Sorry, but DU is fucked. It's the sad truth.

[berni_mccoy]

If you support Obama, you can't post facts without having it attacked by the same fucking group of people who will cowardly unrec it to boot.

I hate to say it, but DU's time has come. I've backed off for over a week and GD literally shit the bed with bullshit from Grover Norquist's site, Liar Dog Fake. Unless we counter the bullshit 24-7, there is literally an army of people willing to dump their diarrhea all over this site with far too many people willing to lap it up.

Yep. I think I'm done here.

[goclark]

1. berni ~ how we will miss you

Believe me, we feel your pain.

[Uzybone]

2. This site needs a direction

it was easy during the Bush years to whine and moan and post smears...after all it was Bush, he did almost nothing right. DU was a sanctuary from the RW media madness that was everywhere else.

Now DU regurgitates RW smears. Its sad.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

5. This site has a mechanism for providing direction.

Sadly, it chooses not to use it. And I would refer to it directly, but it's against the rules.

[Cha]

3. Oh well..

This President and his Admin will go on without DU and that makes me happy. They deal with major slodge 24/7.

We'll all find a niche where we're doing the best work in networking and activism for our country.

I'll miss each and every one of you who I don't interact with anymore.:grouphug:

[quiet.american]

4. Hey Berni - you kept up the good fight for as long as you could.

But I hear you - the current zeitgeist here has long jumped the shark from being agnostic about the Democratic Party, to being serially hostile - and most of the time the outrage is based on absolute nonsense.

What else is left to do? Save your sanity. I'm spending more of my time over at "Political Animal" and whitehouse.gov these days.

[Cha]

7. I've posted on political

animal before. Mostly cool bc Steve Benen sets the discussion with his reports but I natually had to encounter at least one poster who brought his complete nonsense to rattle on about.

But, one does find out a lot on Steve's Blog with excellent links.

[quiet.american]

8. Hi Cha -- a hearty thanks to you for the intro to that blog!

I first heard about it from you, and now it's one of my first stops during the day to get a "sensible read" on what's happening out there in the political universe. Haven't quite figured out yet whether the resident "teabagger" mascot over there in the comments section -- "Al" -- is actually deliberate satire or not. :)

[Cha]

13. And, babylonsister passed it

on to me.:) Mine was a What-Ever named joe who prided himself on insulting the President.

[berni_mccoy]

10. Check out this rec-list post at DKos.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/5/25/869846/-What-the-Obama-Administration-is-Doing-About-The-Oil-(More-Than-You-Think)

:-)

[quiet.american]

11. Yes! Thank you! This needs to be its own post here.

I've been following the WH's "Spill" blog and keeping up with their efforts, which is why all the wailing and gnashing of teeth 'out there' over "they're not *doing* anything!!!!" has just made me shake my head.

[berni_mccoy]

12. I did post it here... unfortunately...

the responses to that post mostly led to this OP.

I truly think I'm done here. Can't stand the anti-Obama propaganda that has infested this site. Far too few people care about facts and far too many do not want to appear to support the Administration lest they be labelled kool-aid drinkers.

[Number23]

15. What I can't understand is the immediate need to blame the President for this

Imagine it -- you live in an area that suffers a major calamity. Bridge collapse, hurricane etc. Who in their right mind decides that the AUTOMATIC person to blame for any lack of response or inadequate response is the damned President??

Wouldn't your automatic go-to blamees be the company responsible, maybe the mayor of your town, emergency officials, maybe as high as the governor? Why are people on this site AUTOMATICALLY blaming Obama for BP's fuck up?? I saw the Coast Guard admiral on PBS Newshour two nights ago. The guy interviewing him mentioned how some people are becoming frustrated by the federal response and the man looked point blank in the camera and said something like "what else are we to do? BP caused the mess and has the resources to fix it. What would people have us do?" The interviewer followed up with a question about the government replacing BP and the admiral responded with "replace them with WHO?" Doesn't that say everything that needs to be said regarding this issue??

This is not a situation like Katrina where the government simply FAILED to act. Damn. I wish that this had never happened. I feel so bad for the people, animals and plantlife in the Southern US right now.

[Political Tiger]

27. I think a lot of people around here have become conditioned

to blame Obama for everything no matter what. No thought or reason is allowed. Just blame Obama.

It's like a cult, but instead of everyone loving the leader, they all hate him! Very strange!

[Cha]

29. Thank you, Bernie~ I knew they were doing all they could and

going on to the step of doing more.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

6. It's totally and utterly fucked.

I don't blame you one bit, Berni. I might be following suit.

[graywarrior]

9. It's really sad that most of the good people are leaving.

[RoyGBiv]

14. I "gave up" not long ago ...

I still come for the sub-forums like the BOG, Computer H&S, etc. I wander out there into the nastiness occasionally, but rarely even try to post something substantive. Whenever I do, it is almost completely ignored.

.. unless I use the word "fuck" a lot or dare try to shatter illusions.

I'm a fairly patient person, but I've played this game before. I've tried to discuss what's been taking place here with admins, but aside from initial discussions, everything has been ignored since then. As Nicholas said, this place lacks direction. It's Usenet as its use as a discussion forum between people of ideas was dying. I fear the tipping point has been reached and that there's no going back now.

I've noticed that DU is mentioned less and less across the blogosphere whereas at one time it was a "rising star." There's a reason for that.

[Cha]

17. Oh, I remember that

"rising star"..we were so on it!

[Drunken Irishman]

16. I am the point where I'm just a total asshole now...

And I'm sure a lot of people hate me for it.

But I've tried to rationally debate and it goes nowhere.

As I said in another thread, fuck 'em.

[POAS]

20. I tried to post something light hearted

in a thread about the Chicago trip and got blasted. You can't even be a bit silly anymore.

[Political Tiger]

21. I did the same thing in one of those threads wailing about Obama talking basketball

and I was totally sarcastic....I purposely made my response as stupid as could be but I didn't add the little "sarcasm" smiley thing at he end and two of the haters thought I was serious and actually gave me kudos for what, to anybody with half a brain, was an obvious ridiculous response to the topic at hand!

[cliffordu]

18. Close to it myself.

Quoting known liars and repackaged R talking points under the guise of "liberal purity" has me disgusted beyond belief.

I wonder what the true allegiance is for some. And I know EXACTLY what it is for others.


Take good care of yourself, Berni - Send me an email if you are posting someplace else....

[Political Tiger]

19. I totally understand where you are coming from.

Months ago I decided I just couldn't post here anymore because it seemed so pointless, a waste of time and because I couldn't visit this site without leaving feeling frustrated and depressed. I took a break, a long break, and I think it did me good. Now I've decided to try to give it another go, although it seems much worse than it was before.

There is so much hate on this site it is unbelievable, and for that I hold responsible the administrators of DU.

On the rules page they state "Democratic Underground is an on line community for Democrats and other progressives. Members are expected to be generally supportive of progressive ideals, and to support Democratic candidates for political office." I don't know why they have that there because it clearly is not true.

They continue with "The administrators of Democratic Underground are working to provide a place where progressives can share ideas and debate in an atmosphere of mutual respect." Please! I can't post anything remotely positive about Obama without being called a myriad of hateful names. There is no "atmosphere of mutual respect" here. This has happened because the administrators have ignored their very own rules! They post a set of civility rules and point out, in bold type, "There are no exceptions to these civility rules." Could've fooled me!

What makes it worse is that often times it's the same people causing the trouble, people who have been attacking Obama since even before he was sworn in as president. Why are they still here? Why are they allowed to post hateful comments about Obama and attack other posters over and over again without any consequence?

It's one thing to disagree with the President, but these people hate him with a passion, and they make no bones about it. They brag about it. So why are they on an online community that is supposed to "provide a place where progressives can share ideas" and "support Democratic candidates?"

With that said, I decided to implement what I guess can be called my own "civility rules." Anyone who makes hateful statements about Obama go directly to my ignore list. People who post disagreements about Obama's policies and/or decisions but do it in an honest, thoughtful and rational manner are exempt, because it's one thing to disagree with the President, but it's another to simply attack him just for the hell of it. And the first thing that gets them sent to my ignore list is when they use the "change we can believe in" motto in a sarcastic manner, because that, to me, shows they have a deep seeded hatred for Obama because there has been change, a lot of change, change for the better, and if they can't see that then it proves to me they don't want to see it.

Anyway, I hope you don't go but if you do I can certainly understand. Perhaps a vacation from this site is in store for you and you will return after taking a break from the hate.

Meanwhile, speaking for myself, I am going to use the ignore list liberally, which I am finding to have funny results. For instance, when I start a thread and return to it, often times I'll see mostly "ignored" in the reply section, and I have to laugh because here is all these haters babbling on calling me God knows what, thinking "I've told him" when in fact they have simply wasted their time because it is I, not them, who is having the last laugh! And some of these idiots who I haven't put on ignore yet I'll go ahead and respond and then put them on ignore, and they'll respond again not knowing that they are being ignored therefore resulting in me having the final word, which if they knew, would drive them crazy!

[yowzayowzayowza]

23. It'd be nice to have at least one forum where...

the rule against 'inflammatory non-constructive criticism of Democrats' was strictly enforced, certainly no ad-hominems towards Democrats. Tiz hard enuf to have a productive discussion in such a big tent w/o folks constantly runnin 'round with rhetorical machetes.

[Cha]

24. Interesting thoughts on your

experiences here. I probably have more on Ignore than anyone and I can see why from all the comments made about what's goin' on.

It was a lot worse and now the mods are deleting the personal insults pretty darn fast if you alert..can't speak to the slimey shots against the Prez bc a lot of those types are not shown to me.

I know I like your sig line, PT!

[Political Tiger]

26. I'm hated on two levels here

One, just like many of us, because I do support President Obama, and two, because I am a gay man who supports Barack Obama! My fellow gay Democrats on this site, not all, but a vocal minority, truly hate me. I know this because they have told me so. They have been the most vicious people I have ever met. Their vitriolic hatred only made me more determined to stay because I know for a fact they do not in any way, shape or form represent the true feelings of most gay people, and I wanted to show others that there are sane gay people in this world, especially since they managed to chase away many of the other gay folks here who shared my point of view.

These gay Obama hating zealots took over the GLBT board to the point where people like me, although not officially banned, were for all intents and purposes banned. We sure as hell aren't welcomed there! I found that disheartening because just like everyone else, gay people have a wide range of views.

But as the hate Obama crown increased, the more frustrated I became, and I remember when that happened.....a PUMA site closed down, I forget what it was called, but suddenly all these new Obama haters started appearing. Once the flood gates were opened, it seemed to me that they were determined to take over DU like the Obama haters did in the GLBT forum. So after awhile I had to get away from all the negativity.

I see a lot of good, sane liberal people who were here before missing. I hope they aren't gone for good. It's sad, because the balance here has been tipped to the far, far (angry) left who are always going to hate Obama, no matter what, and If DU doesn't take control, this site is going to become anti-Obama all the time.

Anyway, I'm glad you like my new sig, I do too, and I know I'm gonna catch some flack for it, which I must confess, is one reason I decided to use it! lol

[Number23]

30. PT, I want to apologize for any role I played in this

I am a gay man who supports Barack Obama!

For some reason, I thought I'd read somewhere that you said that you were black or a gay man of color and I'm so sorry, but I think that that I helped spread this mistake on this site! Please accept my apology. Please let me know if you forgive me because I think that my mistaken belief that you were a gay man of color is what lead to at least some of the constant foolishness that is hurled your way.

[Political Tiger]

31. Oh 23, there is absolutely nothing to forgive you for!

You have nothing to feel sorry about, or to apologize for! I do remember there was some mentions of me being a gay man of color, but that happened long after the GLBT Obama-haters (and straight Obama haters) started in on me. Hell, they targeted me before Obama was even sworn in, when it was announced that Rick Warren was going to say a prayer at his inauguration, and since I didn't blow up or freak out and call Obama homophobic and didn't claim that the world was coming to an end and all that they teamed up and decided that I was only pretending to be gay, or that if I was really gay I was full of self-hate, that I was a "Aunt Liza" which I guess is the gay version of Uncle Tom, and a bunch of other BS.

From that day forward, I became a pariah in my own community (at least on DU).

So you had nothing to do with it.

I do remember some mention of me being a gay man of color probably because I started posting on the African-American issues forum, where I felt a hundred times more welcome than the GLBT forum, and I figured if people thought I was black that was fine by me, and I remember wondering if I should try to set the record straight but I didn't know how to go about it because I didn't want anyone to think that I would be bothered or ashamed to be thought of as being black. I do remember in a couple posts I did say something like "as a white man...." to kind of let people know I wasn't black because at the same time I didn't want people to think I was pretending to be an African-American like I was being accused of pretending to be gay!

But you have nothing to feel sorry about!

If I got any extra flack because someone thought I was a gay person of color then to hell with them!

And speaking of Rick Warren, this craziness going on about Obama and the oil spill reminds me a lot of the months of hysteria that engulfed DU over the Rick Warren thing. They went bonkers over that and they're still going bonkers!

If they could be reasoned with, I'd like to remind them that I was right about the Rick Warren "crisis." The world didn't end and Obama has done much for the gay community in his short time in office and even this week we hear that DADT is close to coming to an end, but of course they don't want to hear any of that.

But again, you have absolutely nothing to feel bad about! :)

[Number23]

36. I'm glad you accept my apology

And I'm also exceptionally glad that you felt so welcome in AAIG. Even though I'm not the slightest bit surprised because even though AAIG is comprised of some of the smartest, coolest, most traveled and educated folks on DU, some folks are working overtime to make it appear that black folks the world over have nothing better to do than hate on other people and that includes those of us in AAIG.

I'm glad you're back, PT. Even if you're not a brotha. :)
:fistbump:

[madamesilverspurs]

22. Wonder what would happen

if BOGsters shared a master ignore-list? If the nasties couldn't get anyone to play with them, would they take their ick elsewhere? And I've never used the animated emoticons, but I might if there was one that could deliver a sloppy raspberry; serial raspberries, hmmmmm...


-

[Political Tiger]

28. I wonder if there is any limit to how many people you can have on your ignore list

because I already have, and I just guessing, probably 400 people on it!

[NanceGreggs]

25. I hear ya, Bernie ...

... and your leaving would be an incredible loss to all of us, and this site as a whole.

But I think we're all feeling pretty much the same right now.

I took a two-month break after my best friend passed just before Christmas. I came here looking for something to take my mind off that event - and wound up having to leave, due to all of the negativity, everything you (and others here) have mentioned.

At the time, I thought I was just overly-sensitive to the negativity, because of my emotional state.

When I came back in February, a lot of the worst offenders had been TS'd - and I thought this site was finally getting back on track.

Unfortunately, my hope of that being the case was short-lived.

I've had quite a few posts (replies to others) deleted in the past few weeks. There was a time I would have been duly chastised, and ashamed that I had been perceived as knowingly breaking the rules. But now the rules don't seem to matter anyway - and having comments deleted is becoming a badge of honour.

That is a truly sad state of affairs.

We all know (and now I'll probably be deleted again for saying this) that there is a particular site that is used to coordinate UNRECS for any DU posts that put Obama in a positive light. And while posts even remotely inferring that is the case are removed, the very people participating in this activity are free to do so without interference.

As I said, sad state of affairs.

Keep in touch, Bernie, and let us know where you land. A lot of us won't be far behind.

[graywarrior]

33. They do not understand the conflict between governmental order, freedom, and equality

They think the world runs the way they want it to.

[Cha]

34. Sorry your best friend

passed on, Nance:hug:

[NanceGreggs]

35. Thanks so much, Cha ...

It was sudden, and very unexpected. Five months later, it still doesn't seem real.

But I am still grateful for the time we had together - my life will always be richer for it.

[grantcart]

32. Berni you are currently posting at DU

Limit yourself to the BOG and pass on the rest.

[NJmaverick]

37. The place has become an Anti-Obama cess pool

I don't know how Skinner could let that happen.

[bigwillq]

38. DU is fine.

And, seriously, who cares about the unrec/rec system? Do you really? Sorry, I don't. There are far more important things to worry about than some silly rec system on a message board. You shouldn't take this place that seriously. It is what it is. Sure, there are some bad apples. Ignore them. They're not worth it.

While it has its flaws, DU is still a great place to come for information, articles, and, YUP, even discussion.

[Cha]

39. And, that's your opinion..I see berni's

pov too.

[Bobbie Jo]

40. FUBAR

.....the usual suspects, etc.

[DevonRex]

41. If we weren't here, we could be exercising, volunteering at the local Dem offices,

actually doing something GOOD for the Democratic Party instead of contributing to a site hell bent on taking it down.

[Cary]

42. I wish I had an answer for you.

Hell, I wish I had an answer for me. I tried to quit awhile ago.

It used to be really great here. Didn't it, or am I imagining that?