Did you catch this? Edwards' 'College For Everyone' is being tested in NC right now....

[Blackhatjack]

John and Elizabeth are 'testing' the concept of 'College For Everyone' right now in one of the poorest counties in North Carolina -- and it is working!

Some people 'talk' about their ideas and never put them into practice. THis is not the first time John and Elizabeth have put together a prototype of their ideas to demonstrate its viability.

Given the results analyzed so far, this is a program that could be instituted 'nationwide' and John pointed that out in the debate last night.

Make college possible and affordable for all qualified young people willing to work for it, and we will see our entire society benefit from having college educated workers and fewer individuals struggling with minimum wage jobs.

[Jackpine Radical]

1. I would love to hear some details on that...

like, how is it being funded? In what sense is it "working?" Etc.

[mnhtnbb]

7. Here's a story from the local Raleigh paper about the program

http://www.newsobserver.com/102/story/573372.html

[pagerbear]

2. You would have to convince Americans that education is valuable for that work.

[Blackhatjack]

12. Right you are, but that is an easy sell....

More people working with higher salaries means a larger tax base and fewer people relying on the Government to subsidize their subsistence.

Higher wages come with their own added benefits of reducing government outlays.

[pagerbear]

13. Just anecdotal, but my observation is

...that lots of folks who need convincing would rather believe in the Lottery Fairy than in education.

[Sapphire Blue]

3. Yes; he started it a year ago, giving out $300,000 in scholarships @ Greene Central High School.

More info here...

College for Everyone: http://journals.democraticunderground.com/Sapphire%20Blue/255

[frazzled]

5. Yes, private donation to a hundred kids

That's hardly a government program constituting "College for All." Plenty of private individuals have made far more substantial donations to send kids to college (I met a kid once for whom George Soros was footing the entire tuition and living expenses at MIT). There are also many foundations that fund more scholarships to more needy students: The Ron Brown Foundation, for example, which funds the education for promising African-American students at top colleges and universities of their choice.

There's little in what John Edwards did in this town in N.C. that isn't already being done, piecemeal. It wasn't even a particularly extraordinary donation, given his wealth. And I don't know where anyone can go to college for $3,000 a year. Tuition at state universities far exceeds that, not counting living expenses and books.

I'd like nothing more than to see more government funded higher education, as in many parts of Europe. But remember that to do that, only a small minority can go, and even for them, many European insitutions are starting to have to charge fees. Whatever we do to expand educational opportunities for students, this little donation in one place is not the prototype. Sounds more like a political ploy.

[Sapphire Blue]

9. No, it's a prototype for his "College for Everyone" program; Edwards isn't President yet.

When he is President, College for Everyone will become a reality.

[frazzled]

14. Incredibly naive ...

I've read about this modest private donation. I know a substantial amount about government financial aid, tuition costs, and both domestic and foreign higher education administration from professional experience. Obviously, nothing I could say about the reality of this plan (or non-plan) will get past the stars in your eyes. So keep clapping those hands and believing in fairies. It seems rather pointless to continue a conversation that would pit actual policy discussion against faith. I know when it's not going to be productive to have further debate.

[Sapphire Blue]

16. Thanks for kicking this thread so more will see it!

Transformational Change For America And The World - JOHN EDWARDS for PRESIDENT 2008

:woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo: :woohoo:

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

"I'm proposing we set a national goal of eliminating poverty in the next 30 years." - JOHN EDWARDS 08

Silence is Betrayal - JOHN EDWARDS 08

Ending Poverty in America

[Blackhatjack]

17. All you have to do is bring facts along with your argument, otherwise you are unarmed..

What facts have I cited that are untrue?

What do you know about Edwards' plan that the rest of us do not know?

And if you have facts that will educate us, please share.

However, accusing people of 'having stars in your eyes' and 'believing in fairies' is not helpful, nor evidence supportive of your argument, unless of course you just wish to insult people as your primary goal.

[Sapphire Blue]

18. No, no, no... he wouldn't want to insult me! That would be rather crass, wouldn't it?

Perhaps he just admires my optimism? ;) After all, I have much to be optimistic about w/John Edwards!

[dogday]

19. Then don't sit on your butt and post about it

Get out and make a change like Edwards is trying to do... All mouth and no action and you have the nerve to critize one of the biggest activists on this board.....


I grow tired of these types of posts....

[unc70]

21. Not naive at all; one of many initiatives in NC

NC has a long way to go in education, particularly in the high schools. The Edwards pilot initiative in Green County seems focused on motivating the HS students to study and to stay out of trouble in HS and to help them know that others care about them and their success.


And check out the other things being done to make higher education (of all types) more accessible to NC students. For example, at UNC-Chapel Hill, the Carolina Covenant is a recent initiative that promises that students from low-income families (less than 200% of federal poverty level) can graduate debt-free. Covenant students must work 10-12 hours weekly on campus in a work-study job; the University meets the rest of the students needs through grants and scholarships from various sources. No loans! In 2004, there were 345 freshman in this program; the previous year, 240 (when the criterion was 150%).

Check out http://www.unc.edu for further info.

In NC, the cost to students to attend the state-supported public education (technical schools, community colleges, colleges, and universities) is quite low (tuition, fees, everthing in total). NC also provides state grants for NC students attending most private colleges in the state.


BTW to better understand the Edwardses, it really helps to know a little of the history of the liberal/progressive Dems in NC -- Dr Frank Porter Graham, Gov/Sen Terry Sanford (who got NC voters to elect JFK), and former UNC President Bill Friday. These are three of the best and brightest people I have ever met and are the ones I most admire and respect for their public service, their dedication to the people of NC, and their abilties to inspire the rest of us to action and to stand for what is right, just, and needed. It seems to me that John Edwards becomes increasing in line with this tradition and its values.

BTW there are good documentaries on these leaders that were recently re-shown on WUNC-TV and may still be on-line. These also highlight the dirty politics of the right in NC, particularly that of Jesse Helms, in opposition to almost everything I hold dear. I will look for links to these docs.

"Where the weak grow strong, and the strong grow great,"
third line of the NC State Toast

[Blackhatjack]

10. You completely missed the point of the OP....

The concept is being tested in NC, and making a private donation to pay for testing of the concept is something entirely different from your criticism "Plenty of private individuals have made far more substantial donations to send kids to college."

Many great ideas are proposed by members of our legislature, but they die on the vine because there is no money allocated 'to test the concerpt.'

This is where John and Elizabeth are different. They are putting their own money behind the concept to see if it will work. As results come, they will have data to back up their proposal that government take on the program for funding.

BTW this not the only education concept that they have 'tested' with their own money. So your criticism that this '...wasn't even a particularly extraordinary donation, given his wealth' is not convincing.

Why not give credit where credit is due? Or do you have other reasons for criticizing people who put their own money into charitable causes to help others?

[MedleyMisty]

4. So who's going to do the minimum wage jobs?

I don't have a beef with the program or anything. It's just that I read the last sentence of your post and that's what immediately sprung to mind - someone has to do the jobs that don't pay very much.

[Lex]

6. I guessing they don't *make* anyone go to college.

College for everyone who wants to go to college.

[Blackhatjack]

11. As presently being tested, the students have to be qualified for college and willing to work...

... so it is not just a 'hand out' but rather a way for qualified students to get a college education if they want one and are willing to work for it.

[Blackhatjack]

8. Part of the answer lies in increasing the minimum wage and benefits ....

and another part of the answer lies in the 'outsourcing' of jobs that require higher education to places like India.

If jobs remain here because businesses find it cost-effective to use qualified educated workers here, it will lift the economy as a whole and increased wages and benefits of minimum wage workers will reduce the reliance on Government subsidies to crack the poverty level.

[pagerbear]

15. Self delete

[Iris]

20. I hope it is "college for everyone who is college material"

Here in GA, we have the HOPE scholarship - anyone with a B average gets free tuiton at state schools. Not too many C's are given out anymore. On top of it, the governor wants to hold schools accountable for retention, so when students don't measure up, the colleges lower the standards to meet them.

[Sanctified]

22. One thing I have never understood is.

We can offer every American child a free elementary school education.

We can offer every American pre-teen a free junior high school education.

We can offer every American teenager a free High School education.

But we cannot offer every American adult a free college education.

Why is it we can afford to educate our children to Mediocracy yet we wont spend just a little extra money and educate them to Excellence. I would be in favor of creating a Federal College System which would use tax dollars to provide every person who attended a completely free college education, it may be an average college education but it would sure as hell be better than a high school diploma. And if Private and State colleges piss and moan thats their problem maybe they will have to lower their tuition rates to become a little more competitive.

[Matsubara]

23. A society with 100% college-educated people...

will inevitably produce a huge number of college-educated people working at shit jobs.

"College for everyone" and ideas like it come from a middle-class conceit that college is the be-all, end-all and that anyone with out a Uni degree is pretty much an idiot.

But the facts are different. Some of the highest-paid jobs today- mechanic, plumber, electrician - (yes, thye pay much better than a lot of college-educated cubicle drone jobs) don't require college, but they do require advanced secondary education to develop those skills.

I'm all for university education for everyone if we are talking about producing better-rounded adults with a better understanding of the world, but it is not a solution to our job market problems or the gaping class divide. for that we need more secondary technical education and a newfound respect for jobs that are not "white collar".

I wish I had studied to become an electrician - I could be pulling in $80K per year now.

Anyone who thinks these skilled blue-collar technicians is "Stupid" or a grease monkey is extremely ignorant, and probably kenee-deep in debt trying to maintain a lifestyle that their union-member grandads could have paid for with CASH.