don't wanna sell my soul to him.....". I'm going to burn my Midnight Oil records in memory of your principles, now all compromised. Expect a chunk of melted vinyl on your cabinet desk next week.

P69

[WileEcoyote]

8. Brought to you from the same folks who gave you Pearl Harbor

Remember?

[1monster]

22. That was a very funny book...

http://www.amazon.com/Those-Wonderful-Folks-Pearl-Harbor/dp/0671780522

[me b zola]

9. Please clink on to youtube

Freepwits are spreading their usual hate.

[bertman]

10. This video has been on the internetz from the beginning. It's far more difficult to tell

what happened looking at this one because the filming vessel appears to be moving to the right, which would give a skewed perception of the path of the other two vessels.

Looking at the video taken from the whaling vessel, it's apparent that the Gil was put into FORWARD four seconds before the crash. You can clearly see the turbulence in the Gil's wake.

I'm thinking the whaler saw a chance to have a very close call and intimidate the Gil by veering to starboard, and the Gil saw an opportunity to have a relatively harmless collision by scooting far enough forward to get clipped but not broadsided.

[beardown]

11. Real questions

"You can clearly see the turbulence in the Gil's Wake" .

I can't. It looks like the water kicked up by the water cannon being fired on the Gil. The Gil is a very advanced type design. What type of propulsion does it use? Is there a way to see the difference in turbulence between the water kicked up by a water cannon and the turbulence kicked up by the Gil? More importantly in this specific case, is there a way to tell if there is turbulence being generated by the Gil's propulsion system through the turbulence that is already being created by a water cannon being used in rough seas?

I'm clueless on how to spot the Gil created turbulence so I'm interested in hearing from someone with the expertise to see why it's clearly the Gil's turbulence.

[bertman]

12. beardown, I am not an "expert" by any means, but I am an experienced boater, so here

is my attempt to answer your questions. In the ten or so seconds preceding the crash, observe the rear of the Gil. There is some white water but not what I consider turbulence. That tells me that the engine(s) were either on "idle" (in neutral) or they were in gear but at very low rpms. After the spray from the firehose is out of the frame and before the bow wave of the whaler gets to the Gil, it's evident that the Gil's engine(s) have been engaged enough to cause turbulence--the white swirls behind the two pontoons and the center portion of the boat. This is indicative that the propulsion system (which I assume is prop-driven), is pushing water away from the rear of the Gil as the boat is pushed forward.

I've watched the video at least ten times, and that's what I see.

I also see from the Shepherd's video that the whaler does seem to veer to starboard, but it appears to me that had the Gil not moved forward, this turn to the right would have only been a very close call and not a collision.


What would the motivation be to give the Gil the gas? 1) maybe the captain was trying to rev the engines and swing to starboard to avoid the collision; although, the bow does not turn to the right as would happen with a boat as nimble as the Gil. 2) maybe the captain panicked and hit the gas. 3) maybe the captain saw an opportunity to create a media sensation by "being rammed" by the whaler.


My money is on #3. The Gil is a very seaworthy craft and must have an incredible amount of flotation built into it. This is obvious from the way it stayed afloat despite having its bow torn off. The captain would have known that his vessel would survive a strike on the bow section only. That would explain why the Gil was idling so close to the path of the whaler. Had he been moving forward the entire time, it is likely that the Gil would have been hit broadside and cut in half near the cockpit, killing the crew (or some of them) and sinking the vessel on the spot.


It pains me to say this, but I think it's true. I contribute to Greenpeace and will continue to do so, but this looks like the Gil's fault. Of course, I could be wrong.


[beardown]

13. Thanks

There's been a lot of discussion on the hit and I wondered if you had some definitive info on what the Gil may have been doing.

It sounds like you're making some assumptions, albeit some with applicable knowledge.

My assumption precedes yours and is that the whaler had closed the gap between the ships to an unsafe distance because they wanted to spray the Gil and they were tired of having their hunt complicated by the Gil and that removed any margin for error on either captains' part. From there, your assumptions kick in.

Obviously, the Gil was trying to get in the way of the whaler as that's what they are there for, but I doubt even a captain as out there as the Gil's was going to risk a shearing angle ramming incident between a large steel whaler and a much smaller and lighter fiber boat. Yet another assumption on my part.

[bertman]

14. I think your points are valid, beardown. My hunch about the motivation of the skipper of the

Ady Gil is based almost exclusively on the type of tactics that I have seen these guys use to interfere with the whaling operations in past incidents that were filmed. They have balls of titanium and seem to be fearless (or maybe crazy).

A large part of the anti-whaling effort revolves around public perception of the whalers as bad guys (which they are), so I'm surmising that a ramming by a whaler would have been a coup for their p.r. department.

[beardown]

15. Based on the Whale Wars...

I've seen a little of the Whale Wars, I believe that's the name, and from what I've seen if this is the same captain then poor or as you noted maybe crazy judgment on his part could have easily placed his boat in a defenseless position for an aggressive move by the whaler or to nudge his boat a bit more into it's path.

He's got great judgment on his goals, I just don't think that he always makes the best tactical moves considering the unforgiving nature of the seas that his crew is often times sailing on.

[1monster]

23. Check out this video by the crew members of the Ady Gil itself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfgPgnyX0ak

also posted on DU by Junkdrawer http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x420992 posted by Junkdrawer

[FourScore]

16. bertman, with all do respect, I don't see how you can say that.

The whaling ship does a hard turn directly into the path of the Gil and then adjusts course after ramming.

Watch this video:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x420907

[bertman]

17. The video is down, FourScore, but as I said, I believe the captain of the whaler was trying

to come as close to the Gil as he could. Maybe he was trying to ram her. I don't know. BUT, I see clearly that the Gil's prop wash indicates that the throttle was pushed into forward enough to move the Gil forward into the path of the whaler. My view is that had the Gil not moved forward it would have maybe been bumped by the ship or just rocked by the bow wave, but certainly not sheared as actually happened.

Is there another link to the video? Is it the one taken from the Shepherd? I've seen that one a number of times, which is why I say the whaler veered right.

[FourScore]

19. It's been reposted.

See it here:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x420992

Thanks.

[slackmaster]

18. I think bertman has summed it up correctly

There was asshattery on both sides. The Japanese vessel made a last-ditch effort to avoid a collision by steering to the right, but it was too late.

[FourScore]

20. Watch this video. It is from on board the Ady Gil.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x420992

[slackmaster]

21. I wouldn't have commented in this thread had I not seen the video

I just happen to disagree with the knee-jerk reactions exonerating Ady Gil just because SSCS is on the correct side of the commercial whaling debate.

I have some experience in sailing and in photography. I think both vessels were being operated in an a reckless manner. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[bertman]

24. Thanks, FourScore, I watched it a number of times. There is no doubt that the whaler

was turning toward the Ady Gil. In my opinion, now that we see the video as filmed from the Ady Gil, there was dangerous and deadly recklessness shown by the captain of the whaler. BUT, I have to say that I watched in amazement as the whaler kept barreling toward the Gil yet the captain of the Gil seemed to just assume that it was okay to lolligag at idle in the path of a massive ship that is coming toward you and whose captain probably would like to swamp you or maybe even ram you. That constitutes negligent recklessness, in my view.

As slackmaster points out, there's blame on both sides of this one. I have to think that any impartial party viewing this from the Gil would have to conclude that the whaler captain intentionally put them in his course and could have run into them and over them had he hit them broadside. But the next question is What The Fuck was the Gil captain thinking to wait like a sitting duck while this pissed-off whaler is bearing down on his vessel and his crew. Which brings me back to another post where I believe that they probably welcomed the collision and, given that the whaler did turn at the last second, if the Gil captain had not driven into their path, he would likely have only gotten wet and really pissed.

This is fucked up beyond all description. Two idiot cowboys playing grown-up games that luckily did not kill anyone. I have read about people doing stuff this stupid before, but I can't remember ever watching it up close and personal like that.

[FourScore]

25. Thank you for your well-reasoned response, bertman.

"Two idiot cowboys playing grown-up games that luckily did not kill anyone." -- That probably says it all.

I can see how one would find it surprising that the Gil crew didn't react sooner considering the baiting that was going on from both sides. The situation was more serious than they seemed to comprehend -- which is obvious from their laissez-faire attitude throughout most of the video. But I will say that I used to live on a sailboat, and can put myself in those guys shoes. In boating, it is ALWAYS the responsibility of the smaller boat to move out of the line of path of the larger vessel. Once that has been done, the larger ship is not to make reckless course deviations that could put the smaller vessel into harms way. I have seen some close calls on the water. But they were usually caused by people who were either not paying attention or were too inexperienced. The Ady Gil had done everything they were supposed to. They were not in the direct path of the whaler vessel. It was the whaler vessel that changed course and barreled down directly onto the smaller vessel. It was deliberate and exceedingly dangerous. You say you have spent time on boats, so you must know all this.

From the Gil crew's perspective, it must have all happened very quickly from the moment they realized that the whaler ship was not only coming up close, but intentionally ramming them as well. In the video shot from the Sea Shepard, it looked as if they were just going to spray the Gil, which is probably what the Gil crew thought as well. Then the whaler made a sharp turn directly into the Gil, rammed them and cut back out.

I still do not see much fault on the side of the Gil crew, other than they did not comprehend their "cowboy playing grown-up games" naivity. (Great line, BTW).

That's how I see it.

:beer:

[Prana69]

26. Ludicrous suggestion.

"...and the Gil saw an opportunity to have a relatively harmless collision by scooting far enough forward to get clipped but not broadsided."

Don't be ridiculous. That's analagous to saying a pedestrian can have a "relatively harmless collision" with a freight train.

As if anyone would actually put themselves, their crew or their vessel in that kind of situation. The captain (and owner) of the Ady Gil in particular is far too sensible to contemplate that.