So, why is the space shuttle such news today. Behind Paris

[glowing]

hilton saga, seems like now is the Patriotic time to watch the space shuttle launch. Wow, people look at wasted tax money, look at environmental damage, look at something we've seen many times now.

And we can't divorce ourselves from Big Oil because we just don't have the technology or whatever b.s.....We put man in space and can't do something to save our own asses.

[originalpckelly]

1. Well, you're in a great mood.

And by the way, since the Columbia disaster, they've been paying attention.

[glowing]

3. Your right, I'm not.

Since doing the testing on the soil and water from a launch, its not so cheery anymore from me. I'll probably get cancer from testing those samples.

[RL3AO]

2. Brace for attack.

:hide:

[SharonRB]

4. I just watched the liftoff

They make me nervous now.

I did comment to my hubby, though, that they're spending all this money on the shuttle when there are so many more important things to spend our money on.

[TZ]

5. there is TONS of medical research that is done in zero gravity

among other things. Plus environmental research on things like climate change! I would say that the shuttle space missions do plenty to "save our own asses".

[Mz Pip]

6. Science is never

a waste of tax money, IMHO. Space exploration is one government program I wish they would spend MORE money on.

Science research is what will save our asses.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[RL3AO]

7. Yep. Just cut a couple billion from Defense. They wont notice the loss.

[Mz Pip]

8. Build one less

gazillion dollar fighter plane or attack helicopter and we might actually be able to get back to the moon.

Mz Pip
:dem:

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

11. Arguable.

Not all scientific experiments are equally important, thus it's a waste to spend money on trivial science experiments that don't show anything, when you could be spending it on a worthwile experiment. That's why there are panels of independent scientists who decide, say, which projects get funded and which don't.

Now, is there any valid science going on with this latest shuttle mission? I doubt it.

[cobalt1999]

21. flaw in your logic though.

At the point in time you are doing a scientific experiment is is impossible to know how important it is going to be. Those "trival experiments" may lead to new theories that make major impacts.

To think you can judge what experiments are "worthwhile" is a fools position as history has proven many times.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. Heh

"To think you can judge what experiments are "worthwhile" is a fools position as history has proven many times."

Better tell all the scientists.

[cobalt1999]

28. The scientists already know that.

If you've been involved deeply in any scientific field, you know it.

[BlooInBloo]

31. Easier path to appreciating that point: Read Kuhn.

[glowing]

12. Until someone figures out some sci-fi space travel.. we won't make

it very far. Science won't save our asses. People assume scientists are some saving grace. They are not. They hypothesize, they test, the conclude... do what you will with information that is provided with the findings. Do not put scientists on a pedestal. We do some great research, but at the end of the day we are people, and we may be wrong. Alway question everything, even by the brightest scientific mind.

I've explained why I hate science text books before. They leave no imagination and a fallacy on the whole field. And believe me the pressure is there at times to finds something. I've worked with many professors who use a lot of students who flub a lot of numbers to earn their grades. I've seen it done, and I did report it.

[RL3AO]

14. I disagree

Science will save our ass.

[theguvnorgc]

18. run along

you're needed in homeroom.

[Skidmore]

9. Cuz Little Boots is having laser cannons installed on the space station

and is aiming them at Vuladimeer (that's what he calls him), just to remind him that Vuladimeer is his true soulmate.

[Lex]

10. Oh, get a grip.

Jesus.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

13. W H A T B U L L S H I T

600 YRS AGO, you would have been complaining that the world was flat, that sailing off to the west would end up in disaster, not to mention a waste of money. Yet this maniac named Columbo found out that his mistakes became one hell of a profit center.

THE HUMAN SPECIES (pardon me for yelling) IS A CREATIVE, CURIOUS, INVESTIGATIVE CRITTER. WE THRIVE ON LEARNING SHIT.

The shuttle, as assbackwards, badly designed, and poorly managed program it was, represents a pretty incredible technical event.
100 yrs ago we took to the air. 26 years ago we built a badly designed truck/bus/transport/emblem/item(see below)



* the shuttle, despite its many incredible design defects, is one HELL of a vehicle.

[BlooInBloo]

15. Um, people haven't thought the world was flat for at least 1000s of years.

[RL3AO]

16. Ptolemy in the 2nd pretty much proved the world was round.

EDIT: Fixed date.

[BlooInBloo]

19. Thus the "at least 1000s of years". They knew it before him, just didn't have a decent model...

... While we might laugh at the epicycle-deferent model now, it was bad for the tools available to them at the time. Besides, Copernicus' heliocentric model also used epicycles/deferents - not just as many.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

25. wanna bet?

heh, there are parts of NC and SC and Bama that would argue that point.

[BlooInBloo]

26. heh.

[theguvnorgc]

20. well said

exactly correct.

[karlrschneider]

17. It cost about a days worth of the Iraq "war". Money well spent.

Go somewhere else to bitch about real scientific progress.

[glowing]

22. I wouldn't complain if I thought it was valid. I think its distraction

from environmental degredation that really effects our lives. And after testing the aftermath of a launch, its not environmentally friendly at all.

[karlrschneider]

32. The aftermath of your car passing by isn't all that environmentally friendly either.

The by-products of a shuttle launch are about equal to 30 seconds of global automobile driving.

[Bake]

23. But for the space program, you wouldn't be here, there would be no DU

In fact, there would be no PCs. No hand-held calculators.

Science rocks.

Go to Wikipedia and read again about the Challenger and Columbia disasters. I watch these launches and hold my breath every single time.

After the Challenger was lost, the ONE thing Reagan did well was his address to the nation, written by Peggy Nooner -- "they have slipped the surly bonds of earth and touched the face of God."

I'm choking up right now. So excuse me if I don't share your cynicism. People who strap themselves into tin cans on top of great big bombs to light the candle -- they are heroes to me. Always have been; always will be.

Bake

[ChairmanAgnostic]

27. bravo or brava, which ever fits.

EXACTLY! ! ! ! !

[glowing]

29. I'm glad they mean something to you. I used to want to be an

astronaut. I thought it would be the best job. I was the only 6 yr old I knew with a star map and a real honest to God telescope. As I became older, I realized that there was too much here down on earth that needs attention and looked to another untapped frontier, the worlds oceans and envrionment. I suppose its expolration that still drives me, I just don't believe that its going come on a space shuttle anymore. And like I've posted, the launch poses serious harm to our environment.

I'm not in a glowing mood today. The real news isn't good. I shouldn't rain on anyone's parade. I'm glad that you enjoyed the launch.

[Warren DeMontague]

30. "Wasted Tax Money", "Environmental Damage". Here are my eyes rolling.

:eyes:

"Wasted Tax Money" is the half-trillion a year for the military industrial complex. "Wasted Tax Money" is $40 Billion a year to keep Cancer Grannies and Willie Nelson from smoking pot.

Wasted Tax Money is the tax breaks we give churches, for fuck knows what reason, particularly since so many of them seem incapable of respecting the separation of church and state.

As for the environment, it is the perspective gained by moving into space that has been instrumental in combatting the flat-earth, regressive, neo-luddite shit that is destroying the environment. You want to talk about the Planet? Here it is:



You can thank NASA for that perspective. Finding out about the Universe which we live in is instrumental in our continuing to survive in it. And our future is in space, like it or not. The money we spend on NASA is well spent. If anything, they need more of it.

[Bake]

33. Well said and amen!

NASA's budget is nothing compared to the billions we're wasting every month in Iraq. And NASA hasn't killed anybody - intentionally - at least to my knowledge. The benefits far outweigh the costs of space exploration. What we need to do is quit orbiting the earth and start exploring some more!

Bake

[Solon]

34. If you want to see wasted taxpayer's money, look to the Department of War...

oops, I meant to say the Department of Offense, oh shit, there I go again, one last time, the Department of Defense. There, third times the charm. Anyways, NASA has a budget that is a pittance compared to most of our other programs, yet they alone contributed more to science in the last 50 years than damned near EVERY other human activity in the entirety of human history. This is combined with the accomplishments of the ESA, JAXA, RKA, and its predecessor the Soviet Space Agency.

While I agree that the Space Shuttle is a waste, in today's world, it is needed at the moment, and NASA is working hard to get its successor ready for launch in a few short years. The Space Shuttle, along with the Soyuz spacecraft, are the workhorses of there respective space agencies, and developing a successor to either takes a while.