Health Care Bill Is In Trouble If They Keep The Excise Tax In It" Congressman Kucinich

[democracy1st]

Run time: 05:10 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6mXhUOOeO4   Posted on YouTube: January 14, 2010 By YouTube Member: Views on YouTube: 0   Posted on DU: January 14, 2010 By DU Member: democracy1st Views on DU: 1107

 
http://MOXNews.com/
January 13, 2010 MSNBC The ED Show


Health-care reform bill's proposed tax on high-cost plans raises questions


With Congress on the verge of imposing a new tax on high-cost health insurance plans, skeptics continue to raise questions about who would be hit hardest and whether health-care spending would be limited as much as proponents say.

The Senate health-care legislation includes a 40 percent excise tax on insurance plans worth more than $23,000 per year for a family of four. When the legislation would go into effect in 2014, only a small fraction of all plans would be taxed, but more would be captured over time: roughly a quarter by 2019, collecting about $150 billion over 10 years.

The House legislation instead relies on an income tax surcharge on families earning more than $1 million. But centrist Senate Democrats are opposed to the surcharge, and the excise tax has been endorsed by the White House and many health-care economists, who tout its cost-containment potential.

Supporters of the Senate provision say it would restore some equity in the tax system, which exempts employer-provided health benefits while forcing people who buy insurance on their own to use after-tax dollars. To avoid the tax, supporters predict, employers and employees would shift to less-generous plans that would make patients more sensitive to costs, slowing the growth in health-care spending. Employers, the theory goes, would put the savings into higher wages.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/06/AR2010010604931.html

[eridani]

1. Let's hope so

This is an electoral disaster waiting to happen.

[Divine Discontent]

2. K&R 5! wake up guys & gals in Congress & the WH! You're hurting Americans with this, also, you

hurt our chances for real progressive reform over the next decade, to make up for Dumbya's ignorance.

[jonathan_seer]

3. It's a huge tax increase on the middle class of this country - and NOTHING will make it acceptable.

to the voters, Union especially.

Democrats would NOT be forgiven.

In the eyes of the typical voter who is only passingly and occasionally pays attention to politics and who elects presidents such a tax would make them feel like total chumps fools for voting Democratic, because in part they voted Democratic, because they believed us when we said the Democratic party is the champion of the little guy.

Should such a bill pass, the Democratic party would become the party who turned the IRS into a collection agency for private insurance policies without any effective cost control, and the Federal Government into the personal enforcer for the Insurance Industry. The party would become the ultimate Corporate party.

That would be the ULTIMATE perception should a bill become law taxing middle class health insurance policies.

All the logic and sense that makes this seem like a "fair deal" to some will NOT matter at all.

Nor will the fact that millions could be helped.

Democrats will be voted out of office en masse once it dawns on the voters that the Democrats passed a law that in effect made the Federal Government an enforcer for the Insurance industry and we pay taxes for them to do that.

Again that's what millions of voters will ultimately conclude, whether it is wholly true or not is irrelevant.

The fatal nature of passing such a tax was made certain when Dems. decided to forgo raising taxes on those who make 200,000 or more.

Regardless of their lack of direct connection, the voters WILL connect them, and make Democrats pay.

And should such a funding measure pass as they prefer to call it the Democrats can forget about "making changes and fixing it later."

Trust me. If this law passes, Democrats will lose their majorities and become the permanent minority party, handing victory to the Republicans after the game was declared over. They won't be allowed to stay in a position where they could make changes later.

Again what the "public will see and believe" is often quite different than the political spin coming from the Bill supporters.

To the vast majority once the new requirements of the bill became known, Democrats would become known as the party that taxes the middle class for the benefit of the Insurance Industry and the party that turned the IRS into the Insurance Industry's collection agency and the Federal Government as a whole into the Insurance Industry's enforcer.

The "tone deafness" of these proposals is mind numbing.

Even more astounding is the notion that Americans won't conclude that the IRS is the Insurance Industry's collection agency and the Federal Government their Enforcer.

As it stands Americans would pay these "penalties" via IRS deductions, and those who refused would be punished by the federal government.

YOu can't spin that at all, not even with promises that thousands of lives will be saved by the bill.

Health bill aside, how Democratic leaders could be so oblivious to how offensive most Americans would find the enforcement provisions.

Americans left right or center would NOT tolerate the "actual outcome" of the Health bill as it stands now which is the IRS and the US Government become enforcers for Insurance companies

Even if it did all the good the backers claim it will, It would not matter.

Those that think this sensible and logical and justifiable should be permanently banned from the table of politics, for they lack even the slightest amount of political sense.

To think they can "convince" the middle class who'd be hit the hardest to accept this and NOT start an open revolt to kick Democrats out of office is astounding in its level of total political tone deafness.

Passing a bill with this sort of tax or any tax that hits the middle class hardest is the ONE thing Democrats can do that WOULD make millions vote for a tea party candidate regardless of their lack of sanity.

Doing so would be easy to justify in aftermath of passage of such a bill with those kinds of provisions.

Democrats would find it impossible to convince the typical voter fresh from witnessing the Democrats turn the IRS and the Federal Government into the paid for by your taxes collector and enforcer for the Insurance Industry of anything.

Such a law with such provisions would make voting for the libertarian, tea bagger types the only option for many, and they'd feel justified and right in doing so, even if they loathed everything the tea baggers stood for.

There would BE NO RECOVERY, NONE!

People who support this can point out how wrong I am, but that's not my point.

Facts in this case would be secondary to the "perception of the public" should a bill increasing taxes on the middle class under the guise of a "cadillac health plan fee" ultimately become law. A "tax" passed on the middle class that voted Democrats into office 2008 after Democrats passed on increasing taxes on the wealthy and passed on fixing our financial system for fear of upsetting the fat cat bankers.

Anything that remotely resembles a raise in the tax burden of the middle class, and it doesn't matter what you call it will be election suicide for the Democrats, and rightly so.

It can't be spun, and I can't believe bill supporters are trying as if they have a chance of doing so.

Any time fees are mandated by the Government the typical American sees a "tax." Why the supporters of this bill think they can call it something else and make those affected feel differently is beyond me.

[jonathan_seer]

4. sorry for the repetitiveness of my post

I wrote it late at night long after my editing skills called it a night. :blush:

[proudohioan]

5. No need for apology, your point is well taken.

Even those who are generally intelligent, rational and well informed human beings will find themselves prone to negativity and hysteria over the bill, given these hard economic times.

[midnight]

6. 70 cents an hour to pay back to govt. for having a necessity???

Not even if this was single payer should this be allowed.... Someone is drinking from the cool aid.....

[12string]

7. As an aside

I know I'm a little off topic with this observation but I have to accept those poll numbers with a grain of salt.I believe those numbers are skewed in favor of Obama and the health bill by low information respondents.If a person gets their information from the local news station and their daily paper I just don't think they have enough information to give these issues the critical analysis needed.