Whether You've Done It Or Not, Driving Drunk Is Quite Simply Stupid.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

No matter what points are brought up in defense of otherwise, it will still be indisputable fact that driving drunk is stupid.

I'm a bit surprised at some of the things I've read here advocating that it isn't, or diminishing its danger. We are supposed to be smarter than that.

I've read opinions from posters trying to state that what the law considers drunk and what really is being drunk are two different things. That's hogwash. There are more than enough studies available to show that significant impairment occurs at a BAC of .08%. I find it depressing and scary that so many here think that if they feel like they're not drunk, by their own standards, that it is ok to drive. These arguments are stupid and dangerous.

All the time I read articles about how some moron decided to get behind the wheel drunk, with the end result being the tragic loss of some innocent child, some mother, some father. And when I read these articles the defense always turns out to be the same: "I didn't feel drunk, your honor. I thought I was ok to drive". Always the same thing. They always think they were ok. That's why it isn't up to someone's perception as to whether they should flaunt the law and drive anyway, because they think they're ok. Everyone thinks they're ok, until they end up killing themselves or some innocent child, mother, father, brother, sister or friend.

So please, be responsible for yourselves. If you've been drinking, don't drive. There is no excuse for doing so and it is a concept that I'd think would be overwhelmingly supported and reinforced on DU. Let's hope that it is.

[Bluzmann57]

1. You are correct

And I have done it myself, although, luckily, I have never been arrested nor caused any harm to anyone else. But let's face it, a vehicle traveling at a high rate of speed is certainly a potentially lethal weapon and impaired judgement doesn't help in the operation of said vehicle. Now I either stay home or take a cab or have a designated driver. We all should do the same.

[crim son]

2. I agree with you

though I had to learn the hard way. I believe that some people simply don't understand that, while they may be lucky time and time again, all it takes is one serious mistake - made so much more likely by the consumption of alcohol - and their life is changed forever, or gone. It's not worth it when cab fare doesn't amount to more than a few bucks.

[Coventina]

3. Yes, drunk driving is stupid. So is nyquil driving. Driving tired.

Driving and talking on cell phones. Driving while in a bad mood. Driving while sick. Driving with crippling menstrual cramps. Driving with small kids in the car (how many of us have seen parents turned around whacking shorties in the back seat?). Driving and listening to the radio (I've had to pull over when I've heard stories that made me cry and I couldn't see through my tears).

Driving is stupid. Driving is dangerous. Most people out on the road shouldn't be there. I know there have been dozens of times I was a danger to myself and others. But then, I have to put food on my family, and that involves driving when maybe I shouldn't. It's the way our car-based society is.

[pnwmom]

25. The difference is that most of the other situations you describe

are much less cut and dry. Alcohol intake is optional, easy to measure, and is within the control of the drinker.

You have to drive in less than optional situations because you have to feed your family -- but you don't have to drink alcohol anytime.

[treestar]

31. One rarely hears of anyone being arrested for driving under the

influence of a medication - but you'd think it would happen more often, with anyone taking a medication where the bottle instructions say not to drive ever being in an accident, that would come right up.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

49. One of the biggest problems...

In places where there is a large population of the elderly is those elderly driving under the influence of their daily medications.

With the wide use of so many ananxiolytics and other psychotropics these days, that problem might be bigger then we know.

[treestar]

58. And as my Dad always said, the worst drivers in the world, to begin

with, are old men! :hide: (Something he says less and less as he advances into his 70s).

[pnwmom]

89. Probably because officers can't smell pills on a person's

breath. And there is no breath test for antihistamines (for example).

I have read of a number of cases where officers arrested and/or tasered people who were having diabetic shock.

[Coventina]

32. I agree with what you say, drunk driving is "less" excusable BUT

as long as alcohol is a legal substance people will drive while drunk, because of the nature of our car-based society.

Plus, if I hit and kill someone because I was nodding off, they aren't any less dead than if I were drunk.

Driving is dangerous. We are taking our lives and the lives of others, in our hands every time we get behind the wheel. We have to acknowledge that getting in the car means we can kill or be killed, every single time.

[Quixote1818]

4. Have you ever driven while feeling tired?

[pnwmom]

21. Irrelevant question.

Similar to saying, have you ever driven while distracted or worrying about a problem?

There are any number of other situations which could negatively impact driving -- that doesn't excuse driving while drunk.

[Quixote1818]

27. I know it doesn't excuse it but driving while tired is just as dangerous as being drunk

Yet it gets a pass by most people including yourself as shown above. That is irresponsible.


Experts: Driving Tired Is Like Driving Drunk
This Week Is Sleep Awareness Week

PLATTSBURGH, N.Y. -- You know you're not supposed to drink and drive, but experts say it can be just as dangerous to drive when you're tired.

It's National Sleep Awareness Week.

A recent study shows more than half of us admit to driving while tired -- a potentially fatal habit.

"Sleep-deprived people can have problems with reflexes and judgment," said medical expert Dr. Randy Stoloff.

One Australian study shows being awake for 18 hours straight produces an impairment equal to being drunk. It's the cause of some 100,000 accidents each year nationwide and at least 20 in Clinton County.

"In today's fast-paced society, this has the potential to become even worse than it is now," said Clinton County Public Health worker Molly Lawrence.

Some signs to watch for include yawning more frequently than every few minutes, inability to keep your eyes open, not remembering last miles traveled, and drifting out of your lane or hitting rumble strips.

If you are doing any of those things, experts say to pull over and nap, or better yet, don't drive at all when you're that tired.

To get adequate sleep, experts suggest regular exercise -- at least three hours prior to bedtime -- and avoiding alcohol and stimulants before bed.

Developing consistent sleep patterns also helps a lot.

There are tests you can take on the Web to see if you are sleep-deprived:

www.sleepfoundation.orghere.

www.drowsydriving.orghere.


http://www.wptz.com/news/8301184/detail.html?subid=10101102

[pnwmom]

88. I didn't give anything a pass. I just said one doesn't excuse

the other.

That being said, it is easy to keep track of one's alcohol intake. But measuring "tiredness" is much harder, particularly if the person is sleeping 8 hours but not getting restful sleep.

[treestar]

33. IA, that is way more dangerous

I used to get that feeling, while totally sober, that I was going to fall asleep, and had to pull over.

It was way scary. And you don't know that it's going to happen when you start, either.

[Quixote1818]

39. Not only that, your reaction time and ability is drastically hindered!

I watched a program where they had sleep deprived people drive a course and they had cardboard children run out in front of them and they couldn't stop. They hardly even attempted to touch the break. They basically just ran right over the cardboard kids.


It's just as irresponsible as driving drunk and in many cases more irresponsible. Being really tired and driving is worse than being at .08 and driving in most cases.

I have driven while really tired before and after thinking about what I was doing I will NEVER do it again! I could hardly keep the vehicle between the lines. It took all the concentration I had. But just being a little tired is just like being drunk.

Now, whenever I feel a little tired I pull over and take a nap. It's just not worth it.

[Marrah_G]

5. from someone who has suffered the effects of drunk drivers....

:applause:

[StarryNite]

40. Me too!

Thankfully it only resulted in damage to our vehicle and not our children who were in the back seat. How can anybody defend a drunk driver?

[mike_c]

6. no arguments with that....

eom

[hlthe2b]

7. Is murder wrong too?

I'm sure none of us can be sure until you tell us.....:eyes:


NO offense intended to those who have suffered at the hands of drunk drivers, who have my absolute sympathy and understanding... but I do not know why some on DU feel the need to preach at the rest of us all the time...

[Quixote1818]

8. LOL!

Some of these threads just crack me up!

[KG]

11. some days, you can't beat DU for pure comedy...

:hi:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

12. Yeah, Cause Like, Advocating Driving Drunk Is Funny And Stuff.

Grow up.

[Name removed]

13. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

9. I'm Sorry, Can You Point Me To The Link Where A Bunch Of DU'ers Stated It Was Ok?

Or where they said something like "Ehhhhh, I didn't murder him that badly, it was quick and painless"?

Since you can't, your argument is worthless.

If you don't like the preaching, tough. Get over it.

But when I see a few threads that minimize the impact of drunk driving and put forth some reckless concepts, there is nothing wrong with providing a counter message.

If you didn't appreciate the message, too bad so sad. You'll live.

[Dr.Phool]

42. Is posting on DU while drunk illegal also?

I do that on occasion.

[spoony]

59. Well, if you did a drive-by post whilst drunk, maybe. :-)

[Warpy]

10. I discovered drunkenness at 13 while I was still riding a bicycle

to get to the cheesy diner that would serve me beer in a paper cup in the last booth in the back. I discovered that I did not ride better when I had a buzz going, the road rash was indisputable proof of that.

I was over it all by the time I got my driver's license. I have never driven drunk. I learned better early on.

The problem with alcohol is that it really does make you feel like Superman. You might know you're a little more plastered than you intended getting, but gosh darn it, it's too far to walk home, you should be able to get there OK on autopilot, right? Or you're listening to the alcohol tell you that you're smarter, wittier, better looking, and can drive a whole lot better with a little chemical augmentation, right?

I still think our drinking age is too high and our driving age is too low. It worked for me, anyway, finding out what alcohol did to my coordination and reaction time before I got behind the wheel of a car.

[terrya]

14. I agree.

Thank you.

[yardwork]

15. No arguments here!

And driving while under the influence is NOT the same as driving while tired or sleepy.

[Coventina]

26. drowsy driving can be just as deadly as drunk driving:

try looking at drowsydriving.org

here's a few other links, but there are many more about the dangers of driving while tired:

http://www.nysgtsc.state.ny.us/drow-ndx.htm

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/science/buzz/stories/s1010416.htm

[yardwork]

93. It's not the same thing. Drowsy drivers don't drive aggressively - drunks often do.

Am I advocating for driving while tired? Absolutely not! It's common sense not to drive while tired or sleepy. However, being tired or sleepy isn't the same as being drunk.

[Gregorian]

17. Driving is stupid.

There's nothing wrong with drinking.

When are we going to wake up and realize that it's driving that is the problem.

Don't expect a reply. I'm typing this with a screwdriver. My keyboad is dead.

But do think about what I said. Let's not confuse the issue. Driving is what has killed the planet.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

18. "Don't expect a reply. I'm typing this with a screwdriver. My keyboad is dead"

:rofl:

I know you probably didn't mean that as a joke, and I hope you get your keyboard fixed, but I did think that was one of the funniest lines I've seen recently even if unintentional. Just seriously made me smile. :)

[taterguy]

19. Damnit that's my line

I'm the one that's supposed to extol the virtues of a car-free existence at every opportunity and then choke on the fumes of the flames that ensue.

I do think that while driving is occasionally useful there are some people that are as addicted to it as they are to alcohol. I've known people who drove to bars, when their house was a ten minute walk away and they didn't have to worry about crime. Sad.

[Gregorian]

44. If you only knew.

But I'm absolutely in a total rage. Here I am at 50 years old in a state like I've never been in.


I'm getting at the one thing that is infuriating me. Cars. If you want to see a group of people addicted to driving, you should see this tiny one lane road in Mendocino. I live near the end of it, and still it's a stream of traffic. I came here with the intention of riding my bike. Forget it. They won't cross the center line. They won't give me one inch. I'm struggling to find a place to call home that is reasonably free of the hell that cars create. I cannot find it. All of my belongings are strewn across the state of California. An entire machine shop. A crane. A backhoe. A 55 Chevy pickup. I'm living out of a shoebox. And I'm totally lost.

Tell me about cars and ranting. I'm so close to losing it I can't believe it's actually me. An educated college graduate with years of being a good person. I hope I can hold it together long enough to not bludgeon someone.

I had to rant. I see you're also a cyclist. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. Inside a car is one thing. The perspective one gets from the reality of a bike, is the true reality of what the car is. Violence.

[Berry Cool]

81. Agreed, agreed, agreed.

Part of the reason people drive drunk (or sleepy, or distracted, etc.) is because of our national addiction to driving, period.

We're a big country geographically and we pride ourselves on our individualism. Put the two together and you end up with a nation full of people who see the ownership and operation of a personal transportation vehicle as a birthright and an absolute necessity. Many people never think twice about whether or not they "need" a car. Of course they need one, they tell themselves. They need one the same way they need air, food, water and sleep.

There are countries in which public transportation is so widespread and accepted that our addiction to cars is considered absurd. But that's never mattered too much to America. Outside certain major cities in which public transportation is plentiful and traffic congestion is so bad that a car is more a liability than a pleasure, we are The Land of the Automobile. And most people would surrender their car only if you pried it from their cold, dead fingers.

[Gregorian]

96. Right on. I just wish there were more like you.

You really nailed it. Those words go through my head as well. The car is almost a natural extension of the body. But it's a sickness.

Drinking and driving a horse? How would that be a problem? It is the car that is the problem.

[pnwmom]

28. Drinking, if you're an alcoholic or a child of one, can ruin lives.

[Madspirit]

20. Who Said it Isn't Stupid?

I want a link to someone saying it's not stupid to drink and drive.
Lee

[KG]

24. no need for that - this is pre-emptive ponificating.

i, for one, am feeling severly chastised. :eyes:

[Madspirit]

36. Very True!!...n/t

[HCE SuiGeneris]

52. ...

:spray:

[sandnsea]

22. And use a Designated Driver

It's a part of my children's partying lingo - I hope it's part of everybody's.

[JerseygirlCT]

23. Exactly right. nt

[treestar]

29. Smart people have done it

It's rather that the drinking makes you stupid.

Drinking in public, even if you're not driving, can get you or someone else hurt, yet there's also the need to use judgment about how much you can drink and still function.

Frankly I think the smartest thing for bars might be to have or share a van that takes people home if they overdid it. It might be a positive thing they can advertise their bar with - you know, have a good time, but we'll drive you home.

Maybe bars could even have vans to pick people up, lol.

Or just better public transporation so no one thinks they "have" to drive.

[uppityperson]

30. Of course, saying I did it isn't saying it is/was ok

Acknowledging that I did something that stupid is NOT saying it is ok, is not excusing it, merely acknowledging it.

[NoAmericanTaliban]

34. Most of the suspect drunk drivers I spot are actually cell phone yakkers

Drunk driving is stupid not to mention all the legal perscriptions folks are on....
When I spot a potential dd - someone driving slow, weaving in the road, no blinker, not paying attention, etc. - 95% of the time they are yakking on their cell phone or texting. They are often more dangerous than the dd's - and yet where is the outrage here. Should we start a
Mothers Against Cell Yakkers - MACK. They chose to Yak on the phone just like a drunk choses to drive. Wonder how many of the MADD folks use cell phone while driving?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

35. You're Absolutely Right There.

I have observed the same thing. It's probably even more dangerous.

[Coventina]

38. I can't remember where I heard this, but at least drunk drivers are TRYING to drive

unlike the cell phone yakkers.

It was meant as a joke, but there is an element of truth in it.

[AmyDeLune]

45. Myth Busters and a British study determined that talking on a cell phone

while driving was even more dangerous than driving drunk due to the driver paying more attention to the phone than the road.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

47. I Love Myth Busters. Didn't Catch That One Though.

Doesn't surprise me in the least. I can't get over how 'in their own world' those cell talkers are on the road.

[Alexander]

37. In other news, the sky is blue.

:eyes:

[Beausoir]

41. And water is still wet.

What an absolutely ridiculous thread.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

43. Why Is It Ridiculous? What's The Problem With It? Fact Is, There Is None, And You Just Feel The

need to attack based on it being a thread started by the big bad OMC. :rofl:

See, many posters in other threads were undermining the whole concept of driving drunk as if it wasn't all that serious or as if the laws were too strict. Some seemed to put forth a premise that they feel fine so they can drive. Putting forth such a thing is stupid. Furthermore, when this many people in our community openly state that they've driven drunk, I don't find it to be an absolutely ridiculous premise to offer a bit of a reminder as to how stupid it is. But the main catalyst was the fact that some were actually trying to infer that .08% isn't drunk and that they don't drive when they 'think' they're drunk, but that at other stages they feel good enough. As I said, such a premise is dangerous and blatantly stupid, and there's nothing wrong with addressing it with a statement saying so.

So the only thing ridiculous in this thread is the responses from posters who only belittle based on the fact that the bigggggg badddddd OMC said something. It's so utterly laughable! :rofl:

[Alexander]

48. "Big bad OMC"? Get over yourself. You aren't nearly that important.

I dislike this thread because it's stating the obvious.

If a certain DUer insists that drunk driving is a good thing, I hope you will PM them in the future instead of wasting everyone else's time stating common knowledge.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

51. Thank You For Your Concern.

This wasn't one DU'er. And so sorry you dislike the thread, but it is my hope you'll get over it. But thanks for your concern. :hi:

(And you say I'm not nearly that important, and I wholeheartedly agree with you. We're just posters on a message board. Hence, my mockery of the 'big bad OMC' concept, since some here literally obsess themselves with attacking me or hurling insults my way. I laugh at their obsessions. It really is unhealthy for them. "Oh Noooooooo we've gots to get big bad OMCCCCCCCC!!!!!" :rofl:

[Alexander]

54. You need to show me an example, or shut the hell up.

Yes, DUers have admitted to driving drunk. But I didn't read a single post saying it was a good idea or that more people should drive drunk.

If you can find me such a post, I would love to read it. Put up or shut up.

Otherwise it's clear this is just a waste of space.

BTW - concern? I have zero "concern" for you or your inflated sense of self-importance. Now accept the fact that some of us don't like the obvious being stated, get over it, and go do something useful with your time.

[Quixote1818]

56. Dude, your post comes across as though you are lecturing Gandhi about non-violence

Or Paris Hilton about partying. Where is your sense of humor? Can't you just laugh at yourself just a little? Here, have a drink to let off all the tension. :beer:

[Maddy McCall]

72. Exactly.

:thumbsup:

[Alexander]

57. Okay...

(And you say I'm not nearly that important, and I wholeheartedly agree with you. We're just posters on a message board. Hence, my mockery of the 'big bad OMC' concept, since some here literally obsess themselves with attacking me or hurling insults my way. I laugh at their obsessions. It really is unhealthy for them. "Oh Noooooooo we've gots to get big bad OMCCCCCCCC!!!!!" :rofl:)

Well, I'm not one of these people and I personally don't give a rat's ass about you.

If the obsessions of some unhinged nobodies on a message board send you into fits of riotous laughter, then good for you.

I'd rather you PM whoever was dumb enough to say people should drive drunk, if anyone here actually said that. That way your intended recipients will get the message, and the other 99% of us can be spared your infinite wisdom.

[bettyellen]

69. it was many DUers saying drunk driving is not so bad, doesn't warrant jail time...

making excuses and making light of drunk driving. lucky you missed them i guess, but there were plenty in the past week.
one would guess a lot of people here just don't use cabs or designated drivers.

[incapsulated]

73. I agree

And if so many of us admit to driving drunk I think it's pretty "obvious" we don't take it seriously enough, so why come down on OMC for pointing that out?

Uh?

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

74. Because Unfortunately, I'm OMC LOL

I've kind of done it to myself, to be honest, but even sensible messages of mine are the subject of knee jerk critique. Some would rather get their quick shot in on me then actually pay attention to context.

It's all good though. I don't mind 'em. Their silliness cracks me up a bit. :)

[incapsulated]

75. But you're a Ranger fan...

You can't be ALL bad.

:P

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

76. Hear Hear! I Miss Them Already. I Can't Wait For Next Season Already!

Yup. I'm true blue here, both Democrat wise and Ranger fan wise. :)

[joe_sixpack]

46. It's been said that 28 percent of all accidents...

are caused by drunk drivers. That means that 72 percent are caused by sober people. Man we've got to get those crazy Tee-totalers off the roads! But seriously. I agree. For some actions there are often excuses. There's no excuse for drunk driving. As harmful as it is to our society, it's something you'd think could be completely controlled. There's just no reason to ever do it, period.

[NoAmericanTaliban]

55. Let's not gloss over the fact that DD had become big business

for the police, lawyers, dui schools, the justice system, etc. The police now raise a lot of $$$ going after DD's & it is now a major source of revenue. We are all human and I'm sure that a lot of us have driven 'drunk' when we should not have. The irony is that the habitual and repeat offenders often don't receive jail punishment until it is their 4th or 5th dui. That is who the law should really concentrate on to get off the road.

[SOS]

50. It is indeed stupid

But the problem never goes away, because alcohol makes people stupid.

A perfectly intelligent, rational person may drive drunk because the alcohol has impaired their judgment.

[LiberalFighter]

53. Add other things into the equation increases the risk of driving drunk.

Driving at nite
Driving with passengers
Driving while talking on phone
Driving with adverse weather conditions
Driving in unfamiliar surroundings

At a minimum a person driving while drunk will usually include nite time driving.

[NoAmericanTaliban]

62. Actually a lot of DD's are driving during the day...

I used to believe that most DUI's occur at night until a few years ago when the local police in
Norcross, GA started putting up road blocks during the day time from 11 am till 3 pm. Too my surprise they were actually catching more DD's then than at night, even during the middle of the week.

[LiberalFighter]

77. I wasn't saying more dui's occur at nite...

saying that these other factors increase the risk while driving drunk.

[NoAmericanTaliban]

79. They also increase the risks when driving sober as well...

[Rex]

60. No argument here.

Driving drunk is a very, very bad idea.

[Nikki Stone1]

61. You got your 5th recommend, OMC

I'm with you 100% on this

[hlthe2b]

63. Get ready, DUers coming soon.....

You like this one, better get your recommending finger in shape. I bring you OMC's greatest hits to come:

1. Whether You've Done It Or Not, Bludgeoning Your Mother-in-law With a 2x4 Is Quite Simply Wrong.
2. Whether You've Done It Or Not, Downloading Pornography onto Your Boss's Laptop Before the Big Presentation Is Quite Simply Stupid.
3. Whether You've Done It Or Not, Mowing Through The Crowd at High Speed Waiting for Best Buy to Open in order to Get That Last New X-Box Is Quite Simply Wrong.
4. Whether You've Done It Or Not, Pointing Your Rocket Launcher at an Overhead Boeing 747 Is Quite Simply Stupid.
5. Whether You've Done It Or Not, Installing a Large Idaho Potato in Your Neighbor's Tailpipe Is Quite Simply Wrong.


I'm sure, like me, all DUers could never have guessed that driving while drunk was stupid and wait with baited breath for the next pronouncements from the noble one. However would we live our lives absent stupidity or sin, without this sage advice? We are NOT worthy! :eyes:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

64. Awwww, Don't Take It To Such Heart That Some People Understood My Need For Posting It.

You're acting like a child. Does it hurt you in some way that some people understood the need for the post? You don't like the thread. Poor you. But you seem to be really taking it to heart. Go outside and relax or something! It's all ok! :hi:

[nadine_mn]

91. oh my gosh - I snorted pop

thank you for OMC greatest hits to come....

[hlthe2b]

94. ....

Happy to oblige, oh fellow "unworthy" DUer! LOL :toast:

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

95. Yay!!!!! I Have A New Groupie!!!!! Wooooohoooooo!!!!!

Welcome to the club!!!!!

One more person for me to laugh my ass off at! :rofl:

[treestar]

97. LOL. Whether you've done it or not, starting a war in another

country on a false ground is Quite Simply Wrong.

Firing a bunch of your employees because they are doing their jobs rather than doing what you need done is Quite Simply Wrong

Outing an undercover agent, whether you've done it or not, is quite simply wrong

Failing to show up for National Guard Duty, whether you've done it or not, it quite simply stupid

:rofl:

[BlooInBloo]

65. Thanks, but I speak Obvious fluently.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

66. Sometimes Even The Obvious Requires Restatement.

Especially, when it seemed to be apparent, that the issue itself wasn't heeded with as much caution as it should be by some.

I take the subject very personally and find it to be a monumentally important one. When I see that many DU'ers have driven drunk, and others stating that they feel fine at .08% and therefore have no problem driving, then I see no issue with issuing a counter.

Many things are obvious. Yet far too many DU'ers were acting irresponsibly anyway.

So maybe you needed no reminder, but maybe others did. Saying that driving drunk is stupid is not enough. Actually being responsible enough and mature enough to simply refuse to ever do it is altogether different.

That was my problem. Seeing too many people stating "yeah, I've done it. I know it's stupid, but I've done it". That's a crock of shit. Saying it's stupid is worthless, if you aren't going to heed the reasons why.

[Rex]

68. You've really changed.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

98. OMC, when did you go from contrarian to moralizer?

I have always been intrigued by your ability to find the fatal flaw (however minute) of most arguments, yet now you're doing PSA's?

I don't disagree with your premise, although "drunk" is being defined more and more narrowly (if you sniffed the cork, you might want to skip the drive home if there are "checkpoints").

Now on the rare situations in which I've driven in a mind altered state, :-), I've driven slower and more cautiously for fear of having even a fender bender that might involve me being questioned by law enforcement.

Which is why I am chronically frustrated by the fact that folks with multiple DUI's get to eventually drive again. If one is so ignorant as to have received one citation and yet continue to drive recklessly while intoxicated, one is a great risk to oneself and society.

The courts don't seem equipped to deal with repeat offenders in a meaningful way. And, a single glass of beer or wine consumed by a responsible individual who will be driving, is not the worst situation on the roads.

Now, can we talk about Gonzales's no confidence vote tomorrow? I'd really like to hear your take on that. MKJ

[BlooInBloo]

70. (a) many *eveybodies* have driven drunk, and...

(b) It's not an issue of people not *knowing* they shouldn't drive drunk, it's an issue of people knowingly choosing to do that which they know they shouldn't do.


EDIT: subject typo.

[Madspirit]

71. I haven't done it in 21 years.

I got a DWI...what it's called in Texas, in 1986. I took very seriously that I could have killed someone. I have only been totally sober for 15 years but I have not driven with a drop of alcohol in me in 21 years. I wouldn't even allow myself to have a car until I had two years of sobriety under my belt. I switched to a bicycle until I got sober and had been sober for a while. ...and I hurt no one but was fully aware of what I could have done.
Lee

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

67. Just Getting The 666 Off Of My Post Count/View Count LOL

too many jokers out there... hehehe

[liberalhistorian]

78. When it comes to drinking and driving, I don't wanna hear any

excuses or defense or anything else of the kind. It is, always, dangerous, selfish, inexcusable and criminal. ALWAYS. PERIOD. There is NEVER any excuse for driving drunk, EVER. Too many people have lost their lives to people who CHOSE to get in a car and drive after drinking, when they KNOW the dangers of it. A good friend of mine, a young woman in her senior year of high school with her whole life ahead of her to live, including a scholarship to college, was one of them. Because someone decided to get in a pickup and drive after drinking steadily for TWO fucking hours. Her family has never gotten over it.

I remember about seventeen years ago, a young woman in the area I was living in, was hit head-on and killed by a drunk driver while on her way to the hospital to pick up her newborn boy who'd been hospitalized for jaundice. She was the young mother of four children, who were left motherless because someone decided to get in a car and drive after drinking.

Shortly before that, in the same area, a young woman was killed by a drunk driver on her way home from work just four days before Christmas and just two days before she and her fiance were to pick up her engagement ring. And on and on and on and on and on and on I could go. People who drive after drinking are selfish, irresponsible criminals. There is NEVER an excuse for it.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

82. Absolutely Agree With You And Great Post.

[devilgrrl]

80. It's only okay if you're Craig MacTavish...

MacTavish missed the 1984-85 season after being convicted of vehicular homicide, having struck and killed a young woman while he was driving under the influence of alcohol. MacTavish pleaded guilty to vehicular homicide and driving under the influence of alcohol in an accident the night of January 25, 1984 in Peabody, MA. Kim Radley, 26, of West Newfield, ME, died four days later of injuries sustained in the crash.<1>) MacTavish spent a year in jail as punishment for this offence. While incarcerated, he did manage to watch most of the games that were televised. After MacTavish was released from prison, the Bruins, feeling he deserved a fresh start, subsequently offered to let him out of his contract. MacTavish accepted.

Widely viewed at the time as a personal favour from Edmonton general manager Glen Sather to his best friend, then-Bruins' general manager Harry Sinden, the Oilers took a chance on MacTavish and signed him for the 1985-86 season. Sather's gamble turned out to be a good one, as MacTavish spent eight full seasons with the Oilers, helping the Oilers win three Stanley Cups and serving as team captain from 1992 to 1994. MacTavish was traded to the New York Rangers in 1994, just in time to help several other former Oilers (including Adam Graves and Mark Messier) win the Stanley Cup for the Blueshirts. The next season MacTavish signed with the Philadelphia Flyers as a free agent, and was traded to the St. Louis Blues during the 1995-96 season. MacTavish retired following the 1996-97 season. He had been the last helmetless player, having begun his career before helmets became mandatory (then-current players were allowed to remain bare-headed under a grandfather clause).


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Mactavish

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

84. Funny. No Where In That Information You Posted Did Someone Say It Was Ok.

Ohhhhhhhhhh, I get it!!!! I'm a Rangers fan so that means I condone Craig MacTavish driving drunk years ago!!! Ohhhhhhhh!!!!! I see now!!!! What impeccable logic and deduction that was displayed!!!! Wow! What an argument! I mean, how can anyone possibly refute such a concept! Yes! If someone is a fan of any given sports team it means they condone members of that team driving drunk! Like, how did we never see this before? Thank you! Thank you devilgrrl for such enlightenment! Yes! Fans of teams condone those team members driving drunk! Spread it far and wide!

:rofl:

[devilgrrl]

85. Wow, you are just so love with yourself aren't you?

I was drawing attention to his light slap-on-the-wrist sentence and that he was able to go on to a fruitful career in the NHL with little or no punishment. But read into it that way sweety-darling. :hi:

I'll bet my bank account that you're guilty of driving while intoxicated yourself.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

86. You Act As If You Weren't Completely Transparent. It Was Obvious What Your Intent Was.

And how much do you have in your bank account? I'll look forward to seeing it transferred to my paypal account. I'll PM you the address shortly. :rofl:

[devilgrrl]

87. You are a real piece of work sir.

What's next OMC - are you going to toilet train everyone now?

[Name removed]

90. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bliss_eternal]

100. Can I take some of that action...?

:rofl:

[Marrah_G]

103. That was because at that time Mass had VERY lienant DD laws

The asshole that killed my 14 year old relative, ran him over, left him to bleed out on the street will do at most, 2 years because until recently Mass could not look at prior offenses during sentencing. That changed with Melanie's law.

[beevul]

83. Clearly N/T

[WritingIsMyReligion]

92. Driving in any less-than-sober condition is stupid.

Drunk, stoned, on too much medicine, tired, talking on your cell phone? Don't drive.

[mudesi]

99. Drunk drivers ought to be charged with attempted manslaughter

It may sound harsh or over the top, but I truly feel that the laws as they exist in most of North America are way too lenient. I know Paris Hilton doesn't deserve the attention she gets from the mass media distraction machine, but in my opinion she ought to be in jail for attempted manslaughter.

I am fully aware that my opinion in this matter may be based entirely on emotion rather than reason, though if that is the case I'm still completely in denial about it. We hear stories all the time about drunk drivers who killed innocent people after having been charged and convicted of drunk driving multiple times. "His sixth drunk driving conviction" is usually part of the headline.

This nonsense needs to end. It infuriates me when I hear about another innocent civilian killed by a drunk driver. To me, driving drunk is tantamount to taking a gun and firing it randomly in any and every direction.

I am disgusted by the number of people here who answered "yes" in the poll that asked whether or not you have ever driven drunk. I wonder how many would answer "yes" to a poll that asked whether or not you have ever thrown rocks over an overpass, or placed razors in the sand at a playground? Because to me, those kinds of reckless and endangering crimes, with zero regard to the safety of others, are no different.

[Jonathan50]

101. I know people who really shouldn't be on the road...

Drunk or sober.

My wife's sister is one of them. She is really a crappy driver, she rear ended a school bus while her son was in the car, if she had been going a little faster she would have decapitated both of them. She has run off the road more times than I can recall. I don't think she has ever sold an undamaged car and I can think of at least three that she has totaled in the last thirty years I have known her.

Now she just recently got a cell phone. :hide:

Seriously, how dangerous you are drunk depends quite a bit on how good a driver you are sober.

Most of the habitual drunk drivers I have known (and being in construction I know more than a few) are piss poor drivers to start with.

I've driven drunk a few times many years ago. Yep, it was stupid and wrong, but I was young and dumb and full of whatever.

[LWolf]

102. Agreed. n/t